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N'Keal Harry - NE Patriots WR

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Never too early to start dynasty discussion IMO, especially those who might be eyeing up a top pick for next year. 

6'2, 228 pounds

 

Anyone else salivating over this guy at 1.1 in dynasty? 

 

Seems to have super star written all over him. Compared to Nuk and OBJ

 

One of the best one handed catches I've ever seen

Edited by Dr. Dan

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1 hour ago, Dr. Dan said:

Never too early to start dynasty discussion IMO, especially those who might be eyeing up a top pick for next year. 

6'4, 216 pounds, 4.57 40 projection 

 

Anyone else salivating over this guy at 1.1 in dynasty? 

 

Seems to have super star written all over him. Compared to Nuk and OBJ

 

One of the best one handed catches I've ever seen

He's been pegged as the 1.1 almost unanimously by the draft forums/communities that I visit since DK Metcalf's injury.

The biggest knock against him seems to be his speed and separation.

If N'Keal goes out and runs a 4.5 with decent splits he'll be a slam dunk pick.

Edit: He's also been compared to Larry Fitzgerald

Edited by ty247
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I own 2 2019 1sts.  Right now that would be one top 6 pick and one bottom 6 pick.  I have seen Harry's name being thrown in as 1.01 and I have been paying attention in case my top 6 pick ends up near the very top.  My fear with him is that I drafted Treadwell 3 years ago and his issue was speed and separation.  I am not saying he will turn into Treadwell or that Harry isn't light years better than him, however, when I watched tape on Treadwell he seemed to dominate in College.  So for Harry truthers can you tell me what makes him better than Treadwell?

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7 minutes ago, smbkrypt24 said:

I own 2 2019 1sts.  Right now that would be one top 6 pick and one bottom 6 pick.  I have seen Harry's name being thrown in as 1.01 and I have been paying attention in case my top 6 pick ends up near the very top.  My fear with him is that I drafted Treadwell 3 years ago and his issue was speed and separation.  I am not saying he will turn into Treadwell or that Harry isn't light years better than him, however, when I watched tape on Treadwell he seemed to dominate in College.  So for Harry truthers can you tell me what makes him better than Treadwell? 

That's the question right?

I think Harry has superior hands, body control and high pointing ability compared to Laquon.  He's also bigger and looks faster than Laquon.

I think if Harry goes out and runs a mid to high 4.6 like Laquon did (4.64) then you'll have reason to worry but I don't think that'll be the case.

The speed question will be answered at the combine.

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19 minutes ago, smbkrypt24 said:

I own 2 2019 1sts.  Right now that would be one top 6 pick and one bottom 6 pick.  I have seen Harry's name being thrown in as 1.01 and I have been paying attention in case my top 6 pick ends up near the very top.  My fear with him is that I drafted Treadwell 3 years ago and his issue was speed and separation.  I am not saying he will turn into Treadwell or that Harry isn't light years better than him, however, when I watched tape on Treadwell he seemed to dominate in College.  So for Harry truthers can you tell me what makes him better than Treadwell?

My eyeballs.

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35 minutes ago, ty247 said:

He's been pegged as the 1.1 almost unanimously by the draft forums/communities that I visit since DK Metcalf's injury.

I know it's still pretty early, but some immediate opinion after Metcalf's injury was that he could still be the #1 WR in this class if he comes back in time to wow at the combine.  I'm not sure how realistic that is.

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Thanks for the discussion. the biggest issue I've seen is he is compared to Treadwell along with several of those bigger names. A little nerve wracking. 

I have 6 first rounders in 1 league, 3 in another. I should have 1.1 in both. Likely taking him and hoping for a generational talent 

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4 minutes ago, tangfoot said:

I know it's still pretty early, but some immediate opinion after Metcalf's injury was that he could still be the #1 WR in this class if he comes back in time to wow at the combine.  I'm not sure how realistic that is.

The same has been said about Rodney Anderson being the #1 RB in the class if he comes back, declares, and wows at the combine.

It's certainly possible.

I would almost make the comparison in that case to AJ Green vs Julio Jones the year they came out.  AJ Green had to prove his speed and Julio had to prove his health.

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Watching the highlights, he routinely looks like a superstar.  Several of the mocks I've seen don't have him in the 1st round though.  What gives?

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3 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

Never too early to start dynasty discussion IMO, especially those who might be eyeing up a top pick for next year. 

