Henry Ford
Footballguy
I haven't heard her account, I've only read articles about it. And they make sense to me.
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Amy Klobuchar for President 2020 (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter TobiasFunke
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Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
I find them true, but embellished, and I believe needlessly so.
No different than her touting the # of bills she has passed as if she is out there legislating up a storm on national issues constantly, rather than her having addressed a myriad of insubstantial matters as well as several national ones, but far fewer than implied.
A venal sin at best, self-serving exaggeration by a politician, sure.
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Maybe I should have allowed someone without sin to cast the stone at this venal sin, since I am definitely not that person without sin.
Phil Elliott
Footballguy
Yes we were in the same boat but Dr was able to authorize 4 days.
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
Interesting clip from 2006 Amy talking about the border.
https://twitter.com/WalkerBragman/status/1227486350733172738
https://twitter.com/WalkerBragman/status/1227486350733172738
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Yup. Just look at the increase in traffic in this thread recently for the sole purpose of posting dirt.
With the internet people are going to be able to dig up all kinds of random sound bites in a vacuum / out of context and weave attack narratives around them. That's the advantage someone with almost zero track record like Buttigieg has.
So be it. She's tough. The bigger challenge is resources.
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Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Drunken Cowboy
Footballguy
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
"We should secure the border and give immigrants a pathway to citizenship" used to be a mainstream position held by completely normal people until Trump came along. This clip is a nice reminder of that.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Sure. It was mainstream. But it was always a BS, straddle-the-fence, fear-laden position. “Secure the border” only with Mexico - don’t bother securing the Canadian border, because the perception Americans have is that most Canadians are white, aka “safe.”
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
If you're a "border security" person, the reason why you're not worried about the Canadian border is because illegal immigration from Canada is trivial compared to the volume of illegal immigration from Mexico. There's no reason to assume a racist motivation for that position.
I mostly don't care about securing the border -- I'm not opposed to more border security, but it's not something I have much of an opinion about one way or the other. That said, if more border security will calm people down and make it easier to liberalize our immigration process, that's a great trade-off IMO.
Don Quixote
Footballguy
Well, I got you joffer by 3 minutes.joffer said:
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Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
I don’t disagree with the above. It’s pragmatic and rational. Sadly, it reminds me of the stupid things I have to do at work to manipulate people into doing the right thing.
Border security has always been about optics more than impact.
roadkill1292
Footballguy
I don't think digging up dirt on candidates works any more. Sure, go back 35 years and there's Bernie saying nice things about the commie USSR and Bloomburg treated minorities abominably when he was mayor and Klobuchar treated her underlings abysmally and on and on. It was proven four years ago that that stuff doesn't matter because we elected somebody with lots more skeletons in his closet than all of the Dems combined. Worse, he's given credence to our misgivings by his appalling ignorance and childish behavior -- he's who we thought he was -- and he's favored to win again in November.
So hurl your dirt. I don't think I care. More, I don't think you care if you vote for Donald Trump.
So hurl your dirt. I don't think I care. More, I don't think you care if you vote for Donald Trump.
joffer
Footballguy
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
My wife and I are highly educated lawyers and neither of us could have worked a remote control in the 24 hours after my son was born. I was just tired from the constant crying. My wife was exhausted and in severe pain.
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
That goes to the value of the idea, not to her exaggeration of her tale to make herself more heroic. I have not been speaking out against the idea. I have questioned the veracity of her origin story, a bit. My questions do not disqualify her in my mind. They just give me pause to actually think about what she says and how she says it. I do the same with nearly everybody. It is a habit after years of prosecuting.
rockaction
Footballguy
I keep coming back to her and this thread as well as Mayor Pete's. I don't think I can vote for Donald Trump this time around -- and didn't last time -- but I am less likely to vote third party, and I find myself sort of hoping she can be the wonky, drama-free President that we need, IMHO.
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Certainly she would be drama-free compared to Trump, likely compared also to Obama, Bush, and Clinton. She is well-educated. My concern with her is that she has remarkably little executive administrative experience. I can appreciate, however, that maybe judgment makes up for some of that. Maybe Presidents need only to set a tone, a philosophical course, a set of goals and then allow their cabinet and the professional administrators already in all of the agencies and departments to do their jobs.
rockaction
Footballguy
I share your concern about executive experience as opposed to merely legislative experience. I worry about all the Democratic candidates' foreign policy mettle as commander-in-chief and I wonder how they will handle other duties incumbent upon the executive branch. I'm not even sure what sort of team she'd put in place. So there are still a lot of questions, but every time I hear her speak, I'm enticed.
Although, I totally agree with you about something I also pointed out upthread about her touting her legislative accomplishments like they were really something when in reality most of them were appropriations-type stuff.
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Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Maybe I place too much emphasis on this. In the end our past governors who have assumed the role have not really been without a learning curve. Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter …. Maybe the job is so unique that nobody is prepared, we just need intelligence, emotional maturity, and philosophical bent.
rockaction
Footballguy
I don't think you place too much emphasis on it. I think being prepared as governor is a lot different than as senator. People have certainly preferred governors as presidential winners since the seventies -- before Obama, that is, sometimes for the reason of experience. A cabinet is different from a legislative staff. The ins and outs of the executive terrain and the balancing of powerful departments at the ready is unlike anything a senator will have done, IMHO. Deployment of the proper departments with the proper charges is something one would get a feel for as governor that one could not possibly experience as legislator.
