Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Sign in to follow this  
bosoxs45

What makes Joe Biden a better candidate than Elizabeth Warren?

Recommended Posts

She seems as polarizing as Hillary. I'm one that finds her fake and unlikable. I also prefer a moderate. Biden is not my #1 choice, but would be an easy one between the two and I promise I am not a lobbyist. My preference is not specifically about electability, though I do thing a moderate, in general,has a better shot attracting independent and GOP voters. I also worry, in general, about an older candidate generating the enthusiasm to get younger voters to the polls, though doesn't seem to be an issue for Sanders.

 

Edited by Mystery Achiever

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, avoiding injuries said:

She’s fake and unlikable to a lot of people. 

 

54 minutes ago, Mystery Achiever said:

She seems as polarizing as Hillary. 

 

I support Biden over Warren because I agree with him more on several key issues. But these comments bother me because I think that if Warren was a man she wouldn’t come across the same way. Like Hillary she is an aggressive, pushy woman and people don’t like that. Kamala Harris has an easier time because somehow her persona is friendlier; also, she is far more physically attractive than Hillary or Warren. Unfortunately that matters. 

Our society continues to treat women as less than men; we objectify women. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, timschochet said:

 

I support Biden over Warren because I agree with him more on several key issues. But these comments bother me because I think that if Warren was a man she wouldn’t come across the same way. Like Hillary she is an aggressive, pushy woman and people don’t like that. Kamala Harris has an easier time because somehow her persona is friendlier; also, she is far more physically attractive than Hillary or Warren. Unfortunately that matters. 

Our society continues to treat women as less than men; we objectify women. 

Physical attraction has nothing to do with Hillary and Warren being disgusting dishonest politicians.  AOC is attractive and many think she’s less than intelligent too.  Stop all the mental gymnastics and stick to the topic

  • Like 4
  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I moved back to Mass after 35 years just in time to be treated to her initial campaign against Scott Brown. I've been politically active since i was 13 (over half a century) and i aint seen a worse campaigner. She's nerdsmart to tornado-ramble proportions, self-conscious in a way that makes Conan O'Brien look like Cary Grant, has trouble being genuine in regular contact and quite evidently hates the process as much as she loves governance. I really like what her publicity folk are doing, brief guerilla attacks of policy ideas where shock & enthusiasm rule the day but, once she gets down to being examined in debate or interview, she'll fall back upon being caught between want she wants to say and has been told to say and ends up sounding faker than Hillary. If i were handling her, i would have sent her to method-acting classes so she knows the difference between telling & saying but, til then, she's the only member of DemCaravan who can str8up lose to Trump.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, timschochet said:

 

I support Biden over Warren because I agree with him more on several key issues. But these comments bother me because I think that if Warren was a man she wouldn’t come across the same way. Like Hillary she is an aggressive, pushy woman and people don’t like that. Kamala Harris has an easier time because somehow her persona is friendlier; also, she is far more physically attractive than Hillary or Warren. Unfortunately that matters. 

Our society continues to treat women as less than men; we objectify women. 

I'm a woman. My top Dem choices are women. I have several women friends who feel as I do about Warren. She's earned the criticism, imo on the merits, not gender. ymmv.
Like you, though, even if I found her a wonderful a person, I'd prefer Biden on policy.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They are really pretty different candidates. There are many reasons to prefer one over the other. For me, I have serious doubts she could win the general election and Biden will easily if he is the nominee. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I find it odd that she would be criticized for being "fake", when the same term could be applied to most of her potential rivals -- Biden (plagiarized speeches), Bernie (he's really a millionaire!), Trump (fake origin story, fake net worth). I agree with Tim that these criticisms wouldn't be as prevalent if she were a man.

Nonetheless, Warren is pretty far down on my list, for two main reasons:

1. she becomes so focused on delivering her message (or her talking point) that she fails to listen to her audience. I've seen examples of this when she's campaigning (when someone will ask her a question about one topic, and then she'll respond by answering a question to a completely different topic), and I've seen it during congressional hearings (when she'll ask a question, then not even listen to the response, then plow ahead with whatever unrelated "Gotcha" point she was planning to deliver). I suppose that some people find this approach to be refreshing, but I find it to be tone deaf. She just doesn't connect with people, IMO.

