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China - the Super Thread

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It’s only a matter of time before Hong Kong is no different than the rest of China.  It’s inevitable.

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On 6/6/2019 at 9:53 AM, Da Guru said:

Nothing China says or does will ever surprise me.  After traveling there 5 times for work and meeting many different people it is easy to see the masses of China are basically minions who only focus on what is right in front of them like a horse with blinders on.  Not saying all but they are basically a brain washed society and have no concept of any type of life outside of China.

Been that way for thousands of years too 

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Carrie Lam backs down and 'suspends' Hong Kong extradition bill, sets no new time frame

Quote

 

The Hong Kong government is backing down and suspending its highly unpopular 

extradition bill

, without setting a new time frame for its reintroduction. It maintains the legislation's intention of plugging legal loopholes is still valid.

At a press conference on Saturday, 

Chief Executive Carrie Lam

 Cheng Yuet-ngor, using the words "suspension" and "halting" interchangeably, admitted her government had not communicated the need for the bill well enough. "I feel deep sorrow and regret that deficiencies in our work – and various other factors – have stirred up substantial controversies," she said. ...

 

 

Edited by SaintsInDome2006

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4 hours ago, jonessed said:

It’s only a matter of time before Hong Kong is no different than the rest of China.  It’s inevitable.

2047 according to the existing agreement

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Hong Kong has again been shaken by protests as tens of thousands of people arrived in Yuen Long, a town gripped by tension over the past week following earlier scenes of unprecedented violence at a railway station.

Protesters were continuing their calls for a full withdrawal of a now-suspended bill that would have allowed the extradition of fugitives to mainland China as well as responding to last Sunday’s attack when men – thought to include local villagers and triad members – armed with wooden sticks and metal rods ambushed protesters and passers-by, leaving at least 45 injured.

Police, who had taken the rare step of refusing permission for the march out of safety concerns, have fired tear gas and sponge grenades in a prolonged dispersal operation. Follow the events on our live blog below. Reporting by Sum Lok-kei, Alvin Lum, Kanis Leung, Phila Siu, Martin Choi, Danny Lee, Nectar Gan, Lee Jeongho, Christy Leung, Tony Cheung, Viola Zhou and Alan Wong.

 

SCMP, aftershocks continue in Hong Kong.

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China - we force use to answer citizen questions regarding one-party propaganda hypotheticals on state-run cell state cell service to earn citizenship points

U.S. - We can't even ask if you're a citizen in a head count. 

Tell me who wins, historically?  

Edited by rockaction

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I should say I honestly don't know the answer to my own question, but the difference is certainly stark.  

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"Hong Kong's radical demonstrators have repeatedly used extremely dangerous tools to attack police officers, which already constitutes a serious violent crime, and also shows the first signs of terrorism emerging," Yang Guang, spokesman for the Hong Kong and Macao Affairs Office of the State Council, said at a press briefing in Beijing on Monday.

"This wantonly tramples on Hong Kong's rule of law and social order," he added. "Hong Kong has come to a critical juncture."

 

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2 minutes ago, jamny said:

"Hong Kong's radical demonstrators have repeatedly used extremely dangerous tools to attack police officers, which already constitutes a serious violent crime, and also shows the first signs of terrorism emerging," Yang Guang, spokesman for the Hong Kong and Macao Affairs Office of the State Council, said at a press briefing in Beijing on Monday.

"This wantonly tramples on Hong Kong's rule of law and social order," he added. "Hong Kong has come to a critical juncture."

This is how tyrants speak of democracy. Having said that, the use of the T-word suggests the Chinese/HK authorities are ramping up the violence to suppress the demonstrations.

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On 8/3/2019 at 10:29 AM, rockaction said:

China - we force use to answer citizen questions regarding one-party propaganda hypotheticals on state-run cell state cell service to earn citizenship points

U.S. - We can't even ask if you're a citizen in a head count. 

Tell me who wins, historically?  

In a war between the two, or internally?

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1 minute ago, Henry Ford said:

In a war between the two, or internally?

