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2020: The Race For the White House - The Good Place

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1 hour ago, jamny said:

Just found out Beto O'Rourke is 46? That's kinda surprising. He acts.....much younger. :oldunsure: 

How so?

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Maybe K Harris should not rush to judgement on Smollett case before claiming white lynching...  this is inexcusable and rookie move.  Disappointed..

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2 hours ago, jamny said:

Just found out Beto O'Rourke is 46? That's kinda surprising. He acts.....much younger. :oldunsure: 

congrats?

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1 hour ago, The General said:

How so?

Just some observations from the limited things I've seen. I would have guessed 40, tops.

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California’s move to Super Tuesday hands Harris a big edge in 2020

‘Our strategy runs straight through California,’ says a top adviser. But a subpar performance in her home state could also sink Harris’ candidacy.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/02/16/kamala-harris-california-2020-strategy-1173320

 

Absent a collapse in the debates, or some other snafu - this is why Harris has to be considered the favorite at this stage.

 

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16 hours ago, jamny said:

Just found out Beto O'Rourke is 46? That's kinda surprising. He acts.....much younger. :oldunsure: 

I was aware of his age - but agree with the general sentiment that he acts a bit younger. 

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I like Bernie’s politics, but for the love of god do not hand the Presidency to Trump in 2020, Bernie supporters.

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1 hour ago, Jobber said:

I like Bernie’s politics, but for the love of god do not hand the Presidency to Trump in 2020, Bernie supporters.

Yes...I wish he would instead work to form policy and platform rather than derail other candidates or divide things up.

Democrats cannot afford to have that big division...it cost them big time last election.

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4 hours ago, sho nuff said:

Yes...I wish he would instead work to form policy and platform rather than derail other candidates or divide things up.

Democrats cannot afford to have that big division...it cost them big time last election.

Not following.  Bernie kept soley to the policies in the last election.  What should he have done differently?

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6 hours ago, Jobber said:

I like Bernie’s politics, but for the love of god do not hand the Presidency to Trump in 2020, Bernie supporters.

Don't start this. Bernie would have won in 2016 and would win in 2020. I know he isn't liked because his ideas are too earth shattering for you third way types so let's not even start the argument and we will be happy, thanks.

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8 minutes ago, The Commish said:

Not following.  Bernie kept soley to the policies in the last election.  What should he have done differently?

Not run?  Still push others to the narrative. I don’t fault him for the last one and I may not have worded that well.   But now?  We know his followers may very well stick with him and them sit out.  We can’t have that again IMO.

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3 minutes ago, Dedfin said:

Don't start this. Bernie would have won in 2016 and would win in 2020. I know he isn't liked because his ideas are too earth shattering for you third way types so let's not even start the argument and we will be happy, thanks.

Hey man, I believe he would have won in 2016 and would in 2020. I like him a lot. But if for whatever reason he doesn’t win the nom, we must all support and vote for the nominee. Even if they are not our perfect candidate.

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6 minutes ago, Jobber said:

Hey man, I believe he would have won in 2016 and would in 2020. I like him a lot. But if for whatever reason he doesn’t win the nom, we must all support and vote for the nominee. Even if they are not our perfect candidate.

Ohhh sorry dude, I misread you. I'm a Bernie supporter and I voted for H in 16. I'll vote for whoever I need to in 20. I think the number of Bernie or no one is greatly exaggerated, but just mho. Sorry I took your post the wrong way.

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35 minutes ago, sho nuff said:

Not run?  Still push others to the narrative. I don’t fault him for the last one and I may not have worded that well.   But now?  We know his followers may very well stick with him and them sit out.  We can’t have that again IMO.

All that changes is there wouldn't have been a primary.  It would have STILL been Hillary vs Donny.  Him not being in the race wouldn't have changed that :shrug: 

Some might sit out....if they do, the party reaps what they sow.  If they want to actively burn bridges to push their person, they can't be mad that those they burned don't want to rebuild the bridge.  That's not how it works.

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I’m just saying I don’t think they can handle a splintered party or a nasty campaign. 

Bernie gettin in may increase the chances of that.

Edited by sho nuff

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13 hours ago, sho nuff said:

I’m just saying I don’t think they can handle a splintered party or a nasty campaign. 

Bernie gettin in may increase the chances of that.

This is up to the DNC leadership more than anyone else.  Do things on the up and up and there's plenty of room for debate among the candidates.  I do believe Bernie's message will be lost a bit as many have taken on his policies and are much younger with more up side.  Right or wrong, there is a desire for a party to reflect more the diversity of the country and unfortunately Bernie will probably be seen as "the old white guy who's typical in politics" by those wanting to change it up a bit.

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Bernie’s supporters last time were quite passionate, but this time around there are more than one progressive candidates. So it will be interesting to see how many progressive voters stick with Bernie. 

