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Widbil83

Joe Biden under fire for celebrating segregationists

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5 hours ago, Widbil83 said:

No I don’t agree with Warren, Booker or Kamalas assessment.  It’s playing the race card 101 and extremely dirty.  You can’t tell me these people really honestly believe Joe Biden is a racist.  But this is what is going to go on during the Democrat primary, the term “circus” doesn’t go far enough for the things we are going to witness in the next 9 months.  It’s going to sweep Trump right back in for a second term.

This is what I am afraid of.  

 

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11 minutes ago, timschochet said:

They’re making a mistake. The Democratic voters are not going to respond well to candidates attacking each other. They want them to stay positive and attack Trump. 

The people running for the ticket aren't there to get Biden the nom. There will be sniping, some dirty accusations, press blowing stuff out of proportion. To the average person who doesn't post in a politics subforum on a fantasy football site this stuff doesn't even register. 

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15 minutes ago, timschochet said:

They’re making a mistake. The Democratic voters are not going to respond well to candidates attacking each other. They want them to stay positive and attack Trump. 

I literally spit out my drink reading this. :lmao: 

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6 minutes ago, Widbil83 said:

I literally spit out my drink reading this. 

Hopefully you didn't short out your keyboard. :hophead:

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1 hour ago, timschochet said:

They’re making a mistake. The Democratic voters are not going to respond well to candidates attacking each other. They want them to stay positive and attack Trump. 

As long as Biden is staying ahead of the polling and isn't seen as slipping, he will keep his attacks on the President. In the opening debates next week, other candidates are running out of time if they have any shot of being noticed. If they go after Biden at all next week in the 1st debate, I expect more indirect attacks than straight up, but you may get one or two candidates who go in a little stronger. Booker has been setting up for this opportunity, let's see if he goes more aggressively. As some of these candidates begin dropping and time passages, they are going to have to go after each other, but while I would expect it to be more policy based than the Republicans in 2016, identity politics are big for the far left of this party.

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On 6/20/2019 at 1:33 PM, Sheriff Bart said:

Biden is basically a hornier GWB.

I am picturing the conan obrien bits with the still photos that have moving mouths. 

My favorite was the W man date. 

 

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Did anybody see the interview with Al Sharpton yet?  Kudos to the Rev on this for really grilling him.  Biden said he “grew up in the black church.” :lmao:  Pretty cringeworthy stuff.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/06/23/joe_biden_statement_about_segregationists_was_out_of_context_they_didnt_print_the_whole_deal.html

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1 hour ago, Widbil83 said:

Did anybody see the interview with Al Sharpton yet?  Kudos to the Rev on this for really grilling him.  Biden said he “grew up in the black church.” :lmao:  Pretty cringeworthy stuff.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/06/23/joe_biden_statement_about_segregationists_was_out_of_context_they_didnt_print_the_whole_deal.html

It sounded like he was referencing his political work done with black churches.

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57 minutes ago, The General said:

It sounded like he was referencing his political work done with black churches.

I agree, still pretty funny. The finger waving and thigh grab he lays at 1:58 in the video on Sharpton though is bizarre. :lmao:

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Just now, Widbil83 said:

I agree, still pretty funny. The finger waving and thigh grab he lays at 1:58 in the video on Sharpton though is bizarre. :lmao:

It is a bit of a roller coaster with Joe at time but his answer to the question was fine. 

I have heard him discuss a range of topics infinitely better than Trump is capable, he’s likable according to the polls.

Definitely far from a perfect candidate however. 

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Still not going away-

Quote

WASHINGTON — U.S. Sen. Cory Booker, continuing his criticism of former Vice President Joe Biden, said he was “disappointed” at the former vice president’s defense of remarks that praised segregationist senators.

Speaking on ABC’s “This Week,” Booker said he “heard from many, many African Americans who found the comments hurtful.”

“This was a time for him to be healing and to be helpful‚ especially the time that he is looking to bring this party together and lead us in what is the most important election of our lifetime,” Booker said. “And I was disappointed.”

