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Zyphros

Dynasty: Miles Sanders - Eagles

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Posted (edited)

With his workout in the books and his numbers being above average across the board seems like the RB to watch out for.  Might be the 2nd biggest winner of the combine at the RB position. 

He has size 5'10" 5/8 211, was a top25 overall recruit out of high school, played behind Barkley and he looks like Barkley when he runs, he just can't quite do what Barkley can do (nobody can).  24 receptions his last year in school just never had a chance to do more with Barkley ahead.  Common theme here just behind a generational player.  And now he's proven to be a plus athlete, pass catcher in drills, and smooth as can be at that size with speed.  

He made my favorites list a month ago and after this combine he moves into mid 1st consideration for me.  Now I just need a landing spot that doesn't kill his value.  

Bench press - 20 reps

Vert - 36"

Broad jump - 10'4"

40 yard dash - 4.45 and 4.5

Edited by Zyphros
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Penn St players have tested above their ability quite a bit the last few years.  It may be prudent to temper expectations a bit.

That type of enthusiasm had some owners taking Gesiki over Goedert last year at TE.

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Just now, trader jake said:

Penn St players have tested above their ability quite a bit the last few years.  It may be prudent to temper expectations a bit.

That type of enthusiasm had some owners taking Gesiki over Goedert last year at TE.

Very true, but that also could be how they recruit.  They might be using more athletic measures than other schools and if they don't meet a certain threshold they don't want them.  Either way that program has put out good athletes and solid players however you view it.  

I didn't have Gesicki over Goedert and I trust my eyes, Sanders passes that test, and then he matched it with athleticism and good showing in drills.  If you view it as athleticism first then tape, I think you're doing it wrong.  That's how I got suckered into Christine Michael.  

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I don't know a lot about Sanders, but he didn't look good to me in the Citrus Bowl.  He's projected as a Day 3 pick.

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1 minute ago, Zyphros said:

 

I didn't have Gesicki over Goedert and I trust my eyes, Sanders passes that test, and then he matched it with athleticism and good showing in drills.

After the combine least year I tried to like Gesicki but all I saw was Coby Fleener, who also had an awesome combine.

To your point before today, based on how he looked in games,  I thought Sanders was most undervalued RB in this class but I think that might be over.

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I turned in for a sec earlier and they had changed his 1st run to 4.50.  Not sure if it changed back or what.

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4 minutes ago, skinfanjon said:

I turned in for a sec earlier and they had changed his 1st run to 4.50.  Not sure if it changed back or what.

Official time is now 4.49

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16 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

3 cone?

 

I haven't seen any 3 cone for any RB posted yet.  I'm thinking they didn't run it yet.  

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Quote

NFL Network's Daniel Jeremiah named Penn State RB Miles Sanders Friday's top performer from the NFL Scouting Combine.

No arguments from us. Sanders is a silky smooth glider with organic vision and instinctive cutting ability, but just how explosive he was was a question coming into the combine weekend. Question it no more. The 5-foot-11, 211-pound Nittany Lions product rocked the 40-yard dash in an unofficial 4.45 seconds on Friday while posting jumps of 36 inches (vertical) and 124 inches (broad). Don't be surprised if Sanders starts to legitimately work his way into the Round 2 conversation.

SOURCE: Greg Pickel on Twitter

Mar 1, 2019, 1:25 PM

 

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2 hours ago, JohnnyU said:

I don't know a lot about Sanders, but he didn't look good to me in the Citrus Bowl.  He's projected as a Day 3 pick.

It certainly was a fun time in January when you trashed me for having him over Snell. Guess what? That’s happening in rookie drafts now for sure.

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3 hours ago, Zyphros said:

With his workout in the books and his numbers being above average across the board seems like the RB to watch out for.  Might be the 2nd biggest winner of the combine at the RB position. 

