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Sanders Praises Fidel Castro, Daniel Ortega in 1985 (1 Viewer)

Just absurd. There is a treasure trove of old Bernie radical comments ready to resurface. The DNC is in absolute panic right now.  

 
I don't think Sanders makes any efforts to delineate democratic socialism from socialism there, he largely seems to be praising socialism per se. When you're the front runner this stuff comes out. Fwiw Trump visited the Politburo's apparatchiks in 1987 and he has praised Kim, Putin and Xi as president. He also seemed to lament the end of the USSR at one point and another time indicated that Putin's role as ex-KGB was not significant. But given that it doesn't help things at all if the opposition to that has this stuff in his back history as well.

 
He does make some good point though LOL. Regarding what it means to "support" a candidate and what it means to vote for someone else.

 
He’s an ardent Socialist with a long track record of comments supporting such.  His tone has softened only recently.  He has no chance of beating Trump with that history.  I’m a bit shocked he’s a front runner.  Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

 
This is the same guy who said the Boston Bomber should be allowed to vote last year. Those ads will be fun.

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders said he thinks every U.S. citizen, even the convicted Boston Marathon bomber Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, should be allowed to vote in American elections.

Sanders offered his stance at a CNN town hall Monday when asked whether he thought felons should be allowed to vote while they’re incarcerated, not just after their release. 

He was pressed on whether it was appropriate to enfranchise sex offenders or someone convicted of a heinous crime like Tsarnaev, who with his brother carried out the 2013 Boston Marathon bombing that left three dead and injured hundreds more.

"Yes, even for terrible people, because once you start chipping away and you say, 'Well, that guy committed a terrible crime, not going to let him vote. Well, that person did that. Not going to let that person vote,' you're running down a slippery slope," Sanders said in response to a question about restoring felons' voting rights.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2019/04/23/bernie-sanders-voting-rights-boston-marathon-bomber-buttigieg-harris/3548232002/

 
I don't think Sanders makes any efforts to delineate democratic socialism from socialism there, he largely seems to be praising socialism per se. When you're the front runner this stuff comes out. Fwiw Trump visited the Politburo's apparatchiks in 1987 and he has praised Kim, Putin and Xi as president. He also seemed to lament the end of the USSR at one point and another time indicated that Putin's role as ex-KGB was not significant. But given that it doesn't help things at all if the opposition to that has this stuff in his back history as well.
Yes, this should end him in the primary, but not in the general.

 
This is the same guy who said the Boston Bomber should be allowed to vote last year. Those ads will be fun.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2019/04/23/bernie-sanders-voting-rights-boston-marathon-bomber-buttigieg-harris/3548232002/
That’s a pretty sick way to frame the question though.  If you think the imprisoned should have the right to participate in democracy, it naturally follows that yes, even some bad guys get to vote.  Many of them are living a life of slavery in our incarceration system, the most expansive prison population in the world, a blight on our ideas of freedom & justice.  You don’t throw out the black guy who caught 40 years on a weed charge with the Boston Bomber etc.  

 
He’s an ardent Socialist with a long track record of comments supporting such.  His tone has softened only recently.  He has no chance of beating Trump with that history.  I’m a bit shocked he’s a front runner.  Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
If you took a hard look at the past 25 years of Bernie’s life and compared it to the past 25 years of Trump, who’s the better man? The difficulty for Bernie is that a political statement he made 25 years ago is going to be presented as game changing news, whereas 25 years of whoring, draft dodging, tax evasion and pissing away a fortune through terrible business decisions is almost completely ignored. 
 

 
Fwiw, I don’t think the DNC is afraid Sanders would lose the general.  I think they’re afraid he might actually win.  Who do you think their corporate donors prefer?  Sellout Trump and his never ending gifts to the corporate/warfare state or the guy that’s dedicated his entire life to pushing back?  

I’m not buying the boogeyman narrative.  That’s Glenn Beck echochamber stuff.  Sanders isn’t nearly as ‘radical’ as people like to say he is.  If he was, he would condemn US imperialism more fiercely and talk about seizing the means of production etc.  The DNC doesn’t try to primary him, he always goes along with the Party over 3rd party/independent candidates, and he occasionally supports liberal interventionism.  He’s been in the system for a long time.  He has pledged to support Joe Biden in the GE.  He’s basically a New Deal Democrat at this point.  

 
Fwiw, I don’t think the DNC is afraid Sanders would lose the general.  I think they’re afraid he might actually win.  Who do you think their corporate donors prefer?  Sellout Trump and his never ending gifts to the corporate/warfare state or the guy that’s dedicated his entire life to pushing back?  