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The normal Democratic Nomination process will be repeatedly descirbed as "Democtrats in Disarray", by a lazy press. It's ultimately the forum for debating national policy. So let's mix it up, throw a few elbows if necesary and coalesce around our candidate as we all know we MUST do in the end. 

I look forward to debate on the issues.

And I'll slam all the "she used the wrong hot sauce" coverage.   

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1 hour ago, The Commish said:

This is up to the DNC leadership more than anyone else.  Do things on the up and up and there's plenty of room for debate among the candidates.  I do believe Bernie's message will be lost a bit as many have taken on his policies and are much younger with more up side.  Right or wrong, there is a desire for a party to reflect more the diversity of the country and unfortunately Bernie will probably be seen as "the old white guy who's typical in politics" by those wanting to change it up a bit.

Yes and no...it’s also up to those supporters to not get so whipped into a Bernie frenzy that they get let down and don’t vote against someone like Trump this time.

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I think last Dem cycle was a perfect storm - unlikeable candidate, plausible conspiracy of "the fix is in", and "no way we elect Trump".

 

It feels a little like the Dem machine is circling the wagons around Harris - but I think the process will be a much more open contest than 2016.  I do think all of the candidates will get a fair shake, and a good candidate will emerge from the process.

And, I think you will have a lot of people motivated to vote against Trump - and that motivation did not exist in 2016.

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1 hour ago, sho nuff said:

Yes and no...it’s also up to those supporters to not get so whipped into a Bernie frenzy that they get let down and don’t vote against someone like Trump this time.

They don't get "whipped into a Bernie frenzy" if the DNC doesn't do shady ####.  It's not that complicated :shrug:  What happened last cycle is all traced back to the shady behavior.  This notion of "suck it up and vote for her anyway" wasn't going to fly, nor should it.  The DNC dug their own hole, it's not up to Bernie supporters to fill it.

As I said before, if they just let this play out like it should with no thumbs on the scales etc, this is a moot point.  I don't think they'll have any problem rallying support against Trump.

 

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2 hours ago, timschochet said:

Bernie’s supporters last time were quite passionate, but this time around there are more than one progressive candidates. So it will be interesting to see how many progressive voters stick with Bernie. 

All of them, outside of Booker it seems, are similar and it will not take a lot to jump from one to the other.  I personally think Bernie's window is closed, which sucks, but there's no question this set of candidates were all inspired by him in one way or the other and were shown that there is actually a place for progressives in the party and that it's ok to run on the platform the Dems profess to be for.  That's a huge step for that party IMO.

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3 minutes ago, The Commish said:

All of them, outside of Booker it seems, are similar and it will not take a lot to jump from one to the other.  I personally think Bernie's window is closed, which sucks, but there's no question this set of candidates were all inspired by him in one way or the other and were shown that there is actually a place for progressives in the party and that it's ok to run on the platform the Dems profess to be for.  That's a huge step for that party IMO.

You don’t think Klobuchar is a little right of the pack? And Biden as well if he gets in? 

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3 minutes ago, timschochet said:

You don’t think Klobuchar is a little right of the pack? And Biden as well if he gets in? 

What policy is to the right?  She wants to expand education, thinks corporate money in politics is an issue and wants Medicare for All.  

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22 minutes ago, The Commish said:

What policy is to the right?  She wants to expand education, thinks corporate money in politics is an issue and wants Medicare for All.  

It seems to me that she has expressed some pro-business views that the others may not share- I’ll have to look. 

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48 minutes ago, The Commish said:

They don't get "whipped into a Bernie frenzy" if the DNC doesn't do shady ####.  It's not that complicated :shrug:  What happened last cycle is all traced back to the shady behavior.  This notion of "suck it up and vote for her anyway" wasn't going to fly, nor should it.  The DNC dug their own hole, it's not up to Bernie supporters to fill it.

As I said before, if they just let this play out like it should with no thumbs on the scales etc, this is a moot point.  I don't think they'll have any problem rallying support against Trump.

 

Maybe and I agree that was a huge part.  But will some be let down if it’s not a progressive candidate amdnstay home?  I hope that’s not the case.

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7 hours ago, The Commish said:

What policy is to the right?  She wants to expand education, thinks corporate money in politics is an issue and wants Medicare for All.  

Where has she said this?

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1 hour ago, -fish- said:

Where has she said this?

Yea, pretty sure she has come out and said she is not for Medicare for all at this time. 

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She should be out for all decent people then.

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On 2/17/2019 at 12:46 PM, Jobber said:

I like Bernie’s politics, but for the love of god do not hand the Presidency to Trump in 2020, Bernie supporters.

Don't run a corporate or centrist, not that hard.  Run someone that represents your base.

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On 2/17/2019 at 6:51 PM, sho nuff said:

Not run?  Still push others to the narrative. I don’t fault him for the last one and I may not have worded that well.   But now?  We know his followers may very well stick with him and them sit out.  We can’t have that again IMO.

