What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Top 10 QB's of All Time (1 Viewer)

Jim Kelly turned the Bills around. Everything from work ethic to game play to community...so many became similar to him. They had tons of bad draft picks before and since. I know Levy and the GM get credit but I give a lot to Kelly.

The older I get, the less I love Marino.

I can't seem to give credit to Eli and feel that's unfair but...he seems like a cog not a leader

Moon wasn't a crunch time QB and I think it shows in his record. Every game wasnt to sling it and outscore the other. 

Warner brought change. Hope for UDFAs, speedy slant, NFLE...a whole lot no one gives him credit for. Was he great long?

I'd put Randall in the top ten. He was the best mobile QB and sling it QB at times and no one can change their game like he did. There's race issues he dealt with and...I think he brought change too but you can't tell me Philly Randall wasn't scary to play against or him chucking to Moss Carter and Reed. I'd probably put him 10th but he was quite a player

 
Is the question who is the most talented QB or who is the most accomplished? There doesn't seem to be much of an argument on the latter. I've seen the arguent that some QBs would have done as well or better than Brady but I believe in evaluating the question on what actually happened rather than on what might have happened if circustances were different.

The question of who the most talented QB may be a better debate. I'd go with Steve Young but there are several other people with good cases.

 
Is the question who is the most talented QB or who is the most accomplished? There doesn't seem to be much of an argument on the latter. I've seen the arguent that some QBs would have done as well or better than Brady but I believe in evaluating the question on what actually happened rather than on what might have happened if circustances were different.

The question of who the most talented QB may be a better debate. I'd go with Steve Young but there are several other people with good cases.
Correct, players should be evaluated on what they did, not what might happened if x, y or z happened.  Sure, it is fun to debate how well Peyton Manning could have done with Bill Belichik as his coach his whole career, or how Tom Brady would have done had he been drafted by the Bengals, or how much better Elway's stats would have been had he played his whole career with an offensive head coach, but it ultimately is just chit-chat.  Players should be judged and evaluated on what they did. 

 
Jim Kelly turned the Bills around. Everything from work ethic to game play to community...so many became similar to him. They had tons of bad draft picks before and since. I know Levy and the GM get credit but I give a lot to Kelly.

The older I get, the less I love Marino.

I can't seem to give credit to Eli and feel that's unfair but...he seems like a cog not a leader

Moon wasn't a crunch time QB and I think it shows in his record. Every game wasnt to sling it and outscore the other. 

Warner brought change. Hope for UDFAs, speedy slant, NFLE...a whole lot no one gives him credit for. Was he great long?

I'd put Randall in the top ten. He was the best mobile QB and sling it QB at times and no one can change their game like he did. There's race issues he dealt with and...I think he brought change too but you can't tell me Philly Randall wasn't scary to play against or him chucking to Moss Carter and Reed. I'd probably put him 10th but he was quite a player
Randall Cunningham in the top 10?  Instead of a knee jerk reaction which is.....noway.  I need some time to look at that.

 
Insomniac said:
Is the question who is the most talented QB or who is the most accomplished? There doesn't seem to be much of an argument on the latter. I've seen the arguent that some QBs would have done as well or better than Brady but I believe in evaluating the question on what actually happened rather than on what might have happened if circustances were different.

The question of who the most talented QB may be a better debate. I'd go with Steve Young but there are several other people with good cases.
How good was Archie Manning? How do we know?

When it comes to QB's we do have to look at numbers/accomplisments, trying to.....but if......is pretty hard to do.  Sure Dan Marino was better that 90% of those who won SB's, and Kelly, Tarkenton who never won a SB were superior to Trent Dilfer, Jim McMahan SB winners. But it ends there.

I put a lot into where does a guy stack up when it comes to historical stats, longevity at the top a real big deal.  And if a SB winner that is a plus.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
FYI, Brady has never beaten Brees or Rodgers in the playoffs (although he might have a chance to beat Brees in 2 1/2 weeks) and he had a losing record in the playoffs against Peyton.  Just saying...
Brady never played Brees or Rodgers in the play-offs and only could in a SB.   Brady dominated Manning overall. 

I think Mannning's post season performances are what brings him down a notch to me. 

