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Duke Johnson the Texan - TRADED

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Texans will get a 3rd round comp pick for Honeybadger so they may have felt they were playing with house money. Texans are also projected to have the most cap space in the league next year (although ~$20M of it will probably go to resigning Clowney, it would still leave them among the highest teams in remaining cap space) so they could just as easily grab another FA RB or extend Miller for 1 or 2 more years. They were linked to Gordon when he was a rookie in the draft so that's an outside possibility as well.

With no GM currently, it's pretty hard to say with much certainty what they will do next offseason or what their current motivations are outside of maybe the obvious: they cut Foreman, they had no one else at the position besides UDFA's and Miller, they have needed a receiving back for a long time, their WR's outside of Hopkins can't stay healthy, Duke is an outstanding receiving back.

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Posted (edited)
36 minutes ago, Hot Sauce Guy said:

I believe so, yes. 

Jonathan Taylor looks like maybe an Elliott level stud, and Travis Etienne is probably Mixon level. Beyond that who knows? J.K.Dobbins, D'Andre Swift, and Najee Harris are all considered day 2 prospects, but I'll admit to not knowing much about them.

Edited by travdogg
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1 minute ago, Hot Sauce Guy said:

What’s not to agree with? It’s reality. In the past you’d see as many as 6-7 day 1 RBs, many of them in the top 10.

2019 NFL draft: Josh Jacobs 24 overall. The only 1st round RB. Next RB selected was at 53 by the Eagles (round 2) & at 70 (end of the 3rd round) the Rams took Henderson. 4 more RBs went in Round 3. 

2018 draft: 1st round Barkley 1.02, Penny to the Seahawks at 27 & Pats grabbed Sony Michele at 31. Chubb early 2nd but most went in round 3. 

With more specialist RBs & RBBCs, there’s just not the same emphasis on early pick RBs as there once was. The game’s changed a bit - that’s definitely had an impact.

Anyway, back on topic - just because the Texans traded potentially (likely) a 3rd rounder doesn’t mean they can’t trade back up to the 3rd round if that’s where they want to draft a RB, right? 

That seems somewhat obvious. :shrug:

There wasn't any blue chip talent in this year's draft. 7 were drafted by the end of day 2, but they didn't start to fall off the board til later than usual because the top end wasn't what it's been in recent years.

I'm curious if 2020 will play out like 2018. Blue chippers at the top, but the really good ones slip some in part because there's so many of them. Some of them had baggage though - whether self inflicted, made up, or health related. Still, 7 total were drafted before the end of round 2 and 8 before the end of round 3.

2017 was much more defined - blue chipper's in the top 10. Then blue chipper's with mental midget risk in round 2. And again, 8 were off the board by the end of day 2.

Outside of Zeke (again, blue chipper - drafted early) the 2016 class mostly sucked and was valued accordingly. Only 4 were picked by the end of day 2.

2015 was more normal - two picked top 15 with again 8 being picked by the end of day 2.

This is the norm in the leeg. RB value hasn't sunk. The great ones get drafted early and the good ones (or great ones with baggage) are picked sometime before day 2 runs out. Teams aren't mining day 3 for starters. They're taking shots then. They mine for starters day 2. Or prioritize one day 1.

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Fills a role. I don't think he wins anybody a championship this year but all that needs to happen is for Miller to get banged up for this guy's value to sky rocket. 

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6 minutes ago, Buckna said:

Texans will get a 3rd round comp pick for Honeybadger so they may have felt they were playing with house money. Texans are also projected to have the most cap space in the league next year (although ~$20M of it will probably go to resigning Clowney, it would still leave them among the highest teams in remaining cap space) so they could just as easily grab another FA RB or extend Miller for 1 or 2 more years. They were linked to Gordon when he was a rookie in the draft so that's an outside possibility as well.

With no GM currently, it's pretty hard to say with much certainty what they will do next offseason or what their current motivations are outside of maybe the obvious: they cut Foreman, they had no one else at the position besides UDFA's and Miller, they have needed a receiving back for a long time, their WR's outside of Hopkins can't stay healthy, Duke is an outstanding receiving back.

They are? They gave $22.5m to Gipson, $10m to Roby, and $7.5m to Kalil. With the Kareem Jackson and Honey Badger losses they will get comp picks for them, but given how the comp pick formula works is it for certain a 3? 

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6 minutes ago, travdogg said:

Jonathan Taylor looks like maybe an Elliott level stud, and Travis Etienne is probably Mixon level. Beyond that who knows? J.K.Dobbins, D'Andre Swift, and Najee Harris are all considered day 2 prospects, but I'll admit to not knowing much about them.