6'4, 216 pounds, 4.57 40 projection 

 

Anyone else salivating over this guy at 1.1 in dynasty? 

 

Seems to have super star written all over him. Compared to Nuk and OBJ

 

One of the best one handed catches I've ever seen

Depends where he goes. he could very well be drafted by Buffalo and that takes him off my chart. Horrible FFL playoff weather and QB is not exactly stellar.

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1 hour ago, lod001 said:

Depends where he goes. he could very well be drafted by Buffalo and that takes him off my chart. Horrible FFL playoff weather and QB is not exactly stellar.

seeing him to the Jets possibly. I'd love that destination. Bills would be a for sure pass for me 

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1 hour ago, jm192 said:

Watching the highlights, he routinely looks like a superstar.  Several of the mocks I've seen don't have him in the 1st round though.  What gives?

He's likely a top 10 pick depending on his 40

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Jets would be a good landing spot. 49ers would be ideal but I think Shanahan is infatuated with little speedy guys.

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Speed isn't the issue so much as quickness. Quickness is arguably more important than raw speed in football. Anquan Boldin wasn't fast, but he could separate because he was quick out of breaks. Same with Allen Robinson (4.60), Keenan Allen (4.71), and Hopkins (4.57). Crabtree is another one. Not overly fast, but quick change of direction and a quick first step. I don't think Harry's 40 time is hugely important as long as he doesn't run something awful or phenomenal. It's more about his quickness and whether or not he'll be able to separate.

With the taller WRs, this is usually a bit of a concern. They tend to be more rigid and deliberate in their movement than the smaller guys since their size allows them to be less mobile. I had worries about guys like Mike Evans, Kelvin Benjamin, and Mike Williams in this department. Obviously Evans has panned out in a big way, but the others have been more inconsistent so far. Treadwell is a good shout as well. I liked him in college, but I didn't quite love him. Limited RAC skills, low YPR, and just didn't seem as loose athletically as some of my favorite past NCAA WRs like Blackmon, Dez, Demaryius, and Crabtree.

I've not seen a lot of Harry and I'm not going to act like an expert on his game, but my early verdict is that he's somewhere in the middle. For a big guy, he shows some suddenness in his routes and obviously he's had some impressive RAC plays. On the other hand, I don't see the kick returner agility of Demaryius, JuJu, etc. I don't think he's as athletic as Vincent Jackson or Larry Fitzgerald. People like Beckham who were mentioned in this thread are probably not the right comparison since they're ultra high end athletes in terms of explosiveness, fluidity, and overall mobility. However, Harry is a lot bigger than Beckham and doesn't need to be that athletic to win.

It's really early and I reserve the right to change my opinion, but right now I'd have him in Mike Williams territory, meaning he's probably going to be a high pick, but I don't personally see him as a can't-miss prospect yet.

Edited by EBF
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Sutton is probably a pretty solid comp for Harry.  All WRs seem a bit difficult to determine just how well or poorly their game will translate at the next level, but Harry wins the same way Sutton does - he’s definitely athletic enough and he wins with body position, catch radius, getting his hands to the ball before the DB does, and then surely securing the ball.  He’s a load to handle and when he’s in the open field he can create additional yards with his athleticism as well as his size.

Separation is a definite plus in the NFL, but it isn’t the only way for a WR to win.  Just like Sutton, he’ll create mismatches with his size, positioning, and winning 50/50 opportunities and he’ll be a dominant asset in the red zone.  A lot of being successful as a WR is winning the QB’s trust - if the QB puts the ball out there for him will he come down with it?  Harry can turn questionable passes into completions.  IMO, like Sutton he’ll earn that trust and be a potential star at the next level.

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17 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

Thanks for the discussion. the biggest issue I've seen is he is compared to Treadwell along with several of those bigger names. A little nerve wracking. 

 

Like Sutton was.  It’s a lazy comparison.

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10 hours ago, Bronco Billy said:

 

Like Sutton was.  It’s a lazy comparison.

JuJu was compared to Treadwell too even though there were few stylistic comparisons (agile RAC receiver vs. catch radius/jump ball possession guy).

I feel like Treadwell is just the current WR bogeyman of the moment that any big-ish WR with 4.50+ wheels will be compared to, even if it doesn't fit.

In this case I do think there are some similarities, but I don't recall Laquon ever making the plays after the catch that we've seen from Harry.

