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The Nancy Pelosi thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
Dedfin
Footballguy
Well I sort of had ren pegged for an accelerationist whether he consciously agreed with it or not.
ren hoek
Footballguy
"Look, we all want principled leadership in Washington. That's why we need to line up behind milquetoast neoliberals that don't stand for anything, and punch left whenever progressives/independents expose how feeble and corrupt Democrats are."
ShamrockPride
Footballguy
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TobiasFunke
Footballguy
It is false and defamatory to suggest that I advocate lining up behind milquetoast neoliberals in every or even most situations, or that I do not use cutlery and do not wash my hands.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Noticed you did not state your stance on animal cruelty. More specifically, your feelings towards domestic cats. Very suspicious.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
There just isn't much room for domestic cats in the cupboard and under the stairs, where I definitely do not live and it is false and defamatory to say otherwise.
I may not always agree with her - but she sure can throw a jab:
Pelosi: Trump doesn't understand the financial insecurity facing federal workers during the shutdown: "The president seems to be insensitive to that. He thinks maybe they could just ask their father for more money. But they can't."
ETA: Tweet with video https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1083106246792601600
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timschochet
Footballguy
Update: 3 cheers for Nancy Pelosi. Standing up to President Trump. She is exactly what this country needs right now!
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I too stand with President Pelosi, and am glad to see that Vice President Trump is learning his place.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Man is Trump getting pwnedtimschochet said:
The General
Footballguy
Pelosi throwing windmill dunks on Trump. She’s like Dominque in his prime here.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
[scooter]
Footballguy
We're not really at the windmill dunk stage right now. Right now she's more like Dikembe Mutombo, blocking Trump's shots and giving him the finger wag each time.
Mister CIA
Footballguy
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Rewarding those diametrically opposed to your worldview because those on your side aren’t exactly lined up with your views is the very definition of an adult temper tantrum. You’re better than this Cav.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Because paygo means the only way the wall could ever be reasonably proposed would be in conjunction with amnesty/DACA permanence/guest worker visas to offset the cost with tax revenue.
Dedfin
Footballguy
Some progressives say "they got to her" which, as a pretty far lefty is annoying for me to hear. The left eating its own needs to stop.
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IC FBGCav
Footballguy
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
He’s listing ways to pay for the wall. You have to have offsetting cuts or increased revenue which will pay for any bill under the current House rules (aka PayGo.)
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Nancy Pelosi, a Woman in Control, Is a Rival Who Flummoxes Trump
Nancy Pelosi, the speaker of the House, has an understanding of the way the legislative branch operates that the president does not.
Nancy Pelosi, the speaker of the House, has an understanding of the way the legislative branch operates that the president does not.
WASHINGTON — When President Trump is battling a man, he tends to belittle his foewith nicknames like “Cryin’ Chuck” and “Low-energy Jeb.” When he is in a fight with a woman, he is known to lob insultslike “horseface” and “ugly” and “dog.”
But Mr. Trump has never before faced an adversary like Speaker Nancy Pelosi.
Their latest clash, over the State of the Union address, ended with the president capitulating late Wednesday night, and agreeing to delay the speech until the government shutdown is over. Earlier in the day, Mr. Trump tried to back Ms. Pelosi into a corner by saying he intended to give the speech next Tuesday in the Capitol. She called his bluff and disinvited him.
For a president who prides himself on being a master negotiator, Ms. Pelosi is a different kind of opponent, and one who so far has flummoxed him.
Longtime friends of the president say Mr. Trump is not afraid of powerful women, respects them and has empowered them at the White House and in his business. But on the rare occasion when he was challenged by a woman, Mr. Trump was either in charge — or knew the woman had a boss, usually a man, to whom he could appeal, said Barbara A. Res, a former executive vice president of the Trump Organization.
In this case, Ms. Pelosi is her own boss. And under the Constitution, she is a leader of a branch of government that is equal to the chief executive.
