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the lone star

Eliminated Owner No Longer Cares, But Making A Trade

Should We Still Process This Trade If The Owner Is Indifferent?  

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Question

So an Eliminated Owner in my league No Longer Cares because he is out of it now, But he is Making A Trade where he is giving up the best player in the deal. The deal is still fair per our trade calculator, but when the Vice Commish reached out to him about the deal, the owner seemed indifferent to it going through. To test him, the Vice Commish sent a lopsided offer (Vice Commish was receiving the better end) and the owner accepted the deal. Since it was just a test, we aren't processing that trade, but what about the first one where it passes our trade-calculator test? 

As of yet, the indifferent owner hasn't told us if he will be leaving, so he could be back, but we do have a waiting list. Nobody has been picked from that waiting list though, so I guess it's still the indifferent owner's team. But our thinking is that he (the indifferent owner) will probably not be back next season.

The 2nd owner in the deal REALLY wants the player as he is in the championship game this week (no trade deadline in this league), so should we process the trade? What do you think?

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Is why I set trade deadlines weeks before playoffs start.  though what do your bylaws say?  if nothing preventing it then you really can't (shouldn't) veto it.  Especially if it just giving up best player in deal & not something like Todd Gurley for Josh Gordon (this is just used as a ref)

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For Re-draft leagues, teams that have been eliminated should have their rosters frozen and locked from any transactions.  They are no longer involved in the current season.  This trade should not be allowed even if you do not a have specific rule regarding trading with eliminated teams.  This is not valid in any way.

 

If this is a dynasty league then that is a different story.

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7 minutes ago, j0nese said:

Is why I set trade deadlines weeks before playoffs start.  though what do your bylaws say?  if nothing preventing it then you really can't (shouldn't) veto it.  Especially if it just giving up best player in deal & not something like Todd Gurley for Josh Gordon (this is just used as a ref)

Yes it should be overturned.  The eliminated team is no longer valid for the current season (assuming redraft - dynasty is different) and should be frozen from all transactions.  There is no way an eliminated team should be involved in any trades. 

 

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BUT if the league is still allowing trades; & it isn't a lopsided trade, & there are no by-laws then what ground do you have to reverse it?

Is trading still allowed?  Yes; go to next step   No; then reverse the trade

is the trade lopsided?  Yes; reverse it & stop the trade   No; continue to next step (i.e. if this was regular season would the trade be processed)

do the by-laws prevent trading from teams eliminated in playoffs?  Yes; then why was trade allowed to be offered   No; allow the trade to go through

 

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This is just like my new BS league. Horrible commish that doesn't know how to run a league. Once regular season is over, all non-playoff teams are locked out. No trades, no waivers, no nothing. Their rosters are locked and they are locked from making changes.

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1 minute ago, BigRedNole said:

This is just like my new BS league. Horrible commish that doesn't know how to run a league. Once regular season is over, all non-playoff teams are locked out. No trades, no waivers, no nothing. Their rosters are locked and they are locked from making changes.

I agree it SHOULD be like that, but if not then you can't change it now.  If other trades have gone through with teams not in playoff's; & is said the deal is fair then no gotta let it stand

 

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The fault lies not with the eliminated owner,but with your leagues trade deadline.

Based on your rules the trade should pass

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16 hours ago, j0nese said:

BUT if the league is still allowing trades; & it isn't a lopsided trade, & there are no by-laws then what ground do you have to reverse it?

Is trading still allowed?  Yes; go to next step   No; then reverse the trade

is the trade lopsided?  Yes; reverse it & stop the trade   No; continue to next step (i.e. if this was regular season would the trade be processed)

do the by-laws prevent trading from teams eliminated in playoffs?  Yes; then why was trade allowed to be offered   No; allow the trade to go through

 

It doesn't matter is the league still allows trades.  Once a team is eliminated they are not a team anymore regardless of the league allowing trades.  That roster is frozen and the commish should not allow any transaction involving the eliminated team.  This is not a rule issue.  The grounds to reverse is that the eliminated team is ELIMINATED and is no longer a team for this season. 

 

NOTE:  This is for redraft only.  In a dynasty league other things are in play. 

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15 hours ago, BigRedNole said:

yes, if they did not have the rules in place, you can't change it. It is just a mickey mouse league with people that do not know how to run a league or put rules in place.

Yes you can.  The eliminated team is not longer playing this year.  They should not be allowed to make trades because their roster is no longer playing. For intents and purposes this is collusion because the eliminated team can no longer win so they are giving away their players to another team to help them win with zero benefit to them since they cannot win. 