 
Top 5 in interceptions . . . 6 times
Top 5 in fumbles . . . 4 times
Losing record . . . 6 times
Missed the playoffs . . . 9 times
One + done in the playoffs . . . 4 times
Career earnings . . . 2nd all time (will take over the top spot next year from his brother)
Career fumbles + interceptions . . .  6th all time
Career pick 6's . . . 7th all time
Career fumbles . . . 8th all time
Career interceptions . . . 14th all time
Career sacks . . . 15th all time
Career completion % . . . 40th all time
Career passer rating . . . 42nd all time
Career TD% . . . 68th all time
Yards per attempt . . . 85th all time
Yards per completion . . . 133rd all time

Hmmmmmmm?
Eli Sucks.  Just saying...

 
We have one drive to win the game,  we are on our 10 yard line with 1:56 left. 4 points down.

1.Tom Brady/Joe Montana

3...???

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top 10 PAC12/NFL QB's

1.Aaron Rodgers  Cal

2.John Elway Stanford

3.Warren Moon  Wash

4.Dan Fouts  Oregon

5.Troy Aikman  UCLA

6.Carson Palmer USC

7.Andrew Luck  Stanford

8.Drew Bledsoe  WSU

9.John Brodie  Stanford

10.Mark Brunell Wash

What other NCAA conference compares to that?

Tom Brady was a Cali kid at Serra HS, how he ended up at Michigan...?

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top 10 Niner QB's

1.Joe Montana

2.Steve  Young

3.Y.A.Tittle

4.John Brodie

5.Frankie Albert

6.Alex Smith

7.Jeff Garcia

8.Colin Kaepernick

9.Jim Plunkett

10.Steve  DeBerg

The first 4...sure, the others just somewhere n the top10, didn't do any real homework.

 
ZenoRazon said:
Randall Cunningham in the top 10?  Instead of a knee jerk reaction which is.....noway.  I need some time to look at that.
I remember LT complimenting him on and on and yet LT often thought every QB stunk and I always found that hmm...

In the old videos, Parcells, Gibbs, Ditka, even Walsh rave about young Randall.

For me, it was his determination. The announcers would talk like Quick was an awesome WR and the guy would only get open deep, drove me nuts. Anyway, Randall faced best ever defenses and while most QBs crumbled, he did about every athletic thing you could think of whether it be a fake, a move, a pump, a flip, a dive. The Eagles had a few RBs that would just sort of hang around and if he needed to adlib, they were ready with a block or catching a toss. The "I'm getting this first down" mindset was something in him. Then as if he wasn't enough of a super athlete, the guy punted and well too. How the heck do you defend that?

I mocked people for taking the old man in fantasy, as I selected Jake Reed who did real well. All arrogant and all, I was so wrong. I think he lost one game that year, as a pocket QB. 

I think we've wanted Vick, Kordell, RG3.....to be just like Randall, in many respects

 
I remember LT complimenting him on and on and yet LT often thought every QB stunk and I always found that hmm...

In the old videos, Parcells, Gibbs, Ditka, even Walsh rave about young Randall.

For me, it was his determination. The announcers would talk like Quick was an awesome WR and the guy would only get open deep, drove me nuts. Anyway, Randall faced best ever defenses and while most QBs crumbled, he did about every athletic thing you could think of whether it be a fake, a move, a pump, a flip, a dive. The Eagles had a few RBs that would just sort of hang around and if he needed to adlib, they were ready with a block or catching a toss. The "I'm getting this first down" mindset was something in him. Then as if he wasn't enough of a super athlete, the guy punted and well too. How the heck do you defend that?

I mocked people for taking the old man in fantasy, as I selected Jake Reed who did real well. All arrogant and all, I was so wrong. I think he lost one game that year, as a pocket QB. 

I think we've wanted Vick, Kordell, RG3.....to be just like Randall, in many respects
Cunninghams career comp%....56.6. his career QB rating....81.5.

That just won't work because so many other QB's are superior to that.

YES....a highlight video of his would be hard to beat but  it's not about that.