I’m not buying the boogeyman narrative.  That’s Glenn Beck echochamber stuff.  Sanders isn’t nearly as ‘radical’ as people like to say he is.  If he was, he would condemn US imperialism more fiercely and talk about seizing the means of production etc.  The DNC doesn’t try to primary him, he always goes along with the Party over 3rd party/independent candidates, and he occasionally supports liberal interventionism.  He’s been in the system for a long time.  He has pledged to support Joe Biden in the GE.  He’s basically a New Deal Democrat at this point.  
I’m pretty much a mainstream DNC democrat, and I socialize with many folks who identify as such.  Zero of us are “scared that Sanders might win”.  That’s a false narrative.  

 
I guess we’ll see but my perception is that Sanders is as close to bulletproof as Trump is. None of this stuff will significantly diminish his support in my judgment.
You could be right. My brother is a Bernieguy though and hasn't heard of a lot of these radical Bernie quotes when I bring them up (not that he’d care anyway). My perception is the average Joe doesn’t really know either despite him being around forever. Which I’d be pretty worried about running against Trump.

 
Anyhow this stuff is amusing but it’s not disqualifying. So what if Bernie used to like left wing dictators? Trump likes all dictators regardless of ideology. Are we suddenly supposed to care about this now? 

Maybe if Bernie were running against Ronald Reagan, or Harry Truman, or John F Kennedy, or Gerald Ford, or any of the other Presidents of our past who, all the way to and including Barack Obama, no matter their faults,  had some sense of integrity and American exceptionalism. Maybe then we could look at Bernie Sanders and find him unworthy. But when you’re opposing Donald Trump, this no longer has any meaning at all. 

 
There’s no question the Democrat party machine and the institutions they represent prefer 4 more years of Trump over a Sanders presidency. Trump is not going to change anything, nor would any other Democrat who was on the stage last night. Banks, oil, wars, Wall Street - couldn’t care less about any superficial differences among Trump or Biden or Klobuchar or Buttigieg. None of these charlatans will end the wars or deliver health care, education and stability to the working poor.  I doubt Bernie could accomplish any of that either, but I think it would be his goal.  
 

 
Anyhow this stuff is amusing but it’s not disqualifying. So what if Bernie used to like left wing dictators? Trump likes all dictators regardless of ideology. Are we suddenly supposed to care about this now? 

Maybe if Bernie were running against Ronald Reagan, or Harry Truman, or John F Kennedy, or Gerald Ford, or any of the other Presidents of our past who, all the way to and including Barack Obama, no matter their faults,  had some sense of integrity and American exceptionalism. Maybe then we could look at Bernie Sanders and find him unworthy. But when you’re opposing Donald Trump, this no longer has any meaning at all. 
Lol at the idea Reagan had integrity.  

 
That’s a pretty sick way to frame the question though.  If you think the imprisoned should have the right to participate in democracy, it naturally follows that yes, even some bad guys get to vote.  Many of them are living a life of slavery in our incarceration system, the most expansive prison population in the world, a blight on our ideas of freedom & justice.  You don’t throw out the black guy who caught 40 years on a weed charge with the Boston Bomber etc.  
I don’t disagree, but it’s a pretty stupid way of answering a question also. At least spend 10 seconds describing what a monster the Boston Bomber is before you say he should have voting rights.

 
I’m pretty much a mainstream DNC democrat, and I socialize with many folks who identify as such.  Zero of us are “scared that Sanders might win”.  That’s a false narrative.  
Ok, that’s great.  I don’t consider mainstream Democrats to be the DNC.  The DNC got blindsided by Trump.  The narrative up until just like 2 weeks ago was that Biden could go on cruise control, get his black ‘firewall’ in SC, and then be the most ‘electable’ Democrat to ‘beat Trump.’  

Lo and behold, Biden got absolutely crushed in Iowa.  He’s already conceded NH will be an L for him.  His turnout at the caucuses was pathetic.  All the stuff we’ve been saying about him being a bad candidate that is out of touch was correct.  It turns out you have to actually excite a base.  

Sanders has set historic records for small dollar donations, in every single state in the country except for the home state of a few other candidates, and people want to act like he is doomed out the gate.  He won the popular vote, he’s polling well, he’s raking in cash from a massive base.  

I just don’t think other candidates, least of all the DNC, really recognize the antiestablishment sentiment and historic inequality between the poor and the rich right now.  People won’t care about ‘beating Trump’ with a slightly different status quo, they want real systemic change.  I think the DNC and its corporate grifter network is absolutely horrified by that.  

 
If you took a hard look at the past 25 years of Bernie’s life and compared it to the past 25 years of Trump, who’s the better man? The difficulty for Bernie is that a political statement he made 25 years ago is going to be presented as game changing news, whereas 25 years of whoring, draft dodging, tax evasion and pissing away a fortune through terrible business decisions is almost completely ignored. 
 
