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Sanctuary Seekers to Sanctuary Cities. Why not? (1 Viewer)

Bozeman Bruiser said:
How do you feel about the mayors, governors, and local law enforcement who have used human beings, particularly illegals including criminals, as a means to exact cost and retribution?

Do they get a free pass because you agree with their motives?
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You can't bring retribution upon yourself. Cities and states have the power under our Constitution to determine their own policing laws, as long as it does not violate fundamental civil rights. If a city wants to investigate robberies instead of murders they can do that. If it wants to investigate speeding instead of jaywalking it can do that. But that's up to the people of that state or city, not the federal government. I think the reason that cities really don't enforce the immigration laws is it saves them costs, money, and resources. We don't have local communities across America wildly slapping themselves in the face, the truth is they have other problems typically that they think are more important and some may even consider it a net benefit.

However Opie's state, Mississippi, passed a law outlawing sanctuary cities, that's why there are no MS cities on that list. But ya know what, towns like Jackson, and Gulfport, d'Iberville, and Biloxi can still just not pick up illegal aliens. In fact your town - where is that again? - may even do that, even if it's not a sanctuary town, but you don't even realize police aren't picking up or arresting illegal aliens. And if you have a complaint about that you can march right into your city hall to speak up about that.

 
Slapdash said:
Nice!  Glad my city made the list of a site that regularly propagates fake news about immigration.

You still didn't answer his question 
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Speaking of, not answering a question....when is someone going to answer the question posed in the title of the thread?
That being, " Sanctuary Seekers to Sanctuary Cities. Why not?"

I'll make it multiple choice:

  1. Because we really don't want the potential voters....we just want their votes.
  2. Because setting them in areas that are already blue areas, doesn't help the cause.  No matter how many votes they may give us, we can only win a state's electoral votes, once.
  3. Because Trump thought of it.
  4. Give us some time.  As soon as a consensus is made, the MSM will tell us what to think.
  5. All of the above.
Seeing as how some here like the idea of their city being included....coupled with the fact that many of the Democratic leaders of these sanctuary areas have agreed that they'd "love to have them"....I'm leaning towards either #3 or #4.

Could there be another reason that Congress doesn't try to pass some sort of law that allows this?

 
Opie said:
The communities who've labeled themselves "sanctuary cities", obviously want to harbor those seeking sanctuary.
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Opie - serious question: in your opinion what percentage of homes rebuilt on the MS gulf coast would have still been unbuilt 10 years post-Katrina, and how much more would it have cost for those that were rebuilt?

I'd estimate 75% fewer built and 50% more expensive. Seem fair?

I've seen the Hispanics on the Coast. Talk about the contributions that Hispanics have made in your state. I know the truth, I've seen it. Admit it.

___>>>--->>> They showed up for Mississippi. Remember that.

 
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Opie said:
Speaking of, not answering a question....when is someone going to answer the question posed in the title of the thread?
That being, " Sanctuary Seekers to Sanctuary Cities. Why not?"

I'll make it multiple choice:

  1. Because we really don't want the potential voters....we just want their votes.
  2. Because setting them in areas that are already blue areas, doesn't help the cause.  No matter how many votes they may give us, we can only win a state's electoral votes, once.
  3. Because Trump thought of it.
  4. Give us some time.  As soon as a consensus is made, the MSM will tell us what to think.
  5. All of the above.
Seeing as how some here like the idea of their city being included....coupled with the fact that many of the Democratic leaders of these sanctuary areas have agreed that they'd "love to have them"....I'm leaning towards either #3 or #4.

Could there be another reason that Congress doesn't try to pass some sort of law that allows this?
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Has anyone said no we don't want them?

