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Dynasty and Redraft: QB Tua Tagovailoa, Miami Dolphins

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1 hour ago, Smack Tripper said:

I get its off the bye but I wouldn't throw Tua in the deep end against the rams

What would you call the Deep End exactly? I'm not worried about the Rams offense vs the Miami Secondary at the moment so Tua might actually get a couple short fields. That #99 for the Rams is pretty good, we're gonna need to get a hat on him but we got 2 weeks to figure it out. 

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54 minutes ago, steelwind said:

https://youtu.be/yqMqtBMZVzI

From the unseen footage of Tua throwing in practice who is he throwing to?  Is it Parker?

The first pass looks like its maybe Grant or Ford, Parker is taller. Parker wear #11, hard to tell from the footage. 

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2 minutes ago, Ministry of Pain said:

What would you call the Deep End exactly? I'm not worried about the Rams offense vs the Miami Secondary at the moment so Tua might actually get a couple short fields. That #99 for the Rams is pretty good, we're gonna need to get a hat on him but we got 2 weeks to figure it out. 

Which again is why I say, if they were going to do this all along, throw him out there against a terrible jets team, and the spend the bye week reflecting on it.

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I posted in the preseason, but I thought the original plan was to have him start week 10 against the Jets. I think the schedule getting jumbled around definitely changed their plans a little bit.

Edited by Man In The Box
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2 minutes ago, VikingFrog said:

Which again is why I say, if they were going to do this all along, throw him out there against a terrible jets team, and the spend the bye week reflecting on it.

The OL needed a couple weeks. Hunt just took over at RT which is Tua's blind side so I think only because it's a Bye week are we going to see Tua this early. The plan had to be between Jets games later in the Year but that was shuffled around due to Covid IMO. 

Miami has handled this beautifully so far and I am an uber critical fan of everything they do. I would have actually liked Tua to sit longer until Fitz really gave the job away but I'm happy how they are handling this and that's why i sit on the couch and they get paid to be on the sidelines. This feels right to me in a way we haven't seen down here in a long long time. 

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1 hour ago, Ministry of Pain said:

What would you call the Deep End exactly? I'm not worried about the Rams offense vs the Miami Secondary at the moment so Tua might actually get a couple short fields. That #99 for the Rams is pretty good, we're gonna need to get a hat on him but we got 2 weeks to figure it out. 

I guess in my mind, if the move was eminent, I'd make at 2-3 vs. a dead in the water Jets team.  He probably couldn't lose that game, get him into the bye feeling good.  

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From local sports writer Barry Jackson:

>>Without cameras on & recorders running, two players have conveyed positive things about how Tua has looked in practice. What's encouraging about this move is that Tua must be performing well there, in eyes of coaches, to make this move after two wins in a row and Fitz at 95 rating.<<

https://mobile.twitter.com/flasportsbuzz/status/1318602035164577792

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58 minutes ago, SoBeDad said:

From local sports writer Barry Jackson:

>>Without cameras on & recorders running, two players have conveyed positive things about how Tua has looked in practice. What's encouraging about this move is that Tua must be performing well there, in eyes of coaches, to make this move after two wins in a row and Fitz at 95 rating.<<

https://mobile.twitter.com/flasportsbuzz/status/1318602035164577792

Yep seems like it has to be a combo of 

1. this was their rough plan all a long

2. Tua is totally healthy 

3. Tua is looking sharp in practice 

4. The team is playing well so they know he will have a good chance of being successful 

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As a Tua superflex dynasty owner, I like where this is headed. Flores seems to be building something there, just hope they are making the right moves with the draft capital they have invested in and built up. I think Tua has the accuracy, leadership, and intangibles to be special.

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There was a part in the game Sunday, probably around the 3rd quarter, where fitz was sitting with the tablet in his hand pointing something out to Tua.  That interaction between the two of them is going to be big for tua's growth and I wonder if Mia brings fitz back again next year just to keep the consistency.

