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ren hoek

Jeffrey Epstein: there is definitely nothing to see here folks, I am feeling very sleepy, I think I'll take a nice nap.

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15 minutes ago, Sand said:

Can executives here get charged with aiding and abetting a child molester?  One can't help but wonder how much more damage was done during those 3 years.  At the very least the whole executive team should get ousted, today.

I agree with your overall point about more accountability at news divisions.  But, have there been allegations of wrongdoing in the last 3 years?  (I don't know the answer - just asking the question without hitting up google).

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Have we at least all agreed that Epstein made his living blackmailing people?

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Really bothers me that this story is losing momentum. More than any travesty of modern politics, this wreaks of the rich getting away with it. By now, dozens of prominent men should be publicly implicated. The fact they are not saddens me. I doubt the SDNY case will go anywhere. Too much money, too many lawyers, and a corpse seem to have sealed the tomb.

Edited by Mr. Ham
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Just now, Mr. Ham said:

By now, dozens of prominent men should be publicly implicated.

Yeah, that’s more or less the way I feel too.  The fact is, the NY justice system scooped up one of the most important witnesses of all time, and now that witness is dead.  

That trial would have been an all-consuming affair, with enormous implications about the way we view power and officialdom.  Those girls would have gotten their day in court.  Instead, it’s just memoryholed away behind the daily palace intrigues.  I just don’t see a real just ending to all this in the future.  

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That project veritas video underscores how brave Julie K Brown’s work was, and how much credit the Miami Herald deserves for pushing back and not backing down from the story.  What kind of world do we live in where a news organization buries that?

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1 hour ago, ren hoek said:

That project veritas video underscores how brave Julie K Brown’s work was, and how much credit the Miami Herald deserves for pushing back and not backing down from the story.  What kind of world do we live in where a news organization buries that?

Propaganda organization. She mentioned Clinton, so of course it got shut down.  I'd love to know what she meant by her comment. 

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7 hours ago, Sand said:

So Amy Robach let loose that ABC management killed her Epstein story 3 years ago.  All over the fear from the palace that they would lose access to Will and Kate.

Can executives here get charged with aiding and abetting a child molester?  One can't help but wonder how much more damage was done during those 3 years.  At the very least the whole executive team should get ousted, today.

NBC - quashed Weinstein story

ABC - quashed Epstein story

No moral compass whatsoever in these organizations.  None.

Color me skeptical that the full story is being told here. If this was such a slam-dunk case, why didn't another media outlet run with it? Surely Fox had known about Epstein and Weinstein for years? Why not run exposés on them every single day, especially during election years?

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38 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

Color me skeptical that the full story is being told here. If this was such a slam-dunk case, why didn't another media outlet run with it? Surely Fox had known about Epstein and Weinstein for years? Why not run exposés on them every single day, especially during election years?

Because both Bill and Donnie are connected to him. And both sides of the aisle had powerful people go down in the MeToo movement that followed Weinstein. Thank goodness for the real journalists who finally took on these stories.

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1 minute ago, Biff84 said:
48 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

Color me skeptical that the full story is being told here. If this was such a slam-dunk case, why didn't another media outlet run with it? Surely Fox had known about Epstein and Weinstein for years? Why not run exposés on them every single day, especially during election years?

Because both Bill and Donnie are connected to him. And both sides of the aisle had powerful people go down in the MeToo movement that followed Weinstein. Thank goodness for the real journalists who finally took on these stories.

The root of the issue is that American media outlets do not usually publish these types of serious allegations without some kind of corroborating sources -- as Robach herself indicated in the Daily Mail story. The liability factor (for both the media outlet and the victim) just isn't worth it.

It's easy and lazy to pick on network TV news channels, but that's just a side effect of powerful people exploiting the system.

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1 hour ago, [scooter] said:

The root of the issue is that American media outlets do not usually publish these types of serious allegations without some kind of corroborating sources -- as Robach herself indicated in the Daily Mail story. The liability factor (for both the media outlet and the victim) just isn't worth it.

It's easy and lazy to pick on network TV news channels, but that's just a side effect of powerful people exploiting the system.

That depends on whether you believe the spontaneous excited utterance or the subsequent carefully manicured public statement.  I know what I'd tend to believe.

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24 minutes ago, Punxsutawney Phil said:

Isn't James O'Keefe some alt right YouTuber that basically slices together audio?

Yes but she confirmed the incident and explained it was her frustration that they weren’t able to find collaborative sources that would allow them run the story. That of course could just be her following in line with the network.

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I think crap like this happens with our news media more than we would care to think. Our media does not report, they inform the public with what they want us to know. Not trustworthy at all. 

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27 minutes ago, Beef Ravioli said:

I think crap like this happens with our news media more than we would care to think. Our media does not report, they inform the public with what they want us to know. Not trustworthy at all. 

Enemy of the people?

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I've noticed a huge increase in the "Epstein didn't kill himself" memes over the past few weeks.

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The Vicky Ward story already said all this. 

And I think that journalistic politics like weighing a big scoop vs losing access to the Palace is something that goes on all the time. But rarely does it involve something so heinous. Like Ren said thank goodness for Julie Brown.