Per usual a couple of these guys will slip but add Eno Benjamin, Ke'Shawn Vaughn, Cam Akers, and AJ Dillon to that list. But also per usual there will be surprises to cancel them out. If a team goes into next year's draft with only one back that isn't also a stand alone star there will be plenty of options to change that inside the first 100 picks.

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7 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

This is the norm in the leeg. RB value hasn't sunk. The great ones get drafted early and the good ones (or great ones with baggage) are picked sometime before day 2 runs out. Teams aren't mining day 3 for starters. They're taking shots then. They mine for starters day 2. Or prioritize one day 1.

Sort of true, but a little off. Yes, they’re going day 1.  That’s not exactly the same as “early”. 

But in the past a lot of those backs would have gone in the top half of the 1st, where now they’re going much later. 

10 years ago Michele & Penny would have likely been top 15 picks, not end of the round bargains. :shrug:

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1 hour ago, travdogg said:

He hasn't really been discussed yet, but does this hurt Keke Coutee a bit? Some of his value was being the guy getting short passes as an extension of the running game. Might some of his work, become Johnson's work? Or would that make Coutee more likely to run deeper routes, as he's also pretty fast?

Keke isn't just and intermediate threat. He can hurt you deep too. So no, this should't hurt him unless Duke starts stealing work in the slot. 

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52 minutes ago, Hot Sauce Guy said:

Yes. when I say weeks it’s like saying “10 days” to mean 14 in the business world. The assumption is “business days”, as one wouldn’t count weekends.

likewise for BYEs in the NFL. By “weeks” I always mean “game weeks”, but your clarification is accurate. 👍🏼

It’s important in context; it’s one more week you’ll have to carry a non-contributor on the roster. I tend to make a lot of FAAB moves & would not want to make my bench shorter for 9 of the 13 weeks.

(we have two IR spots but suspended players are not eligible)

But rn he’s practically free in redraft so if you have the room, stash away.

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14 minutes ago, travdogg said:

Johnathan Taylor looks like maybe an Elliott level stud, and Travis Etienne is probably Mixon level. Beyond that who knows? J.K.Dobbins, DeAndre Swift, and Najee Harris are all considered day 2 prospects, but I'll admit to not knowing much about them.

 Basing this mainly off the stuff GOD Faust posts in the 2020 thread, I think Swift is regarded as first round pick. Him and Etienne the top 2 guys with Taylor more of a late first. Supposed to be a really really strong draft for RBs (and WRs too) with 2-3 first round RBs and several more going day 2.

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3 minutes ago, dipandglide said:

Keke isn't just and intermediate threat. He can hurt you deep too. So no, this should't hurt him unless Duke starts stealing work in the slot. 

Keke is going to be a perpetual game time decision, imo. 

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He'll never start, but he could be a good PPR cheeser for a year or two.

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24 minutes ago, dipandglide said:

Keke isn't just and intermediate threat. He can hurt you deep too. So no, this should't hurt him unless Duke starts stealing work in the slot. 

Agreed. Duke provides a contingency plan in the event something were to happen to Keke again though. The Texans sorely missed him when he was out last year and didn't bring in anyone that could fulfill his role should that happen again. Duke can at least do Keke's baseline work well, even if he won't open the lid on the defense.

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52 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

:coffee::shrug:

Backup in CLE. Backup in HOU. 

It's a much better situation to be behind one of the worst backs in the league at the end of his career than it is to be behind one of the best backs in the league at the start of his career.  That's without even considering Hunt returning from suspension. 

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2 hours ago, Unwrittenlaw said:

Quite possibly the starter next year. L Miller is a FA in 2020.

You don't give a 4th that could be possibly be a 3rd rd pick for a backup.

 

Could very well be the next Tiki Barber who's silent for 3-4 yrs and then blows up.

I'll bet the farm against him being the starter in 2020. No way that's happening.

As for the Duke:Tiki comp... nah.

43 minutes ago, matttyl said:

Gotta think this is big for Duke, in 2020. 

wat

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33 minutes ago, BobbyLayne said:

It’s important in context; it’s one more week you’ll have to carry a non-contributor on the roster. I tend to make a lot of FAAB moves & would not want to make my bench shorter for 9 of the 13 weeks.

(we have two IR spots but suspended players are not eligible)

But rn he’s practically free in redraft so if you have the room, stash away.

Absolutely true on all points. 