“Dealing with anyone with power equal to his is a first for him — at least in his mind,” Ms. Res said. “He has the perception that he is the most powerful person in the world, and then he comes up against somebody who thinks they have as much power as he or as much control as he, and that’s a shock to him. And it’s complicated by the fact that she is a woman.”
Unlike Hillary Clinton, Ms. Pelosi is not running a race against the president and she is not going away. She also has an understanding of the way the legislative branch works that he does not. Most important, she is blocking him from getting something he desperately wants: a wall along the southern border with Mexico that was a core promise of his 2016 campaign.
“I think that he’s caught between his respect for Pelosi and his anger at her resistance,” said Michael D’Antonio, the author of “The Truth About Trump.” “He gets very frustrated when he can’t close a sale. And I think that he’s perplexed about how to get what he wants here because he respects Pelosi.”
The president went so far as to acknowledge Ms. Pelosi’s powers on Wednesday in a takedown of Senator Chuck Schumer, Democrat of New York, in what Democrats saw as a bit of projection. “I think that Chuck Schumer sadly is dominated by the radical left and he’s dominated by Nancy Pelosi, very strongly dominated,” Mr. Trump said. “He can’t move, he’s a puppet, he’s a puppet for Nancy Pelosi, if you can believe that.”
(Mr. Schumer has proved an adept negotiator in his own right, provoking the president to claim ownership of the shutdown during an Oval Office meeting in December.)
In one sense, the row over the State of the Union reveals as much about the difficulty Mr. Trump is having adjusting to life in Washington under a divided government as it does about his treatment of women. When Paul D. Ryan, a Republican, was speaker, Mr. Trump could exert leverage over Mr. Ryan, just as he can over Senator Mitch McConnell, the Republican leader. He cannot do that with Ms. Pelosi.
Gwenda Blair, another Trump biographer, said Mr. Trump typically viewed women as “easier targets” in negotiating sessions. But that is not the case for Ms. Pelosi. For starters, the only nickname he has devised for Ms. Pelosi is her own name — Nancy.
“Nancy Pelosi, or Nancy, as I call her, doesn’t want to hear the truth,” the president told reporters Wednesday at the White House — a comment that was either meant to showcase a supposedly close relationship or, alternately, diminish her by dropping her last name. But if it was an attack, it was by Trump standards unusually restrained. (Before the election, Mr. Trump tried calling Ms. Pelosi “High Tax, High Crime Nancy Pelosi” on Twitter,but it did not stick.)
“He knows how to emasculate men and he assumes that will work, and he knows how to attempt to shame women around their appearance, but he doesn’t have a useful weapon in this relationship,” Mr. D’Antonio said. “He has yet to give her a nickname, he has yet to criticize her appearance and I think he knows that would be very risky for him to do. So I think he’s stuck in a way that he’s rarely stuck.”
John Feehery, a Republican strategist who advised former Speaker J. Dennis Hastert, sees something else at work: smart politics. He said Mr. Trump treated Ms. Pelosi respectfully for a very simple reason: He respects her.
“Compared to how he treats everybody else, I think he’s been very respectful and I think that’s good politics for him,” Mr. Feehery said, adding: “You have to be careful when you’re trying to deal with the speaker. She’s got power. You don’t want to unnecessarily insult her because that’s not good politics and I don’t think it gets him a better deal.”
The speaker, for her part, has used Mr. Trump’s playbook against him. After their much-publicized Oval Office meeting, she described his demand for a wall as “like a manhood thing for him” during a private session with Democrats. The comment quickly leaked out. At other times she has cast Mr. Trump as a toddler.
“A temper tantrum by the president,” Ms. Pelosi said this month, describing Mr. Trump’s conduct during the shutdown. “I’m a mother of five, grandmother of nine. I know a temper tantrum when I see one.”
Ms. Pelosi, who is often the only woman at the negotiating table with Mr. Trump, has not been shy about correcting him. The first time he hosted her at the White House, he asserted — without evidence — that he had won the 2016 popular vote because three million to five million people had voted illegally, Ms. Pelosi told MSNBC at the time. “I said that’s just not true,” she recalled telling him.