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19 minutes ago, wgoldsph said:

There was a part in the game Sunday, probably around the 3rd quarter, where fitz was sitting with the tablet in his hand pointing something out to Tua.  That interaction between the two of them is going to be big for tua's growth and I wonder if Mia brings fitz back again next year just to keep the consistency.

The question might be more does Fitz go to another team where he's a bridge to another quarterback. I remember fondly when he was with the Jets and he, Brandon Marshall, and Eric Decker all had great years and made a run for the playoffs, only to miss out at 10-6. Maybe the Jets could use him again as the bridge to their next QB.

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31 minutes ago, Joe Summer said:

When was the last time that a starting QB on a .500 team (or better) got benched for a rookie?

Bears just did it... I know Foles isn't a rookie, but kind of the same situation.

Other than that I doubt it.  You used to be able to sit rookie QB's and let them learn over time, but that's not the case in today's NFL.  It's a race to get them in.

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7 minutes ago, Deamon said:
40 minutes ago, Joe Summer said:

When was the last time that a starting QB on a .500 team (or better) got benched for a rookie?

Bears just did it... I know Foles isn't a rookie, but kind of the same situation.

Right, that's my point. Foles had 48 career starts, made a Pro Bowl, and won a Super Bowl. I'd have no qualms about benching Ryan Fitzpatrick for a guy with that resume. But benching a starting QB on a playoff-contending team for a rookie? I can't remember that happening in recent history.
 

10 minutes ago, Deamon said:

You used to be able to sit rookie QB's and let them learn over time, but that's not the case in today's NFL.  It's a race to get them in.

Usually, the only reason that it's a "race" to start a rookie QB is because the team sucks and they don't have a decent starting QB to begin with. So, it's no big deal if you bench Tom Savage (remember him?) or Nathan Peterman because those guys aren't leading you to the playoffs, ever.

Anyway, I hope this move works for Miami. I have Tua on my bench so I'm rooting for him.....I just don't have high hopes.

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2 minutes ago, Joe Summer said:

Right, that's my point. Foles had 48 career starts, made a Pro Bowl, and won a Super Bowl. I'd have no qualms about benching Ryan Fitzpatrick for a guy with that resume. But benching a starting QB on a playoff-contending team for a rookie? I can't remember that happening in recent history.
 

Usually, the only reason that it's a "race" to start a rookie QB is because the team sucks and they don't have a decent starting QB to begin with. So, it's no big deal if you bench Tom Savage (remember him?) or Nathan Peterman because those guys aren't leading you to the playoffs, ever.

Anyway, I hope this move works for Miami. I have Tua on my bench so I'm rooting for him.....I just don't have high hopes.

It's not going to "work" for Miami if the goal is success this year.  But I don't think that's their goal.  So this move works for them for sure if they're looking for next year and their starter has half a season under his belt.

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6 hours ago, Deamon said:

It's not going to "work" for Miami if the goal is success this year.  But I don't think that's their goal.  So this move works for them for sure if they're looking for next year and their starter has half a season under his belt.

Half a season of 72% completion percentage, 3500 yards passing with 26 TD's, 700 yards rushing with 8 TD's.

Just kidding.

Anybody doing projections for Tua? He has some skill players to toss it to.

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17 minutes ago, Scooby1974 said:

Half a season of 72% completion percentage, 3500 yards passing with 26 TD's, 700 yards rushing with 8 TD's.

Just kidding.

Anybody doing projections for Tua? He has some skill players to toss it to.