 
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The mostly Hispanic immigrant population in south Mississippi was vital to the reconstruction following Katrina. It seemed as if almost all of the construction crews had substantial numbers of Hispanic workers—workers who labored remarkably long and hard hours at least six days weekly in the hot Mississippi sun to include repairing tens-of-thousands of roofs. These very hard-working, honest and friendly immigrants, most of whom spoke little or no English, were living in extremely crowded living quarters, worked from dawn to after sunset, and were seemingly everywhere helping our region rebuild. Unfortunately, they were oftentimes victimized by contractors who would not pay them the wages promised, their access to legal assistance and health care was minimal and the language barrier was significant, especially in Mississippi. The immigrant situation was so bleak that an advocacy organization exists to try to assist them, The Mississippi Immigrants Rights Alliance (Cintra, 2007). The immigrant Katrina story on the Mississippi Gulf Coast is at least as tragic as any other sector of the population---and almost certainly more so in many cases.
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- USM, Hattiesburg.

After the storm, Hispanics poured into the community for construction work. Their nail guns pounded from sun up to sun down, seven days a week, as they re-roofed damaged houses.

"A lot of times, you would find them sleeping in trucks in parking lots because there were no rooms to rent and no places to stay," he said, "but they were able to help tremendously in rebuilding the community."

Workers came from Honduras, Guatemala, Panama, Nicaragua and Mexico. 
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- Billoxi Sun Herald. 

This is where @Opielives.

 
I think the big issue is the wide swath of options for what constitutes a “sanctuary city.”  At its base level, it just means a city that won’t use state and local resources to enforce federal law and/or won’t respond to requests to hold people without a warrant.  Which is primarily a lawsuit-saving tactic for jurisdictions tired of being sued for holding someone illegally who turns out to have been misidentified by ICE.  Those jurisdictions are mostly in cost saving mode and will be very upset to have thousands of immigrants of any kind brought to the city. 

On the other end of the spectrum, apparently, is Chicago which is welcoming the idea.  

It’s mostly another a removal of state and local autonomy that has people upset, since that's the issue in the first place. 

 
Opie said:
Speaking of, not answering a question....when is someone going to answer the question posed in the title of the thread?
That being, " Sanctuary Seekers to Sanctuary Cities. Why not?"

I'll make it multiple choice:

  1. Because we really don't want the potential voters....we just want their votes.
  2. Because setting them in areas that are already blue areas, doesn't help the cause.  No matter how many votes they may give us, we can only win a state's electoral votes, once.
  3. Because Trump thought of it.
  4. Give us some time.  As soon as a consensus is made, the MSM will tell us what to think.
  5. All of the above.
Seeing as how some here like the idea of their city being included....coupled with the fact that many of the Democratic leaders of these sanctuary areas have agreed that they'd "love to have them"....I'm leaning towards either #3 or #4.

Could there be another reason that Congress doesn't try to pass some sort of law that allows this?
Click to expand...
I think for cities that have stated their intentions to specifically create a safe haven for undocumented immigrants this may be a legitimate criticism.  I haven’t seen them come out against having more undocumented immigrants though. And obviously that's not what “sanctuary city” solely means. 

 
We also shouldn’t ignore the fact that Trump asked his people to break the law and offered to pardon them for it. 

With any other President, this act alone would be grounds for impeachment. With Trump it’s just another day. 

 
It’s a great idea. We are told over and over by the left they are hard working, commit less crime(one of Tim’s favorite lines) , are better Americans etc.  we have cities that want them. Send them. I cannot believe there would be any resistance from these cities. 

 
timschochet said:
If they’re in custody at the border they’re seeking asylum. If they were truly undocumented they wouldn’t be in custody; they would already be deported. Trump is trying to make these two groups one and the same, basically for bigoted reasons. His supporters are falling for it. 
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How many of those in custody seeking asylum, once released into the interior of the country show up for their hearings?  Be honest now tim as we both know the answer. 

While we are at it be honest about those seekers. They use asylum but we both know it’s economic reasons for the vast majority of them. 

 
It must be exhausting having to defend someone as terrible as Trump.

But hey, at least they have that 1% real wage growth, 2.9% gdp, and massively increasing deficit to hang their hats on.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
Opie - serious question: in your opinion what percentage of homes rebuilt on the MS gulf coast would have still been unbuilt 10 years post-Katrina, and how much more would it have cost for those that were rebuilt?