At a New York City fundraiser last week, Biden talked about his ability to work with U.S. Sens. James Eastland of Mississippi and Herman Talmadge of Georgia, two ardent segregationists. In the talk, Biden said Eastland "never called me ‘boy,’ he always called me ‘son.’”

Biden said on MSNBC Saturday that he wasn’t referring to the practice of segregationists denigrating black men by calling them “boys.”

"I do understand the consequence of the word “boy,” Biden said. “But it wasn’t said in any of that context at all.”

Booker attracted much-needed attention to his 2020 presidential campaign by going after Biden, who leads in opinion polls for the Democratic nomination. The two men met privately after Booker’s criticism.

“I have a lot of respect for Joe Biden and a gratitude towards him, and that’s even more of a responsibility than I have to be candid with him, to speak truth to power,” Booker said on ABC.

“Again, it’s not about working across the aisle; if anything I’ve made that a hallmark of my time in the Senate to get big things done and legislation passed. This is about him evoking a terrible power dynamic that he showed a lack of understanding or insensitivity to by invoking this idea that he was called son by white segregationists who - yes, they see him - in him, their son."

 

https://www.nj.com/politics/2019/06/booker-is-disappointed-in-biden-for-defending-praise-of-senate-segregationists.html

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It is always important that the Dem candidates get some practice in playing the race card in the primaries so they are ready for the general.  :thumbup:

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5 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

It is always important that the Dem candidates get some practice in playing the race card in the primaries so they are ready for the general.  

And Republicans never play the race card in the primaries or in the general? Please. Reagan talking about the "welfare queen" driving a Cadillac. Or the Willie Horton ads against Dukakis in the general. Or how bout John McCain in the South Carolina primary where Bush people spread the rumor of McCain having fathered a black child?

And didn't Trump play the race card after coming down the golden escalator when he first announced his candidacy with talking about Mexicans being criminals and rapists?

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18 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

It is always important that the Dem candidates get some practice in playing the race card in the primaries so they are ready for the general.  :thumbup:

If you’re running against Donald Trump you don’t need any practice playing the race card- when he deals it’s in every hand. 

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There are multiple Democrat Presidental candidates working to take out the front runner of their party in the worst way imaginable, and all some Democrat posters here are talking about is Trump playing the race card. :lmao:

Edited by Widbil83

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3 minutes ago, Widbil83 said:

There are multiple Democrat Presidental candidates working to take out the front runner of their party in the worst way imaginable, and all some Democrat posters here are talking about is Trump playing the race card. :lmao:

No you misunderstood me. Trump never plays the race card because Trump is a racist. 

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On 6/22/2019 at 2:23 PM, Widbil83 said:

No I don’t agree with Warren, Booker or Kamalas assessment.  It’s playing the race card 101 and extremely dirty.  You can’t tell me these people really honestly believe Joe Biden is a racist.  But this is what is going to go on during the Democrat primary, the term “circus” doesn’t go far enough for the things we are going to witness in the next 9 months.  It’s going to sweep Trump right back in for a second term.

See you can't take this out of context. Biden is very proud that he voted against busing. He is very proud of his plan that caused mass minority incarceration. Then there is Anita Hill a double whammy. 

What will sweep Trump back in is making ads out of Biden's record and African Americans staying home again like they did in 2016. That's what you should be afraid of 

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41 minutes ago, NCCommish said:

What will sweep Trump back in is making ads out of Biden's record and African Americans staying home again like they did in 2016. That's what you should be afraid of 

And throw in some visuals of his finger wagging and getting close up in people's faces with those denials. The resevoir of examples is growing, including that picture Joe posted recently and a forum where he responded to Joy Reid getting about as close to her as possible. He's very defiant in defending his positions.

ETA The Joy Reid exchange. It looked a little worse the 1st time I saw; maybe different angle. He starts his move at :30.