He has size 5'10" 5/8 211, was a top25 overall recruit out of high school, played behind Barkley and he looks like Barkley when he runs, he just can't quite do what Barkley can do (nobody can).  24 receptions his last year in school just never had a chance to do more with Barkley ahead.  Common theme here just behind a generational player.  And now he's proven to be a plus athlete, pass catcher in drills, and smooth as can be at that size with speed.  

He made my favorites list a month ago and after this combine he moves into mid 1st consideration for me.  Now I just need a landing spot that doesn't kill his value.  

Bench press - 20 reps

Vert - 36"

Broad jump - 10'4"

40 yard dash - 4.45 and 4.5

Agree with all

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4 hours ago, Zyphros said:

 Might be the 2nd biggest winner of the combine at the RB position. 

 

I'd have gone with best day at RB position myself.

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29 minutes ago, cloppbeast said:

Doubtful.

What round to you see him going in?

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Bojang0301 said:

 

It certainly was a fun time in January when you trashed me for having him over Snell. Guess what? That’s happening in rookie drafts now for sure.

Where he goes in fantasy rookie drafts is irrelevant.  What they do on Sunday is relevant.   I believe Snell is the better runner because he has better vision and 897 yards after contact.  Sanders 661.  Neither has demonstrated great ability in the passing game, but Snell has shown he is capable in screens and dump off plays and is a great pass protector. Sanders, not as much in pass protection.  If you watched the Citrus Bowl it was all on the table and Snell was clearly the better running back..  If you didn't watch the Citrus Bowl and are interested in these two RBs, I highly recommend you watch it.  Then get back to me.

Edited by JohnnyU

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Just now, cloppbeast said:

2nd - 3rd

Not a chance on God's green earth.

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His rushing stats are nearly identical to Barkley's junior year. Although Sanders didnt even catch half as many passes.

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, cloppbeast said:

His rushing stats are nearly identical to Barkley's junior year. Although Sanders didnt even catch half as many passes.

Go watch the Citrus Bowl and tell me Sanders is better than Snell.  Forget the stats, even though Snell looks better between the tackles, has better vision, and has better yards after contact, and is better at pass protection.  Forget all that, put it out of your mind and watch that game....please.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRgmWJO6jFo

Edited by JohnnyU

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I’m just not excited. I know he tested well but PSU has some kind of magic in their strength and conditioning. I’m not buying it.

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10 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Go watch the Citrus Bowl and tell me Sanders is better than Snell.  Forget the stats, even though Snell looks better between the tackles, has better vision, and has better yards after contact, and is better at pass protection.  Forget all that, put it out of your mind and watch that game....please.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRgmWJO6jFo

Honestly Johnny you are a uk,homer right??? And you probably,watched sanders in the citruus bowl only right?

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7 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I’m just not excited. I know he tested well but PSU has some kind of magic in their strength and conditioning. I’m not buying it.

Other then testing well his rushing numbers were almost identical to Saquon's the previous season. This is not just a workout warrior.

I'm not saying this after the fact, before today I thought he was the most undervalued rookie RB going and could not figure out why he was not talked about more but those days are over now.

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4 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Honestly Johnny you are a uk,homer right??? And you probably,watched sanders in the citruus bowl only right?

True, and true, but do me a favor and watch that game.  Forget the numbers, even though Snell's is better overall and is a LOT better between the tackles and in pass pro, just take the time and watch the game.

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Go watch the Citrus Bowl and tell me Sanders is better than Snell.  Forget the stats, even though Snell looks better between the tackles, has better vision, and has better yards after contact, and is better at pass protection.  Forget all that, put it out of your mind and watch that game....please.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRgmWJO6jFo

for the season snell 5.0 avg....Sanders 5.8 ? Snell with more carries....PSU was and odd team this year, never seemed to click, I remember him destroying sparty this year pretty well, I think Sparty ranked pretty highly vs the run this past year

Edited by bicycle_seat_sniffer

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57 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Where he goes in fantasy rookie drafts is irrelevant.  What they do on Sunday is relevant.   I believe Snell is the better runner because he has better vision and 897 yards after contact.  Sanders 661.  Neither has demonstrated great ability in the passing game, but Snell has shown he is capable in screens and dump off plays and is a great pass protector. Sanders, not as much in pass protection.  If you watched the Citrus Bowl it was all on the table and Snell was clearly the better running back..  If you didn't watch the Citrus Bowl and are interested in these two RBs, I highly recommend you watch it.  Then get back to me.

