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Ringer Article On Hong Kong Protests (1 Viewer)

It’sIt’s early afternoon on Sunday, October 20, in Hong Kong, and the air has not yet filled with gas. No fires yet burn in the streets. No one is running afraid, nor screaming in pain. The city is gorgeous, the sky clear. Cars roll past and music plays from a loudspeaker as the first of a few hundred thousand people are gathering for a protest that will begin here at Salisbury Garden, in the neighborhood of Tsim Sha Tsui, and among them there’s a young man who’s happy to talk about why he’s here.

“We have our freedom,” he says. “We will fight to keep it.” He does not give a name, preferring instead to go by his online handle, Poplar584. He is small, with a gentle voice, wearing a mask and dressed all in black. I ask what he expects to happen.

“The police will use force again,” he says. “Of course they will.”

I ask whether he’s afraid.

“No.” He shakes his head as if almost offended by the question. “Hong Kong people are strong. We will stay strong. We aren’t afraid of the police. We aren’t afraid of China.” And yet, he admits, he understands why fear may be warranted.

“We just have umbrellas,” he says, and then he shrugs.

“They have weapons.”
The pics in here are indeed terrific.

I just feel that the USA should be supporting this movement 100%. Democracy should always be our cause.

 
The shops are all closed, but in the middle of the street gather the most radical of Hong Kong’s protesters, the young people known as the “frontliners.” They are dressed all in black. They carry umbrellas in their hands and letters to their families in their backpacks. The umbrellas to protect against police. The letters in case they fail.

 
The pics in here are indeed terrific.

I just feel that the USA should be supporting this movement 100%. Democracy should always be our cause.
It's the difficult part of international politics.  We should,  you're right.  We will immediately be in the hottest Cold War imaginable with China, or worse. 

Then what?

 
It's the difficult part of international politics.  We should,  you're right.  We will immediately be in the hottest Cold War imaginable with China, or worse. 

Then what?
This is often the difficult part of domestic politics as well. Plenty of things that ten year old me would wish for. Over 40 me says no thanks. Really not much different. We are passing on what is right morally because it is wrong practically and economically for us. 

 
This is often the difficult part of domestic politics as well. Plenty of things that ten year old me would wish for. Over 40 me says no thanks. Really not much different. We are passing on what is right morally because it is wrong practically and economically for us. 
Agreed. Balance and compromise and what sacrifices you're willing to make for gain in other areas all make it complicated. Both home and abroad. 

 
I do think the one thing I was surprised by though was how sensitive China was to Morey's comment. That seemed like a pretty small thing to me and it turned into an uproar.

 
It's the difficult part of international politics.  We should,  you're right.  We will immediately be in the hottest Cold War imaginable with China, or worse. 

Then what?
Yank, we've been in a cold war struggle with China since 1949. Then what has been the policy for decades. Then keep pushing for democracy.

 
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I do think the one thing I was surprised by though was how sensitive China was to Morey's comment. That seemed like a pretty small thing to me and it turned into an uproar.
I don't think anyone who has been following China (or Russia) should be surprised. Control of information and pressure on corporate entities trying to do business there has been a practice for some time. This is just a situation where it has burst into the open. 

 
The pics in here are indeed terrific.

I just feel that the USA should be supporting this movement 100%. Democracy should always be our cause.
I think most do.

Would really love to see Pops, Kerr and James wear a "Free Hong Kong" shirt walking into the arena or during warmups.  That would really raise the awareness bar.  Or even Kaepernick who has not said anything about this.  The Nike employees have been pretty quiet on this topic.

I have stated this before, I have been to China at least half dozen times for work.  I would venture to say that most of the country has no idea, or at least very little of what is going on in Hong Kong.  I talked to an engineer from China last week and he said his family does not know even about Hong Kong, but he was very afraid to even talk about it with them and he lives in the USA.

 
I think most do.

Would really love to see Pops, Kerr and James wear a "Free Hong Kong" shirt walking into the arena or during warmups.  That would really raise the awareness bar.  Or even Kaepernick who has not said anything about this.  The Nike employees have been pretty quiet on this topic.