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Just now, kittenmittens said:

It's a much better situation to be behind one of the worst backs in the league at the end of his career than it is to be behind one of the best backs in the league at the start of his career.  That's without even considering Hunt returning from suspension. 

Eh... that's just a nice way to spin the phrasing. He's a worse back than Lamar Miller, so does it really even matter? He's a backup regardless. Both Miller and Chubb seem pretty durable. If you're a backup/bit player, it doesn't matter how much better the starter is. Just that he's better. I'm no Miller fanboy, either. I've got him in zero leagues. This move just seems like Houston is playing it safe after dropping their previous backup while Cleveland is moving a disgruntled, overpaid backup. 

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There's absolutely no way Houston spends a 1st or 2nd rd pick on a RB next year. They just spent a 3rd on Foreman a couple of years ago. 

So they spent a 3rd on Foreman in 2017, gave up a 2020 3rd for Duke Johnson, and you think they're going to spend a 1st/2nd in 2020 on a RB? Not happening.

Their DE and CBs are getting old with Watt at 30 yrs and J Joseph 

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

wat

Didn't think the Texans GM would be giving up (likely) a 3rd round pick for a guy who he didn't foresee as being a likely starter at RB.  I mean no one has traded a 3rd or more for a veteran RB in years.  The only thing close to that would have been the McCoy for Kiko Alonzo trade in 2015.  Then I remembered the Texans don't have a GM right now.  Still, they have to realize that teams are trading likely 3rd round picks for RBs, especially one that's already the 11th highest paid in the league (per year) unless the plan is to keep them multiple years (likely the full 3 years of this deal).  Also means that Miller is likely gone at the end of this year. 

Edited by matttyl
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4 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

Eh... that's just a nice way to spin the phrasing. He's a worse back than Lamar Miller, so does it really even matter? He's a backup regardless. Both Miller and Chubb seem pretty durable. If you're a backup/bit player, it doesn't matter how much better the starter is. Just that he's better. I'm no Miller fanboy, either. I've got him in zero leagues. This move just seems like Houston is playing it safe after dropping their previous backup while Cleveland is moving a disgruntled, overpaid backup. 

He's a different back than Miller. Duke's great out of the shotgun, of which Houston runs a lot of. They have a bad OL. Duke's solid in pass pro and the best thing for a bad OL is a pass catching RB. Plus the Keke insurance I mentioned earlier. I think he's a real good fit on this team.

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1 minute ago, matttyl said:

Didn't think the Texans GM would be giving up (likely) a 3rd round pick for a guy who he didn't foresee as being a likely starter at RB.  I mean no one has traded a 3rd or more for a veteran RB in years.  The only thing close to that would have been the McCoy for Kiko Alonzo trade in 2015.  Then I remembered the Texans don't have a GM right now.  Still, they have to realize that teams are trading likely 3rd round picks for RBs, especially one that's already the 11th highest paid in the league (per year) until the plan is to keep them multiple years (likely the full 3 years of this deal).  Also means that Miller is likely gone at the end of this year. 

The Texans are not a well managed team. I wouldn't read into their moves very much.

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1 minute ago, MAC_32 said:

He's a different back than Miller. Duke's great out of the shotgun, of which Houston runs a lot of. They have a bad OL. Duke's solid in pass pro and the best thing for a bad OL is a pass catching RB. Plus the Keke insurance I mentioned earlier. I think he's a real good fit on this team.

Duke's great getting handoffs when down 20 points and facing a prevent defense. I don't think he's a special player at all. He's a nice 3rd down back, but he should never be a starter.

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1 minute ago, FF Ninja said:

The Texans are not a well managed team. I wouldn't read into their moves very much.

Isn't that exactly the point right now, though....in this very thread?  They just gave up more than anyone has in recent memory for this position, and are inheriting a contract that makes the guy the 11th highest paid in the league at the position.  They must view him very well.  I don't think you do either of those things for a guy you see as a career backup.  They must at least view him as starter potential.  I'm not saying that view is correct, but they must at least think that to have done this.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, matttyl said:

Isn't that exactly the point right now, though....in this very thread?  They just gave up more than anyone has in recent memory for this position, and are inheriting a contract that makes the guy the 11th highest paid in the league at the position.  They must view him very well.  I don't think you do either of those things for a guy you see as a career backup.  They must at least view him as starter potential.  I'm not saying that view is correct, but they must at least think that to have done this.