Bernie.  I’m not sure what your point is though.

 
That’s a pretty sick way to frame the question though.  If you think the imprisoned should have the right to participate in democracy, it naturally follows that yes, even some bad guys get to vote.  Many of them are living a life of slavery in our incarceration system, the most expansive prison population in the world, a blight on our ideas of freedom & justice.  You don’t throw out the black guy who caught 40 years on a weed charge with the Boston Bomber etc.  
The Boston Bomber is an extreme example, but "black guy who caught 40 years on a weed charge" is an equally terrible characterization of the typical convict.  Here's a report on the prison population from 2017, which seems to be the most recent year available.  Table 12 breaks down the offenses committed by folks in state prisons, which represents the overwhelming majority of prisoners.  Table 14 does the same for federal prisons.

At the state level, most offenders (55%) are locked up for violent crimes.  Another 17.5% were convicted of serious property crimes, like burglary.  Drug possession only accounted for 3.5% of state prisoners.  Drug offenses make up a good share of the federal prison population (47%), but that's almost all trafficking, not possession.  I'm all for drug legalization, but most people who engage drug trafficking aren't the best people in the world, and I'd prefer that they not be allowed to vote.  I'm definitely happy with murderers and rapists not voting.   

 
Ok, that’s great.  I don’t consider mainstream Democrats to be the DNC.  The DNC got blindsided by Trump.  The narrative up until just like 2 weeks ago was that Biden could go on cruise control, get his black ‘firewall’ in SC, and then be the most ‘electable’ Democrat to ‘beat Trump.’  

Lo and behold, Biden got absolutely crushed in Iowa.  He’s already conceded NH will be an L for him.  His turnout at the caucuses was pathetic.  All the stuff we’ve been saying about him being a bad candidate that is out of touch was correct.  It turns out you have to actually excite a base.  

Sanders has set historic records for small dollar donations, in every single state in the country except for the home state of a few other candidates, and people want to act like he is doomed out the gate.  He won the popular vote, he’s polling well, he’s raking in cash from a massive base.  

I just don’t think other candidates, least of all the DNC, really recognize the antiestablishment sentiment and historic inequality between the poor and the rich right now.  People won’t care about ‘beating Trump’ with a slightly different status quo, they want real systemic change.  I think the DNC and its corporate grifter network is absolutely horrified by that.  
I agree with all of the above.  Very well stated.

 
The Boston Bomber is an extreme example, but "black guy who caught 40 years on a weed charge" is an equally terrible characterization of the typical convict.  Here's a report on the prison population from 2017, which seems to be the most recent year available.  Table 12 breaks down the offenses committed by folks in state prisons, which represents the overwhelming majority of prisoners.  Table 14 does the same for federal prisons.

At the state level, most offenders (55%) are locked up for violent crimes.  Another 17.5% were convicted of serious property crimes, like burglary.  Drug possession only accounted for 3.5% of state prisoners.  Drug offenses make up a good share of the federal prison population (47%), but that's almost all trafficking, not possession.  I'm all for drug legalization, but most people who engage drug trafficking aren't the best people in the world, and I'd prefer that they not be allowed to vote.  I'm definitely happy with murderers and rapists not voting.   
But how many violent crimes were related to the drug trade?  We used to have gang wars and killing sprees over alcohol too.  Then Prohibition ended and the violence went away.  

There are still black men in prison for crimes/misdemeanors that should have been forgiven a long time ago.  Some of them were put to death despite evidence that exonerated them.  It’s not descriptive of every prisoner but it’s enough of them.  

 
Ok, that’s great.  I don’t consider mainstream Democrats to be the DNC.  The DNC got blindsided by Trump.  The narrative up until just like 2 weeks ago was that Biden could go on cruise control, get his black ‘firewall’ in SC, and then be the most ‘electable’ Democrat to ‘beat Trump.’  

Lo and behold, Biden got absolutely crushed in Iowa.  He’s already conceded NH will be an L for him.  His turnout at the caucuses was pathetic.  All the stuff we’ve been saying about him being a bad candidate that is out of touch was correct.  It turns out you have to actually excite a base.  

Sanders has set historic records for small dollar donations, in every single state in the country except for the home state of a few other candidates, and people want to act like he is doomed out the gate.  He won the popular vote, he’s polling well, he’s raking in cash from a massive base.  