I have stated this before, I have been to China at least half dozen times for work.  I would venture to say that most of the country has no idea, or at least very little of what is going on in Hong Kong.  I talked to an engineer from China last week and he said his family does not know even about Hong Kong, but he was very afraid to even talk about it with them and he lives in the USA.
I would like to see Nike up their presence on this. I understand why they're not. But it doesn't seem to fit with their other marketing. 

 
The fascinating thing to me on this too was how much James seemed to bend the knee. Silver was tough in comparison. 

 
I would like to see Nike up their presence on this. I understand why they're not. But it doesn't seem to fit with their other marketing. 
Well the majority of Nike products are made in China and Vietnam.    Last year Nike`s China revenue was $1.6 billion up almost 20% from the previous year. That puts it ahead of the traditionally strong markets of Latin America, where revenue for the past quarter was $1.3 billion, up only 3%.

At the current growth rate, within two years, Nike's Chinese sales will approach those in Europe and the Middle East, where revenue was $2.4 billion last quarter, up 6%. The China growth rate also means that Nike predicts the region's revenue will approach that in Nike's home market of North America in a couple of years, where sales last quarter were $3.8 billion, up 7%.

China`s Nike sales rate is growing at more than double than anywhere else.   With the product also being made there I highly doubt Nike or big names like James, Pops and Kerr will be joining in to protest Hong Kong anytime soon as the NBA seems to just want this to go away.

 
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Well the majority of Nike products are made in China and Vietnam.    Last year Nike`s China revenue was $1.6 billion up almost 20% from the previous year. That puts it ahead of the traditionally strong markets of Latin America, where revenue for the past quarter was $1.3 billion, up only 3%.

At the current growth rate, within two years, Nike's Chinese sales will approach those in Europe and the Middle East, where revenue was $2.4 billion last quarter, up 6%. The China growth rate also means that Nike predicts the region's revenue will approach that in Nike's home market of North America in a couple of years, where sales last quarter were $3.8 billion, up 7%.

China`s Nike sales rate is growing at more than double than anywhere else.   With the product also being made there I highly doubt Nike or big names like James, Pops and Kerr will be joining in to protest Hong Kong anytime soon as the NBA seems to just want this to go away.
For sure. Totally get all that and that's what I mean when I say I understand why. 

Just makes it tough to reconcile with the "Believe in something. Even if it means sacrificing everything" thing. 

 
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For sure. Totally get all that and that's what I mean when I say I understand why. 

Just makes it tough to reconcile with the "Believe in something. Even if it means sacrificing everything" thing. 
That is the caveat for people like Pops, Kerr and even James and others who are so fast to speak out on social topics yet when it impacts their life or possible their paychecks and bottom line they are strangely silent.   It is easy to be an activist and tell others what they should do if it does not affect your own life.   We will see..somehow I think eventually one of them will take a stand,    Pops is 70 years old and near the end of his career so I am guessing he might.

 
Really sucks how often what is right will get overplayed by what is best on the world political stage.

 
China Says It Will Roll Out ‘National Security’ Steps for Hong Kong

Communist Party leaders announced the move after months of protests in the city, but gave no details. 

The most eye-catching language was about Hong Kong, where for some 21 weeks protesters have challenged the Beijing-backed government, demanded democracy and denounced China’s growing hold over the city, a former British colony that maintains its own laws and freedoms.

Hong Kong and Macau, a former Portuguese colony, are both run as “special administrative regions” under Chinese sovereignty. China would “build and improve a legal system and enforcement mechanism to defend national security in the special administrative regions,” the meeting summary said.

The vague language leaves plenty of guesswork about what the Chinese leaders may have in mind. Some pro-Beijing hard-liners in Hong Kong have suggested the time may have come for the Chinese authorities to impose new security legislation on the territory, which Britain returned to Chinese sovereignty in 1997.

Article 18 of the Basic Law, the mini-constitution that defines Hong Kong’s status, gives Beijing broad authority, which it has never exercised, to act on a perceived threat in Hong Kong to national threat or unity.

The Basic Law also requires that Hong Kong pass its own national security laws, but it has not done so, especially after protests in 2003 prompted the territory’s government to abandon proposed legislation.

 
No I mean, the original campaign, not the altered one.
For the original, I think it was both. Certainly they're promoting Kaepernick as an athlete giving an example of making a sacrifice for a goal they believe in. 