His arm talent is great, the main issues are decision making, pocket presence and escapability. Against the lowly Jets, Fitzpatrick had pressure on many plays because they blitzed. And rookie RT Hunt, who the Dolphins believe in, but PFF ranks "102nd of 113 offensive tackles who have appeared in a game this season" will be tested. I expect lower numbers than Fitzpatrick had, but it's anybody's guess. They may run the ball more and have quick passes, but more drive ending sacks.

https://amp.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article246514185.html

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3 minutes ago, SoBeDad said:

His arm talent is great, the main issues are decision making, pocket presence and escapability. Against the lowly Jets, Fitzpatrick had pressure on many plays because they blitzed. And rookie RT Hunt, who the Dolphins believe in, but PFF ranks "102nd of 113 offensive tackles who have appeared in a game this season" will be tested. I expect lower numbers than Fitzpatrick had, but it's anybody's guess. They may run the ball more and have quick passes, but more drive ending sacks.

https://amp.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article246514185.html

Fitz's experience on bad teams certainly slowed the game down in his head so he was less apt to panic. Plus the guy would take off and run. It will be interesting to see if he could buy some time for his receivers to get downfield too. But I'm sure he has had "throw it away" drilled into his head all pre/current season given his hip issue and concern for long term health.

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10 hours ago, Joe Summer said:

When was the last time that a starting QB on a .500 team (or better) got benched for a rookie?

Giants benched Kurt Warner for Eli when they were 5-4 iirc

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The Jets are so bad QBs are getting benched because they only beat them by 24.

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Rookie Blindside OL at both RT and RG, as much as i have praised their play early on, the fact remains his primary blockers his blind side are both Rookies. Gaskin doesn't even weigh 200 lbs and he's expected to lay his body out for Tua? These are just questions and things you should at least ponder from a Phinsfan. 

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Let's Shark it up... who is Tua going to be looking for out there? Is this the move that launches Preston Williams into a stretch run WR2 (or better)?

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Hope Tua looks good this week since I lost Dak but going up against the Rams and the added pressure of Burrow and Herbert looking like studs so far 

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Considering how well other rookie QB’s with arguably equivalent weapons around him have done this year, I’m pretty encouraged Tua could be a strong play down the stretch...I’m seriously considering dropping run of the mill QB’s like Matthew Stafford and Philip Rivers in a couple of different leagues for his potential upside.

I can’t imagine the Dolphins would sit Fitzpatrick and insert someone they have no confidence in.

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36 minutes ago, Team Smokin' said:

Where do you have him ranked for ROS MoP? 

I can name 12-15 QBs I would rather have in FF and I'm cautiously optimistic he can do well.  I would have him ranked around 20th at the moment and that might even be too high, we'll see. 

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man after watching the kind of pressure the Rams can create.....I think the kid is in trouble this week.....

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1 minute ago, Stinkin Ref said:

man after watching the kind of pressure the Rams can create.....I think the kid is in trouble this week.....

He’s definitely in a tough spot this week, but I see some value once he gets beyond the Rams.

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Just now, Saboo said:

He’s definitely in a tough spot this week, but I see some value once he gets beyond blasted the Rams.

fixed

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3 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

man after watching the kind of pressure the Rams can create.....I think the kid is in trouble this week.....

Keeping in mind, protecting the QB is probably the single biggest (glaring) weakness of the Bears... but yes, Tua will get to meet 99 and others this weekend. 😃

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the dolphins get a gift wrapped matchup with the jets after one more game......I think its worth the wait....Christmas day instead of Christmas eve....

Edited by Stinkin Ref
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On 10/27/2020 at 1:34 PM, Stinkin Ref said:

man after watching the kind of pressure the Rams can create.....I think the kid is in trouble this week.....

It's too early for him to face this test. It should have been Fitz til after this game. The veteran would have trouble with Ramsey smothering the best WR and Donald breathing down his neck. It just seems like a test for someone with veteran savvy to be patient for the other WRs, to force a throw or two to keep Ramsey where he is etc. 

I really hope they're willing to pull him if he struggles. There have been countless QBs that have been shellacked so many times they get gun shy and lose their confidence.

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7 hours ago, Bri said:

It's too early for him to face this test. It should have been Fitz til after this game. The veteran would have trouble with Ramsey smothering the best WR and Donald breathing down his neck. It just seems like a test for someone with veteran savvy to be patient for the other WRs, to force a throw or two to keep Ramsey where he is etc. 