When Mr. Trump tried to undercut Ms. Pelosi during the Oval Office session last month by suggesting she was constrained because she was facing a challenge in her bid to become speaker, she cut him off.
“Don’t characterize the strength that I bring to this meeting as the leader of the House Democrats,” she told him, in a moment that quickly went viral.
Ms. Pelosi’s allies have been celebrating.
During a closed-door meeting of Democrats, Representative James E. Clyburn of South Carolina, the No. 3. Democrat, introduced Ms. Pelosi by quoting from the ancient Chinese military treatise, Sun Tzu’s “The Art of War,” according to a Democratic aide in the room.
“Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win,” Mr. Clyburn said. Turning to Ms. Pelosi, he said, “Thank you for winning for us. Now let’s go to war.”
Ms. Pelosi replied by reminding rank-and-file lawmakers to stick together, and to hold fast to the Democrats’ position that they would not negotiate over border security with the president until the government was fully open. “Our unity is our power,” she told them, “and that is what had the president change his mind.”
Republicans portrayed Ms. Pelosi as disrespectful and tried to put a good face on Mr. Trump’s retreat. “I think the president showed some humility, which is an awesome thing,” said Representative Daniel Webster, Republican of Florida.
Even so, some Republicans conceded that Ms. Pelosi had won this round.
“She stood her ground in the initial test,” said former Representative Tom Davis, a Republican who ran the party’s campaign committee. “I think she’s shown she’s an iron woman — and tough as nails.”
But Mr. Trump has never before faced an adversary like Speaker Nancy Pelosi.
Their latest clash, over the State of the Union address, ended with the president capitulating late Wednesday night, and agreeing to delay the speech until the government shutdown is over. Earlier in the day, Mr. Trump tried to back Ms. Pelosi into a corner by saying he intended to give the speech next Tuesday in the Capitol. She called his bluff and disinvited him.
For a president who prides himself on being a master negotiator, Ms. Pelosi is a different kind of opponent, and one who so far has flummoxed him.
Longtime friends of the president say Mr. Trump is not afraid of powerful women, respects them and has empowered them at the White House and in his business. But on the rare occasion when he was challenged by a woman, Mr. Trump was either in charge — or knew the woman had a boss, usually a man, to whom he could appeal, said Barbara A. Res, a former executive vice president of the Trump Organization.
In this case, Ms. Pelosi is her own boss. And under the Constitution, she is a leader of a branch of government that is equal to the chief executive.
“Dealing with anyone with power equal to his is a first for him — at least in his mind,” Ms. Res said. “He has the perception that he is the most powerful person in the world, and then he comes up against somebody who thinks they have as much power as he or as much control as he, and that’s a shock to him. And it’s complicated by the fact that she is a woman.”
Unlike Hillary Clinton, Ms. Pelosi is not running a race against the president and she is not going away. She also has an understanding of the way the legislative branch works that he does not. Most important, she is blocking him from getting something he desperately wants: a wall along the southern border with Mexico that was a core promise of his 2016 campaign.
“I think that he’s caught between his respect for Pelosi and his anger at her resistance,” said Michael D’Antonio, the author of “The Truth About Trump.” “He gets very frustrated when he can’t close a sale. And I think that he’s perplexed about how to get what he wants here because he respects Pelosi.”
The president went so far as to acknowledge Ms. Pelosi’s powers on Wednesday in a takedown of Senator Chuck Schumer, Democrat of New York, in what Democrats saw as a bit of projection. “I think that Chuck Schumer sadly is dominated by the radical left and he’s dominated by Nancy Pelosi, very strongly dominated,” Mr. Trump said. “He can’t move, he’s a puppet, he’s a puppet for Nancy Pelosi, if you can believe that.”
(Mr. Schumer has proved an adept negotiator in his own right, provoking the president to claim ownership of the shutdown during an Oval Office meeting in December.)
In one sense, the row over the State of the Union reveals as much about the difficulty Mr. Trump is having adjusting to life in Washington under a divided government as it does about his treatment of women. When Paul D. Ryan, a Republican, was speaker, Mr. Trump could exert leverage over Mr. Ryan, just as he can over Senator Mitch McConnell, the Republican leader. He cannot do that with Ms. Pelosi.