The metrics guys didn't love Treadwell and I think part of that was his abysmal YPR, even in college. Few signs of explosiveness.

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14 hours ago, Bronco Billy said:

Sutton is probably a pretty solid comp for Harry.  All WRs seem a bit difficult to determine just how well or poorly their game will translate at the next level, but Harry wins the same way Sutton does - he’s definitely athletic enough and he wins with body position, catch radius, getting his hands to the ball before the DB does, and then surely securing the ball.  He’s a load to handle and when he’s in the open field he can create additional yards with his athleticism as well as his size.

Separation is a definite plus in the NFL, but it isn’t the only way for a WR to win.  Just like Sutton, he’ll create mismatches with his size, positioning, and winning 50/50 opportunities and he’ll be a dominant asset in the red zone.  A lot of being successful as a WR is winning the QB’s trust - if the QB puts the ball out there for him will he come down with it?  Harry can turn questionable passes into completions.  IMO, like Sutton he’ll earn that trust and be a potential star at the next level.

STRONGLY disagree Sutton and Harry are nothing like.

Tex

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17 minutes ago, BigTex said:

STRONGLY disagree Sutton and Harry are nothing like.

Tex

 

Oh, that’s right.  You saw Sutton live a few times in college and told all of us he wasn’t very good.  

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9 hours ago, Bronco Billy said:

 

Oh, that’s right.  You saw Sutton live a few times in college and told all of us he wasn’t very good.  

We all make some bad calls here and there - but when new evidence comes to light we should be willing to reevaluate and not necessarily double down. Sutton isn't proven at the NFL level yet but his arrow is surely pointing in the right direction.

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8 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

We all make some bad calls here and there - but when new evidence comes to light we should be willing to reevaluate and not necessarily double down. Sutton isn't proven at the NFL level yet but his arrow is surely pointing in the right direction.

 

He was pretty assertive that Sutton couldn’t play in the NFL based upon his first hand experience of being at SMU games.  I don’t see how anyone could think that now.

I miss my share or more too.  But to “strongly disagree” that Sutton’s game and Harry’s game are similar is going to need a bit more support than simply that statement if it’s going to be taken with any degree of seriousness.

 

.

Edited by Bronco Billy
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43 minutes ago, Bronco Billy said:

 

He was pretty assertive that Sutton couldn’t play in the NFL based upon his first hand experience of being at SMU games.  I don’t see how anyone could think that now.

I miss my share or more too.  But to “strongly disagree” that Sutton’s game and Harry’s game are similar is going to need a bit more support than simply that statement if it’s going to be taken with any degree of seriousness.

 

.

I quoted you but I was more directing the comment at him. I remember that discussion as well - and I find it a bit strange he's still taking a hardline anti-Sutton stance.

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50 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

I quoted you but I was more directing the comment at him. I remember that discussion as well - and I find it a bit strange he's still taking a hardline anti-Sutton stance.

 

Thanks for the clarification.

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2 hours ago, Bronco Billy said:

 

He was pretty assertive that Sutton couldn’t play in the NFL based upon his first hand experience of being at SMU games.  I don’t see how anyone could think that now.

I miss my share or more too.  But to “strongly disagree” that Sutton’s game and Harry’s game are similar is going to need a bit more support than simply that statement if it’s going to be taken with any degree of seriousness.

 

.

Sutton has proven he can play in the NFL already. He is most definitely not an bust. Hes not a superstar, yet, but he is most definitely not a bust

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just watched some highlights. Dude has moves after the catch. Gonna move him into top 3 at WR and I now think I could put him above Sutton as a prospect.  

If they can teach him how to use those moves in his routes, he will gain separation. At 6'-3" and separating form DBs he'd be a nightmare.

Edited by lod001
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10 hours ago, lod001 said:

just watched some highlights. Dude has moves after the catch. Gonna move him into top 3 at WR and I now think I could put him above Sutton as a prospect.  

If they can teach him how to use those moves in his routes, he will gain separation. At 6'-3" and separating form DBs he'd be a nightmare.

If you're looking for separation go look at the dudes game today.  

Absolutely killed it.

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I traded 2018 1.7 for a 2019 1st and 2nd. That will turn into 2019 1.1 and 2.1. 

I need WR help, hoping he runs a 4.5.