2. I have no problem with what she did regarding her perceived Native American ancestry. I think her behavior prior to entering politics was consistent with what most Americans would have done in the same situation, and I find much of the criticism of that behavior to be disingenuous at best.

That said.....I think that she has completely mishandled the revelations about her ancestry. She needed to acknowledge that her family stories were flat-out-wrong. And she still hasn't done that. It shows a complete lack of leadership, IMO.

Of course, neither of the above reasons would be enough for me to vote for a pathological liar over her. But I think there are better options in the Democratic primary.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Mystery Achiever said:

I'm a woman. My top Dem choices are women. I have several women friends who feel as I do about Warren. She's earned the criticism, imo on the merits, not gender. ymmv.
 

I don’t think being a woman grants you or your friends immunity to society’s tendencies towards the objectification of women. In fact it might very well be the opposite as some studies of 2016 suggest that women distrusted Hillary even more than men did. 

Sexism and how we regard women as leaders are complicated subjects. I’m well aware that when I suggest that it plays a significant role in how we all think, certain conservatives like @Ramblin Wreck are going to get annoyed and disagree. They’re going to argue that Hillary and Warren are disliked because of what they’ve done and how they behave. And there is some truth to this. 

And yet, I’m also convinced that their sex plays a part. I truly believe that society, and I include you, me, Ramblin Wreck, and everybody else, is simply not as comfortable with aggressive women behaving the same way that men traditionally have as political leaders. Maybe that will change over time. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, timschochet said:

I don’t think being a woman grants you or your friends immunity to society’s tendencies towards the objectification of women. In fact it might very well be the opposite as some studies of 2016 suggest that women distrusted Hillary even more than men did. 

Sexism and how we regard women as leaders are complicated subjects. I’m well aware that when I suggest that it plays a significant role in how we all think, certain conservatives like @Ramblin Wreck are going to get annoyed and disagree. They’re going to argue that Hillary and Warren are disliked because of what they’ve done and how they behave. And there is some truth to this. 

And yet, I’m also convinced that their sex plays a part. I truly believe that society, and I include you, me, Ramblin Wreck, and everybody else, is simply not as comfortable with aggressive women behaving the same way that men traditionally have as political leaders. Maybe that will change over time. 

Please stop attributing positions to me and telling me what my feelings are.  Joe Bryant has asked you to stop this nonsense already.  I am capable of stating my own positions when I feel it necessary.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Warren is miles smarter than Biden which is why I favor her. I don’t find Biden all that appealing except for his experience.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, wikkidpissah said:

I moved back to Mass after 35 years just in time to be treated to her initial campaign against Scott Brown. I've been politically active since i was 13 (over half a century) and i aint seen a worse campaigner. She's nerdsmart to tornado-ramble proportions, self-conscious in a way that makes Conan O'Brien look like Cary Grant, has trouble being genuine in regular contact and quite evidently hates the process as much as she loves governance. I really like what her publicity folk are doing, brief guerilla attacks of policy ideas where shock & enthusiasm rule the day but, once she gets down to being examined in debate or interview, she'll fall back upon being caught between want she wants to say and has been told to say and ends up sounding faker than Hillary. If i were handling her, i would have sent her to method-acting classes so she knows the difference between telling & saying but, til then, she's the only member of DemCaravan who can str8up lose to Trump.

Sadly the best campaigners often don’t make the best governors and vice versa. Electing a President is actually a pretty stupid process. It would be like choosing an accountant through a singing competition. 

Edited by Ilov80s

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, timschochet said:

In fact it might very well be the opposite as some studies of 2016 suggest that women distrusted Hillary even more than men did. 

Didn’t women also distrust Trump more than men did? Maybe women are just better judges of character overall.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there a lamer trope than "Bernie is a millionaire"?! He's a millionaire from books & lectures that are a direct result of his popularity as a public servant/politician

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like Warren a lot, but I think she found her calling as a Senator.  Would love to see her replace Schumer at the top.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

Please stop attributing positions to me and telling me what my feelings are.  Joe Bryant has asked you to stop this nonsense already.  I am capable of stating my own positions when I feel it necessary.

