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Zyphros

Dynasty: Kelvin Harmon WR Redskins

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My favorite WR of the draft.  I watch him and I see pure effort in a lot of instances, which is why I really like him.  Also I feel like he could play any WR role.  Back to back 1000 yard seasons. 

Listed at 6'3" 214

Top Plays of 2018 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6qinnLPQSM

Stats - https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/kelvin-harmon-1.html

Profile on TheDraftNetwork - https://thedraftnetwork.com/2019/01/04/2019-nfl-draft-player-profile-kelvin-harmon/

Some might say he body catches but that's a different discussion :P

It seems I have an affinity for WR's in the Carolina's this year.  Anthony Ratliff-Williams being the other I really like (although raw), as well as Deebo (which I hadn't looked for a thread yet on him).  I keep saying this but the WR's in this class are looking better and better every second.  

 

Edited by Zyphros
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my least favorite top wr of the draft.

why is his habit of body catching for a different discussion? isn't that what a player thread is for? 

I'm not interested in drafting him at all. maybe a knowledgable poster like yourself (op) can change my mind. the fact that you like him has me coming into this thread to see what you have to say about him

Edited by Dr. Dan

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NC State WR Kelvin Harmon averaged the third-most yards per route run (2.83) in the ACC.

Pro Football Focus only credits Clemson's Justyn Ross and Tee Higgins with more yards per route, leaving Harmon as the top declared receiver in the ACC according to this metric. As a junior, Harmon (6'3/214) picked up 1,065 yards on 72 receptions (14.8 YPC) and scored six touchdowns, which makes Harmon a "top 50 lock" according to The Draft Network's Jon Ledyard. 

Jan 20 - 2:07 PM

Source: PFF College

 

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NFL Draft Scout's Rob Rang lists NC State junior WR Kelvin Harmon as the top riser from Week 9 after his performance on Saturday against Syracuse.

Harmon (6'3/214) was an absolute monster against the Orange -- albeit in a losing effort -- catching 11 passes for 247 yards with two scores. The junior was productive in 2017 with a thousand-yard season, but he's really taken things to another level in 2018. "Harmon’s final draft grade could hinge on how he runs for the stop-watch," writes Rang, "but his physicality and body control are undeniable."

Source: NFL Draft Scout 

Mon, Oct 29, 2018 04:29:00 PM

 

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10 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

my least favorite top wr of the draft.

why is his habit of body catching for a different discussion? isn't that what a player thread is for? 

I'm not interested in drafting him at all. maybe a knowledgable poster like yourself (op) can change my mind. the fact that you like him has me coming into this thread to see what you have to say about him

He body catches sometimes, but I don't think that's his standard or shows how well his hands actually can pluck the ball out the air.  I don't see body catches a whole lot from him, I see him short arming it, but it's still a hands catch.  I think his QB did him little favors to throw him open and lead him but he tracks really well and can adjust mid air with his body.  Harmon does a good job at a lot of things and I think his effort is outstanding.  He'll be a great teamate for that sort of thing and his coaches will love him for that.  He needs some help at getting in and out of breaks when it comes to double moves or sharper cuts, but when it's a 1 cut type of route that isn't a sharp cut he excels.  He's a big guy so doing some of the quicker out routes won't be where he makes his money.  It'll be on the outside more often than not.  Constantly makes tough catches and bails his QB out, but again he could of done so much more had his QB helped him out a bit.  That will improve at the NFL level (hopefully).  

I don't like getting into comparisons anymore but I see some AJ Green and Keenan Allen in his game.  Not saying that he is those players, but I see some similarities between them.  

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I haven't watched too closely but he looks good on paper. What kind of athlete is he expected to be?

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18 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I haven't watched too closely but he looks good on paper. What kind of athlete is he expected to be?

Totally guessing here, but I'd say an above average athlete.  Not a world beater at anything particularly though.  Still going to test relatively well for his size I imagine. 

I took this from WalterFootball, "8/28/18: According to NFL teams' preseason data provided by team sources, Harmon checks in at 6-foot-2, 218 pounds. He is said to run the 40 in 4.55 seconds. He also has 32.5-inch arms, 8.88-inch hands, and with a 75.5-inch wing span, per this data."

 

37 minutes ago, Ben & Jerry's said:

The Colts will take a hard look @ 2.35 if he is still there. 

Personally I don't think he makes it that late but with how good the defensive positions are, it's possible.  I'd love that landing spot.  

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I know it was stupid, but I traded Mahomes for Harmon before the season, so he better pan out :)  I like his physical make up and his ability to catch the ball in traffic and at the catch point.   He will overpower most DBs.

Edited by JohnnyU
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20 hours ago, Zyphros said:

I see some AJ Green and Keenan Allen in his game.  Not saying that he is those players, but I see some similarities between them.  

That is a weird statement. I don't see Green and Allen as similar players at all.

I agree Harmon has some characteristics that are reminiscent of Green, such as athleticism, body control, tracking and high pointing the ball.

I don't see Allen in his game at all. Allen's game is all about quickness, precise routes and cuts, and elite hands... I don't see any of those things as particular strengths of Harmon.