 
1.  Brady

2.  Montana  

3.  P. Manning

4.  Rodgers

5.  Brees

6.  Foles

7.  Bradshaw

8.  Marino

9.  Young

10.  Kaepernick

 
It's impossible to win TWO SB, be among the best ever in career stats and suck.
If there was a hall of fame for avoiding injuries, Eli is a first ballot, mortal lock. How you can play as many games at QB as he has and not get hurt is amazing. Even Farve dealt with nagging injuries and played through them. Eli never even seems to have those. Maybe he has, and I just have not been aware. But his play on the field for his career has only been average to good. He just gets the benefit of being on a team that won the Super Bowl twice. And compiling lots of stats because he has never gotten hurt.

 
If there was a hall of fame for avoiding injuries, Eli is a first ballot, mortal lock. How you can play as many games at QB as he has and not get hurt is amazing. Even Farve dealt with nagging injuries and played through them. Eli never even seems to have those. Maybe he has, and I just have not been aware. But his play on the field for his career has only been average to good. He just gets the benefit of being on a team that won the Super Bowl twice. And compiling lots of stats because he has never gotten hurt.
Ok, a good QB who was always there for you, that'll work. Sure beats.....he sucks.

 
Jim Kelly turned the Bills around. Everything from work ethic to game play to community...so many became similar to him. They had tons of bad draft picks before and since. I know Levy and the GM get credit but I give a lot to Kelly.

The older I get, the less I love Marino.

I can't seem to give credit to Eli and feel that's unfair but...he seems like a cog not a leader

Moon wasn't a crunch time QB and I think it shows in his record. Every game wasnt to sling it and outscore the other. 

Warner brought change. Hope for UDFAs, speedy slant, NFLE...a whole lot no one gives him credit for. Was he great long?

I'd put Randall in the top ten. He was the best mobile QB and sling it QB at times and no one can change their game like he did. There's race issues he dealt with and...I think he brought change too but you can't tell me Philly Randall wasn't scary to play against or him chucking to Moss Carter and Reed. I'd probably put him 10th but he was quite a player
screw the race baiting , you don't have to go there.as a Giants fan who watched Randall C KILL the Giants all the time, he's a bonafide top 10 , I agree 100%! he was just soo good. kids nowadays who are on this site have no idea what Cunningham was all about. I HATED the Eagles ( stil do) but they, along with the Bills, were in the right place at the wrong time - Eagles had the Gibbs era, Parcells era, Jimmy Johnson era..Bills had to play ALL 3 of these teams, at their zenith, in the SB - they could've beat the g-men  but didn't stand a chance v Redskins, or Dallas 2x. those Eagles' teams were something special. Reggie White.J. Brown. Byars. Randall C, bla bla bla..it's a shame they never won. they'd be talked about as one of the all-time greats had the just gotten a Lombardi trophy back then.

Warner was special.Jim Kelly was already in my top ten! he's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drew Brees.

 
  • Smile
Reactions: Bri
screw the race baiting , you don't have to go there.as a Giants fan who watched Randall C KILL the Giants all the time, he's a bonafide top 10 , I agree 100%! he was just soo good. kids nowadays who are on this site have no idea what Cunningham was all about. I HATED the Eagles ( stil do) but they, along with the Bills, were in the right place at the wrong time - Eagles had the Gibbs era, Parcells era, Jimmy Johnson era..Bills had to play ALL 3 of these teams, at their zenith, in the SB - they could've beat the g-men  but didn't stand a chance v Redskins, or Dallas 2x. those Eagles' teams were something special. Reggie White.J. Brown. Byars. Randall C, bla bla bla..it's a shame they never won. they'd be talked about as one of the all-time greats had the just gotten a Lombardi trophy back then.

Warner was special.Jim Kelly was already in my top ten! he's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drew Brees.
Appreciate the Eagles love. We Philly fans feel the same way, especially about 1991. One of the best defenses of all time and Randall gets knocked out for the season in the first game. Eagles still finish 10-6 even with Jim McMahon, Jeff Kemp, Brad Goebal, and Pat Ryun playing QB, but miss the playoffs. 

 
And while I really don't think Cunningham should be in the top ten all time, He probably would be number one all time in the way he moved. There was a certain grace about his running style. Vick was faster, but Cunningham just looked so good when he was escaping the pocket. Go watch a Cunningham highlight film. It is a pleasure to watch.