You already responded and I didn’t attribute any positions to you that you didn’t already very clearly state. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, wikkidpissah said:

Is there a lamer trope than "Bernie is a millionaire"?! He's a millionaire from books & lectures that are a direct result of his popularity as a public servant/politician

He was a millionaire before that. He just has a difficult time owning it. There's nothing wrong with saying "Yeah, I'm a millionaire. And people like me should pay more taxes."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, timschochet said:

I don’t think being a woman grants you or your friends immunity to society’s tendencies towards the objectification of women. 

That is a fair point, absolutely, but it should  not invalidate criticism of Warren on the merits.And, as said I have still picked two women over, what is it now, 18 or so guys? Hopefully all  on merit, not  perception.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, wikkidpissah said:

Is there a lamer trope than "Bernie is a millionaire"?! He's a millionaire from books & lectures that are a direct result of his popularity as a public servant/politician

It’s lame to hate on anybody because they are a millionaire, not sure why politicians that write books would merit special exemption and it’s less lame to call out the successful lawyer or basketball player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, timschochet said:

You already responded and I didn’t attribute any positions to you that you didn’t already very clearly state. 

You're a liar, as usual.  See the bolded below.

And yet, I’m also convinced that their sex plays a part. I truly believe that society, and I include you, me, Ramblin Wreck, and everybody else, is simply not as comfortable with aggressive women behaving the same way that men traditionally have as political leaders. Maybe that will change over time. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Ramblin Wreck said:

You're a liar, as usual.  See the bolded below.

And yet, I’m also convinced that their sex plays a part. I truly believe that society, and I include you, me, Ramblin Wreck, and everybody else, is simply not as comfortable with aggressive women behaving the same way that men traditionally have as political leaders. Maybe that will change over time. 

Read the part again that you chose not to bold: “I include you, me, Ramblin Wreck, and everybody else”- in other words I was making a general argument about all of society and not about you in particular. 

You seem awfully eager to call people liars. You also seem quite angry all the time, and quite eager to criticize other posters. I hope everything is OK with you in real life as you appear to be in a very bad mood. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Read the part again that you chose not to bold: “I include you, me, Ramblin Wreck, and everybody else”- in other words I was making a general argument about all of society and not about you in particular. 

You seem awfully eager to call people liars. You also seem quite angry all the time, and quite eager to criticize other posters. I hope everything is OK with you in real life as you appear to be in a very bad mood. 

:lmao:  You used my name.  State whatever opinions about yourself you want.  Leave me out of your nonsense and cut your lying BS about me out.  

I am not angry at all.  My life is just fine.  You live in Southern California as you like to brag about and you spend well over half your life on this forum.  You shouldn't talk about anyone else's life, IMO.  Take care of yourself first and again, leave me out of your stupid rants.  I can speak for myself

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a spectrum on how politicians view business.

 On one end, businesses are revered as the job and wealth creators.  They are protected at almost all costs, are subsidized by the government and are promised less and less regulation even if their actions are harmful.

On the other end, business is viewed as the enemy.  They are perpetually greedy and out to screw everyone for the sake of profits.  No amount of regulation is enough because government knows how everything should be best run.

Warren is too far to the edge of the latter side.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, djmich said:

It’s lame to hate on anybody because they are a millionaire, not sure why politicians that write books would merit special exemption and it’s less lame to call out the successful lawyer or basketball player.

not missing the point as badly as scooter, but he's being hamfistedly painted as hypocritical for personal wealth and thereby grouped with folks who've gamed the system, made even more ridiculous by the fact that the wealth is the direct, nearly accidental result of popular acceptance of his manifesto.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, wikkidpissah said:
56 minutes ago, djmich said:

It’s lame to hate on anybody because they are a millionaire, not sure why politicians that write books would merit special exemption and it’s less lame to call out the successful lawyer or basketball player.

not missing the point as badly as scooter

:rolleyes:

Don't misinterpret my observations for my personal beliefs. Not a good look for you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, James Daulton said:

Whoever has the best chance of casting Trump out is the better candidate.

Okay, I'm running too.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, James Daulton said:
2 minutes ago, Mister CIA said:

Okay, I'm running too.

Unless this is Don Jr, you’ve got my vote 

My official name is, Not Jr.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, timschochet said:

You already responded and I didn’t attribute any positions to you that you didn’t already very clearly state. 

