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2019-20 NBA Thread: new forum, same great taste (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter Capella
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Capella
Footballguy
We were soft," Simmons said. "Soft is don't get bullied, fight over screens, get through screens. You've gotta knock somebody, knock 'em over. You've gotta hit somebody in the face and knock 'em down, make sure they don't score, hit 'em in the face."
Soft is also not bothering to learn how to shoot a 3 so your offense doesn’t get collapsed upon by any competent defense.
modogg
Footballguy
Ben shooting 3s has become one of the least problematic things with this team. Embiid not giving a #### letting guys dunk on him is worse i think. Fatty shot 6-26 tonight. This team is becoming very hard to like
Capella
Footballguy
Ben not knowing how to shoot is absolutely one of the biggest problems. It’s been discussed repeatedly how you can’t have a PG unable to shoot at all in today’s nba. It’s insane.
Major
Footballguy
While I'm doubtful it'll mint a ring, at least this Rockets small ball is fun to watch. I like Capela's game and will miss the blocks+lobs but it was time for a change. It reminds me of a modern day Run TMC or Nuggets Run N Gun and while that didn't work in the past, maybe it will in the current NBA? Who knows, worth a gamble as they were heading for another early exit from the playoffs.
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
Well, looks like it worked against the Lakers too. Interesting this team. Westbrook just a beast tonight, and Covington throwing daggers down the stretch in his debut. Lakers didn't fall into the trap of looking for mismatches in the post the way Portland did, but couldn't keep up with all Houston's ballhandlers. Fun to watch and I am a Laker fan.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Houston goes into LA and wins 
Tallest player seeing PT - 6'7 Robert Covington.
Don't know that they'll beat either LA team in a 7 game series but I'd definitely take them over Denver/Utah. They'll definitely have their share of ups/downs with it but really plays to their strengths of their roster. Spreads the #### out of teams and allows Westbrook/Harden to drive to the dish whenever they want surrounded by guys that can stick it from the perimeter and maximizes Harden/Westbrooks rebounding ability. Kudos to D'Antoni for running with small ball after it worked so well in Utah a week or two back. That was my big takeaway from that game. Thought dealing Capela was a no brainer move and kudos to them for pulling the trigger
With or without Capela, they weren't going to be a good defensive team.
Really fortunate they were able secure Covington for Capela when the Center market for guys w/o range is nonexistent. Morris was a nice get for the Clips, but this transition to small ball by the Rockets was far and away was my favorite trade season move.
Tallest player seeing PT - 6'7 Robert Covington.
Don't know that they'll beat either LA team in a 7 game series but I'd definitely take them over Denver/Utah. They'll definitely have their share of ups/downs with it but really plays to their strengths of their roster. Spreads the #### out of teams and allows Westbrook/Harden to drive to the dish whenever they want surrounded by guys that can stick it from the perimeter and maximizes Harden/Westbrooks rebounding ability. Kudos to D'Antoni for running with small ball after it worked so well in Utah a week or two back. That was my big takeaway from that game. Thought dealing Capela was a no brainer move and kudos to them for pulling the trigger
With or without Capela, they weren't going to be a good defensive team. Really fortunate they were able secure Covington for Capela when the Center market for guys w/o range is nonexistent. Morris was a nice get for the Clips, but this transition to small ball by the Rockets was far and away was my favorite trade season move.
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Major
Footballguy
Tonight was the first time I've seen them really play as a team instead of just sitting around watching Harden and Westbrook play hero ball. Good to see some emotion again. Hope they keep this energy. And yeah, Covington was
MAC_32
Footballguy
Right or wrong (it's probably wrong) this is the thought process, but why max him? Seriously asking. I like to think I know what I'm talking about when it comes to NFL contracts, but I've never tried figuring out the NBA.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Agree. And they need to move Simmons.
They just look miserable out there. Simmons passes up so many jump shots in the lane and forces passes for worse shots. Embiid looks like he is scared about hurting his hand more and he still looks out of shape. Harris is a bright spot — glad they got him, but too bad they included Shamet in that deal.