I'd estimate 75% fewer built and 50% more expensive. Seem fair?

I've seen the Hispanics on the Coast. Talk about the contributions that Hispanics have made in your state. I know the truth, I've seen it. Admit it.

___>>>--->>> They showed up for Mississippi. Remember that.
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WHY do you people keep whittling this down to race?

It's about legal vs illegal.

The Democrats have control of the House....instead of spending all of their time trying to either undo the results of the 2016 election or crippling President Trump in the 2020 election, why don't they try to enact some legislation to change our impotent immigration laws.

BTW....I know how hispanics are...I live in NEW Mexico....You know, cleaner than the OLD Mexico but less prosperous.
Believe it or not....not all hispanics are the same and they don't vote as one.

Oh...and 35 years ago...I married one (still married to her)....and adopted one. And what's funny is that her entire family is against illegal immigration.
Even funnier is that my wife's DNA test showed her to be 11% Native American with her family roots in northern NM.

I would suggest that you stop pigeonholing Hispanics.

 
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timschochet said:
We also shouldn’t ignore the fact that Trump asked his people to break the law and offered to pardon them for it. 

With any other President, this act alone would be grounds for impeachment. With Trump it’s just another day. 
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As I wrote yesterday, it doesn’t matter. Nothing matters anymore. Nobody cares. 

Its one day later and that story is already basically dead. 

The only time Trump has ever told the truth is when he said he could kill someone on fifth avenue and his supporters wouldn’t care. 

 
timschochet said:
We also shouldn’t ignore the fact that Trump asked his people to break the law and offered to pardon them for it. 

With any other President, this act alone would be grounds for impeachment. With Trump it’s just another day. 
Click to expand...
Don't forget...he uses baby seals as tires on his car!

 
Opie said:
WHY do you people keep whittling this down to race?

It's about legal vs illegal.

The Democrats have control of the House....instead of spending all of their time trying to either undo the results of the 2016 election or crippling President Trump in the 2020 election, why don't they try to enact some legislation to change our impotent immigration laws.

BTW....I know how hispanics are...I live in NEW Mexico....You know, cleaner than the OLD Mexico but less prosperous.
Believe it or not....not all hispanics are the same and they don't vote as one.

Oh...and 35 years ago...I married one (still married to her)....and adopted one. And what's funny is that her entire family is against illegal immigration.
Even funnier is that my wife's DNA test showed her to be 11% Native American with her family roots in northern NM.

I would suggest that you stop pigeonholing Hispanics.
Click to expand...
When the Republicans for two years had control of all 3 branches of government , why don't they try to enact some legislation to change our impotent immigration laws. I guess they were spending all their time giving tax breaks to the rich and trying to take health care away from millions. 

 
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Opie said:
WHY do you people keep whittling this down to race?

It's about legal vs illegal.

The Democrats have control of the House....instead of spending all of their time trying to either undo the results of the 2016 election or crippling President Trump in the 2020 election, why don't they try to enact some legislation to change our impotent immigration laws.

BTW....I know how hispanics are...I live in NEW Mexico....You know, cleaner than the OLD Mexico but less prosperous.
Believe it or not....not all hispanics are the same and they don't vote as one.

Oh...and 35 years ago...I married one (still married to her)....and adopted one. And what's funny is that her entire family is against illegal immigration.
Even funnier is that my wife's DNA test showed her to be 11% Native American.
Click to expand...
Zero to do with race, has to do with backing people who backed you.

 
boots11234 said:
How many of those in custody seeking asylum, once released into the interior of the country show up for their hearings?  Be honest now tim as we both know the answer. 

While we are at it be honest about those seekers. They use asylum but we both know it’s economic reasons for the vast majority of them. 
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I have no idea. I imagine the longer they have to wait the more those numbers rise. But I don’t begin with the assumption that they don’t intend to show up. 

As far as your second point, yes you are honest in your opinion. I don’t share it. There are corrupt governments in those countries and terrible gangs. There is also economic destitution caused by those factors and by drought caused by climate change. It’s all linked. 