You really need to stop the stuff Joe told you to not do. And then you act innocent. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, John Blutarsky said:

You really need to stop the stuff Joe told you to not do. And then you act innocent. 

Check out this new guy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Republicans would love to see either Warren or Sanders become the Democrat nominee for President. Today on This week with George Stephanopolis on the round table Christie was loving it as a progressive Democrat was arguing with Democrat  Heitkamp about Medicare for all. Christie said(and I agree) if you give Americans the binary choice of him or a “socialist” Trump is going to get re-elected. Many of you may not think that Sanders or Warren are socialists or if they were that’s not bad, but the Midwest wants no part of it. Polls show Biden leading Trump by 14 points, Sanders head to head a 7 point lead and Warren only a 3 point lead. Democrats number one goal is to defeat Trump and they want to put the best horse out there so they are jumping on the Biden bandwagon.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2019/05/16/trump-down-biden-pennsyvania-more-than-10-quinnipiac-poll/3691646002/

 

 

Edited by lazyike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, James Daulton said:

Whoever has the best chance of casting Trump out is the better candidate.

It's an interesting balance. Go with the "safest" in Biden or swing for the fences with someone who might generate more turnout.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Leroy Hoard said:

It's an interesting balance. Go with the "safest" in Biden or swing for the fences with someone who might generate more turnout.

2008 says hi.

  • Thinking 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Mister CIA said:

2008 says hi.

 

13 minutes ago, Mister CIA said:

2008 says hi.

Whomever turns out the dems should be nominated.  We'll sort out the policy details later. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Leroy Hoard said:

It's an interesting balance. Go with the "safest" in Biden or swing for the fences with someone who might generate more turnout.

Bernie's supporters are by far the most passionate. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Your opinion is that a woman wouldn’t make a good President?

Absolutely not. And I don't think Biden is a better candidate than Warren, who is my preferred candidate at this point in time. It's just the only answer I can think someone would give to the question, because I think Warren outclasses him in every single other way. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We did the shrill, old white woman in 2016.  It didn't work.

Whether you like it or not, winning president is mostly about personality.  Biden is likable.  Warren is not.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, The Narrator said:

It's just the only answer I can think someone would give to the question, because I think Warren outclasses him in every single other way. 

Except nobody in this thread has given it. (Present company excluded.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

4 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Except nobody in this thread has given it. (Present company excluded.)

This is the post immediately above yours

16 minutes ago, Captain Cranks said:

We did the shrill, old white woman in 2016.  It didn't work.

Whether you like it or not, winning president is mostly about personality.  Biden is likable.  Warren is not.  

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, lazyike said:

Republicans would love to see either Warren or Sanders become the Democrat nominee for President. Today on This week with George Stephanopolis on the round table Christie was loving it as a progressive Democrat was arguing with Democrat  Heitkamp about Medicare for all. Christie said(and I agree) if you give Americans the binary choice of him or a “socialist” Trump is going to get re-elected. Many of you may not think that Sanders or Warren are socialists or if they were that’s not bad, but the Midwest wants no part of it. Polls show Biden leading Trump by 14 points, Sanders head to head a 7 point lead and Warren only a 3 point lead. Democrats number one goal is to defeat Trump and they want to put the best horse out there so they are jumping on the Biden bandwagon.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2019/05/16/trump-down-biden-pennsyvania-more-than-10-quinnipiac-poll/3691646002/

The GOP is going to use the “socialist” smear no matter who the Dem nominee is. They did it to Obama, and it worked pretty well - something like 2/3 of GOP voters believed he was a straight-up socialist.

They’re also beginning to do it to Biden, who is probably the most conservative candidate in the Democratic field: link

I don’t have all the answers, but I really don’t think it’s worthwhile for Dems to try and pick a candidate who won’t be the victim of bad-faith GOP attacks. They’re coming either way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Politician Spock said:

Bernie's supporters are by far the most passionate. 

A lot of them are also not really Democrats. 

I watched some interviews with some of these people who show up to his rallies. They expressed more dislike for Biden than they did for Trump. Several of them stated that they would never vote for Biden “or any Wall Street candidate.” It’s the exact same crap as last time. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.