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1 hour ago, metoo said:

I traded 2018 1.7 for a 2019 1st and 2nd. That will turn into 2019 1.1 and 2.1. 

I need WR help, hoping he runs a 4.5.

I am hoping I can turn at least one of my picks in a similar spot into the same. I have 6 first rounders and I want to push one or two to 2020

Edited by Dr. Dan

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8 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

I am hoping I can turn at least one of my picks in a similar spot into the same. I have 6 first rounders and I want to push one or two to 2020

I had 3 2019 firsts and was able to turn a mid to late 2019 into a 2020 pick. As a RB needy team I felt the need to diversify and pick up some 2020 lottery tickets. 

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On 10/30/2018 at 2:01 PM, matuski said:

My eyeballs.

:yes:  All you have to do is watch.  He knows how to use his size and strength.

He does get separation, he makes tough catches, he breaks tackles.

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59 minutes ago, matuski said:

:yes:  All you have to do is watch.  He knows how to use his size and strength.

He does get separation, he makes tough catches, he breaks tackles.

He' needs to impress good enough to get into the 1st round but not good enough for the teams with hack QBs to take him. No chance the Raiders get him in the 1st but also no chance the 48ers do either. Buffalo has to be out I would think because they are too close to the top of the 1st. Jets, Browns Colts, yes! Cowboys, please no.

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The Draft Network's Benjamin Solak believes there are "warranted concerns" in Arizona State junior WR N'Keal Harry game.

Solak explains, "While he seems to have great long speed, it doesn’t show up on his deep routes, and he fails to recruit his hands in a lot of his route stems to discourage physicality. He seems a bit like a player so physically gifted, he doesn’t like to do the little stuff." Solak isn't completely down on Harry though and thinks he could "test through the roof" and is " unbelievably productive." Harry is one of the top names to monitor among wide receivers in this draft cycle.

Source: The Draft Network

Nov 4 - 10:22 AM

 

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On 11/3/2018 at 10:11 PM, metoo said:

I traded 2018 1.7 for a 2019 1st and 2nd. That will turn into 2019 1.1 and 2.1. 

I need WR help, hoping he runs a 4.5.

Good job!

Tex

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N'Keal Harry - WR -  Sun Devils

THe Draft Network's Jon Ledyard projects the Raiders to take Arizona State WR N'Keal Harry with the 24th pick in his latest mock draft.

Khalil Mack for N'Keal Harry, who says no? This is the pick that would have been the Bears if not for the trade, if you don't get that reference. Harry put up big numbers at Arizona State, but he's been sort of a volatile prospect among analysts in his time with the Sun Devils. "Harry is big and strong with high-point and post-catch ability, but how he tests will be critical," writes Ledyard. "His athleticism appears decidedly average in space, and separation could be an issue that haunts him." The Raiders certainly have a need at wideout, and if he does test well at the combine, it's more than feasible that he could go in this area of the draft.

Source: The Draft Network

Jan 21 - 7:22 PM

 

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Let me preface this by saing I like Harry quite a bit, but I do see some striking similarities to my like of him, and my like of Kevin White when he was coming out.  Now we don't know for sure what White would of been had he not been injured, that seems fair, but there are some similarities that I remember someone pointing out to me about Kevin White at the time.  I'm learning from my mistakes and I'm proceeding with some caution here.  

His comps are literally from bust Treadwell to superstar Nuk, and he could fall anywhere in that range, but I do like him a lot.  

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9 hours ago, Zyphros said:

Let me preface this by saing I like Harry quite a bit, but I do see some striking similarities to my like of him, and my like of Kevin White when he was coming out.  Now we don't know for sure what White would of been had he not been injured, that seems fair, but there are some similarities that I remember someone pointing out to me about Kevin White at the time.  I'm learning from my mistakes and I'm proceeding with some caution here.  

His comps are literally from bust Treadwell to superstar Nuk, and he could fall anywhere in that range, but I do like him a lot.  

I actually think he's not at all a comp to Kevin White. White never touched a D1 playing field untill age 21. During that year he was 3rd on the team in receptions. N'Keal Harry was 18 years old when he led ASU in receptions. 

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At this point, he is my 1.01. Checks all the boxes at this point: college production, produced at a very young age, physically looks the part, succeeded in special teams, health. 