Without being cheeky, take your pick. I think at the time I was thinking "between the two." But I was legitimately asking, and not just rhetorically. I'd love to hear people's thoughts. In a weird way, it keeps me entertained and gives me stuff to read and think about, especially intelligent responses, which I think you'll give. If I disagree, I'll respond, but not caustically.

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26 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Without being cheeky, take your pick. I think at the time I was thinking "between the two." But I was legitimately asking, and not just rhetorically. I'd love to hear people's thoughts. In a weird way, it keeps me entertained and gives me stuff to read and think about, especially intelligent responses, which I think you'll give. If I disagree, I'll respond, but not caustically.

I guess in the long view, my answer is the same.  In a war between the two or internally.  

Historically, free societies have eventually won the wars with authoritarian societies.  Sometimes it takes a long time.  A shorter example would be WWII.  

Internally, the kind of control it takes to control a society has become very difficult to wield over several consecutive generations.  In general, the world moves farther away from that sort of thing over time.  Some portion of that society always gets away, if not the entire society.

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Looks like riot police have tried to clear out the airport but have pulled back. Expect them to come at them harder next time.

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Protesters captured what appears to be an undercover cop and have him ziptied to a luggage cart right now.

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Can this end well for the protesters without some kind of intervention from the outside world?

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2 hours ago, jamny said:

Can this end well for the protesters without some kind of intervention from the outside world?

No, imo. Only real question to me is how bad it will "look" to the outside world when they crack down.

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1 hour ago, Tecumseh said:

Protesters singing the US national anthem and waving American flags. Don't think that will end well for them.

https://www.asiatimes.com/2019/07/article/why-hong-kong-protestors-fly-the-american-flag/

Any time in my life prior to 2016 and I would swell with pride reading this. 

Hope you are doing well GB. 

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5 minutes ago, Sheriff Bart said:

Any time in my life prior to 2016 and I would swell with pride reading this. 

Hope you are doing well GB. 

Any other time I would think we might help. 

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1 minute ago, Henry Ford said:

Any other time I would think we might help. 

Has Trump tweeted his T&P's yet?

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21 minutes ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

By doing what exactly ?

Following Republican and Democratic policy for the last 75 years which is speak up for democratic values and support others abroad who do so as well.

Edited by SaintsInDome2006

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>>The remarks marked a reversal from the promise Trump made to Xi in a phone conversation in mid-June. The president surprised his aides when he told Xi that he would not condemn the Chinese government over a crackdown in Hong Kong. He understood it was an internal issue in which the U.S. would not interfere, he said.<<

Politico

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1 hour ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

By doing what exactly ?

Well, after Tienanmen Square, Nancy Pelosi drafted and passed legislation allowing Chinese students to stay in the US after graduating to keep them from going back to be slaughtered.  But you’re right, a Republican President vetoed that bill (though passed an executive order doing the same thing.)

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23 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

Well, after Tienanmen Square, Nancy Pelosi drafted and passed legislation allowing Chinese students to stay in the US after graduating to keep them from going back to be slaughtered.  But you’re right, a Republican President vetoed that bill (though passed an executive order doing the same thing.)

Well done by her.

What should be done today I guess is what I was asking?

 

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3 hours ago, Sheriff Bart said:

Any time in my life prior to 2016 and I would swell with pride reading this. 

Hope you are doing well GB. 

Hope you're doing well too, my friend.

I have to say I am still proud and humbled when I read that. Despite our current leadership, the ideals of our Republic still mean something to the rest of the world. In thinking about it, it may even make me a little more proud that the freedom and democracy that our flag and anthem represent can supersede Trump and the damage he is doing. They know who our President is. They aren't waving the flag for him. They're waving it for what we are and what they aspire to be. 

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On 8/14/2019 at 8:48 PM, SaintsInDome2006 said:

>>The remarks marked a reversal from the promise Trump made to Xi in a phone conversation in mid-June. The president surprised his aides when he told Xi that he would not condemn the Chinese government over a crackdown in Hong Kong. He understood it was an internal issue in which the U.S. would not interfere, he said.<<

Politico

Trump knows if the real Xi is a regular guy who just loves to eat buns or a Daenerys Targaryen.