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
Exactly this. Look at New Orleans for comparisons sake. People were slamming Lonzo Ball for the past year or two because he was a horrid shooter. He’s worked on his shot and improved it to the point where defenders actually have to defend him—and both he and the Pelicans are having a decent season considering all of the injuries they are having. The space that it frees up for other players to operate helps the entire offense flow better. It’s not that Simmons needs to learn to be a sharpshooter—he just needs to get a shot that is worthy of defending. It’s beyond shocking and frustrating that he doesn’t seem to care.
With that said—this team has far more problems than that. Embiid is undisciplined and shoots way too many 3’s. Brett Brown doesn’t seem to have any sort of leadership or control over that locker room. For a team that is filled with talent—they have no identity or discipline. I like the moves they did at the deadline—but even with them—unless somebody takes leadership on this team—they will underachieve their talent and will be a playoff bust.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Embiid shoots 3s because they want him to shoot 3s. They need to attempt to get spacing somehow.
Embiid is too emotional though. He doesn't seem to have the gear to step up when he's not feeling great. This hand thing is surely bothering him and causing him to be disengaged. When he is not at full strength, he has so little impact. Although he is skilled, he wins on his physicality and when he doesn't have that, he falls way down.
Capella
Footballguy
Exactly. Nobody is suggesting he needs to become Steph Curry but at this point he should have a shot where they don’t just lag off him to the paint. He won’t even consider shooting. It’s the weakest thing I’ve ever seen an nba player do. Can’t believe his peers don’t clown him for it more.
General Malaise
Footballguy
Phily should have kept Reddick, IMO.
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
I get that they might want him to shoot 3’s—but there is not a chance in hell that any team wants one of the most dominant big men in the game to shoot 5-10 three point shots per game. That’s just absurd. He’s not shooting good threes—he’s settling for threes because there is no leadership on that team to direct him otherwise. Perhaps when Butler was on that team—he may have been a guy that could call people out on stuff—but at this moment—they have nobody playing that role. I personally don’t think its his physicality that has fallen off—I think that team is playing with no chemistry and no fun. It’s no different then when there is drama or stress in the workplace for anybody—you lose interest and you become less engaged. He doesn’t look like a guy that’s playing hurt—Embiied is looking like a guy thats playing like he doesn’t care. At least that’s what I see.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Well, i was kind of devil's-advocating there but, if you're a bad team whose last 2 hi-#1s arent working out, nobody will take your $30mil guy for free (even tho he's a good player) and no one's ever gonna sign with you, why not seize the short season to try counter-programming Mike D'Antoni. Post up all these point-centers, kick it to Love if they sag, teach the new not-Lillard PG the pick & roll and see if that could be a thing. If it works, overpay the bastage and give your fans some entertaining ball.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
But don't you realize their coach learned the game in the lap of St. Popovich a mere 27 years ago and musses his hair in frustration every time his players don't do what he didn't teach them? Isn't that leadership enough?!?!
modogg
Footballguy
he also shoots 3s because it allows him to get back on defense. if he plays in the post, he is often behind the play and can't get back in time to play defense.
and yeah, watching him get worked over by Robin Lopez last night, and the last 3 games watching everybody dunk on him, dude just needs to sit
offdee
Footballguy
Milwaukeean here and Giannis fan. But, WTF was he thinking with his drafting of his All-Star team? Only thing I can think is that he just wants guys around him that will help him do more, pass to him more, allow him to carry the team to win MVP? Embiid as his #1 pick?!