 
Ok, a good QB who was always there for you, that'll work. Sure beats.....he sucks.
Here is a list of players that ranked one spot ahead of Eli each year in passer rating to give folks a true comparison as to how Eli performed year to year.

2018 - Ryan Tannehill
2017 - Cam Newton
2016 - Jameis Winston
2015 - Philip Rivers
2014 - Ryan Tannehill
2013 - Brandon Weeden
2012 - Andy Dalton
2011 - Matt Schaub
2010 - Jay Cutler
2009 - Kurt Warner
2008 - Donovan McNabb
2007 - Kyle Boller
2006 - Jon Kitna
2005 - Trent Dilfer
2004 - A.J. Feeley

Eli's career passer rating is 84.1. The average of all the QBs that finished the season ranked 20th the past 15 years is 82.5. Bottom line, Eli hasn't even been in the top half of starting QBs in the league over his career.

 
screw the race baiting , you don't have to go there.as a Giants fan who watched Randall C KILL the Giants all the time, he's a bonafide top 10 , I agree 100%! he was just soo good. kids nowadays who are on this site have no idea what Cunningham was all about. I HATED the Eagles ( stil do) but they, along with the Bills, were in the right place at the wrong time - Eagles had the Gibbs era, Parcells era, Jimmy Johnson era..Bills had to play ALL 3 of these teams, at their zenith, in the SB - they could've beat the g-men  but didn't stand a chance v Redskins, or Dallas 2x. those Eagles' teams were something special. Reggie White.J. Brown. Byars. Randall C, bla bla bla..it's a shame they never won. they'd be talked about as one of the all-time greats had the just gotten a Lombardi trophy back then.

Warner was special.Jim Kelly was already in my top ten! he's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drew Brees.
Saw Cunningham play at UNLV also saw him high jump and run a leg on a 4x1 team.

Totally up on his NFL career,  a fantastic athlete but....not a top 10 All Time QB. There is nothing he did to warrant that level of respect.

When it comes to TD passes.....number39 all time. Yards he's.....46.

He never won a SB.

 
Here is a list of players that ranked one spot ahead of Eli each year in passer rating to give folks a true comparison as to how Eli performed year to year.

2018 - Ryan Tannehill
2017 - Cam Newton
2016 - Jameis Winston
2015 - Philip Rivers
2014 - Ryan Tannehill
2013 - Brandon Weeden
2012 - Andy Dalton
2011 - Matt Schaub
2010 - Jay Cutler
2009 - Kurt Warner
2008 - Donovan McNabb
2007 - Kyle Boller
2006 - Jon Kitna
2005 - Trent Dilfer
2004 - A.J. Feeley

Eli's career passer rating is 84.1. The average of all the QBs that finished the season ranked 20th the past 15 years is 82.5. Bottom line, Eli hasn't even been in the top half of starting QBs in the league over his career.
I don't care, he was A "good" QB, always there for his team.  A guy who can win you a SB  a couple times. 

Who on that list can say that?

 
I don't care, he was A "good" QB, always there for his team.  A guy who can win you a SB  a couple times. 

Who on that list can say that?
So now we are making a lot of the top "good" quarterbacks? For example, Jim Plunkett won two Super Bowls and was a good quarterback. Bob Griese won 2 Super Bowls and didn't even reach 100 yards passing in either game he won. I would put Eli a lot closer to those guys than many of the other guys getting discussed. Yes, Griese got inducted into the HOF, but not many people would consider him in the pantheon of the all time greatest.

 
So now we are making a lot of the top "good" quarterbacks? For example, Jim Plunkett won two Super Bowls and was a good quarterback. Bob Griese won 2 Super Bowls and didn't even reach 100 yards passing in either game he won. I would put Eli a lot closer to those guys than many of the other guys getting discussed. Yes, Griese got inducted into the HOF, but not many people would consider him in the pantheon of the all time greatest.
Nobody is talking about Eli among the very elite, but top 20ish, hmmmm?

 
I know,  and how can you keep what he has accomplished out of that top 20? Too many playoff wins, too high on the stats lists.
Eli has barely ranked in the Top 20 in any individual season, let alone all time. If longevity alone makes you a Top 20 talent, then you win this debate.