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
Zero to do with race, has to do with backing people who backed you.
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Which is a big part of President Trump's election....and probably reelection...of course, he delivers.

Democrats promise everyone the moon...fail to deliver....then come back four years later with more promises.
And if it's not about race...why all the identity politics?

They don't care about the voters....just their votes.

 
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Opie said:
WHY do you people keep whittling this down to race?

It's about legal vs illegal.
Click to expand...
Three reasons it’s about race: 

1. Because the majority of undocumented immigrants in this country are Asians and Europeans who flew in and overstay their visas. And Trump never talks about them. 

2. Because President Trump, from the beginning of his campaign for President, has characterized Hispanic undocumented immigrants and Hispanic migrants seeking asylum as violent felons, rapists, gang members, and responsible for our drug culture. 

3. Because President Trump conflates Hispanic undocumented immigrants and Hispanic migrants seeking asylum as the same people. 

These are all expressions of racism and bigotry towards Hispanics. Donald Trump is a bigot and a racist and this is clear evidence which has been there for all to see since the start of his campaign. 

 
Opie said:
Democrats promise everyone the moon...fail to deliver....then come back four years later with more promises.
 
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On this one point I partly agree with you. The Democrats have behaved very cynically on the issue of undocumented immigrants, particularly when they have held power. They have done very little, mainly because they are afraid to lose white union votes. 

That being said, the Dream Act was a Democratic proposal. Democrats supported the McCain-Kennedy plan of 2006 and the Gang of 12 plan of 2014; both were blocked by Republicans in the House. It’s hard to move on these issues when the other side refuses to do a thing. 

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
Only because people keep quoting them.
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I strongly disagree with Opie, Boots, and the rest (in fact I find a lot of what they’re posting here rather offensive) but they’re expressing ideas and engaging in conversation. They’re not trolling IMO and I see no reason to ignore them. Besides, millions of Americans share their views. 

 
Opie said:
Which is a big part of President Trump's election....and probably reelection...of course, he delivers.

Democrats promise everyone the moon...fail to deliver....then come back four years later with more promises.
And if it's not about race...why all the identity politics?

They don't care about the voters....just their votes.
Click to expand...
Well what you’re talking about is the opposite of *that. 

 
timschochet said:
That being said, the Dream Act was a Democratic proposal. Democrats supported the McCain-Kennedy plan of 2006 and the Gang of 12 plan of 2014; both were blocked by Republicans in the House. It’s hard to move on these issues when the other side refuses to do a thing. 
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So which is it?  Did Democrats not do anything out of fear?  Or did Democrats support a number of things that might have addressed the problem, but had them blocked?

 
timschochet said:
Three reasons it’s about race: 

1. Because the majority of undocumented immigrants in this country are Asians and Europeans who flew in and overstay their visas. And Trump never talks about them. 

2. Because President Trump, from the beginning of his campaign for President, has characterized Hispanic undocumented immigrants and Hispanic migrants seeking asylum as violent felons, rapists, gang members, and responsible for our drug culture. 

3. Because President Trump conflates Hispanic undocumented immigrants and Hispanic migrants seeking asylum as the same people. 

These are all expressions of racism and bigotry towards Hispanics. Donald Trump is a bigot and a racist and this is clear evidence which has been there for all to see since the start of his campaign. 
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  1.    :bs:  https://www.pewhispanic.org/interactives/unauthorized-trends/  (specifically, the interactive graph)
  2.    :bs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LprUoGEr1TU
  3.    :bs: https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/oct/19/jeff-sessions/jeff-sessions-claim-about-asylum-system-fraudulent/
 
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timschochet said:
Do you read your links before you post them? Because none of them contradict a single point that I made above. 
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Seriously, so in the first link....you looked at the interactive graph and selected  Region/County of Birth and saw no dispute to your allegation?

Really?

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
So which is it?  Did Democrats not do anything out of fear?  Or did Democrats support a number of things that might have addressed the problem, but had them blocked?
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Are you asking me? I think many  Democrats in power would rather have this as an issue to try and get votes than they would actually like to see it solved. I think they are eager to get Hispanic votes but nervous about losing white votes. 