I saw his comment when he picked Kemba over Harden was (paraphrasing) "I want a guy that is willing to pass"
-----
Team LeBron
Starters: LeBron James, Anthony Davis, Kawhi Leonard, Luka Doncic, James Harden
Reserves: Damian Lillard, Ben Simmons, Nikola Jokic, Jayson Tatum, Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook, Domantas Sabonis
Team Giannis
Starters: Giannis Antetokounmpo, Joel Embiid, Pascal Siakam, Kemba Walker, Trae Young
Reserves: Khris Middleton, Bam Adebayo, Rudy Gobert, Kyle Lowry, Brandon Ingram, Donovan Mitchell
First Round (Starters)
1. Anthony Davis (Team LeBron)
2. Joel Embiid (Team Giannis)
3. Kawhi Leonard (Team LeBron)
4. Pascal Siakam (Team Giannis)
5. Luka Doncic (Team LeBron)
6. Kemba Walker (Team Giannis)
7. James Harden (Team LeBron)
8. Trae Young (Team Giannis)
Second Round (Reserves)
9. Khris Middleton (Team Giannis)
10. Damian Lillard (Team LeBron)
11. Bam Adebayo (Team Giannis)
12. Ben Simmons (Team LeBron)
13. Rudy Gobert (Team Giannis)
14. Nikola Jokic (Team LeBron)
15. Jimmy Butler (Team Giannis)
16. Jayson Tatum (Team LeBron)
17. Kyle Lowry (Team Giannis)
18. Chris Paul (Team LeBron)
19. Brandon Ingram (Team Giannis)
20. Russell Westbrook (Team LeBron)
21. Donovan Mitchell (Team Giannis)
22. Domantas Sabonis (Team LeBron)
https://www.nba.com/allstar/2020/draft
I saw his comment when he picked Kemba over Harden was (paraphrasing) "I want a guy that is willing to pass"
-----
Team LeBron
Starters: LeBron James, Anthony Davis, Kawhi Leonard, Luka Doncic, James Harden
Reserves: Damian Lillard, Ben Simmons, Nikola Jokic, Jayson Tatum, Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook, Domantas Sabonis
Team Giannis
Starters: Giannis Antetokounmpo, Joel Embiid, Pascal Siakam, Kemba Walker, Trae Young
Reserves: Khris Middleton, Bam Adebayo, Rudy Gobert, Kyle Lowry, Brandon Ingram, Donovan Mitchell
First Round (Starters)
1. Anthony Davis (Team LeBron)
2. Joel Embiid (Team Giannis)
3. Kawhi Leonard (Team LeBron)
4. Pascal Siakam (Team Giannis)
5. Luka Doncic (Team LeBron)
6. Kemba Walker (Team Giannis)
7. James Harden (Team LeBron)
8. Trae Young (Team Giannis)
Second Round (Reserves)
9. Khris Middleton (Team Giannis)
10. Damian Lillard (Team LeBron)
11. Bam Adebayo (Team Giannis)
12. Ben Simmons (Team LeBron)
13. Rudy Gobert (Team Giannis)
14. Nikola Jokic (Team LeBron)
15. Jimmy Butler (Team Giannis)
16. Jayson Tatum (Team LeBron)
17. Kyle Lowry (Team Giannis)
18. Chris Paul (Team LeBron)
19. Brandon Ingram (Team Giannis)
20. Russell Westbrook (Team LeBron)
21. Donovan Mitchell (Team Giannis)
22. Domantas Sabonis (Team LeBron)
https://www.nba.com/allstar/2020/draft
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CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
It was comforting to see the Bucks set the record straight after getting blown out in Philadelphia on Christmas day. Last night, it seemed the game was never in doubt, that Milwaukee could turn it on and close out the game at will whenever they chose to do so.
Giannis is on a historic run, just an incredible force - past 9 games:
Giannis is on a historic run, just an incredible force - past 9 games:
offdee
Footballguy
yeah watching Giannis is something to behold. Pretty much unstoppable already, and if he continues to improve his outside shot as much as he already has in a 1 yr span it's a scary thought for any team that he doesn't play on. Free throw shooting is his only real weakness at this point...and I think that is truly about confidence in it, rather than actually being able to do it
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jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
What is even more impressive to me is that he can put up those astronomical numbers all while being selfless and being the consummate teammate. Lots of guys play the game to accumulate and pad stats. This dude plays a complete team game while putting up video game type numbers. He’s the kind of player that anybody that cares about winning would take less money for to play on his team.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
it's essentially the difference between now & then in basketball - everyone knows how to play like never before but nobody knows the stuff of winning
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
I didn’t see the draft pick by pick—but when I saw the full rosters—it seemed to me like it was almost like an east versus west game with a few exceptions. I wonder if that was something that he had intended.
offdee
Footballguy
I edited my post with the actual draft...