I don't think it was as much, "Our guy did a good thing" as much at it was "Here's an example of our guy doing what we think is a good thing". 

 
No I mean, the original campaign, not the altered one.
For the original, I think it was both. Certainly they're promoting Kaepernick as an athlete giving an example of making a sacrifice for a goal they believe in. 

I don't think it was as much, "Our guy did a good thing" as much at it was "Here's an example of our guy doing what we think is a good thing". 
I 100% agree on this!  I think Nike was using Kaepernick to be good by association, to pretend they had his values when they do not!

 
The fascinating thing to me on this too was how much James seemed to bend the knee. Silver was tough in comparison. 
Joe I was just reading the terrific thread by Adam Harstad - which was in response to this also terrific thread - and it brought to mind something that occurred to me when I read this post a while back.

And that was that here in New Orleans there is a sort of foundational story behind the Saints. Part of it is that the city for years had several exhibition games at drawing the NFL here. And it was popular, large crowds in a football crazy city, home of the Sugar Bowl and an original member of the SEC. Tulane Stadium would immediately be one of the largest stadiums in the NFL and in one of the country's then largest cities. In fact Lamar Hunt supposedly had wanted to move the Dallas Texans here before Kansas City.

The problem? Segregation. The Saints just had their anniversary (11/1/66, All Saints Day 1966), but it almost didn't get a team because the city would not desegregate seating. The NFL and some city leaders making a push to get the Saints - which required common seating - was a major driver to ending segregation in NO.

The other reason we got a team? House Speaker F. Edward Hebert and Senator Russell Long combined to get an anti-trust exemption waived for the NFL in its merger with the NFL, which of course created the modern league we all enjoy so much. Again desegregation was baked into this.

The point is that players like James have become corporations in their own right. Their ability or power to influence politics is not something they can shrug off or ignore. This flows the other way though. They are likewise influenced by governments just as corporations are, because, again, some of them are corporations. Their decisions to put money and power over right and wrong, freedom, justice, free speech, is a choice they make. Seeing men like James and Harden bowed in the face of intimidation against freedom and democracy is a sad and disappointing thing, and IMO it deserves 1000x the reprobation that Kaepernick received.

 
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Joe I was just reading the terrific thread by Adam Harstad - which was in response to this also terrific thread - and it brought to mind something that occurred to me when I read this post a while back.

And that was that here in New Orleans there is a sort of foundational story behind the Saints. Part of it is that the city for years had several exhibition games at drawing the NFL here. And it was popular, large crowds in a football crazy city, home of the Sugar Bowl and an original member of the SEC. Tulane Stadium would immediately be one of the largest stadiums in the NFL and in one of the country's then largest cities. In fact Lamar Hunt supposedly had wanted to move the Dallas Texans here before Kansas City.

The problem? Segregation. The Saints just had their anniversary (11/1/66, All Saints Day 1966), but it almost didn't get a team because the city would not desegregate seating. The NFL and some city leaders making a push to get the Saints - which required common seating - was a major driver to ending segregation in NO.

The other reason we got a team? House Speaker F. Edward Hebert and Senator Russell Long combined to get an anti-trust exemption waived for the NFL in its merger with the NFL, which of course created the modern league we all enjoy so much. Again desegregation was baked into this.

The point is that players like James have become corporations in their own right. Their ability or power to influence politics is not something they can shrug off or ignore. This flows the other way though. They are likewise influenced by governments just as corporations are, because, again, some of them are corporations. Their decisions to put money and power over right and wrong, freedom, justice, free speech, is a choice they make. Seeing men like James and Harden bowed in the face of intimidation against freedom and democracy is a sad and disappointing thing, and IMO it deserves 1000x the reprobation that Kaepernick received.
Thanks @SaintsInDome2006  I think you're right in it seems like some of these megastars only want things to go one way. They want the benefits without the responsibility. 

 
I do think the one thing I was surprised by though was how sensitive China was to Morey's comment. That seemed like a pretty small thing to me and it turned into an uproar.
And how quickly the NBA squashed it. And how fans who think the NFL should tell its players to shut up and play seem to be finally understanding the implications of what it means to tell players that. 
 

Hopefully more support for public figures speaking out will come.  It’ll be interesting for sure. 

 

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