You will have that again unless you run a candidate that wants what the base does.  What we can't have is elites running that don't mirror what the base wants.  The centrists running, backed by corporate dollars are the problem, not the people who vote against them.

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10 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

I think last Dem cycle was a perfect storm - unlikeable candidate, plausible conspiracy of "the fix is in", and "no way we elect Trump".

 

It feels a little like the Dem machine is circling the wagons around Harris - but I think the process will be a much more open contest than 2016.  I do think all of the candidates will get a fair shake, and a good candidate will emerge from the process.

And, I think you will have a lot of people motivated to vote against Trump - and that motivation did not exist in 2016.

Harris is weak on policies and a liar.  Doesn't get my vote.  If the Dem for President isn't first issue MFA.  They don't get my vote, if I think they are Corporate backed, probably go Trump.  All for making things worse until Dems listen to their base over money.

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7 minutes ago, IC FBGCav said:

Harris is weak on policies and a liar.  Doesn't get my vote.  If the Dem for President isn't first issue MFA.  They don't get my vote, if I think they are Corporate backed, probably go Trump.  All for making things worse until Dems listen to their base over money.

Amazing. I sure hope you’re not very representative. 

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7 minutes ago, IC FBGCav said:

Harris is weak on policies and a liar.  Doesn't get my vote.  If the Dem for President isn't first issue MFA.  They don't get my vote, if I think they are Corporate backed, probably go Trump.  All for making things worse until Dems listen to their base over money.

Too early for me to tell.  

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1 minute ago, timschochet said:

Amazing. I sure hope you’re not very representative. 

Why would I have a different view?

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2 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Too early for me to tell.  

Look at Harris on the Breakfast Club last week, she flat out lies about her legalizing weed history.  She could have just said I changed my view but lied instead.

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4 minutes ago, IC FBGCav said:

Look at Harris on the Breakfast Club last week, she flat out lies about her legalizing weed history.  She could have just said I changed my view but lied instead.

It was a terrible interview.  You're going to get some answers that look bad on paper when you ask different questions over the top of someone else.   She's going to have to be more careful to control interviews and speak to one thing at a time.  She's not good in a free-flowing exchange.

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3 minutes ago, -fish- said:

It was a terrible interview.  You're going to get some answers that look bad on paper when you ask different questions over the top of someone else.   She's going to have to be more careful to control interviews and speak to one thing at a time.  She's not good in a free-flowing exchange.

She just flat out lied.  Good or bad interview you know your past and what you supported.

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16 minutes ago, IC FBGCav said:

Why would I have a different view?

Not knowing you, I have no idea. I can tell you why you should have a different view. Because if you’re willing to support Trump unless the Democrat candidate completely disavows corporations, then I don’t really think you have a very good understanding of politics in this country. 

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Just now, timschochet said:

Not knowing you, I have no idea. I can tell you why you should have a different view. Because if you’re willing to support Trump unless the Democrat candidate completely disavows corporations, then I don’t really think you have a very good understanding of politics in this country. 

That's a first, you are thinking now.  But please educate me on how politics works.  You opened the door, I am all ears.

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7 minutes ago, IC FBGCav said:

That's a first, you are thinking now.  But please educate me on how politics works.  You opened the door, I am all ears.

That’s OK. When you stated that you were “all for making things worse” that ended any serious interest I might have in your opinion (other than to hope, as I did, that you’re not representative.) 

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Just now, timschochet said:

That’s OK. When you stated that you were “all for making things worse” that ended any serious interest I might have in your opinion (other than to hope, as I did, that you’re not representative.) 

Run Timmy, Run.  

 

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2 minutes ago, timschochet said:

That’s OK. When you stated that you were “all for making things worse” that ended any serious interest I might have in your opinion (other than to hope, as I did, that you’re not representative.) 

You sir,  are a man without fortitude, conviction or substance.  I can't get that but to each their own.

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8 minutes ago, timschochet said:

That’s OK. When you stated that you were “all for making things worse” that ended any serious interest I might have in your opinion (other than to hope, as I did, that you’re not representative.) 

accellerationism is real.   don't know why you'd choose to ignore it.   

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Just now, -fish- said:

accellerationism is real.   don't know why you'd choose to ignore it.   

I’m not ignoring it. I simply detest it as a theory. Not only because it doesn’t work, but also because it wishes harm on other people. 

There are also some conservatives out there that would prefer socialists take over, believing that the results will be so awful that it will bring about a desired return to the unfettered capitalism of Calvin Coolidge days. I detest this just as much, for the same reasons. 

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Warren will be unveiling an affordable childcare plan tomorrow night: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/elizabeth-warren-universal-child-care-proposal_n_5c688f3ae4b01757c36c2511

The plan makes childcare free for households making less than 2x the poverty line. For others, it caps childcare expenses at 7% of household income, which is how HHS officially defines “affordable childcare.” I think this is similar to Hillary’s plan in 2016 which had a 10% cap.

Edited by caustic

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