Team LeBron
Starters: LeBron James, Anthony Davis, Kawhi Leonard, Luka Doncic, James Harden
Reserves: Damian Lillard, Ben Simmons, Nikola Jokic, Jayson Tatum, Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook, Domantas Sabonis
Team Giannis
Starters: Giannis Antetokounmpo, Joel Embiid, Pascal Siakam, Kemba Walker, Trae Young
Reserves: Khris Middleton, Bam Adebayo, Rudy Gobert, Kyle Lowry, Brandon Ingram, Donovan Mitchell
First Round (Starters)
1. Anthony Davis (Team LeBron)
2. Joel Embiid (Team Giannis)
3. Kawhi Leonard (Team LeBron)
4. Pascal Siakam (Team Giannis)
5. Luka Doncic (Team LeBron)
6. Kemba Walker (Team Giannis)
7. James Harden (Team LeBron)
8. Trae Young (Team Giannis)
Second Round (Reserves)
9. Khris Middleton (Team Giannis)
10. Damian Lillard (Team LeBron)
11. Bam Adebayo (Team Giannis)
12. Ben Simmons (Team LeBron)
13. Rudy Gobert (Team Giannis)
14. Nikola Jokic (Team LeBron)
15. Jimmy Butler (Team Giannis)
16. Jayson Tatum (Team LeBron)
17. Kyle Lowry (Team Giannis)
18. Chris Paul (Team LeBron)
19. Brandon Ingram (Team Giannis)
20. Russell Westbrook (Team LeBron)
21. Donovan Mitchell (Team Giannis)
22. Domantas Sabonis (Team LeBron)
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
Looking at the way giannis picked-I definitely think he was shooting to create as close to an East/West matchup. His three western conference picks came in the late mid to latter part of the draft. I’m guessing he went in with a plan and had to slightly adapt it as it went along.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
The other thing is that the Bucks have a ton of double-digit wins, and he sits out alot of 4th quarters. He's getting these numbers while playing about 30 minutes a night.
Tom Hagen
Footballguy
I have to give @wikkidpissah a lot of credit for being right about Brown from the beginning. I love the guy as a person, but it's clear he will never be able to figure out how to play Simmons and Embiid together. I'm not sure there is a solution, but I am sure Brown doesn't have one.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
i'm old and a Celts fan so have always considered the Sixers and not the Lakers as our natural rival, but was excited to see two such singular talents land together in Philly and its been almost as frustrating for me as it must be for Philly folk that they've never gotten on the same page.
Gr00vus
Footballguy
If it happens it would definitely be an upgrade. The Lakers roster isn't good enough to win a championship right now, I'm all for it. I just don't know if it'll actually happen, and I'm skeptical that that will be enough to put them over the top. He was at the Laker game last night as a spectator.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
After watching their hundreds (?) of their games over the past few years, I am telling you that the coach wants him to do that. I'm not saying that is good or bad, but in many games, Brown was imploring him to shoot more and more, no matter what. It is not even really what he wants to do, I don't think. But they are trying desperately to get all these pieces to fit and he and Simmons on the floor together doesn't give him that much room to operate in the post.
Also, I'm not saying that his physicality has fallen off. I'm saying that he is not engaging it in the same way because he's not having fun and even when he gets mildly injured, he can't seem to ratchet it up. He loses the special force that makes him him when he is in suboptimal physical condition and has less of an impact on the game.
modogg
Footballguy
I like Ben a lot, and still think he has the highest ceiling on the team going forward. But looking at last summer with the multiple videos released of him shooting jumpers all over the court against NBA players in pick-up games has done him no favors at all.
gruecd
Footballguy
I was at the game last night. Embiid is such a lazy, whiny, fat POS. Imagine how good he'd be if he had 10% of Giannis's work ethic.
gruecd
Footballguy
What crazy is that he's putting up those numbers playing like 31 MPG. His per-36 numbers are stupid.
modogg
Footballguy
hearing how Shaq ripped on Embiid last night, he is getting more of the attn. of why the Sixers are not doing well this year. the thing with Embiid is if you watch him play his 1st and 2nd year, he did have that work ethic. looked great on the court.as a Sixers' fan i think there is legit worry of where Embiid will be in 2-3 years. trading him now (or this off-season) may be very beneficial to the team
trader jake
Footballguy
Dating a Kardashian is much worse. It just doesn't end well for any NBA player (numerous examples).
