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The Joker (w/ Joaquin Phoenix)

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6 minutes ago, El Floppo said:

Yeah. That would make as much sense as the argument you've been making. ;)

The KoC role- deniros character and show play a big part of the movie, helping define story arc as well as showing wakeen's domestic side- quality time with Mom, adulation, etc. 

I agree the deniro character was ultimately weak, especially the showdown at the end...but the homage was there tightly enmeshed with the movie.

It was supposed to be a ridiculous argument.

What I'm saying is that just because you want to pay homage to something doesn't mean it's good for the movie.  And there are much better ways to do so that making a huge character the actual homage.  

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1 minute ago, TheIronSheik said:

It was supposed to be a ridiculous argument.

What I'm saying is that just because you want to pay homage to something doesn't mean it's good for the movie.  And there are much better ways to do so that making a huge character the actual homage.  

Agreed

I tried to make the point that homage was more than just the character...it was the show and joker's admiration of the show, which filled a bigger part of plot... A lot which worked.

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4 minutes ago, El Floppo said:

Agreed

I tried to make the point that homage was more than just the character...it was the show and joker's admiration of the show, which filled a bigger part of plot... A lot which worked.

But did they need DiNero for that?  I feel like they could have found so many other actors that would have been better.  Hell, put Michael Keaton in there.  Then you could pay homage to Batman and also have a funny guy who's also known for some serious acting.  

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It was nominated for Best Picture and was one of the highest grossing movies of the year so I think it is fair to say the casting was mostly well received. 

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4 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

It was nominated for Best Picture and was one of the highest grossing movies of the year so I think it is fair to say the casting was mostly well received. 

That has nothing to do with casting.  How many awards was DeNiro nominated for?

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Just now, TheIronSheik said:

That has nothing to do with casting.  How many awards was DeNiro nominated for?

The Casting Society of America named it one of the 5 nominees for best casting in a big budget drama. We didn't like Deniro (and lots of other things about the movie) but we are the minority opinion. 

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On 2/25/2020 at 9:04 AM, TheIronSheik said:

As I said, I don't care what they were trying to do there.  It didn't work.  I'm guessing more people didn't see KOC.  So it falls on deaf ears to the majority and in doing so, looks like terrible casting.  Which means, it was terrible casting.  

I know you have strong feelings here, but here's my take on his casting.

He represents in the movie the establishment.  Something part of everyone's daily life.  Safety, stability, family.  Someone everyone knows.  For that reason, casting perhaps one of the most famous living actors in that role cements for the audience that instant connection...you know him...you like him...you respect him.  He's safe.  And then at the end....bang.  Complete disruption, completely unexpected...

Feel free to bash his acting, he was a little stiff for sure but that's how he acts in almost every movie.  

I think he was there for what he represented to society...not only society of those in the movie, but folks watching the movie.  Insta-connection....and if there was one person in that movie most people subconsciously would consider "safe", it'd be him.  To make Joker's "coming out" scene be one that involves breaking that trust, that connection, that feeling of safety...is why he was there.  Again, dislike his acting style all you want and I won't really disagree...but it was effective having him there, having that unspoken trust, unspoken safety shattered, really added (in my opinion, and I'm sure you'd disagree) to that moment and punctuated Joker's utter disdain for society, for establishment, for the status quo.

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14 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

I don't particularly like DeNiro. Certainly don't respect him - what for?

I don't know if respect is the right word, but he's been a great actor in a lot of great movies. He has delivered many memorable performances and carries with him a level of gravitas. 

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2 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I don't know if respect is the right word, but he's been a great actor in a lot of great movies. He has delivered many memorable performances and carries with him a level of gravitas. 

Okay. I accept the argument based on the word "gravitas".

Criticism retracted.

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1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

The Casting Society of America named it one of the 5 nominees for best casting in a big budget drama. We didn't like Deniro (and lots of other things about the movie) but we are the minority opinion. 

I heard he was nominated for a Dundie, as well.

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1 hour ago, adonis said:

I know you have strong feelings here, but here's my take on his casting.

He represents in the movie the establishment.  Something part of everyone's daily life.  Safety, stability, family.  Someone everyone knows.  For that reason, casting perhaps one of the most famous living actors in that role cements for the audience that instant connection...you know him...you like him...you respect him.  He's safe.  And then at the end....bang.  Complete disruption, completely unexpected...

Feel free to bash his acting, he was a little stiff for sure but that's how he acts in almost every movie.  

I think he was there for what he represented to society...not only society of those in the movie, but folks watching the movie.  Insta-connection....and if there was one person in that movie most people subconsciously would consider "safe", it'd be him.  To make Joker's "coming out" scene be one that involves breaking that trust, that connection, that feeling of safety...is why he was there.  Again, dislike his acting style all you want and I won't really disagree...but it was effective having him there, having that unspoken trust, unspoken safety shattered, really added (in my opinion, and I'm sure you'd disagree) to that moment and punctuated Joker's utter disdain for society, for establishment, for the status quo.

I just want to be clear since discussions on the internet can lead to wrong impressions.  I just don't think he was a good choice.  If others think he was, I'm not trying to change their minds and I respect their opinions.  And I'm not saying this to be a shot at your or anything like that.  I sincerely mean that.  I was just simply arguing my point.  :hifive:

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27 minutes ago, TheIronSheik said:

I heard he was nominated for a Dundie, as well.

LOL What do casting directors know about casting anyway? 

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27 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

LOL What do casting directors know about casting anyway? 

Easy, GB.  Just making a joke.  

I think I may bow out of this thread.  

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9 minutes ago, TheIronSheik said:

Easy, GB.  Just making a joke.  

I see what you did there 

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1 hour ago, TheIronSheik said:

 

I think I may bow out of this thread.  

Still 5x more civil in here than the Mandalorian thread.  ;)

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3 hours ago, KarmaPolice said:

Still 5x more civil in here than the Mandalorian thread.  ;)

I was just joking around myself, I hope he didn't take it seriously 

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