No. That's not the point. The point is discerning if this move means anything. A poorly managed team overpaying for a backup doesn't mean anything of substance. It just means they are playing too fast and loose with their draft picks. They'll almost certainly regret it next year when we see the talent coming off the board in the 3rd round.

Edited by FF Ninja
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2 minutes ago, matttyl said:

Isn't that exactly the point right now, though....in this very thread?  They just gave up more than anyone has in recent memory for this position, and are inheriting a contract that makes the guy the 11th highest paid in the league at the position.  They must view him very well.  I don't think you do either of those things for a guy you see as a career backup.  They must at least view him as starter potential.  I'm not saying that view is correct, but they must at least think that to have done this.

You are right when it comes to who is calling the shots right now, but the person calling the shots will be different sometime in the next 5 months.

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2 minutes ago, Unwrittenlaw said:

No team spends 3 x 1/2/3 rd draft picks for a RB within 3 years. That's all. 

They shouldn't, but we've all seen teams do much dumber. I'll never understand why people assume all things NFL front offices do are rational. Many aren't.

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4 minutes ago, Unwrittenlaw said:

No team spends 3 x 1/2/3 rd draft picks for a RB within 3 years. That's all. 

It’s a sunk cost man. Foreman is gone, his cost is no longer relevant. They aren’t going into 2020 with Duke Johnson as their featured back. 

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1 minute ago, MAC_32 said:

You are right when it comes to who is calling the shots right now, but the person calling the shots will be different sometime in the next 5 months.

And possibly that person will think they have bigger needs than a RB.  Who knows. 

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7 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

Duke's great getting handoffs when down 20 points and facing a prevent defense. I don't think he's a special player at all. He's a nice 3rd down back, but he should never be a starter.

I thought similar in 2018 offseason. Realized I had never even seen the dude play then watched these 2017 highlights:

Duke Johnson 2017 Highlights

Put in immediate offer as soon as Chubb was drafted. This kid is talented. One of the best receiving backs I have seen in a long time. A natural catching the ball. He looks like a receiver running routes and catching but then looks like a RB with the ball in his hands. Sign me up. Huge piece of puzzle for BOB in running Pats South.

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Just now, matttyl said:

And possibly that person will think they have bigger needs than a RB.  Who knows. 

That's kinda my point. I think forecasting what the Texans may do come 2020 right now is incredibly silly.

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Just now, tombonneau said:

I thought similar in 2018 offseason. Realized I had never even seen the dude play then watched these 2017 highlights:

Duke Johnson 2017 Highlights

Put in immediate offer as soon as Chubb was drafted. This kid is talented. One of the best receiving backs I have seen in a long time. A natural catching the ball. He looks like a receiver running routes and catching but then looks like a RB with the ball in his hands. Sign me up. Huge piece of puzzle for BOB in running Pats South.

Yeah, he isn't a garbage time producer. That's 100% a false narrative I stopped fighting a long time ago because most (correctly) didn't spend any time watching this joke of a team before cancer removal last October. Duke played a huge role in finally breaking up the offensive stalemate in the first game against Baltimore - there's more, but that one sticks out. He's just incredibly unreliable for more than small stretches at a time. It's on him to prove otherwise.

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9 minutes ago, tombonneau said:

I thought similar in 2018 offseason. Realized I had never even seen the dude play then watched these 2017 highlights:

Duke Johnson 2017 Highlights

Put in immediate offer as soon as Chubb was drafted. This kid is talented. One of the best receiving backs I have seen in a long time. A natural catching the ball. He looks like a receiver running routes and catching but then looks like a RB with the ball in his hands. Sign me up. Huge piece of puzzle for BOB in running Pats South.

They were 0-16 and he couldn't beat out Crowell. He'll be 27 in 2020. Doubtful he gets his first starting gig at 27.

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6 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

That's kinda my point. I think forecasting what the Texans may do come 2020 right now is incredibly silly.

Silly, but it's a big piece of what this deal means.  I think we know that this year we're looking at some kind of a RBBC between Duke and Miller.  That much we're pretty clear on.  We also know that Miller is a UFA at the end of the year, while Duke will still be under contract (and they brought in Miller as an UFA, Duke they gave up a likely 3rd for).  I don't think that as of yet Miller has done enough to get resigned (and he'll be 29) - so if he's gone, the worst case for Duke would be them bringing in a rookie that would beat him out of the starting job.  I'm not sure that's going to happen - no one is.  But I think there is a decent shot they don't draft a RB till the later rounds, which if that happens at worst he'll be the 1B in a pretty decent offense.