Edited by SaintsInDome2006
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43 minutes ago, jamny said:

I've noticed a huge increase in the "Epstein didn't kill himself" memes over the past few weeks.

This probably belongs in Joe's "Unification" thread.

This could be the one thing that unites America.

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11 hours ago, Max Power said:

Have we at least all agreed that Epstein made his living blackmailing people?

The "Victoria's Secret" guy turned over total financial control to Epstein, and it has never been explained why. 

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8 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

The Vicky Ward story already said all this. 

And I think that journalistic politics like weighing a big scoop vs losing access to the Palace is something that goes on all the time. But rarely does it involve something so heinous. Like Ren said thank goodness for Julie Brown.

I would think election year ramifications may have played a role as well.

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10 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

The Vicky Ward story already said all this. 

And I think that journalistic politics like weighing a big scoop vs losing access to the Palace is something that goes on all the time. But rarely does it involve something so heinous. Like Ren said thank goodness for Julie Brown.

If Buckingham Palace is covering up for kiddie fiddler princes, burn them like the Catholic Church 

Edited by msommer
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19 hours ago, ren hoek said:

That project veritas video underscores how brave Julie K Brown’s work was, and how much credit the Miami Herald deserves for pushing back and not backing down from the story.  What kind of world do we live in where a news organization buries that?

This is not new.  NOT NEW....News organizations have been burying stories since there was news.  Protecting big money, politicians, etc.  I believe this to be more the rule than the exception.  It is the one offs, the ones who "buck the system" that we see and thank god for.  But in many cases they are outcasts.  Don't ever ever believe the media is some holy entity...in many cases they are as dirty as everyone else.

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10 hours ago, Beef Ravioli said:

I think crap like this happens with our news media more than we would care to think. Our media does not report, they inform the public with what they want us to know. Not trustworthy at all. 

Shoot.  Should have read this before I posted...but yep..just said the same thing

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And..I still say the British Monarchy should be looked at .  You're talking about an organization with centuries of influence and power.  The Clintons and many billionaires don't have nearly the clout and utter power those people have.  Don't discount that at all.

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Parts of the ABC story that Is like to see explored more deeply:

1. Royal’s actions when confronted about the story, and “threats” referenced on hot mic

2. What did she mean by her assertion ABC had Clinton? Is this the flight logs that are already public, or more?

Edited by Mr. Ham
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10 hours ago, jamny said:

I've noticed a huge increase in the "Epstein didn't kill himself" memes over the past few weeks.

Been noticing this also, all posted by Trump supporters (of people I know),  assume it's to take attention away from impeachment talk.

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44 minutes ago, yak651 said:

Been noticing this also, all posted by Trump supporters (of people I know),  assume it's to take attention away from impeachment talk.

:rolleyes:  I'm seeing it from both sides. 

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So has there been anything definitive regarding it not being suicide, or is that just conspiracy theory talk?

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1 hour ago, yak651 said:

Been noticing this also, all posted by Trump supporters (of people I know),  assume it's to take attention away from impeachment talk.

Oh for the love of God

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2 hours ago, yak651 said:

Been noticing this also, all posted by Trump supporters (of people I know),  assume it's to take attention away from impeachment talk.

I’m a republican but I don’t care who gets “outed” by the Epstein fiasco. Anyone (republican, Democrat, libertarian and independent) involved in that crap needs to go down! 

The news media needs to go down! Hopefully this coming to light will get some of the crap out of that industry! 

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11 hours ago, Encyclopedia Brown said:

The "Victoria's Secret" guy turned over total financial control to Epstein, and it has never been explained why. 

Yep. He made a weak statement and no one wants to press the issue. 

Media is pathetic. 

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1 minute ago, Beef Ravioli said:

I’m a republican but I don’t care who gets “outed” by the Epstein fiasco. Anyone (republican, Democrat, libertarian and independent) involved in that crap needs to go down! 

The news media needs to go down! Hopefully this coming to light will get some of the crap out of that industry! 

This is one time facebook and twitter will keep something alive that should be. 

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1 hour ago, Jayrod said:

So has there been anything definitive regarding it not being suicide, or is that just conspiracy theory talk?

This will be the conspiracy that unites us and may open the floodgates.

If you have a specific question we can answer it here.

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1 hour ago, jamny said:

:rolleyes:  I'm seeing it from both sides. 

Just what i noticed, I seen it posted 4 times and all 4 were from Friends that openly support Trump, but to be fair they post a lot of crazy stuff.

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7 minutes ago, Beef Ravioli said:

I’m a republican but I don’t care who gets “outed” by the Epstein fiasco. Anyone (republican, Democrat, libertarian and independent) involved in that crap needs to go down! 

The news media needs to go down! Hopefully this coming to light will get some of the crap out of that industry! 

I agree 100%!

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5 minutes ago, Max Power said:

This will be the conspiracy that unites us and may open the floodgates.

If you have a specific question we can answer it here.

I'll reiterate his question, which appears to be specific enough: "So has there been anything definitive regarding it not being suicide[?]"