I am a NC State alum and watched every game Harmon played in college. I think he is a legit first round prospect.

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19 hours ago, Zyphros said:

Personally I don't think he makes it that late but with how good the defensive positions are, it's possible.  I'd love that landing spot.  

I believe it's a real possibility Harmon doesn't get picked until the 2nd round.  I see N' Keal Harry, A J Brown, and Marquise Brown, and D K Metcalf being picked in the 1st round.  However, I do believe Harmon wouldn't last past the early part of the 2nd round.

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On 1/22/2019 at 12:32 PM, JohnnyU said:

I know it was stupid, but I traded Mahomes for Harmon before the season, so he better pan out :)  I like his physical make up and his ability to catch the ball in traffic and at the catch point.   He will overpower most DBs.

Who’s your other QBs?

Tex

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1 hour ago, BigTex said:

Who’s your other QBs?

Tex

Deshaun Watson and Lamar Jackson.

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I know a lot of people comp N'Keal Harry to Alshon (which I don't see- Harry is much more dynamic with the ball in his hands). I see Harmon as very Alshon like- in good ways and bad ways. 

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10 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I know a lot of people comp N'Keal Harry to Alshon (which I don't see- Harry is much more dynamic with the ball in his hands). I see Harmon as very Alshon like- in good ways and bad ways. 

Harmon could very easily be better, or just as good as Harry and I like Harry.   Especially if Harry ends up in a bad situation.

Edited by JohnnyU

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5 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Harmon could very easily be better, or just as good as Harry and I like Harry.   Especially if Harry ends up in a bad situation.

I like Harry a lot more. I'm not a scout or even a "tape grinder". I mostly look at metrics, stats and highlights. I'm not totally sold on Harmon. He is big and uses his body really well with jump balls but that is mostly all I saw. I just wonder he is a versatie enough for the modern NFL. 

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10 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I like Harry a lot more. I'm not a scout or even a "tape grinder". I mostly look at metrics, stats and highlights. I'm not totally sold on Harmon. He is big and uses his body really well with jump balls but that is mostly all I saw. I just wonder he is a versatie enough for the modern NFL. 

Harmon has outstanding ball skills and build up speed to separate.  He's not a burner, but has good play speed.   He has very strong hands.   He will win against most DBs with his physical abilities.   His YAC is a concern, but most of that can be blamed on poor QB play.

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

Harmon has outstanding ball skills and build up speed to separate.  He's not a burner, but has good play speed.   He has very strong hands.   He will win against most DBs with his physical abilities.   His YAC is a concern, but most of that can be blamed on poor QB play.

That's where I see the difference between the 2 players.  Harmon isn't used a lot on short routes within 5 yards, but that's where Harry is used more often.  Harmon does lacks some quickness and that seems to be where Harry excels.  Contrast of styles/useage.  I don't know if the numbers back that up or anything but that's what my eyes noticed.  I do agree that his QB didn't help him out a whole lot.  Same with a lot of these WR's.  

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Just now, Zyphros said:

That's where I see the difference between the 2 players.  Harmon isn't used a lot on short routes within 5 yards, but that's where Harry is used more often.  Harmon does lacks some quickness and that seems to be where Harry excels.  Contrast of styles/useage.  I don't know if the numbers back that up or anything but that's what my eyes noticed.  I do agree that his QB didn't help him out a whole lot.  Same with a lot of these WR's.  

I agree with this based on what I have seen. The difference is I have also seen Harry be used as a jump ball/contested catch player and he has excelled. I haven't seen Harmon excel in the short passing game. 

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Harmon gives me Dotson and Devantae Parker vibes. I could just be gunshy since those two, especially Parker really bit me. 

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Just now, Ilov80s said:

Harmon gives me Dotson and Devante Parker vibes. I could just be gunshy since those two, especially Parker really bit me. 

 

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18 hours ago, JohnnyU said:

Deshaun Watson and Lamar Jackson.

Makes sense.

Tex

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7 hours ago, BigTex said:

Makes sense.

Tex

If I knew what I know now I would have traded Watson and gotten a lot more.

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22 hours ago, JohnnyU said:

Harmon has outstanding ball skills and build up speed to separate.  He's not a burner, but has good play speed.   He has very strong hands.   He will win against most DBs with his physical abilities.   His YAC is a concern, but most of that can be blamed on poor QB play.

he reminds me of moose muhahmad from Carolina

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47 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

If I knew what I know now I would have traded Watson and gotten a lot more.

It’s good to have options and be able to trade from position of strength.

Tex

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On 1/24/2019 at 8:18 AM, Ilov80s said:

I know a lot of people comp N'Keal Harry to Alshon (which I don't see- Harry is much more dynamic with the ball in his hands). I see Harmon as very Alshon like- in good ways and bad ways. 

I watched Harry a couple times now.

I am not seeing great RAC ability from Harry. He had that one play where the defender completely misses him and he did do a spin move to help the guy miss, but the defender already was likely to miss that tackle due to poor angle.