Edited by Mystery Achiever
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https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/450127-press-democrats-form-circular-firing-squad

Press: Democrats form circular firing squad

 

By Bill Press, opinion contributorJune 24, 2019 - 07:55 PM EDT

The views expressed by contributors are their own and not the view of The Hill 

Democrats, get ahold of yourselves. It’s still early in this silly political season, but you’ve already gone off the deep end. There are so many presidential candidates, some of whom have no idea why they’re running, but all of whom are so desperate to get any attention whatsoever and so hungry for a headline, they’ll seize any opportunity to invent a phony excuse to stab another Democrat in the back. With the willing help of the breathless, clueless, political media.

Witness the latest tempest surrounding Joe Biden, whom 22 fellow Democratic candidates piled on top of, accusing him of being, if not outright racist, then at least insensitive, unprincipled, old-fashioned, or just plain old. And cable TV abetted their cause with endless stories about Joe’s latest gaffe.  

This whole flap is total rubbish. And any candidate who took part in it, or any reporter who relished inflating it, should lose his or her political license.

Consider for a moment, with no attempt to demonize or lionize him, what Biden said. To illustrate the point that, unlike the current breed of senators, he knew how to get things done, even in tough times, Biden told supporters at a New York fundraiser that back in his Senate days, on some issues, he even worked with some of the worst, including noted segregationists James Eastland and Herman  Talmadge.

And for that Biden is condemned as a closet racist himself? Among others, Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) said Biden “doesn’t understand the history of our country.” New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio accused Biden of “longing for the good old days of ‘civility.’ ” Sens. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) and Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) also piled on. Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.) demanded that Biden issue an apology. 

Apologize for what? Give me a break. First of all, Biden was not alone in seeking votes of outright segregationists on certain issues. So did Teddy Kennedy, Birch Bayh, Chris Dodd, Paul Simon, and other Senate liberal giants. And they did so, as Biden later clarified, even though “We in fact detested what they stood for in terms of segregation and all the rest.”

So did President Lyndon Johnson. In fact, one of the greatest political stories of the 20th century is how Johnson, himself a former pro-segregation Southern Democrat, strong-armed Georgia’s Richard Russell and other racist Southern Democrats to secure passage of the 1965 Voting Rights Act. The fact is, there would be no Voting Rights Act if Johnson had refused to deal with Russell. And there would have been no 25-year renewal of the Voting Rights Act in 1982 if Biden and Kennedy had been unwilling to work with Eastland and Talmadge.

You have to wonder. What would Harris and Booker prefer? Are they suggesting that, given the opportunity to pass the most important piece of civil rights legislation, Biden and others should have said: We are so perfect, we will never work with, nor will we ever seek or accept the votes of, anybody who doesn’t agree with us 100 percent? We’ll wait till Alabama and Mississippi elect somebody we agree with 100 percent? That may make the purists feel good, but it’s a recipe for political disaster.

Don’t get me wrong. I’m not supporting Joe Biden for president. At the moment, I’m not supporting anybody. Who knows? Biden may be the nominee, he may not. But I do know this: What Americans want to hear from every Democratic candidate is what their plans are to move this country forward and how they plan to beat Donald Trump. They’re wasting their time taking cheap shots at Biden, or anybody else.

Press is host of “The Bill Press Pod.” His Twitter handle is @BillPressPod. He is author of “From the Left: A Life in the Crossfire.”

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17 hours ago, NCCommish said:

See you can't take this out of context. Biden is very proud that he voted against busing. He is very proud of his plan that caused mass minority incarceration. Then there is Anita Hill a double whammy. 

What will sweep Trump back in is making ads out of Biden's record and African Americans staying home again like they did in 2016. That's what you should be afraid of 

They’re not going to stay home.

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56 minutes ago, timschochet said:

They’re not going to stay home.

They did last time. So go ahead and run Hillary 2.0 then spend the next 4 years blaming someone else for the loss.

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1 minute ago, NCCommish said:

They did last time. So go ahead and run Hillary 2.0 then spend the next 4 years blaming someone else for the loss.

In fairness, (nearly) four years of Trump may help with energizing dem voters, even if Biden is the candidate

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23 minutes ago, msommer said:

In fairness, (nearly) four years of Trump may help with energizing dem voters, even if Biden is the candidate

Perhaps. And to be honest I am more concerned with what happens in 2024 if we get 4 years of nothing changing which is what Biden promised his big donors.

