Don Hutson
Footballguy
I think people are overestimating how much activism Kaep does in reality. He kneeled. He wears t-shirts. He makes Nike commercials. He did very little real activism to bring on his notoriety.
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QB Colin Kaepernick, Free Agent (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
Yes. Kneeling during the national anthem created a media firestorm that did not help his football team succeed on the field at the game of football. It created a distraction. Whether the distraction was major or minor, it certainly wasn't something in the service of winning football games.
If I were a GM, I would want to know if that is the kind of thing he intended to do if I hired him. Because as a GM, I would not want to spend my working hours in front of a microphone discussing that with the media, I would want to be scouting players and running the franchise in order to make the team win more football games. I would want my coach discussing football, not politics. I would want my lockerroom thinking about football, not answering questions about politics. Note this has nothing to do with whether his cause is good or bad. This has to do with business. As a GM my business is football. Distracting from football is bad for my business. So if I were to hire someone, I would want them focused on helping my business, not distracting my organization.
Now if you want to play games and pretend none of that is true somehow, thats fine. But it doesnt change the reality. Football is a business. Business people dont want distractions unless they have valuable upside to the business. The fact that WERE TALKING ABOUT THIS proves its a distraction.
Chaka
Footballguy
People are still kneeling, holding fists in the air etc. no one says a word anymore.
And we need to remember he never made a public statement about why he was sitting, then kneeling, until asked.
The fact that we're talking about it also proves that it will draw eyeballs and generate money for the league.
Dizzy
Footballguy
Well, he has received awards and accolades for his "activism" and is about a million dollars ahead of most in charitable contributions. The cause he was trying to bring attention to was glossed over in favor of making his peaceful protests to appear anti-American or anti-military... and that's the kind of thing that happens to activists. So I think it is pretty safe to label him as an activist.
Activism not to be confused with philanthropy.
None of that is relevant to Kaepernick's situation. If he is making political demonstrations IT WILL be a firestorm of publicity. I'm not here to argue the fairness of that fact. If you're looking to hire him, you will question whether he will be doing lockerroom interviews every week about non football issues. Same for his coach, same with his teammates, same with his GM. It does no matter if he claims he isnt looking for that kind of attention. He's going to get that kind of attention. Do you want that in your franchise?
So are you arguing he isnt going to be a distraction, or that it will be a positive distraction? You may suspect it will 'draw eyeballs', but again this is risk versus reward. MAYBE you will sell more season tickets because Colin Kaepernick is on your team doing whatever he intends to do. And maybe it will piss off your paying fanbase. Not all publicity is in fact good publicity.
If a player was juggling fire on the sidelines, Im sure it would draw a lot of eyeballs. I'm not sure it would help my team win football games. I would certainly think long and hard about whether I wanted the subject of my football team to be about why I have a guy juggling fire on the sidelines instead of what my football team is doing to win football games.
kittenmittens
Footballguy
I think this is somewhat simple. Time and time and time again, a team will put up with distractions... if the player is worth it.
Antonio Brown is a great example of this. Nearly unlimited negative PR is acceptable as long as we have a hall of fame player in the fold.
If a player wants to be even a very minor distraction but he is marginal, he's gone.
I think teams would put up with the distraction if Kaep was fine with singing a low value prove it contract. Nobody wants to pay starting QB money for a player who probably isn't that good, isn't known as a great leader or locker room guy, and also might bring a distraction.
Antonio Brown is a great example of this. Nearly unlimited negative PR is acceptable as long as we have a hall of fame player in the fold.
If a player wants to be even a very minor distraction but he is marginal, he's gone.
I think teams would put up with the distraction if Kaep was fine with singing a low value prove it contract. Nobody wants to pay starting QB money for a player who probably isn't that good, isn't known as a great leader or locker room guy, and also might bring a distraction.
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kittenmittens
Footballguy
I love this. Don't give the NFL any ideas! They probably care more about eyeballs and less about distractions than the individual teams do.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
Harping back on what I already posted, this one is open for debate and interpretation.
In my world, a player that wants to play would have set up his own pro day two plus years ago. He would have done a lot more to bring on positive publicity. He would have gotten in front of things and said he is done protesting or picking fights with the league. He would have said he would welcome any role and a modest contract.
IMO, a player that wants to play doesn’t get into a coup d’etat with the league over media access, where the pro day will be held, and a waiver. Or wear what Kaep wore and then make a statement to 32 owners afterwards.
But maybe that is just me. So I personally would not conclude based on what transpired that CK is focused on playing football. I would conclude that he is focused on being a distraction and a candidate to initiate additional legal action.