Gwenda Blair, another Trump biographer, said Mr. Trump typically viewed women as “easier targets” in negotiating sessions. But that is not the case for Ms. Pelosi. For starters, the only nickname he has devised for Ms. Pelosi is her own name — Nancy.
“Nancy Pelosi, or Nancy, as I call her, doesn’t want to hear the truth,” the president told reporters Wednesday at the White House — a comment that was either meant to showcase a supposedly close relationship or, alternately, diminish her by dropping her last name. But if it was an attack, it was by Trump standards unusually restrained. (Before the election, Mr. Trump tried calling Ms. Pelosi “High Tax, High Crime Nancy Pelosi” on Twitter,but it did not stick.)
“He knows how to emasculate men and he assumes that will work, and he knows how to attempt to shame women around their appearance, but he doesn’t have a useful weapon in this relationship,” Mr. D’Antonio said. “He has yet to give her a nickname, he has yet to criticize her appearance and I think he knows that would be very risky for him to do. So I think he’s stuck in a way that he’s rarely stuck.”
John Feehery, a Republican strategist who advised former Speaker J. Dennis Hastert, sees something else at work: smart politics. He said Mr. Trump treated Ms. Pelosi respectfully for a very simple reason: He respects her.
“Compared to how he treats everybody else, I think he’s been very respectful and I think that’s good politics for him,” Mr. Feehery said, adding: “You have to be careful when you’re trying to deal with the speaker. She’s got power. You don’t want to unnecessarily insult her because that’s not good politics and I don’t think it gets him a better deal.”
The speaker, for her part, has used Mr. Trump’s playbook against him. After their much-publicized Oval Office meeting, she described his demand for a wall as “like a manhood thing for him” during a private session with Democrats. The comment quickly leaked out. At other times she has cast Mr. Trump as a toddler.
“A temper tantrum by the president,” Ms. Pelosi said this month, describing Mr. Trump’s conduct during the shutdown. “I’m a mother of five, grandmother of nine. I know a temper tantrum when I see one.”
Ms. Pelosi, who is often the only woman at the negotiating table with Mr. Trump, has not been shy about correcting him. The first time he hosted her at the White House, he asserted — without evidence — that he had won the 2016 popular vote because three million to five million people had voted illegally, Ms. Pelosi told MSNBC at the time. “I said that’s just not true,” she recalled telling him.
When Mr. Trump tried to undercut Ms. Pelosi during the Oval Office session last month by suggesting she was constrained because she was facing a challenge in her bid to become speaker, she cut him off.
“Don’t characterize the strength that I bring to this meeting as the leader of the House Democrats,” she told him, in a moment that quickly went viral.
Ms. Pelosi’s allies have been celebrating.
During a closed-door meeting of Democrats, Representative James E. Clyburn of South Carolina, the No. 3. Democrat, introduced Ms. Pelosi by quoting from the ancient Chinese military treatise, Sun Tzu’s “The Art of War,” according to a Democratic aide in the room.
“Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win,” Mr. Clyburn said. Turning to Ms. Pelosi, he said, “Thank you for winning for us. Now let’s go to war.”
Ms. Pelosi replied by reminding rank-and-file lawmakers to stick together, and to hold fast to the Democrats’ position that they would not negotiate over border security with the president until the government was fully open. “Our unity is our power,” she told them, “and that is what had the president change his mind.”
Republicans portrayed Ms. Pelosi as disrespectful and tried to put a good face on Mr. Trump’s retreat. “I think the president showed some humility, which is an awesome thing,” said Representative Daniel Webster, Republican of Florida.
Even so, some Republicans conceded that Ms. Pelosi had won this round.
“She stood her ground in the initial test,” said former Representative Tom Davis, a Republican who ran the party’s campaign committee. “I think she’s shown she’s an iron woman — and tough as nails.”