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1 hour ago, Hot Sauce Guy said:

What’s not to agree with? It’s reality. In the past you’d see as many as 6-7 day 1 RBs, many of them in the top 10.

2019 NFL draft: Josh Jacobs 24 overall. The only 1st round RB. Next RB selected was at 53 by the Eagles (round 2) & at 70 (end of the 3rd round) the Rams took Henderson. 4 more RBs went in Round 3. 

2018 draft: 1st round Barkley 1.02, Penny to the Seahawks at 27 & Pats grabbed Sony Michele at 31. Chubb early 2nd but most went in round 3. 

With more specialist RBs & RBBCs, there’s just not the same emphasis on early pick RBs as there once was. The game’s changed a bit - that’s definitely had an impact.

Anyway, back on topic - just because the Texans traded potentially (likely) a 3rd rounder doesn’t mean they can’t trade back up to the 3rd round if that’s where they want to draft a RB, right? 

That seems somewhat obvious. :shrug:

I think the "RB value sinking over the last few years" story doesn't really hold up. First, you have to go all the way back to 1990 to find the last time 6 RB's were drafted in the first round. And only one of them was drafted top 15. If you want to go all the way back to the 80's, then sure, things have changed quite a bit. But the last few years holds fairly constant with what's been going on the last 25 years or so.

Here's how many RB's were drafted in round 1 for the last several years: 1, 3, 2, 1, 2, 0, 0, 3, 1, 3, 3, 5, 2, 4, 3, 3, 2, 2, 3, 5, 2, 4, 2, 3

And, here's how many RB's were drafted top 10 in each of those years:    0, 1, 2, 1, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1, 1, 3, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 2, 2, 0, 2 

Here's how many RB's were drafted in rounds 1-3 in those same years:   7, 8, 8, 4, 8, 8, 6, 7, 8, 6, 6, 11, 9, 8, 8, 6, 6, 8, 10, 9, 12, 10, 10, 12

That takes us from 2019->1996.

That looks pretty standard across the board. Not really much of a pattern. Maybe there's a very slight downward trend in the later years, but that could be chalked up to many different factors.

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14 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

They were 0-16 and he couldn't beat out Crowell. He'll be 27 in 2020. Doubtful he gets his first starting gig at 27.

Applying rationality to anything Hue Jackson decided to do is even more silly than trying to forecast what the Texans may do in 2020.

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14 minutes ago, matttyl said:

Silly, but it's a big piece of what this deal means.  I think we know that this year we're looking at some kind of a RBBC between Duke and Miller.  That much we're pretty clear on.  We also know that Miller is a UFA at the end of the year, while Duke will still be under contract (and they brought in Miller as an UFA, Duke they gave up a likely 3rd for).  I don't think that as of yet Miller has done enough to get resigned (and he'll be 29) - so if he's gone, the worst case for Duke would be them bringing in a rookie that would beat him out of the starting job.  I'm not sure that's going to happen - no one is.  But I think there is a decent shot they don't draft a RB till the later rounds, which if that happens at worst he'll be the 1B in a pretty decent offense.

Free agency...trades...there's lot of ways to acquire new personnel rather than just the draft.

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53 minutes ago, FF Ninja said:

Eh... that's just a nice way to spin the phrasing. He's a worse back than Lamar Miller, so does it really even matter? He's a backup regardless. Both Miller and Chubb seem pretty durable. If you're a backup/bit player, it doesn't matter how much better the starter is. Just that he's better. I'm no Miller fanboy, either. I've got him in zero leagues. This move just seems like Houston is playing it safe after dropping their previous backup while Cleveland is moving a disgruntled, overpaid backup. 

I think there is a chance Duke is better than Miller, especially if Miller is declining with age.  He has no room to decline, he's already bottom of the barrel and shouldn't be a starter. 

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Followed him since his Hurricane days... ended as the leading rusher in UM history.  I like his chances to overseat Miller as the lead in a RBBC. 

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3 hours ago, TheWinz said:

13 posts into Duke's thread, and the last 7 don't even mention him.

the trade has tons of ramifications, not just for Duke.

and most importantly, this will bring me back from approaching the lamar miller vortex again, which i was poised to do after Foreman was cut.

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1 hour ago, tombonneau said:

I thought similar in 2018 offseason. Realized I had never even seen the dude play then watched these 2017 highlights:

Duke Johnson 2017 Highlights

Put in immediate offer as soon as Chubb was drafted. This kid is talented. One of the best receiving backs I have seen in a long time. A natural catching the ball. He looks like a receiver running routes and catching but then looks like a RB with the ball in his hands. Sign me up. Huge piece of puzzle for BOB in running Pats South.