Things that could  change my evaluation would be a poor workout or getting drafted to a bad spot (Buffalo, Jacksonville). If he runs slow, doesn't jump high, etc and comes out as a weak athlete than I think he has to get knocked way back. As long as he tests out as an average athlete, then I think his production and eyetest warrants keeping him on the top. 

Edited by Ilov80s
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59 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I actually think he's not at all a comp to Kevin White. White never touched a D1 playing field untill age 21. During that year he was 3rd on the team in receptions. N'Keal Harry was 18 years old when he led ASU in receptions. 

The production helps easy my concerns about that comp but there are other things as well.  Like how well he separates, like he lines up on one side almost exclusively, how there are questions about his route running.  I think his routes are the least of those concerns but then again I thought the same about White. 

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Just now, Zyphros said:

The production helps easy my concerns about that comp but there are other things as well.  Like how well he separates, like he lines up on one side almost exclusively, how there are questions about his route running.  I think his routes are the least of those concerns but then again I thought the same about White. 

Fair points and I can see how someone who liked White a lot might be gunshy. I was anti-White and it was all based around the idea that for such an incredible athlete, how did it take him so long to impactful at the college level. A player with his off the charts athletic gifts should have been dominating earlier. Harry doesn't have that worry. To me  the worry for Harry is more Treadwell than White. His early age production already ends the White comp. Harry was able to walk into the Pac 10 at age 18 and immediatley be the focus of the passing offense. That puts him way ahead of White. The Treadwell athleticism hurlde is all that is left for him IMO. 

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8 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

how did it take him so long to impactful at the college level.

Didn't he start out in juco?

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3 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

Didn't he start out in juco?

Yes which was part of his red flags, here is an article quote

Quote

 

His transformation began with overdue paperwork. In the spring of 2011 White was finishing his redshirt freshman year at Lackawanna College, a school with an enrollment of 1,500 in Scranton, Pa. He had arrived there in ’10 because his grades coming out of Emmaus (Pa.) High weren’t good enough to qualify for a Division I scholarship. The time had come to select his courses for the upcoming semester.

Only he didn’t do it. Then he failed to fill out his financial aid forms. Suddenly the player who talent evaluators now peg as a can’t-miss prospect couldn’t even suit up for the junior college Lackawanna Falcons.

 

https://www.si.com/college-football/2014/11/19/kevin-white-west-virginia-mountaineers

1. Grades weren't good enough in HS. Now sometimes people have learning disabilities, are immature, etc.

2. Missed the deadline to register for classes for his sophomore year of school

3. Missed the deadline for financial aid. 

So it took him 3 years to get through Juco. I don't know what Lackawanna's offense looked like but he only caught 4 passes a game there for 500 yards and 6 TDs. I will give him the benefit of the doubt that they just didn't throw much. Then as a 4th year college player at WVU, again he was the 3rd leading receiver on the team. From such a special athlete who is getting picked top 10 in the NFL draft, those first 4 years after high school were a major red flag. 

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An anonymous scout tells Bob McGinn Football that Arizona State WR N'Keal Harry reminds him of Tampa Bay Buccaneers WR Mike Evans.

The scout tells McGinn that they have a similar athletic background, and both can win with size (Harry is listed at 6'4/213). "Kind of a deceptive speed guy," the scout tells McGinn. "More of an acrobatic type receiver. From what people say at Arizona State, he’s just a terrific person." Harry has his fans -- and some who are not so sold on the wideout -- but if he gets more comps to a star like Evans, he has a chance to be among the first wideouts selected. The combine is going to be massive for him.

Source: Bob McGinn Football 

Jan 29 - 10:07 PM

 

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On 10/30/2018 at 1:41 PM, smbkrypt24 said:

I own 2 2019 1sts.  Right now that would be one top 6 pick and one bottom 6 pick.  I have seen Harry's name being thrown in as 1.01 and I have been paying attention in case my top 6 pick ends up near the very top.  My fear with him is that I drafted Treadwell 3 years ago and his issue was speed and separation.  I am not saying he will turn into Treadwell or that Harry isn't light years better than him, however, when I watched tape on Treadwell he seemed to dominate in College.  So for Harry truthers can you tell me what makes him better than Treadwell?

Laquon Treadwell did most of his damage in college running crossing routes and being stronger than defensive backs after the catch which led to broken tackles and decent YAC.

While i am sure Harry can win on crossing routes too, that isn't his bread and butter. He can win deep too.

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