Are their hearts in the right place? Yeah, compared to the other party. But they’re displaying the same back and forth hesistancy that they did for years with gay issues. 

 
Opie said:
Seriously, so in the first link....you looked at the interactive graph and selected  Region/County of Birth and saw no dispute to your allegation?

Really?
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My statement was that the majority of undocumented people are Asians and Europeans who overstayed their visas and that Trump never talks about them. If you want I can provide you evidence of this fact from dozens of sources. 

 
timschochet said:
Are you asking me? I think many  Democrats in power would rather have this as an issue to try and get votes than they would actually like to see it solved. I think they are eager to get Hispanic votes but nervous about losing white votes. 

Are their hearts in the right place? Yeah, compared to the other party. But they’re displaying the same back and forth hesistancy that they did for years with gay issues. 
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So those times they tried to pass bipartisan legislation don't count?

 
Opie said:
Really...do tell.

It seems to be open to debate

Taking down whatever existing walls that are already on the border would make it an....      " _P_N     B_ RD_R"    ....even more than it is now.

Wanna buy a vowel?
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Really.  Nothing in that first link pushes for open borders.

Amd don’t ever bring a CIS link and expect to be taken seriously.  This conversation has been had about them many times.

Taking down a fence isn’t making it an open border or what open borders means and you know this.

 
boots11234 said:
How many of those in custody seeking asylum, once released into the interior of the country show up for their hearings?  Be honest now tim as we both know the answer. 

While we are at it be honest about those seekers. They use asylum but we both know it’s economic reasons for the vast majority of them. 
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9/10.  Seriously.  89%+ of asylum seekers show up for every single court date. 

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
This is pure Trump. This morning Trump's administration said the policy was not under consideration. An hour later Trump said hell yeah it's a policy. This administration does not plan.

Forget the policy, why do you support this incompetence?
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That what they call a rhetorical question, amiright?

 
Insomniac said:
That what they call a rhetorical question, amiright?
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Of course. Opie said there was a plan and no plan in the space of a few posts, just like the White House said the idea of moving immigrants to sanctuary cities had been rejected and shouldn't be taken seriously and the said oh yeah that's exactly what they're doing with the space of a few hours.

 
timschochet said:
We also shouldn’t ignore the fact that Trump asked his people to break the law and offered to pardon them for it. 

With any other President, this act alone would be grounds for impeachment. With Trump it’s just another day. 
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This is FAKE NEWS. VERY FAKE NEWS

 
Bozeman Bruiser said:
timschochet said:
Have you read any of the mayors’ statements on this? Obviously not. 

Also, are you aware that people seeking asylum are not illegal? Obviously not. 
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Words from mayors who have no skin in the game are meaningless.

Have you seen what the Dems in DC have been saying?

Hint: they don't want them in their district.
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Wait...what?  Not a week ago "the Dems" wanted all the "illegals" to come here so they could vote for them according to your ilk....now that's not true?  That's been one of the most consistent :hophead: points running for years now.  Guess good things do have to come to an end :shrug:  

 
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The Commish said:
Wait...what?  Not a week ago "the Dems" wanted all the "illegals" to come here so they could vote for them according to your ilk....now that's not true?
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Until yesterday they didn't even want them in the country and now they are fine sending them all over the place.

 
Henry Ford said:
9/10.  Seriously.  89%+ of asylum seekers show up for every single court date. 
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Seriously.  When you pull out all the data that you don’t like the numbers look good for those honest asylum seekers. Like I said I have no problem with placing them in sanctuary cities. Speaking of that why does the left call it Dumping?  That’s what you do with garbage not people. Check your racism. 

 
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boots11234 said:
Seriously
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“Most illegally arriving parents seeking asylum are doing so not because they actually were persecuted or have a genuine fear of return, but because that’s what they have heard they should say that will get them released into the United States to live happily ever after, even without legal status.”

 
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