Watching the cut ups of Harmon I am seeing him win on multiple types of routes. He seems better at that than most of this years WR that I have watched so far. I see him catching with his hands and coming back for the ball. He gets more separation than Harry does, although Harry may have better hands.

Going to watch some more but at this moment I think Harmon is better than Harry.

For RAC ability Deebo Samuel the best at that I have seen from this WR group.

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I think Harry has some very good RAC since he was used in the punt return game (USC TD) and WR screen game.

We'll see how he and Harmon test, but I like Harry more at this point, and Metcalf

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7 minutes ago, DexterDew said:

I think Harry has some very good RAC since he was used in the punt return game (USC TD) and WR screen game.

We'll see how he and Harmon test, but I like Harry more at this point, and Metcalf

Harry > Harmon > Metcalf

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7 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

Why?

I'm curious about this as well. 

I've read a lot of different things on all 3 that could easily make it Metcalf > Harmon > Harry. 

 

Now I like Harry and I think he is a stud on the right team, but I also think Metcalf could go before him and has the most potential of the wrs in this draft.

I do think Harmon is the least of the three

Edited by Dr. Dan

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45 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

Why?

 Already posted my feelings on Metcalf in the bust thread, don’t really want to repeat it here.  

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

 Already posted my feelings on Metcalf in the bust thread, don’t really want to repeat it here.  

I wasnt wondering why Metcalf would be behind these guys.

Wondering why you think Harry is better than Haskins?

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8 hours ago, Biabreakable said:

Wondering why you think Harry is better than Haskins?

???  What did I miss?  Why would I compare Harry to Haskins?  Did I have a typo somewhere?

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

???  What did I miss?  Why would I compare Harry to Haskins?  Did I have a typo somewhere?

The post I quoted said Harry is greater than Harmon.

I am wondering why.

I know that is how folks voted recently. However I am not at a point where I can say one is clearly better than the other.

Your statement suggests that you think Harry is better. I am just wondering why you think that.

Edited by Biabreakable

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59 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

The post I quoted said Harry is greater than Harmon.

I am wondering why.

I know that is how folks voted recently. However I am not at a point where I can say one is clearly better than the other.

Your statement suggests that you think Harry is better. I am just wondering why you think that.

I'm not 100% convinced Harry is better than Harmon, but I am convinced Harry is better than Metcalf.

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Kelvin Harmon - WR -  Wolfpack

The Athletic's Dane Brugler projects NC State WR Kelvin Harmon as an NFL starter.

Brugler has his concerns over Harmon's "average long-speed and lack of an explosive top gear" but still projects him as an NFL starting-caliber player. Harmon (6'3/214) wins with his physicality and "my ball" mentality, according to Brugler. Those traits make him comparable to the Saints' Michael Thomas, but Harmon would really need to improve his route running to turn into a player on Thomas' level. As a junior, Harmon averaged 14.8 yards on his 72 receptions (1,065 receiving yards). Harmon is a projected first or second-round selection.

Source: The Athletic 

Feb 1 - 9:08 PM

 

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What is his best  lading spot? 

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1 minute ago, Ilov80s said:

What is his best  lading spot? 

69

Tex

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2 minutes ago, BigTex said:

69

Tex

nice 

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7 hours ago, Faust said:

 

huh, imagine that... route running...

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8 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

What is his best  lading spot? 

Cardinals, Browns, Seahawks, Redskins, Packers, 49er's, Raiders, Colts would be fine with me.  That goes for any WR in this draft.  Some worse spots that I think could have a quick turn around could be the Dolphins or Titans.  I think he might fit best as a Seahawk though.  

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1 minute ago, Zyphros said:

Cardinals, Browns, Seahawks, Redskins, Packers, 49er's, Raiders, Colts would be fine with me.  That goes for any WR in this draft.  Some worse spots that I think could have a quick turn around could be the Dolphins or Titans.  I think he might fit best as a Seahawk though.  

I would agree with Seattle. the biggest criticism of Harmon aside from body catching is he has a pretty bad YAC. Seattle was second last last year in YAC.

 

If Seattle is trying to improve that statistic then Harmon would be a poor choice, but if that is their system (they dont expect wrs to do much after the catch) then Harmon would fit right in 

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Watching highlights on youtube doesn't make me an expert.

 

But basically what I've seen:  Gets behind the defense a lot, which I don't know that he'll do at the next level.  Love his size and strength.  He looks nice in the redzone.  In the right situation, I like him.  

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Bleacher Report's Matt Miller mocked NC State WR Kelvin Harmon to the middle of Round 2.

Harmon (6'3/214) gets Round 1 love from time-to-time, but there's a slightly better chance that he is selected on Day 2 rather than Day 1. That's where he went in Miller's mock draft when the Texans scooped him up with the No. 55 overall pick. Harmon wins with his physicality and "my ball" mentality, according to The Athletic's Dane Brugler, but he also checks out well in the production metrics. As a junior at NC State, Harmon caught 81 passes for 1,186 yards and seven touchdowns.

Source: Bleacher Report 

Feb 8 - 8:13 PM

 

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