Nice film.  I am excited to see him in the Texans offense playing the White/Drake/Hines/Cohen/Ekeler/Thompson role.

Very talented player who has been historically underutilized.  I think he will be a really nice PPR flex with Watson in a high-powered offense.

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3 hours ago, Cobbler1 said:

Have to think they add a legit back somehow.

Draft next year, could bring in Blue again, or resign Miller to a team friendly contract

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1 hour ago, kutta said:

I think the "RB value sinking over the last few years" story doesn't really hold up. First, you have to go all the way back to 1990 to find the last time 6 RB's were drafted in the first round. And only one of them was drafted top 15. If you want to go all the way back to the 80's, then sure, things have changed quite a bit. But the last few years holds fairly constant with what's been going on the last 25 years or so.

Here's how many RB's were drafted in round 1 for the last several years: 1, 3, 2, 1, 2, 0, 0, 3, 1, 3, 3, 5, 2, 4, 3, 3, 2, 2, 3, 5, 2, 4, 2, 3

And, here's how many RB's were drafted top 10 in each of those years:    0, 1, 2, 1, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1, 1, 3, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 2, 2, 0, 2 

Here's how many RB's were drafted in rounds 1-3 in those same years:   7, 8, 8, 4, 8, 8, 6, 7, 8, 6, 6, 11, 9, 8, 8, 6, 6, 8, 10, 9, 12, 10, 10, 12

That takes us from 2019->1996.

That looks pretty standard across the board. Not really much of a pattern. Maybe there's a very slight downward trend in the later years, but that could be chalked up to many different factors.

I’m old. The 80s is exactly what I was thinking of with regard to RBs in the draft.

and the game has changed. There’s 2-down backs and 3rd down specialists & receiving specialists & GL backs & no team is spending high draft picks on any of those guys.

the pattern is that that last 3-4-5-20 drafts have all seen very few “feature back” types & far more 3rd-4th rounders. 

And relevant to this topic, the Texans should have no issue finding a 2-down bruiser if that’s what they feel would compliment Duke as a receiving specialist.

which makes me highly skeptical of the somewhat dubious optimism that Duke is going to be “the next Tiki Barber” with this scenery change. He’d be lucky to be the next James White, and IMO even that’s a stretch since the Texans have a QB who could just as soon take off running as dump it off (ala Brady). 

 

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1 hour ago, MAC_32 said:

They shouldn't, but we've all seen teams do much dumber. I'll never understand why people assume all things NFL front offices do are rational. Many aren't.

Truest thing said in this topic. 

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47 minutes ago, Long Ball Larry said:

the trade has tons of ramifications, not just for Duke.

and most importantly, this will bring me back from approaching the lamar miller vortex again, which i was poised to do after Foreman was cut.

Just when you think you’re out, they suck you back in! 

I stopped investing in Miller the 1st time he burned me. 

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34 minutes ago, zeeshan2 said:

Draft next year, could bring in Blue again, or resign Miller to a team friendly contract

Right there’s a ton of guys they could add for cheap and give early down work too. We just saw two guys who actually did play over Duke on early downs sign for cheap in this offseason alone!

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I think folks also presume that bell cow back is how teams do or wish their offense to operate. I'm sure BOB would like to have a 3 down back, but if he's been willing to stick with Miller all of this time, he's clearly not married to the concept.

All I'm suggesting is diminishing Duke's potential to start because he doesn't look like the other starters needs to be looked through the lens of the offense the team is trying to run and its available personnel is all.

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5 hours ago, MAC_32 said:

They are? They gave $22.5m to Gipson, $10m to Roby, and $7.5m to Kalil. With the Kareem Jackson and Honey Badger losses they will get comp picks for them, but given how the comp pick formula works is it for certain a 3? 

Gipson and Kalil were both cuts by their former teams so they do not count in the calculations. Roby offset's Kareem Jackson's $11M a year contract from Denver. The Texans former GM was super cheap this past offseason basically only going after bargains and guys that don't count in the comp pick calculations. It's likely one of the many reasons he was let go.

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Best I can tell this is the most recent post on Duke surprisingly for a guy who's going pretty early in drafts since Miller's injury.  What's the outlook?  Will he finally get significant carries now that Miller out, or stiil in pass catching/COP/3rd down role.  Huge upside in my mind if he's going to be the guy.  If I missed another post please direct me. 

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