 
Ok, a good QB who was always there for you, that'll work. Sure beats.....he sucks.
I agree with this point. Durability is something that gets glossed over quite a bit. Especially given the typical dropoff from most NFL starters to their backups. Playing every game for so long provided significant value to his team.

 
I agree with this point. Durability is something that gets glossed over quite a bit. Especially given the typical dropoff from most NFL starters to their backups. Playing every game for so long provided significant value to his team.
Not to mention the rest of the teams in the NFC East.

:D

 
Two SB wins

Among the best ever stat wise

RELIABLE for a long time.

How about number 20?
No way. There are currently 34 QBs in the HOF, with Peyton, Brees, Brady, Roethlisberger, Rodgers, Eli, and (IMO) Rivers on the way to joining them. That is 41 QBs.

I don't know much at all about Earl Clark, Jimmy Conzelman, John Driscoll, Benny Friedman, Arnie Herber, or Ace Parker, who all played in the 1920s-1940s, so I will exclude them, leaving 35 QBs remaining in my group.

Without looking into it deeply, I can't see ranking Eli above the bottom 5 of that group, and he could literally be last. So he isn't top 30, much less top 20.

Depending on how to rank him amongst those older QBs I excluded, he might not even be top 35.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
No way. There are currently 34 QBs in the HOF, with Peyton, Brees, Brady, Roethlisberger, Rodgers, Eli, and (IMO) Rivers on the way to joining them. That is 41 QBs.

I don't know much at all about Earl Clark, Jimmy Conzelman, John Driscoll, Benny Friedman, Arnie Herber, or Ace Parker, who all played in the 1920s-1940s, so I will exclude them, leaving 35 QBs remaining in my group.

Without looking into it deeply, I can't see ranking Eli above the bottom 5 of that group, and he could literally be last. So he isn't top 30, much less top 20.

Depending on how to rank him amongst those older QBs I excluded, he might not even be top 35.
How many won more SB's?

How many had more TD;s?

How many had more yards?

How many won more games?

 
How many won more SB's?

How many had more TD;s?

How many had more yards?

How many won more games?
If these are the only questions you think matter, there is no point continuing this conversation.

Based on this and other threads, I have to conclude you are just trolling. :thumbdown:  

 
If these are the only questions you think matter, there is no point continuing this conversation.

Based on this and other threads, I have to conclude you are just trolling. :thumbdown:  
Who trolls, yep, some dumb kid.

A guy up there in the stat rankings, a two time SB champ doesn;t belong in a top 20 debate?

 
Eli number 8 all time TD passes

Eli number 6 all time yards.
lord almighty. Your own freakin words in the original post were:   "Key words....All Time.  So it's more about dominance of era than just stats, numbers."

And then anyone who responds with info that shows he WASN'T dominant during his own era compared to other QBs, you decide to throw stats like "number 8 all time TD passes", etc.

Dude, the past 15-20 years QB stats are exponentially higher (exaggeration) than those from previous generations of QBs with how the game has changed.

You're moving the goal post like crazy with this Eli Top 20 defense.

I'm convinced that you're just using all these different "all time" and "top 10" threads to show off how much NFL history you know and take any chance to whip that out and swing it around.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
lord almighty. Your own freakin words in the original post were:   "Key words....All Time.  So it's more about dominance of era than just stats, numbers."

And then anyone who responds with info that shows he WASN'T dominant during his own era compared to other QBs, you decide to throw stats like "number 8 all time TD passes", etc.

Dude, the past 15-20 years QB stats are exponentially higher (exaggeration) than those from previous generations of QBs with how the game has changed.

You're moving the goal post like crazy with this Eli Top 20 defense.

I'm convinced that you're just using all these different "all time" and "top 10" threads to show off how much NFL history you know and take any chance to whip that out and swing it around.
I was asked where he was stat wise, so I showed him. I didn't just toss it out.

Obviously the game has changed, that isn't news.

I;m not moving anything, Eli won two SB's, he is among the legends stat wish and has been a very reliable player. Just facts.

I talk like anyone would who has a lot of  experience.  Seen a lot of football.

 
Eli's rankings among active players . . .