Agree with this if Simmons is committed to stay in Philly long-term. There are no guarantees but it's a conversation worth having with him. He strikes me as an "eventually he'll end up in LA type player", but if he says otherwise behind the scenes I'd move Embiid this off-season. The Bucks took a while to build properly around Giannis, but that should be the model Philly uses with Simmons.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
What bothers me is that no one is making a traditional big work these days. Embiid, Drummond, KAT, Vuc, Whiteside - teams losing or falling short of expectations. Gobert the only winshare big that aint a multiway player like Joker, Sabonis, Adebayo. All logic says that posts and PnRs should eat these wingstop teams alive, but....
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Embiid didn’t come back out after halftime due to nexk stiffness ... then the sixers went up 20+.
modogg
Footballguy
yup. i know tons of Ben Simmons hate in here, but team looks better when Ben takes the lead. like the Lakers game a week ago
ETA: always funny when they get a big lead and choose to coast for a bit. 4th Q kind of atrocious
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Chaos Commish
Footballguy
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
loved the wiz win over shorthanded dallas. great game.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
I just don’t know. I like them both and hope they figure it out. They seem to not fit well together and that seems more on Ben not being able to shoot than anything. Simmons not taking mid-range jump shots leads to a lot of turnovers and bad shots late in the shot clock by others — it also frustrates Embiid because Simmons drives and clogs the lane and he gets stuck down there without a touch. Shoot the ball and let embiid get the board if you miss and create space later by actually being a threat!
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
If you're not pulling for the Blazers right now, you better be a Utah fan. I doubt they can hold on given they are down to 7 players, but here's hoping.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
That's why i have trouble watching my favorite sport anymore. I don't watch college team sports, women's either,on TV because i get no pleasure as a viewer unless i'm seeing the strategic problem sets being worked out by the very best. Pro football enthralls me because it hungers like Hannibal Lecter for ultimate kills. In just the last five years we've seen the game appear to reach critical mass in passing, to the point where one wondered if running the ball would completely lose its value only to have Lamar Jackson and Derrick Henry and frikkin Raheem Mostert bring it back following RPOs & zoneblock schemes to heaven and dominating teams who downsized their personnel to better defend the pass.
At times basketball has done that even better, because the points of excellence are higher than any sport. But because individual contributions are more highly valued in the sport than strategic value, players are either telling coaches how they'll work for the shot or str8up ignoring coaching schemes and play calls, actually gaining respect & reputation from their peers by how little they allow themselves to be told what to do.. Defeats the entire purpose of the game, when a coach doesn't get to run plays that involve both Harden and CP3/Westbrook, develop a two man game for Simmons & Embiid or employ the bigness & jumpingness & shootingness upon which the game is based to get the ultimate shot each and every time.
I'm lucky enough to regularly see one of the few teams who actually conspire with each other to take shots away from the other team and work the ball open on the offensive side and it's thrilling. Case in point, Jayson Tatum, Promising rookie year, but listened to waaaay too many people showing how how to play star ball last season. This year, Kemba & Maaaacus Smaaaat have reinvigorated his team outlook and fellow high draft pick Jaylen Brown has shown him how one goes about growing one's game and Coach Stevens' new sideways defensive tactics has all of them genuinely excited to break down the other side and make good shots out of that. I'll take it every day over Lakers proving two isnt better than five or the Sixers getting better when their most talented player is out or Houston Wingstop isoing their way to mediocrity, to watching Zion get figured out of his win share before our eyes.
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Chaos Commish
Footballguy
The man doth protest too much, methinks
EYLive
Footballguy
Jayrod
Footballguy
may be on to something here.
meanwhile Sixers up 30 on league leading Bucks. Regular season, especially the first half, always has good takes
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