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
I know what paygo is. The Republicans would never impose that on themselves. So why would Dems?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
They already imposed that on themselves. It’s the House rules that were passed on January 3rd.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Because paygo means the only way the wall could ever be reasonably proposed would be in conjunction with a way to pay for it such as amnesty, DACA permanence, and/or guest worker visas to offset the cost with tax revenue from people working here legally and paying taxes.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
It’s imposed on everything the Senate does, too, because both houses have to pass the bill.
This is “you’re locked in here with me” stuff.
timschochet
Footballguy
Pelosi: winner.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
In addition to her other political talents, she's surprisingly skilled at the snarky, social-media-ready one line jabs for an old lady. I liked this one from today:
Pelosi, asked how Trump will handle backdown on reopening government without wall money, gestures toward her office decorations: “we could plant these flowers along the border and he’d say, ‘I got my wall.’ “
Pelosi, asked how Trump will handle backdown on reopening government without wall money, gestures toward her office decorations: “we could plant these flowers along the border and he’d say, ‘I got my wall.’ “
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
A lot of people having fun with memes & snark today. From Henry Clay to Sam Rayburn to Tip O’Neil to Newt Gingrich, there have been many influential Speakers. Other lesser known names whose power was far reaching. But I think you’d find very few examples of what we saw this week.
This isn’t a partisan swipe at Trump, because I think many conservatives would agree he’s both not aligned with traditional norms or party values, and he’s a bit of schoolyard bully. The best way to handle a bully is to stand up to him.
Have never been a fan of Nancy Pelosi, but dang, she was the right woman in the right place at the right time. Grateful for her leadership.
This isn’t a partisan swipe at Trump, because I think many conservatives would agree he’s both not aligned with traditional norms or party values, and he’s a bit of schoolyard bully. The best way to handle a bully is to stand up to him.
Have never been a fan of Nancy Pelosi, but dang, she was the right woman in the right place at the right time. Grateful for her leadership.
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timschochet
Footballguy
Pelosi has historically been regarded by the right in this country as an extreme leftist. Almost all of the vitriol now targeted at AOC was once targeted at her. I think this is in large part because she was a perceived as a pushy lady from San Francisco, the city at the heart of what much of conservative America despises.
It was always a false meme. Pelosi is actually from Baltimore and she comes from machine politics, hardly liberal. Her father and brother were both mayors of Baltimore at a time when the Democratic Party was heavily controlled by a very elitist, some say corrupt, small group of people who decided everything in smoke filled back rooms. There has never been a hint that Nancy herself has been corrupt, but her experiences gives her an insight into the ways of Power politics which many ideologues don’t have and never will. She is about winning, and knows how to do it.
It was always a false meme. Pelosi is actually from Baltimore and she comes from machine politics, hardly liberal. Her father and brother were both mayors of Baltimore at a time when the Democratic Party was heavily controlled by a very elitist, some say corrupt, small group of people who decided everything in smoke filled back rooms. There has never been a hint that Nancy herself has been corrupt, but her experiences gives her an insight into the ways of Power politics which many ideologues don’t have and never will. She is about winning, and knows how to do it.
Dedfin
Footballguy
In some interview she was asked what lesson she took from her father's political experience, she said "I learned how to count".
sho nuff
Footballguy
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
Elizabeth Drew @ElizabethDrewOH Jan 25
As she left her table at a Washington restaurant Friday night, the staff cheered and applauded Nancy Pelosi. What a week she had had. Said a waitress in near tears,"We need someone who will fight for us." The Speaker carried a small white paper bag, I know not what was in it.
I wonder what was in the paper bag?
As she left her table at a Washington restaurant Friday night, the staff cheered and applauded Nancy Pelosi. What a week she had had. Said a waitress in near tears,"We need someone who will fight for us." The Speaker carried a small white paper bag, I know not what was in it.
I wonder what was in the paper bag?