Completion % - 22nd
Passing Yds / G - 11th
INT % - 23rd
TD% - 13th
Y/A - 17th
Adj Y/A - 22nd
QB Rating - 22nd

Yes, we all get that he has played a long time and compiled a bunch of statistics. He had two great post season runs that resulted in SB wins.
But in the NFL, being below average for many, many years actually HURTS a team . . . and the Giants mediocre record (.504) reflects that.

At what point was Eli considered a Top 5 QB over the course of his career?

Yes, with Eli playing in this era and playing in 230 games, his career numbers will blow past QBs from other eras. Put another way, once someone like Matt Ryan catches up to Eli in seasons played (4 years younger), Ryan will have 9,000-10,000 more passing yards than Eli did. Matt Stafford is 7 years younger. He could end up 10K or 12K more than Eli.

IMO, it's hard (at the moment) to make a truly compelling case for those two guys as a Top 20 QB. Yeah, I get it. Eli has two rings and they don't. But the point remains, once the old vanguard of QBs from the 2000s retire and the new breed and current crop of QBs retire, Eli could very easily fall out of the Top 10 in total stats . . . then out of the Top 15 . . . then out of the Top 20. Hats off to him for having a couple great team years and playing a long time (and making a ton of $$$). But IMO it's hard to view him as anything but a compiler that went on two great post season runs fueled by the strength of the Giants defense.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Eli's rankings among active players . . .

Completion % - 22nd
Passing Yds / G - 11th
INT % - 23rd
TD% - 13th
Y/A - 17th
Adj Y/A - 22nd
QB Rating - 22nd

Yes, we all get that he has played a long time and compiled a bunch of statistics. He had two great post season runs that resulted in SB wins.
But in the NFL, being below average for many, many years actually HURTS a team . . . and the Giants mediocre record (.504) reflects that.

At what point was Eli considered a Top 5 QB over the course of his career?

Yes, with Eli playing in this era and playing in 230 games, his career numbers will blow past QBs from other eras. Put another way, once someone like Matt Ryan catches up to Eli in seasons played (4 years younger), Ryan will have 9,000-10,000 more passing yards than Eli did. Matt Stafford is 7 years younger. He could end up 10K or 12K more than Eli.

IMO, it's hard (at the moment) to make a truly compelling case for those two guys as a Top 20 QB. Yeah, I get it. Eli has two rings and they don't. Put the point remains, once the old vanguard of QBs from the 2000s retire and the new breed and current crop of QBs retire, Eli could very easily fall out of the Top 10 in total stats . . . then out of the Top 15 . . . then out of the Top 20. Hats off to him for having a couple great team years and playing a long time (and making a ton of $$$). But IMO it's hard to view him as anything but a compiler that went on two great post season runs fueled by the strength of the Giants defense.
Amen.

And your argument will mean nothing to ZenoRazon.

 
Eli's rankings among active players . . .

Completion % - 22nd
Passing Yds / G - 11th
INT % - 23rd
TD% - 13th
Y/A - 17th
Adj Y/A - 22nd
QB Rating - 22nd

Yes, we all get that he has played a long time and compiled a bunch of statistics. He had two great post season runs that resulted in SB wins.
But in the NFL, being below average for many, many years actually HURTS a team . . . and the Giants mediocre record (.504) reflects that.

At what point was Eli considered a Top 5 QB over the course of his career?

Yes, with Eli playing in this era and playing in 230 games, his career numbers will blow past QBs from other eras. Put another way, once someone like Matt Ryan catches up to Eli in seasons played (4 years younger), Ryan will have 9,000-10,000 more passing yards than Eli did. Matt Stafford is 7 years younger. He could end up 10K or 12K more than Eli.

IMO, it's hard (at the moment) to make a truly compelling case for those two guys as a Top 20 QB. Yeah, I get it. Eli has two rings and they don't. Put the point remains, once the old vanguard of QBs from the 2000s retire and the new breed and current crop of QBs retire, Eli could very easily fall out of the Top 10 in total stats . . . then out of the Top 15 . . . then out of the Top 20. Hats off to him for having a couple great team years and playing a long time (and making a ton of $$$). But IMO it's hard to view him as anything but a compiler that went on two great post season runs fueled by the strength of the Giants defense.
:goodposting:

Amen.

And your argument will mean nothing to ZenoRazon.
and :goodposting:

I need to stop reading this thread...