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TheDirtyWord
Footballguy
Kaepernick felt this was a sham from the get-go...as evidenced by his tweet when word leaked of the workout.
I’m just getting word from my representatives that the NFL league office reached out to them about a workout in Atlanta on Saturday. I’ve been in shape and ready for this for 3 years, can’t wait to see the head coaches and GMs on Saturday.
He’s not dumb...he knows HC’s and GM’s have other obligations on fall Saturdays. At the end of the day, the NFL was looking to see if he was willing to dance. He’s not. At the same time...if he was really intent on getting back in the NFL, he wouldn’t have in essence said F-U to the offer. He did.
I’m just getting word from my representatives that the NFL league office reached out to them about a workout in Atlanta on Saturday. I’ve been in shape and ready for this for 3 years, can’t wait to see the head coaches and GMs on Saturday.
He’s not dumb...he knows HC’s and GM’s have other obligations on fall Saturdays. At the end of the day, the NFL was looking to see if he was willing to dance. He’s not. At the same time...if he was really intent on getting back in the NFL, he wouldn’t have in essence said F-U to the offer. He did.
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Chaka
Footballguy
So in your opinion he should capitulate entirely. Would you sincerely be satisfied with that? Every other player who wishes may sit, kneel, hold up his hand, which is literally (not figuratively) the only thing Kaepernick did on game day, but not him. Is that a reasonable expectation? It's okay for everyone or it's okay for no-one those are the only reasonable options.
He doesn't need to make public statements about his expectations for salary or his role on the team. I am certain he has discussed it with any teams that have asked, beyond that it's none of our business. These are the kind of things that reinforce my belief that we just love manufactured drama and the media keeps feeding it to us regardless of accuracy.
Signing that waiver would have been entirely, and on every single level a bad decision for any employee. You don't forfeit your rights to litigate all potential future labor disputes. That clause was absolutely a screw you to Kaepernick and his only option was to have move on to an alternate location for his pro day.
He doesn't have a right to play and I am not saying the league should be forced to give him employment. But, IMO they do need just get over it already. It was manufactured drama from the start and a bunch of hyper-reactionary trolls took the bait and whipped everything into a frenzy. And why? Because one guy didn't stand during a magic song. The reaction was bizarre, toxic and sadly emblematic of our times.
I haven’t read this thread. I’m sure it’s the same nonsense that’s been tossed around for the last several years.
This was a mistake for the NFL to do. I’m 100% sure one their lawyers came up with. Complete circus to do at the 2/3rd’s point of the season. If they wanted to give him a fair shake they would have done this in the preseason. That being said some radio hosts have made good points that this has never been done for any FA that I can recall. Now do other FA’s like Dez Bryant request coaches brought in and a professional facility to use? Can’t recall that ever happening.
On the flip side, no way Kaepernick wants to play. Thousands of drones saying: “I want him to get his shot.” Well if he wanted it he wouldn’t have worked out at a high school in a ####a Kinte shirt pretending to be some sort of martyr while being sponsored by Nike. A company that is probably heavily influenced by China and who has been caught using actual slave labor several times in its history. He also showed up with man boobs. Can’t believe there are people actually saying he looked like he was in good shape. No, he looked like a former jock who once upon a time worked out but now sits on the couch eating Oreos and Funyuns.
This is like watching a couple go through a bad divorce and then having one last preceding to see who gets the dog. NFL does what the NFL does which is look stupid. Same as always (example MNF on ####ty Mexico field). Kaep stirred up his long supporters but he also ended up lifting the veil so to speak to some who he once had the support of. He made me feel bad for Hue Jackson having his time wasted, I think that says it all really.
This was a mistake for the NFL to do. I’m 100% sure one their lawyers came up with. Complete circus to do at the 2/3rd’s point of the season. If they wanted to give him a fair shake they would have done this in the preseason. That being said some radio hosts have made good points that this has never been done for any FA that I can recall. Now do other FA’s like Dez Bryant request coaches brought in and a professional facility to use? Can’t recall that ever happening.
On the flip side, no way Kaepernick wants to play. Thousands of drones saying: “I want him to get his shot.” Well if he wanted it he wouldn’t have worked out at a high school in a ####a Kinte shirt pretending to be some sort of martyr while being sponsored by Nike. A company that is probably heavily influenced by China and who has been caught using actual slave labor several times in its history. He also showed up with man boobs. Can’t believe there are people actually saying he looked like he was in good shape. No, he looked like a former jock who once upon a time worked out but now sits on the couch eating Oreos and Funyuns.