Anyway, I'm just saying the same thing over and over, so I'll stop now.
Here's my take, just in general, and why this is likely now a thread I'll visit consistently. I worry about foreign policy the most of anything. I worry about stability in domestic politics and economy second. And third, I worry about political corruption and plutocracy or oligarchy becoming our form of government instead of keeping a republic.
Trump satisfies none of those concerns for me. I don't feel assuaged foreign policy-wise with our muddling the waters with NATO and other actions, I'm worried about the trillion dollar deficit undermining future earnings and growth, and I'm worried that we're headed down a more authoritarian path than I'd like.
So...Klobuchar. Step up. All ears.
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Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
The difference is that governors have executive experience. They have run and managed very large organizations. Senators don’t have that - at best, they run a small staff of people. And in Klobuchar’s case, it sounds like her style of running that small staff has been.....a challenge for those around her......
Anyway, when you vote for most senators, it’s likely that they don’t have much (if any) executive experience. Obama had basically none when he got elected.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
Obama never had any executive experience before becoming president. He barely had any government experience of any kind. And he did just fine.
I agree with DW that wisdom is a lot more important than experience for a position like this.
I agree with DW that wisdom is a lot more important than experience for a position like this.
McBokonon
Footballguy
This is part of the reason I think Castro is her ideal running mate if she gets that far.
roadkill1292
Footballguy
He's a good candidate regardless of the eventual nominee. I think there's lots of good Dem veep choices and I hope we go younger with the eventual selection. We need the next generation to step up and take charge.
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
They also said that four years of Sanders would be four more years of Trump. That's...stretching it to say the least. Inapt analogy there.
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
I like taking a good VP candidate from a key state that could help in an election and have been impressed the little that I have heard from Sen Sherrod Brown from Ohio. I think he and Klobuchar are on the same page. Approval rating isn’t bad...would that help bring home the all important state for the ticket?
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Nevermind. She's lost her mind.
Democratic presidential candidate Amy Klobuchar says she no longer believes English should be the national language of the U.S., disavowing a vote she took more than a decade ago as she tries to build support in a state where Hispanics make up a critical constituency.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
Yeah, English is already not the official language of the U.S.
Klobuchar's current position on this is decidedly mainstream.
Klobuchar's current position on this is decidedly mainstream.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
the moops
Footballguy
Somehow I doubt you were ever voting for anyone but Trump if this is what you consider losing ones mind
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
It’s interesting that Amy was apparently in favor of making English the official language back in 2007. I know this has been an idea that liberals have been against for many years.
Mystery Achiever
Footballguy
Yes, there was more support than I would have expected:
"Klobuchar was one of 17 Democrats to support a 2007 amendment that would have reversed President Bill Clinton's executive order requiring federal agencies to provide materials in languages other than English. It passed 64-33, but the larger immigration bill died.
Klobuchar joined other moderate Democrats and Democrats from red states, like Montana Sen. Max Baucus and North Dakota Sen. Kent Conrad, in voting yes. Among those who voted no were 2020 candidates Bernie Sanders, a senator from Vermont, and Joe Biden, then a senator from Delaware. Barack Obama, then a senator from Illinois, and Harry Reid, then a senator from Nevada, also voted no."
"Klobuchar was one of 17 Democrats to support a 2007 amendment that would have reversed President Bill Clinton's executive order requiring federal agencies to provide materials in languages other than English. It passed 64-33, but the larger immigration bill died.
Klobuchar joined other moderate Democrats and Democrats from red states, like Montana Sen. Max Baucus and North Dakota Sen. Kent Conrad, in voting yes. Among those who voted no were 2020 candidates Bernie Sanders, a senator from Vermont, and Joe Biden, then a senator from Delaware. Barack Obama, then a senator from Illinois, and Harry Reid, then a senator from Nevada, also voted no."
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
My objection to Klobuchar is that, in close to a year of watching her, i've never seen her add anything fresh on any issue. All variations upon "We should handle that sensibly". Got nothing against her, but even less for her and have never thought her candidacy was based on any more than "oo - I'm on TV" during the Kavanaugh hearings
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Klobuchar just had her Aleppo moment.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
i dunno - starting to get the feeling America wants a mom after three years of deadbeat dad
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Not that I personally am the benchmark. But I didn't know what Aleppo was in 2016. I do know who the President of Mexico is now (and can also name his predecessor).
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wikkidpissah
Footballguy
This is just ignorant. Please show me which other candidate has anything close to a plan for the national debt.
Senator Klobuchar's plan would seek to “reverse this trend with the goal of lowering the debt to GDP ratio by the end of her first term and putting our country on a sustainable fiscal path.”
The plan includes a commitment to “Govern with Fiscal Responsibility” by reducing debt as a share of Gross Domestic Product (GDP) and “putting our country on a sustainable fiscal path.” To begin this process, Senator Klobuchar proposes to establish a dedicated fund to finance deficit reduction during normal times and stimulus during economic downturns, eliminate duplicative government programs, and move to biennial budgeting with a 25-year budget window.
During normal economic times, new revenue increases or cost savings dedicated to the fund would go toward deficit reduction. During economic downturns, the fund would automatically be tapped to increase funding for government programs
Senator Klobuchar plans to “initially seed the fund" with $300 billion from raising the corporate tax rate and eliminating duplicative government spending.
http://www.crfb.org/blogs/amy-klobuchars-plan-govern-fiscal-responsibility
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