I highly doubt you have a clue what you’re seeing. I, unlike you, don’t put stock into what my eyes and gut see because I have tangible evidence in numbers. You want to keep pretending it’s 1985, have at it boss.

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12 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

True, and true, but do me a favor and watch that game.  Forget the numbers, even though Snell's is better overall and is a LOT better between the tackles and in pass pro, just take the time and watch the game.

He had a better bowl game, big deal, besides the playoffs bowl games are just about meaningless...sometimes we have to take our homer glasses off Johnny. 

Didn't Kentucky jump out to a big lead in that game?

 

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18 minutes ago, menobrown said:

Other then testing well his rushing numbers were almost identical to Saquon's the previous season. This is not just a workout warrior.

I'm not saying this after the fact, before today I thought he was the most undervalued rookie RB going and could not figure out why he was not talked about more but those days are over now.

I am not a film scout but what I saw on tape reminded me nothing of Saquon and he's missing the key to the Barkley elite RB recipe. 54/632 vs 24/139 receiving. 

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Hey Johnny, do me a favor and we can go like for like. You go and watch Josh Jacobs vs. Citadel and I’ll go and watch the Miles Sanders game you want me to. Then we can have an honest discussion about how players should be viewed prior to the combine, after the combine and after the draft. 

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

He had a better bowl game, big deal, besides the playoffs bowl games are just about meaningless...sometimes we have to take our homer glasses off Johnny. 

Didn't Kentucky jump out to a big lead in that game?

 

Ok, if you're intent on not watching that game just look at highlights and numbers.  Snell overall still trumps Sanders in ever facet except ypc and it is close.  He's better between the tackles, has better vision, is better after contact, and is better in pass protection.  I didn't want to go there, but since you did there you go.  All I asked was for you to watch the game and concentrate on the two players.

Edited by JohnnyU

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1 minute ago, JohnnyU said:

Ok, if you're intent on not watching that game just look at highlights and numbers.  Snell overall still trumps Sanders in ever facet except ypc and it is close.  He's better between the tackles, has better vision, is better after contact, and is better in pass protection.  I didn't want to go there, but since you did there you go.  All I asked was for you to watch the game and concentrate on the two players.

Saying Snell has better vision is laughable.  Sanders has the best vision in this class by a country mile.

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Just now, skinfanjon said:

Saying Snell has better vision is laughable.  Sanders has the best vision in this class by a country mile.

Why would you say that?

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2 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Ok, if you're intent on not watching that game just look at highlights and numbers.  Snell overall still trumps Sanders in ever facet except ypc and it is close.  He's better between the tackles, has better vision, is better after contact, and is better in pass protection.  I didn't want to go there, but since you did there you go.  All I asked was for you to watch the game and concentrate on the two players.

 

Just now, skinfanjon said:

Saying Snell has better vision is laughable.  Sanders has the best vision in this class by a country mile.

Vision isn't a tangible skill that can be measured 

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Just now, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

 

Vision isn't a tangible skill that can be measured 

I say that about Snell because of the way he gains yards between the tackles.  That is tangible. 

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1 minute ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

 

Vision isn't a tangible skill that can be measured 

Actually Graham Barfields Yards Created tries to measure the RB’s impact independent of the OLine. Which is sort of a roundabout way to judge vision.

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5 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I am not a film scout but what I saw on tape reminded me nothing of Saquon and he's missing the key to the Barkley elite RB recipe. 54/632 vs 24/139 receiving. 

Sanders looked really smooth today in the pass catching drills.....glided out there....I will say this, HC Franklin should be winning more with this talent he is sending to the NFL.