I really hope they're willing to pull him if he struggles. There have been countless QBs that have been shellacked so many times they get gun shy and lose their confidence.

I think Flores knew a bye week was the best opportunity to prepare his rookie to play. If they're smart they will feature a lot of Gaskin and a lot of easy, quick reads for Tua. He does throw a beautiful deep ball, and the fins have seen that in practice, so they'll take a few shots I'm sure.  The main problem would be if Tua tries to play hero ball as he did sometimes in college. Then he's going to get pancaked.

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12 hours ago, Ministry of Pain said:

In 10 minutes it will be Day of

That is all

Love the comeback story, love the prospect, but Aaron Donald is a rough way to start your career. Would be insane if they nabbed a WC with him.

Any guesses on who he will favor? I love the Unicorn's talent but there just hasn't been enough consistent volume. Guys is such a physical mismatch. But maybe Gesicki gets the biggest bump with the change?

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7 minutes ago, BobbyLayne said:

Love the comeback story, love the prospect, but Aaron Donald is a rough way to start your career. Would be insane if they nabbed a WC with him.

Any guesses on who he will favor? I love the Unicorn's talent but there just hasn't been enough consistent volume. Guys is such a physical mismatch. But maybe Gesicki gets the biggest bump with the change?

Maybe the slot receiver,  Grant or Ford on short crossing routes, if the goal is to avoid Donald. Perhaps Gesicki on some block and release catches. I think the team and Tua also want to showcase his arm on some deeper routes to loosen the secondary, so it won't be all dink and dunk.

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2 minutes ago, SoBeDad said:

Maybe the slot receiver,  Grant or Ford on short crossing routes, if the goal is to avoid Donald. Perhaps Gesicki on some block and release catches. I think the team and Tua also want to showcase his arm on some deeper routes to loosen the secondary, so it won't be all dink and dunk.

I imagine he's had a ton of 2nd string reps with those guys and will feel very comfortable with that scheme. But yeah, dude is a talent, we're not building a game manager here.

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2 minutes ago, Sneegor said:

Tua going to put on a show today.  Parker will have a big day as well.

Against Ramsey? 

From Barry Jackson:

A) If Tagovailoa isn’t very good Sunday, don’t worry. Plenty of great quarterbacks have struggled in their debuts.

B) If Tagovailoa doesn’t show anything during the next five games or struggles in four of them, be concerned, because all of the very good quarterbacks who started as rookies in this past decade had at least one very good game in their first five and most had more than that.

C) If Tagovailoa is extraordinary Sunday, the odds are slim that he will be a big disappointment based on recent history, though Mariota is the outlier.

 

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18 minutes ago, BobbyLayne said:

Love the comeback story, love the prospect, but Aaron Donald is a rough way to start your career. Would be insane if they nabbed a WC with him.

Any guesses on who he will favor? I love the Unicorn's talent but there just hasn't been enough consistent volume. Guys is such a physical mismatch. But maybe Gesicki gets the biggest bump with the change?

I do think WIliams will see more deep passes his way and from that perspective you understand why Miami wants to have Tua's skillset out there. Some long passes to Preston will open up the running lanes more for Gaskin who has done well despite not having a lot of speed. So again, Preston Williams IS NEEDED to open this offense up for Tua. 

Parker has had a nagging injury or two, I give him props for playing thru them, he received a nice contract, he's putting himself out there. That said he has short armed a couple balls and is coming off a couple rough games. He also will see a lot of Jalen Ramsey today. Parker was perfect for Fitz, not sure what the favorite will be now. 

-Keep an eye n Ford and Grant, sometimes rookies have been working a lot with the WR3 and WR4 while Fitz is taking 1st team reps, don't be surprised if some sleeper has the stats for Miami today. Also think the TE will be more heavily involved in the pass attack. 

Edited by Ministry of Pain

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