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***Official Donald J. Trump Impeachment (Whistleblower) Thread*** (4 Viewers)

Fair enough.

I think it’s worth spending time to show Trump’s behavior isn’t without consequences. And I believe senate republicans need to be held accountable for supporting it.

We’ve already seen one senator swayed regarding the constitutionality of the trial. Although I doubt Trump will be convicted, maybe a few more Rs will come to their senses before it’s all said and done, and maybe a few voters as well.
This is my priority. 

 
I've said this before, and not tongue in cheek at all - if I was one of the many pro-Trump GOPers on this site and in this country I would be furious - physically angry - at Donald Trump for putting together what can only be nicely described as the worst legal defense team ever to disgrace our judicial and legislative branches. From the completely outclassed Stop the Steal team of awful excuses for legal counsel to this mockery, he has shown he is incapable of rising to the moment of defending his cause and choosing people capable of helping him.

But what do I know. 
I just read their brief. It's really, really bad - not just from an argument standpoint but it's atrocious down to the way it improperly cites sources. 

So weird. 

 
I've said this before, and not tongue in cheek at all - if I was one of the many pro-Trump GOPers on this site and in this country I would be furious - physically angry - at Donald Trump for putting together what can only be nicely described as the worst legal defense team ever to disgrace our judicial and legislative branches. From the completely outclassed Stop the Steal team of awful excuses for legal counsel to this mockery, he has shown he is incapable of rising to the moment of defending his cause and choosing people capable of helping him.

But what do I know. 
Because there aren't many left that will even bother to defend him. That says a lot.

I will never comprehend the undying loyalty to an elite level disloyal person, who also is so unlike most of his supporters.

 
I've said this before, and not tongue in cheek at all - if I was one of the many pro-Trump GOPers on this site and in this country I would be furious - physically angry - at Donald Trump for putting together what can only be nicely described as the worst legal defense team ever to disgrace our judicial and legislative branches. From the completely outclassed Stop the Steal team of awful excuses for legal counsel to this mockery, he has shown he is incapable of rising to the moment of defending his cause and choosing people capable of helping him.

But what do I know. 
Which is why instead today the complaint is about the media covering stories about Trump being unhappy with his team.  Not about Trump...not about how bad they really were...but mocking the media for covering stories about Trump being unhappy with the team.

 
In fairness, Trump didn’t hire Powell and Wood. They Krakened on their own accord.
 

Trump’s first choice of defense teams for this trial were highly regarded (and not camera hungry fame whores).  Who knows why they left, as for whatever we think of the performance of this new team, they haven’t tried to litigate the election again. 

Trump can’t get a white shoe firm. None will have him. 

 
In fairness, Trump didn’t hire Powell and Wood. They Krakened on their own accord.
 

Trump’s first choice of defense teams for this trial were highly regarded (and not camera hungry fame whores).  Who knows why they left, as for whatever we think of the performance of this new team, they haven’t tried to litigate the election again. 

Trump can’t get a white shoe firm. None will have him. 
The ultimate FU move would have been to pardon Michael Cohen and then have him represent Trump at the Senate trial.

 
OK - it is late October 2024. Kamala Harris is leading the democrat ticket for president, with AOC as vice president. Polling shows they are winning easily in the general election that is happening in just a few weeks. The republican controlled congress just introduced articles of impeachment against both Harris and AOC. Turns out they were having some weird affairs with high level Chinese officials. It is not looking good for their chances of beating the impeachment.

So, instead, they both resign from their positions. They go on to win the election, and the democrats (now called the chinese loving marxist party) take back control of the house and senate.

You telling me during the lame duck period, while Harris and AOC are no longer VP and US Rep, the republican controlled congress is going to throw their hands up and not go forward with impeachment? I mean, they just told us that it is unconstitutional, right?

 
OK - it is late October 2024. Kamala Harris is leading the democrat ticket for president, with AOC as vice president. Polling shows they are winning easily in the general election that is happening in just a few weeks. The republican controlled congress just introduced articles of impeachment against both Harris and AOC. Turns out they were having some weird affairs with high level Chinese officials. It is not looking good for their chances of beating the impeachment.

So, instead, they both resign from their positions. They go on to win the election, and the democrats (now called the chinese loving marxist party) take back control of the house and senate.

You telling me during the lame duck period, while Harris and AOC are no longer VP and US Rep, the republican controlled congress is going to throw their hands up and not go forward with impeachment? I mean, they just told us that it is unconstitutional, right?
Right....all these arguments for why NOT to proceed with ensuring law/order are followed are setting a precedent that most aren't thinking about.