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2 minutes ago, NCCommish said:

Perhaps. And to be honest I am more concerned with what happens in 2024 if we get 4 years of nothing changing which is what Biden promised his big donors.

Though I disagree with you, this at least is a legitimate concern. Biden losing because of lack of black support is not, IMO. 

Latest tracking polls show that this controversy has done nothing to affect Biden’s lead, or his support level among African Americans which remains very high and enthusiastic. 

NC, you don’t want Biden because he doesn’t represent the systemic progressive  change you desire in a Democratic candidate. I get that and it’s a perfectly legitimate position. But when you attempt to argue that he is a poor candidate because he is more likely to lose to Trump than those you personally prefer, you lose credibility. 

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29 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Though I disagree with you, this at least is a legitimate concern. Biden losing because of lack of black support is not, IMO. 

Latest tracking polls show that this controversy has done nothing to affect Biden’s lead, or his support level among African Americans which remains very high and enthusiastic. 

NC, you don’t want Biden because he doesn’t represent the systemic progressive  change you desire in a Democratic candidate. I get that and it’s a perfectly legitimate position. But when you attempt to argue that he is a poor candidate because he is more likely to lose to Trump than those you personally prefer, you lose credibility. 

Something to keep in mind about that latest polling. 2/3rds of those polled said they didn't know the candidates well enough to decide. Joe is still running on name recognition to some degree. Further we did see African Americans in that poll say they were less likely to vote for Biden after his comments came to light. Combine those two factors with Joe's propensity to gaffe and I would suggest my credibility is just fine. 

Edited by NCCommish

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8 minutes ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Biden is among my least favorite of the realistic Democratic nominees, but he does seem to have the best chance in the general against Trump.

Also not a huge fan. He means well I guess.

I read some articles yesterday that something like 60% of people either know nothing or very little about any of these candidates. 

Makes sense Joe and Bernie will be top of polls and do well in polls against Trump. They are the only names that 60% has heard of.

As the field narrows those 1, 3, 4% that the lower tiers have will feed to other candidates. Maybe Joe collects them all maybe a moderate like Tim Ryan or Bennett collects them.

 

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36 minutes ago, The General said:

Also not a huge fan. He means well I guess.

I read some articles yesterday that something like 60% of people either know nothing or very little about any of these candidates. 

Makes sense Joe and Bernie will be top of polls and do well in polls against Trump. They are the only names that 60% has heard of.

As the field narrows those 1, 3, 4% that the lower tiers have will feed to other candidates. Maybe Joe collects them all maybe a moderate like Tim Ryan or Bennett collects them.

 

"PETE!"

/ @Sinn Fein

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4 minutes ago, msommer said:

"PETE!"

/ @Sinn Fein

Mayor Pete is definitely right there. He’s got plenty of game. How the little guy handles national adversity is next step I suppose.

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2 hours ago, Maurile Tremblay said:

Biden is among my least favorite of the realistic Democratic nominees, but he does seem to have the best chance in the general against Trump.

When I wrote this, I was just going by head-to-head polls, but as Nate Silver says, those are basically useless right now (for the general election).

So I decided to check with electionbettingodds.com to see what the market was saying.

My naive attempt to estimate the candidates' relative chances of beating Trump in the general if they win the primary is to divide their current chance of winning the general by their current chance of winning the primary. I.e., if Sanders is exactly half as likely to win the general as he is to win the primary, and if Yang is two-thirds as likely to win the general as he is to win the primary, then it seems like Yang is more likely than Sanders to win the general given a win in the primary.

Here are the results:

           Primary   General   Ratio
Yang        5.6       3.6       0.64
Buttigieg  11.2       6.0       0.54
Biden      28.8      14.9       0.52
Warren     15.2       7.8       0.51
O'Rourke    3.9       2.0       0.51
Sanders    11.5       5.7       0.50
Harris     13.3       6.1       0.46

So I take back the idea that Biden would be the biggest favorite over Trump in the general.  It seems that way in the useless polls (maybe based on name recognition), but it's not clear from the betting markets.

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