 

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3 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

 

Vision isn't a tangible skill that can be measured 

Shrug.

4 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Why would you say that?

It'll be more clear in 8-9 months. 

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So I’ve probably lead the rally here against Johnny for reasons mostly obscure (just him being overly critical because he only wants to explore numbers that fit his narrative) but it’s ok that he thinks Snell is better. Snell does have a nice market share and Yards after contact. That’s not my problem. My problem is it’s disingenuous. He and others will not use the same metric he is pointing to for Snell to justify putting Josh Jacobs at 1.01. 

As far as I’m concerned this is a bad class but I don’t really see much difference between Sanders or Jacobs or Weber or even someone like Alex Barnes. As far as Snell goes... if he’s going to have fan boys there is no difference between him and Alexander Mattison.

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4 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Sanders looked really smooth today in the pass catching drills.....glided out there....I will say this, HC Franklin should be winning more with this talent he is sending to the NFL.

 

That is good but why didn't they use him more in the passing game? Why wasn't he as effective as Saquon when given those chances? Clearly it is an offense that is willing to pass to the RB given what Saquon did in 2017. I wonder if they are recruiting athletes more than football players? Is their S&D focusing more on these kind of drill results than football results? Was it just a wild statistical anomaly that PSU had 3 99th percentile level testers last year? 

Also, Franklin does not impress me and the coaches blew that tOSU game this year but the Penn State program has been plagued by some awful QBs who somehow had tons of hype. Talk about tying an anchor to one's team. 

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3 minutes ago, skinfanjon said:

Shrug.

It'll be more clear in 8-9 months. 

We could go back and forth on this, but Snell has the better resume and had the better game between the two in the Citrus Bowl.  I guarantee you that Snell has a better chance at early down work than Miles Sanders ever will.  Snell will gain more yards after contact, will be better in pass protection, and is tougher.   What asset does Sanders have over Snell?

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2 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

We could go back and forth on this, but Snell has the better resume and had the better game between the two in the Citrus Bowl.  I guarantee you that Snell has a better chance at early down work than Miles Sanders ever will.  Snell will gain more yards after contact, will be better in pass protection, and is tougher.   What asset does Sanders have over Snell?

Athleticism

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3 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

We could go back and forth on this, but Snell has the better resume and had the better game between the two in the Citrus Bowl.  I guarantee you that Snell has a better chance at early down work than Miles Sanders ever will.  Snell will gain more yards after contact, will be better in pass protection, and is tougher.   What asset does Sanders have over Snell?

For starters, he has the perfect name for a RB haha.

But really, vision.  And what the guy above just said, athleticism.

Prediction: Snell is a JAG, won't amount to ish.

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1 minute ago, Bojang0301 said:

Athleticism

wow, OK.  No sense in arguing it any further.  I don't think I can make a claim for Snell over Sanders any better than i already have.  I can respect your opinion and disagree. I've already made a great case for Snell  over Sanders.

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Just now, skinfanjon said:

For starters, he has the perfect name for a RB haha.

But really, vision.  And what the guy above just said, athleticism.

Prediction: Snell is a JAG, won't amount to ish.

Sanders is below JAG.

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15 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I am not a film scout but what I saw on tape reminded me nothing of Saquon and he's missing the key to the Barkley elite RB recipe. 54/632 vs 24/139 receiving. 

Agree on pass catching disparity and not trying to say he looks like Barkley just saying he was productive as rusher, not just a workout warrior. And not for nothing but I for one got so caught up in how good of a reciever that Barkley is but I kind of slept on fact he went for 1300 and  5 YPC behind a horrible OL.  That he could be as productive in the same offense is something I find encouraging.

Also I liked what I saw on tape myself. Not wowed, did not know he'd test this well, but he looked on tape to me like an NFL starter.

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Just now, JohnnyU said:

Sanders is below JAG.

BS see post above. Listed three JAG plodders and one with actual athleticism.

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