 
There’s going to be new evidence reported today and new video nobody’s ever seen before. And at the end of the day, there will be several Republican senators who will still have not seen it. 

 
Right....all these arguments for why NOT to proceed with ensuring law/order are followed are setting a precedent that most aren't thinking about.
That’s because I think most people realize that  “precedent” is a completely meaningless concept in a political process like impeachment. 
 

At the very least, it means something much different than in a legal process.  

 
But he was president when it happened.  Correct?  So why should he now not be punished?
Correct but having a trial after he is out of office is like having a trial to convict someone of a crime after they’re dead.  He’s not running for office ever again, he is essentially in hiding, and all of social media has cut him off at the knees.  It’s beating a dead horse so Democrats can score political points - plain and simple.  

 
Here is what I don't understand, and please forgive me if this was posted somewhere else or in the prior 663 pages of this thread which I have not read completely: If I am Mitch McConnell or more generally a senate Republican, and if I am only thinking politically about self-preservation and the preservation of the party, then why exactly would I vote to exonerate the former president? A Republican party with Trump splits the party and weakens both. If he is allowed to run again but eschews the party to start his own, then that also weakens both a lot. I get that sitting Republicans will take some heat if they flip but it seems to clear a path for the GOP in general and for many individual politicians by "ripping off the band-aid" and then moving forward. Very short-sighted from Mitch especially who is in the fifth quarter of his career and could fall on the sword for the party. If Mitch says that the party line is to vote that Trump cannot run again then it gives cover to incumbent Republicans who can say that Mitch told us to do it whenever they're next on the stump. Seems like the obvious path forward and I'd chalk it up to one last, weak act by Senator McConnell if he does not take it.

 
Correct but having a trial after he is out of office is like having a trial to convict someone of a crime after they’re dead.  He’s not running for office ever again, he is essentially in hiding, and all of social media has cut him off at the knees.  It’s beating a dead horse so Democrats can score political points - plain and simple.  
What if he hadn't gone radio silent or been banned from social media? What if he was obviously going to run again. Would that change your thinking?

 
Per reporting, Senator Roy Blunt said he had never seen any video of the riot until the House Managers showed it today. Senators Hawley, Cruz, Paul, and Johnson refused to watch m: all 4 were apparently immersed in paperwork and none of them looked up even once while the video was on. 
All 5 voted that the trial was unconstitutional. 
My HS history teacher would have probably broken his pointer on my head he would have hit me so hard. 

 
Correct but having a trial after he is out of office is like having a trial to convict someone of a crime after they’re dead.  He’s not running for office ever again, he is essentially in hiding, and all of social media has cut him off at the knees.  It’s beating a dead horse so Democrats can score political points - plain and simple.  
Yet that "dead man" and his allies are fighting it tooth and nail, even though it means nothing.

 
I don't know how you could watch that 13 minute video from yesterday and then act like nobody should have been scared.
Scared yes but spare us the drama.   You are a public figure so dealing with hostile people comes with the job.   We have fireman, policeman, nurses on the covid wing. Military etc etc that risk their lives every day anonymously and in silence. So let’s put this in perspective and stop with the overhype.  

 
Correct but having a trial after he is out of office is like having a trial to convict someone of a crime after they’re dead.  He’s not running for office ever again, he is essentially in hiding, and all of social media has cut him off at the knees.  It’s beating a dead horse so Democrats can score political points - plain and simple.  
How do you know what he will do?

Really not the point, it shouldn’t be his choice. 

 
Scared yes but spare us the drama.   You are a public figure so dealing with hostile people comes with the job.   We have fireman, policeman, nurses on the covid wing. Military etc etc that risk their lives every day anonymously and in silence. So let’s put this in perspective and stop with the overhype.  
There were bombs placed at the RNC and DNC. There were shots fired in the Capitol resulting in a protestor's death. There was the sound of broken glass and pounding on doors and "hang Mike Pence" throughout the halls. They were told to take cover and wear gas masks. Security had guns pulled and aimed at the doors. They were ushered through secret tunnels to escape harm.