 
How about we go back to the beginning.

Key words....All Time.  So it's more about dominance of era than just stats, numbers.

I will pass on Slingin' Sammy Baugh and those prior to the 40's, things were just too different way back then.

I like to start with Otto Graham, imagine ten title games in ten seasons, nobody ever dominated the QB position like he did.

But it does get weird with any All Time list, the obvious reason is we know Otto, Johnny U, Frantic Fran would stand no chance vs these defenders today, none! Imagine these guys today in 1966.

So we have to forget that and go with that dominace of era. There are only two players I think could play in every era and 20 years from now...Jim Brown and Bob Hayes (he'd blow Tyreek Hill totally away)

So in my opinion, based on having seen them all other than Graham (seen videos)

1.Tom Brady  without question THE GOAT

2.Joe Montana  the poster boy for cool,  placing the ball so receivers never slowed.

3.Drew Brees  there is a reason he owns all the records.

4.Peyton Manning  it's his records Brees is breaking

5.Otto Graham  when he retired he was the greatest QB in the history of the game.

6.Dan Marino  the best preview of what was to come.

7.Johnny Unitas  the total package

8.Aaron Rodgers  will move up this list before he retires,

9.Brett Favre  freakish arm and is still among the stat leaders

10.Fran Tarkenton  after all these years he is still in the All Time top 15 stat wise,  A novelty in his day.

Trying to come up with the next 10 would be harder, now it's Big Ben, Steve Young, Warren Moon, Eli Manning, Philip Rivers, John Elway, Roger Staubach, Troy Aikman, Jim Kelly, Dan Fouts, Ken Stabler, Terry Bradshaw, Kurt Warner.

I do expect to see Russell Wilson***,  and if Patrick Mahomes keeps doing what he;'s doing, to be among those listed above someday.

*** nobody mentioned above had more wins at the same stage of the career or owned more records/firsts.

Eli Manning was in my......where in the next 10. I am not Eli Manning fan. Just curious how a two time SB winner can't even make the top 20.

 
Looking at the quarterbacks who overlapped Eli's career, here are the guys up for consideration just as a comparison to Eli.

Guys with long-term careers that many will consider better (in no order):

- Brady, Peyton, Brees, Favre, Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Warner, Rivers

Some may say Rivers may not belong in a "better than Eli" group. C'est la vie. The only thing he doesn't have is post season success.

Call me in another 5-7 years and we can revisit:

- Wilson, Luck, Ryan, Newton, Stafford, Flacco

Stafford and Flacco are reaches, but Stafford's career numbers are inflated and Flacco could go somewhere and win a second ring. Unlikely, sure, but crazier things have happened.

Who knows what will happen, but check back after a decade passes:

Mahomes, Wentz, Watson, Goff, Mayfield, Trubisky, Prescott, etc.

You can add in any other young QB for that matter.So much is left to be written about these guys that it's hard to really evaluate them as all time greats or HOF candidates.

The point being, there could be 15 quarterbacks just in the group of players whose careers intersected with Eli's that history will show were as good or better than Eli.

 
Looking at the quarterbacks who overlapped Eli's career, here are the guys up for consideration just as a comparison to Eli.

Guys with long-term careers that many will consider better (in no order):

- Brady, Peyton, Brees, Favre, Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Warner, Rivers

Some may say Rivers may not belong in a "better than Eli" group. C'est la vie. The only thing he doesn't have is post season success.

Call me in another 5-7 years and we can revisit:

- Wilson, Luck, Ryan, Newton, Stafford, Flacco

Stafford and Flacco are reaches, but Stafford's career numbers are inflated and Flacco could go somewhere and win a second ring. Unlikely, sure, but crazier things have happened.

Who knows what will happen, but check back after a decade passes:

Mahomes, Wentz, Watson, Goff, Mayfield, Trubisky, Prescott, etc.

You can add in any other young QB for that matter.So much is left to be written about these guys that it's hard to really evaluate them as all time greats or HOF candidates.

The point being, there could be 15 quarterbacks just in the group of players whose careers intersected with Eli's that history will show were as good or better than Eli.
Did Eli steal your girl?  Shoot your bulldog?  Why are working soooooooooooooooooo damn hard with this,.it's getting freaky.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top