This is like watching a couple go through a bad divorce and then having one last preceding to see who gets the dog. NFL does what the NFL does which is look stupid. Same as always (example MNF on ####ty Mexico field). Kaep stirred up his long supporters but he also ended up lifting the veil so to speak to some who he once had the support of. He made me feel bad for Hue Jackson having his time wasted, I think that says it all really.
Because the guy made himself a liability to the business that employed him. Which is pretty much what would happen to most people.
irish eyes
Footballguy
The defense of this @@@@@@@ in this thread is truly comical. The very few that are should stop the embarrassment. He has no desire to play, he just wants his clown show on display for attention.
SproutDaddy
Footballguy
irish eyes
Footballguy
Yes because so much of this thread has been about football. Any thread started about him will not be about football. So they should all just be locked.
Dizzy
Footballguy
Chaka
Footballguy
Believe it or not I actually understand your position and, on some level agree with you.
What I do not understand is the anger you are projecting, perhaps you are not aware of it but that is how your posts about Kaepernick project.
So what is it about Kaepernick that makes you seem so angry? The football part or the protest part, and why?
Chaka
Footballguy
I agree that the perception was Kaepernick is a liability. I think there is a legitimate question as to whether that has changed.
I have pretty much checked out of most "News" outlets aside from NPR but you can't get away from it entirely. The Kaepernick workout didn't seem to crossover from sports websites into more national outlets. I think the vocal minority are the only ones really carrying this torch anymore.
No team was going to make him a starting QB offer and he made sure no team was going to make a veteran minimum offer. That was his plan all along.
He wanted to make sure that his little show was going to turn off teams so they didn't offer him a minimum veteran contract. Wearing the shirt he wore, moving the workout at the last minute, making the speech he did. In his warped mind, it gives him the ability to say they are still colluding when in reality he stinks and no one wants a distraction like him. He's got serious mental problems.
Even Jerry Jones sniffed it out and that will tell you how obvious it was.
Cowboys owner and general manager Jerry Jones said on “The Fan” KRLD-FM (105.3) Tuesday morning that the Colin Kaepernick workout wasn’t about football, and that it was more a circus than football, Michael Gehlken of the Dallas Morning News reports.
He wanted to make sure that his little show was going to turn off teams so they didn't offer him a minimum veteran contract. Wearing the shirt he wore, moving the workout at the last minute, making the speech he did. In his warped mind, it gives him the ability to say they are still colluding when in reality he stinks and no one wants a distraction like him. He's got serious mental problems.
Even Jerry Jones sniffed it out and that will tell you how obvious it was.
Cowboys owner and general manager Jerry Jones said on “The Fan” KRLD-FM (105.3) Tuesday morning that the Colin Kaepernick workout wasn’t about football, and that it was more a circus than football, Michael Gehlken of the Dallas Morning News reports.
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SproutDaddy
Footballguy
Only because of posts like yours. You feel the need to spit the regurgitated narrative as if people want to hear it again. Why don't you just not click on any post with his name in it.
Dizzy
Footballguy
He was away and having a life... the NFL cooked up this facade and brought him back to the stage, so there's that.
If CK threads are having such a negative impact on your life, then you should take that up with FBG... maybe get Kaep on the no-thread list.
Otherwise, CK is a football-related topic this week, (again, not of his own doing) so makes sense that there would be a thread or three on it here.
Dizzy
Footballguy
Not disagreeing with your assessment that Kaep took steps to sabotage his audition (mainly because I believe this as well), but it was the NFL's idea for the show... not Kaep's. Taking it a step further I believe the "I WANT TO PLAY FOOTBALL (but not really)" has been the long con going back to his departure from the NFL. In fact wasn't he (reportedly) very close to signing with the Ravens when his girlfriend made a comment about them being slave owners (something along those lines) and blew the whole thing up?
Three comments jumped out at me this past week...
-Steve Young on TNF, "Kaepernick's MO while still in the NFL was a guy that worked on improving things that he already was doing well, but did not apply himself to taking on the challenges of playing the QB position as a whole"
-Adam Schefter on Get Up (last week), "At least two teams asked the NFL to set this up in a neutral location as they had interest, but were fearful of having a Kaep-week of media attention at their own facility during the regular season"
-Tony Dungy on SNF, "Nobody questions the physical skills. If it were me, I would just want to sit down with him and ask if he is willing to buy 100% into what we are doing and what it would take on his part to be ready to help us win football games"
FWIW - I found Young's comments interesting because he certainly has insider knowledge of what happens in 49erville. Schefter added some speculation on how this sham came about. And Tony Dungy is just a respected voice that basically said nobody is, or has, asked Kaep if he wants to play.