Yea, overhype indeed :rolleyes:

 
Scared yes but spare us the drama.   You are a public figure so dealing with hostile people comes with the job.   We have fireman, policeman, nurses on the covid wing. Military etc etc that risk their lives every day anonymously and in silence. So let’s put this in perspective and stop with the overhype.  
This is a very different perspective, that’s for sure. 
Myself, when I watched that video I was thinking that they’re attacking our Capitol, the country that I love. That’s why I’ve compared this to 9/11. That’s why I’ve been so outraged. Overhype? I just can’t see it that way, and, no offense to you, I find it hard to respect anyone who does. 

 
There were bombs placed at the RNC and DNC. There were shots fired in the Capitol resulting in a protestor's death. There was the sound of broken glass and pounding on doors and "hang Mike Pence" throughout the halls. They were told to take cover and wear gas masks. Security had guns pulled and aimed at the doors. They were ushered through secret tunnels to escape harm.

Yea, overhype indeed :rolleyes:
There are iuds, land mines, snipers, burning buildings, risking not only your life but your family, a guy pulling a gun on you, having to fight for your life vs a bad guy, getting tortured, etc etc.

yes - overhype indeed....

 
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When I think of groups who never sensationalize their public service or have their public service publicized,  I think of police unions and members of the military and vets like Dan Crenshaw. 
 

just be honest. Your sole objection to all of this is the possibility of the Blue Team to “score points.”  Never mind that if 40 Republican senators voted to convict, there would be no points to score. Just a bipartisan determination that a line was crossed. 

 
There were bombs placed at the RNC and DNC. There were shots fired in the Capitol resulting in a protestor's death. There was the sound of broken glass and pounding on doors and "hang Mike Pence" throughout the halls. They were told to take cover and wear gas masks. Security had guns pulled and aimed at the doors. They were ushered through secret tunnels to escape harm.

Yea, overhype indeed :rolleyes:
In another thread this morning @jon_mx referred to this as “a few people shouting.” 
Seriously what the heck is happening here? How can people watch these videos and reach this sort of conclusion? I just don’t get it. 

 
There are iuds, land mines, snipers, burning buildings, risking not only your life but your family, a guy pulling a gun on you, having to fight for your life vs a bad guy, getting tortured, etc etc.

yes - overhype indeed....
What do you think would have happened if Nancy Pelosi was in her office all alone when hundreds of protestors got there? And do you think she would be justified in fearing for her life?

 
This is a very different perspective, that’s for sure. 
Myself, when I watched that video I was thinking that they’re attacking our Capitol, the country that I love. That’s why I’ve compared this to 9/11. That’s why I’ve been so outraged. Overhype? I just can’t see it that way, and, no offense to you, I find it hard to respect anyone who does. 
Our country was never at risk.  It was the work of 5000 zealous individuals in a country of 350m.  Was it unique and unfortunate-yes.  But the end of the United States as we know it - no never.  

 
What do you think would have happened if Nancy Pelosi was in her office all alone when hundreds of protestors got there? And do you think she would be justified in fearing for her life?
You can never tell people how they should feel since it’s up to the individual.  So yes if she truly felt scared for her life then it’s justified.  No one knows what would have happened so don’t see the point in going there.

 
Our country was never at risk.  It was the work of 5000 zealous individuals in a country of 350m.  Was it unique and unfortunate-yes.  But the end of the United States as we know it - no never.  
9/11 didn’t threaten the end of the USA either. Nonetheless it was an attack. Would you have called 9/11 an unfortunate attack by a group of zealous individuals? 

 
Not sure why its worth engaging those that have such an odious disregard for the safety of our elected officials :shrug:  
It's not a disregard for the safety of our elected officials so much as it is an attempt to gaslight and minimize due to the sides involved.  That's what's incredibly sad.

There are people from the "red" side (like @jm192, for example), that clearly came out and said it was wrong.  I know if Biden and his supporters (or anyone) did anything close to what happened 1/6, I would firmly denounce it regardless of which side they were on.  I would think most here would.  And that's why the ignore list exists and why it's pointless to engage those who engage in such bad faith.

 
To the ‘political theater’ crowd, it’s only political theater because you view it through political eyes. If this isn’t an impeachable offense, nothing is. Since it’s essentially been established that the President can’t be charged while in office and congressional requests can be ignored, impeachment is the only method left to hold the President accountable. Take that away and call all impeachments ‘political theater’ and the President is above the law.

 
Not sure why its worth engaging those that have such an odious disregard for the safety of our elected officials :shrug:  
Do you think our elected officials really care about our safety all the time?  Plus you’re a public official meaning you deal with public sometimes which could get hostile so it comes with the job.

 

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