Flying Spaghetti Monster
Footballguy
Pelosi is a beast, the GOP was scared to death of her and tried their best to derail her bid for Speaker including supports opponents in her district. She will go down as one of the greatest- if the greatest speakers in modern times.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
A pair of huevos. No word yet on whose.Elizabeth Drew @ElizabethDrewOH Jan 25
As she left her table at a Washington restaurant Friday night, the staff cheered and applauded Nancy Pelosi. What a week she had had. Said a waitress in near tears,"We need someone who will fight for us." The Speaker carried a small white paper bag, I know not what was in it.
I wonder what was in the paper bag?
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Flying Spaghetti Monster
Footballguy
James Daulton
Footballguy
Hopefully she's setting an example for how to deal with bullies like Trump. Stare them back in the face and they'll blink.
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
I think it was the middle class.Elizabeth Drew @ElizabethDrewOH Jan 25
As she left her table at a Washington restaurant Friday night, the staff cheered and applauded Nancy Pelosi. What a week she had had. Said a waitress in near tears,"We need someone who will fight for us." The Speaker carried a small white paper bag, I know not what was in it.
I wonder what was in the paper bag?
squistion
Footballguy
A group text between ex-Trump aides captures the feeling about Trump caving:
'Pelosi ordered everything off the menu and left Trump hanging with the bill,' one Trump ally said. 'Prez Nancy Pelosi, she runs the country now,' said an ex-WH official.
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/01/25/trump-government-shutdown-end-border-wall-1128564
'Pelosi ordered everything off the menu and left Trump hanging with the bill,' one Trump ally said. 'Prez Nancy Pelosi, she runs the country now,' said an ex-WH official.
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/01/25/trump-government-shutdown-end-border-wall-1128564
Summer Wheat
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
ren hoek
Footballguy
John Bolton @AmbJohnBolton 14h14 hours ago
Appreciate @SpeakerPelosi‘s strong statement of support. The U.S. stands united in its support of Venezuelan Interim President Juan Guaidó, and of the peaceful, constitutional transition to democracy in Venezuela.
Appreciate @SpeakerPelosi‘s strong statement of support. The U.S. stands united in its support of Venezuelan Interim President Juan Guaidó, and of the peaceful, constitutional transition to democracy in Venezuela.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I have to agree with tim here. While I'm not a big fan of Pelosi's politics, it's hard not to like her approach to leadership and well she handles some of her comic-book-like adversaries. It was a lot of fun to watch her dog-walk Trump and AOC in the same week.
Shula-holic
Footballguy
She's a tough lady. I don't agree with her on a whole lot politically but I do respect her. Given the mix of centrists from previously red districts and the new hard left she is having to manage I'd say she's doing very well so far.
timschochet
Footballguy
Nancy Pelosi announces she is opposed to impeachment:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-pelosi/pelosi-im-not-for-impeachment-washington-post-idUSKBN1QS2JG
"Impeachment is so divisive to the country that unless there’s something so compelling and overwhelming and bipartisan, I don’t think we should go down that path, because it divides the country. He’s just not worth it."
Well this is sure to create a ####storm. But I think she's right, and I think she's being very smart about this.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-pelosi/pelosi-im-not-for-impeachment-washington-post-idUSKBN1QS2JG
"Impeachment is so divisive to the country that unless there’s something so compelling and overwhelming and bipartisan, I don’t think we should go down that path, because it divides the country. He’s just not worth it."
Well this is sure to create a ####storm. But I think she's right, and I think she's being very smart about this.
timschochet
Footballguy
I'm sure people are going to argue that Pelosi has the responsibility to impeach Trump because he violated the law. And I get that argument.
But we all know impeachment would go nowhere in the Senate. So Pelosi is making a political calculation. I think she's right in doing so. But a lot of progressives are likely to be pissed off about this...
But we all know impeachment would go nowhere in the Senate. So Pelosi is making a political calculation. I think she's right in doing so. But a lot of progressives are likely to be pissed off about this...
Sheriff Bart
Footballguy
Sure. Well, that and republicans don't care about how many illegal things he has done and continues to do.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
And they should be. If you're not going to impeach Trump over the stuff that he's done during the election and since taking office, then you should never impeach anybody for anything.
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