I just don’t think other candidates, least of all the DNC, really recognize the antiestablishment sentiment and historic inequality between the poor and the rich right now.  People won’t care about ‘beating Trump’ with a slightly different status quo, they want real systemic change.  I think the DNC and its corporate grifter network is absolutely horrified by that.  
Conspiracy theory stuff here folks.  Again, I run in mainstream Democratic circles and spend a LOT of time dealing with corporate politics.  Not a single Democrat has ever suggested they don’t want Bernie to win the nomination because he “might win”.  Conversely, every single Dem is focused #1 on beating Trump, regardless of who the nominee is.  Do many prefer other Democratic nominees?  Absolutley!  As do i, for reasons that having nothing to do from fearing a Bernie Presidency.  

You are simply reiterating Bernie-bro talking points and passing along fake conspiracy theories.  

 
The point is that Trump is so obviously terrible that his opponent's flaws don't really matter.  

It's like 2016 didn't happen.
You make a good point, though I’m not sure what the solution is, since we know any candidate Democrats nominate will be tarred and feathered by FoxNews.  

 
You make a good point, though I’m not sure what the solution is, since we know any candidate Democrats nominate will be tarred and feathered by FoxNews. 
As would any Republican running in any other election by the MSM. What's your point?

 
But how many violent crimes were related to the drug trade?  We used to have gang wars and killing sprees over alcohol too.  Then Prohibition ended and the violence went away.  
Probably quite a few, and I agree that this is a good argument for legalizing drugs.  But it's a poor argument for giving murderers the right to vote.  The fact that they killed people in the course of running their drug operation isn't really an exonerating factor.

 
Conspiracy theory stuff here folks.  Again, I run in mainstream Democratic circles and spend a LOT of time dealing with corporate politics.  Not a single Democrat has ever suggested they don’t want Bernie to win the nomination because he “might win”.  Conversely, every single Dem is focused #1 on beating Trump, regardless of who the nominee is.  Do many prefer other Democratic nominees?  Absolutley!  As do i, for reasons that having nothing to do from fearing a Bernie Presidency.  

You are simply reiterating Bernie-bro talking points and passing along fake conspiracy theories.  
The NYT reported that Dem leadership like Pelosi & Schumer, CAP thinktank hacks like Neera Tanden, and mayor rat himself have been meeting with “longtime party financier Bernard Schwartz” re: “What To Do About Bernie”.  

https://i.imgur.com/xYrRPj5.jpg

Why did they do that?  What conceivable problem could Nancy Pelosi have with a presidential candidate that she would need to meet with donors about it?  Why do you think that is TGUNZ?  Is it a conspiracy theory that I just made up?  Or does the corporate sponsorship of the DNC see a left populist rising in their neoliberal party and have a problem with it?

 
Probably quite a few, and I agree that this is a good argument for legalizing drugs.  But it's a poor argument for giving murderers the right to vote.  The fact that they killed people in the course of running their drug operation isn't really an exonerating factor.
Fair enough.  But I don’t think their crimes justify the use of prisoners as slave labor.  You probably find that language extreme but to me it is modern slavery.  It’s codified right there in the 13th amendment.  To the extent that still exists in our country they should have every right to contest it with what little representation they have left.  

 
As would any Republican running in any other election by the MSM. What's your point?
perhaps the lesson from 2016 isn’t to avoid candidates with baggage?   i don’t profess to know the answer.  

One thing that should have died in 2016 was Rush’s MSM narrative.  They destroyed Hillary, yet you’re still pushing it? 

 
There seems to be evidence that the DNC is actively hostile to Bernie's campaign. I think ren is right in this respect.

 
perhaps the lesson from 2016 isn’t to avoid candidates with baggage?   i don’t profess to know the answer.  

One thing that should have died in 2016 was Rush’s MSM narrative.  They destroyed Hillary, yet you’re still pushing it? 
I'm not pushing it; to most people it's as obvious as the sun. Even Democrats understand the MSM is almost actively in their favor. But I confess, Hillary might be the exception to the general rule, but let's not make it the exception that swallows it.

 
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Bernie is far from my first choice that the Dems have to offer and I go back and forth if I think he has a chance against Trump if he were to get the nom.

He has the most fervent followers now of any Dem. He doesn’t take #### about his stances which appeals to people. Populism seems to work if you can talk the talk. 

If he wins the nom he’s the guy to get behind. I’ll be comfortable knowing he won’t get anything radical done if he’s in charge, he’s on the right side of enough issues, he’ll replace RBG with a liberal pick, most importantly we’d get rid of Trump. 

 
I wonder if Sanders hooked up with old VT pal Bill Lee of the Red Sox while he barnstormed Cuba. Sounds like an interesting meeting of the common hive mind. 

 
The point is that Trump is so obviously terrible that his opponent's flaws don't really matter.  

It's like 2016 didn't happen.
Bernie was quite a bit larger favorite in head to head polls versus Trump than Hillary was right up to the end IIRC.

He’s got his people. 

 

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