So Kaepernick couldnt have said, "No thank you, I'm not interested in playing football?" if thats how he felt?
One of the things that bothers me about this discussion is the lack of agency imparted on Colin Kaepernick. As though things just keep happening to him and he couldnt possibly have made other decisions. I'm not saying he should have made different decisions, I'm saying there is a level of condescension in not letting him own his actions. He made decisions, there were consquences, fair consequences of unfair consequences, or some mix of both. I don't know that he regrets anything, and he has taken a stand on some things- I dont think its right to take that away from him as though he just got run over by a steamroller out of the blue.
Dizzy
Footballguy
As an activist (if you think he is an activist... I think he's an activist), he cannot allow himself NOT to take another moment in a fading spotlight to make himself relevant or to make a statement (hence the T-shirt). It's the life he (and others) have chosen... it's all about "the cause" and the more relevant you are, the more you can help your cause.
15 more minutes of fame is 15 more than he had yesterday. He cannot turn that opportunity down.
Ksquared
Footballguy
You are nuts if you don't think this was setup as part of the "out of court" settlement the NFL and Kap made. Look earlier in this thread and I believe his attorneys at one point were complaining that the NFL said they would provide who was attending prior to the circus .... er I mean event. This has always been orchestrated by Kap and his legal team.
Manster
Footballguy
Kaep is a backup. No NFL team is bringing that media circus of a distraction on board to get a backup QB.
I've said it before, I'll say it again, Kaep is essentially a one-trick pony, and I'm talking on the field here.....he has never had good touch on his deep throws.....I mean he's made some throws, but the sample size gets big enough, he fails as a pocket passer.......so I don't think he wants to play at all. Cuz if he plays and fails, which is pretty likely, his whole thing kind of fades away.
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Don Hutson
Footballguy
Borderline starter is probably a more accurate description. He has a strong arm, can run, and has the second lowest interception rate in NFL history. And in the 3 years since he left, the NFL has gone gaga over mobile quarterbacks who can extend plays with their legs and who can be effective with the run/pass option. Pocket passers are the opposite of what coaches want right now. We'll see if his interest in playing is genuine or not. There are 32 teams. It only takes one to want him.
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Gatorman
Supreme Elite Maximum Tier
My impression of this (and I am all for his right to express himself by kneeling) is that CK is a borderline starter with a limited skill set. See someone like Michael Crabtree with CK throwing to him vs what he was with Carr (who is a marginal starter in his own right). On top of that CK is the worst kind of activist: An activist who protests one thing, but then checks out (voting) or is dreadfully misinformed on other things, but chimes in anyway. Add that to the "Look at me!" way he conducted himself when the Ravens were going to bring him in a few years ago and what happened last weekend, and the truth is it did him no good in the perception of the NFL fan. Court of public opinion, Nike, the "woke" crowd maybe another story (and I'm a liberal)
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Manster
Footballguy
I hear what ur saying. I watched him closely in college (University of Nevada season tix) and he was awesome........as a runner.....and occasionally he'd make a big pass, but in the WAC he didn't have to pass much....they ran the crap out of the ball and it set stuff up downfield......I think he got a little better with his mechanics in the NFL, but I was never sold on his passing ability other than he has a strong arm.....I will give you he's a borderline starter, but still who wants that distraction? So far no one does. Ive been thinking someone will be desperate enough.....we'll see.
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Don Hutson
Footballguy
If he is willing to play for a small amount and be a clearcut backup, Seattle might be a good fit. Leftcoast fans wouldn't be too upset with his signing. He fits the system that is in place for Wilson. Sunshine Pete is very accommodating to his player's idiosyncrasies. But Kaep might prefer to play the martyr than accept being a backup for little money. He might make more money from Nike not playing, too.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
please Chicago. would be amazing. they deserve him in IL
seahawk 17
Footballguy
Wrigley
Footballguy
Interseptopus
Footballguy
IheartGuinness
Footballguy
wormburner
Footballguy
IheartGuinness
Footballguy
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
This quote from the writer is telling. The NFL does not want Kappy, and Kappy does not want the NFL.
"More than two years ago, I wrote that Kaepernick was finished as an NFL player. Through his actions, Kaepernick finally made it known to the NFL that the feeling is mutual."
Interseptopus
Footballguy
/thread
Manster
Footballguy
I've been saying this from the get-go......no matter how you feel about Kaep, he's making money, and keeping himself relevant in the media.......he's had his chances to get back in the game, but he's either sabotaged them, or he wasn't willing to accept what was offered......thus, the martyr narrative can keep rolling and the endorsement money keep coming in.
IheartGuinness
Footballguy
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