Edited by bradyfan

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On 8/14/2019 at 8:56 PM, Cowboysfan8 said:

Well done by her.

What should be done today I guess is what I was asking?

 

I think that would be a start. If China begins taking Hong Kong in a show of force, I think we have to help people who would return to Hong Kong by allowing them to stay here indefinitely. 

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58 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

I think that would be a start. If China begins taking Hong Kong in a show of force, I think we have to help people who would return to Hong Kong by allowing them to stay here indefinitely. 

I can’t believe anyone wouldn’t support that 

I think several days ago when this was brought up it was implied that Trump should be doing something about it NOW which was why I asked but it’s cool

Enjoy the rest of your weekend Henry!

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1 hour ago, Henry Ford said:

I think that would be a start. If China begins taking Hong Kong in a show of force, I think we have to help people who would return to Hong Kong by allowing them to stay here indefinitely. 

I can't even imagine how Trump would spin this nor could I imagine the GOP's response if he did.  This would be the ultimate in mental gymnastics.

NOTE:  I agree 1000% that it should be done.

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17 minutes ago, The Commish said:

I can't even imagine how Trump would spin this nor could I imagine the GOP's response if he did.  This would be the ultimate in mental gymnastics.

NOTE:  I agree 1000% that it should be done.

China started piloting the social credit system in 2014 and will fully implement it in 2020.  Why do you think it needed a social credit score for each citizen and business, and what they will do with their black list?

Edited by bradyfan

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On 8/14/2019 at 5:18 PM, Tecumseh said:

Protesters singing the US national anthem and waving American flags. Don't think that will end well for them.

https://www.asiatimes.com/2019/07/article/why-hong-kong-protestors-fly-the-american-flag/

What to do when you get bullied but do not own a gun?  You name drop big gun owners whether you know them or not.

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2 hours ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

I can’t believe anyone wouldn’t support that 

I think several days ago when this was brought up it was implied that Trump should be doing something about it NOW which was why I asked but it’s cool

Enjoy the rest of your weekend Henry!

You can’t believe anyone wouldn’t support allowing people from China who speak Chinese to stay in the country? 

Edited by Henry Ford

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1 hour ago, Henry Ford said:

You can’t believe anyone wouldn’t support allowing people from China who speak Chinese to stay in the country? 

Two kinds of people will be targeted by the Chinese government using the extradition bill protested by Hong Kongers:

1. People who are critical of the Chinese government or make fun of Xi

2. People who have money and companies that Xi family members want to own.

Edited by bradyfan

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5 minutes ago, bradyfan said:

Two kinds of people will be targeted by the Chinese government using the extradition bill protested by Hong Kongers:

1. People who are critical of the Chinese government or make fun of Xi

2. People who have money and companies that Xi family members to want own.

1a. A.A. Milne enthusiasts. 

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Just now, Henry Ford said:

1a. A.A. Milne enthusiasts. 

I lose social credit system points every time I post in this thread.   I’m pretty sure it will be unsafe for me to travel to China now.  Good thing the Chinese government abducts foreign citizens mostly from Asian countries but look for me if you do not hear from me in over 2 weeks.

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4 hours ago, bradyfan said:

China started piloting the social credit system in 2014 and will fully implement it in 2020.  Why do you think it needed a social credit score for each citizen and business, and what they will do with their black list?

Is there a reason you quoted me to ask this?  Best I can tell it has nothing to do with my comment to HF :oldunsure: 

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45 minutes ago, bradyfan said:

I lose social credit system points every time I post in this thread.   I’m pretty sure it will be unsafe for me to travel to China now.  Good thing the Chinese government abducts foreign citizens mostly from Asian countries but look for me if you do not hear from me in over 2 weeks.

“Yes, FBI? The Goombah from Mario Brothers is missing.”

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