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Just now, Zow said:

I'll reiterate his question, which appears to be specific enough: "So has there been anything definitive regarding it not being suicide[?]"

There is no smoking gun if that is the question. 

I'd equate it to something like a guy knows his wife is cheating on him based on everything he has observed. He hasn't seen her do it and she hasn't admitted it, but all the signs are there. 

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13 hours ago, jamny said:

I've noticed a huge increase in the "Epstein didn't kill himself" memes over the past few weeks.

They are pretty funny. 

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5 minutes ago, Zow said:

I'll reiterate his question, which appears to be specific enough: "So has there been anything definitive regarding it not being suicide[?]"

Of course not.  If there were...the people who did it would suck at their jobs

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2 minutes ago, Max Power said:

There is no smoking gun if that is the question. 

I'd equate it to something like a guy knows his wife is cheating on him based on everything he has observed. He hasn't seen her do it and she hasn't admitted it, but all the signs are there. 

Except in this case there is a medical examiner who indicated the manner of death was suicide. 

So, in your example, it'd be like the guy's gut telling him that his wife is cheating on him even though a private investigator followed the wife and found no indication that she was cheating. 

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16 minutes ago, Beef Ravioli said:

The news media needs to go down! Hopefully this coming to light will get some of the crap out of that industry! 

The entire news industry needs to "go down" because it failed to expose a criminal? Come on.

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3 minutes ago, Zow said:

Except in this case there is a medical examiner who indicated the manner of death was suicide. 

So, in your example, it'd be like the guy's gut telling him that his wife is cheating on him even though a private investigator followed the wife and found no indication that she was cheating. 

Um, yeah no.   So let's see...I want to murder someone and want to make it look like a suicide..and I am really really good at doing that...Sooo I go ahead and do that but I cannot fake the suicide well enough to fool a ME?   Then what's the point?

Edited by supermike80

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6 minutes ago, supermike80 said:

Um, yeah no.   So let's see...I want to murder someone and want to make it look like a suicide..and I am really really good at doing that...Sooo I go ahead and do that but I cannot fake the suicide well enough to fool a ME?   Then what's the point?

So in Max Power's analogy the wife is just incredibly good at cheating?

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14 minutes ago, Zow said:

Except in this case there is a medical examiner who indicated the manner of death was suicide. 

So, in your example, it'd be like the guy's gut telling him that his wife is cheating on him even though a private investigator followed the wife and found no indication that she was cheating. 

The second level of facts also put the examiner's findings into question.

The guy who observed the autopsy reported the broken bones in the neck which is "more consistent with strangulation than suicide". So we have that.

I believe they said 6% of suicides by hanging show broken bones, but they also indicate that when people jump off objects and have a fall before they die which leads to that number.

Epstein was old,  but not old enough to call his bones brittle to the point where leaning forward on a noose would cause that damage.

He was in a cell designed to eliminate suicides, yet this genius figured it out. 

And I'd bet that PI is the one kicking it with the wife. 

Edited by Max Power
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9 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

The entire news industry needs to "go down" because it failed to expose a criminal? Come on.

Hopefully it can serve a catalyst for the MSM to prioritize their loyalties or values. 

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2 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Hopefully it can serve a catalyst for the MSM to prioritize their loyalties or values. 

Who or what in the MSM do you think is not properly prioritizing their loyalties or values?

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1 minute ago, Max Power said:
12 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

The entire news industry needs to "go down" because it failed to expose a criminal? Come on.

Hopefully it can serve a catalyst for the MSM to prioritize their loyalties or values. 

That's not going to happen as long as we have a POTUS threatening to dismantle libel protections for the free press.

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7 minutes ago, Zow said:

So in Max Power's analogy the wife is just incredibly good at cheating?

 I don't know if you are playing devil's advocate but what is your take on video camera issue. Still a lot of unanswered questions there.

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2 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

That's not going to happen as long as we have a POTUS threatening to dismantle libel protections for the free press.

 I don't disagree. But it's also the main stream media not willing to be the a bigger man

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10 minutes ago, Max Power said:
14 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

That's not going to happen as long as we have a POTUS threatening to dismantle libel protections for the free press.

 I don't disagree. But it's also the main stream media not willing to be the a bigger man

Why should the MSM risk being dismantled? Or, to put it another way, why do you think a private business has an obligation to place the moral values of others above the interests of the owners and shareholders of the company?

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18 minutes ago, Max Power said:

 I don't know if you are playing devil's advocate but what is your take on video camera issue. Still a lot of unanswered questions there.

I genuinely don't know a ton about the situation other than the general gist of the ME report and the rampant calls that it's a conspiracy. So, I was trying to prompt more specific and additional information than the general "this seems fishy"* sentiment that has been clear. I do appreciate your response to my other post above because you provided specifics and gave me some information that I didn't know. 

 

To answer your actual question, I'll try to find out more information. I have personally been a part of several dozen incidents within jails and prison - where sometimes there is video footage and sometimes now - so I do think I can speak a bit on it as well when I have the opportuntity to learn more about what you're referencing. 

 

*Not a direct quote from anybody but instead my descriptive summary of the previous general claims made by a variety of posters.

Edited by Zow

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