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11 minutes ago, Gally said:

Yes you can.  The eliminated team is not longer playing this year.  They should not be allowed to make trades because their roster is no longer playing. For intents and purposes this is collusion because the eliminated team can no longer win so they are giving away their players to another team to help them win with zero benefit to them since they cannot win. 

not if they have let other eliminated teams make trades before this 1 (i.e. previous playoff weeks).  then reversing this trade means they have to go back & reverse others (if any) & that could impact games.  You can't go changing rules at the end of season, this should've been established from the start

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14 minutes ago, j0nese said:

not if they have let other eliminated teams make trades before this 1 (i.e. previous playoff weeks).  then reversing this trade means they have to go back & reverse others (if any) & that could impact games.  You can't go changing rules at the end of season, this should've been established from the start

Agree that if they have allowed it in the past then it must go through.  You cannot change a rule mid season.  However, I understood this as a one off situation that had not happened before because the question was about allowing an eliminated team to make a trade.....not that trade itself was bad.  If I was wrong with that interpretation then I agree that trade should stand.......and then change the rules over the off-season to freeze all eliminated teams from all transactions.  (again assuming this is redraft and not dynasty).

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2 hours ago, Gally said:

Yes you can.  The eliminated team is not longer playing this year.  They should not be allowed to make trades because their roster is no longer playing. For intents and purposes this is collusion because the eliminated team can no longer win so they are giving away their players to another team to help them win with zero benefit to them since they cannot win. 

I completely agree with you. However, it is apparent they allowed previously eliminated owners to trade during the playoffs. You can't arbitrarily stop it now. They never put rules in place for a trade deadline. This is like changing the point system and retroactively changing every game score to create new playoff teams. The rules that were in place when the trade was made is the rule that has to stand.

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4 minutes ago, BigRedNole said:

I completely agree with you. However, it is apparent they allowed previously eliminated owners to trade during the playoffs. You can't arbitrarily stop it now. They never put rules in place for a trade deadline. This is like changing the point system and retroactively changing every game score to create new playoff teams. The rules that were in place when the trade was made is the rule that has to stand.

I actually took it the other way that this is the first time an eliminated team has made a trade which is what prompted the question.  I see nowhere in the OP that alludes to this happening previously (other than their lame attempt to bait the owner with a lopsided trade offer after the fact).

 

If it has happened in the past (and was allowed) then this must go through and you cannot stop it.  I agree no changing the rules.  But if it has never happened before I see no reason why the Commish can't stop it from happening now. 

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20 hours ago, Guru said:

Too bad, trade stands.  Fix your rules for 2019. 

Why?  If this type of trade has never occurred before (the OP is not clear whether this has happened before or not) why should it be allowed?  It would be within the commish's power to overturn this trade if there has never been a trade between an active team and eliminated team in the past.  

 

I would agree if this type of trade has happened before then it must be allowed.

 

Either way the rules need to be clarified in the off season.

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10 hours ago, the lone star said:

50-50 split, yikes!

its actually not really 50-50 based on the commentary.  There is one glaring piece of information that you haven't clarified - Has this type of trade happened in previous years?

 

Most people are in agreement that if this type of trade has happened in the past then you have to allow it this year.  

Other people are in agreement that if it has never happened before there is no issue in overturning it and setting the precedent. 

 

Basically it comes down to whether or not it has happened before.  Either way the rules need to be addressed to lock any eliminated team from all transactions.  Then you will never face this issue again. 

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On 1/4/2019 at 10:02 AM, Gally said:

its actually not really 50-50 based on the commentary.  There is one glaring piece of information that you haven't clarified - Has this type of trade happened in previous years?

 

Most people are in agreement that if this type of trade has happened in the past then you have to allow it this year.  

Other people are in agreement that if it has never happened before there is no issue in overturning it and setting the precedent. 

 

Basically it comes down to whether or not it has happened before.  Either way the rules need to be addressed to lock any eliminated team from all transactions.  Then you will never face this issue again. 

Yeah, it's happened before. More "lopsided" deals have been pushed through in the past.

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9 hours ago, the lone star said:

Yeah, it's happened before. More "lopsided" deals have been pushed through in the past.

I don't care about lopsided.  I would only care if teams eliminated from the playoffs made trades after they were eliminated.  If that happened previously this trade should be allowed but then change that rule immediately following the season.  No team that is eliminated in the playoffs should be allowed to make any transactions (provided it is a redraft league). 

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On 1/29/2019 at 8:58 AM, Gally said:

I don't care about lopsided.  I would only care if teams eliminated from the playoffs made trades after they were eliminated.  If that happened previously this trade should be allowed but then change that rule immediately following the season.  No team that is eliminated in the playoffs should be allowed to make any transactions (provided it is a redraft league). 

That makes sense in redraft, but this is actually a dynasty league, which complicates things. 

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58 minutes ago, the lone star said:

That makes sense in redraft, but this is actually a dynasty league, which complicates things. 

Not if the owner already gave notice of leaving.  If that is the case as soon as he is eliminated the season is over and his team should be frozen until the new owner takes over. 

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On 3/22/2019 at 7:57 PM, Gally said:

Not if the owner already gave notice of leaving.  If that is the case as soon as he is eliminated the season is over and his team should be frozen until the new owner takes over. 

So what if he changes his mind? What about the trades that were made that same season before he gave notice? Should those be reversed?

Isn't it still his team until a new owner is found? I mean, he did pay full dues, after all.

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