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Got a promotion and making less money! (1 Viewer)

shadyridr

Footballguy
Am I right to be annoyed by how this all played out?

September 2019- my manager (a VP) gets laid off. I was ecstatic as he was a horrible micro-manager and his manager (Big Boss) knew my feelings on the matter.

October 2019- A director on another team leaves. His manager (a VP) asks me if I am interested in the role. Says he thinks it would be a perfect fit for me. I agree and am very excited about the new opportunity. I speak to Big Boss and ask him if this is a promotion (with job grade & pay increase) and he says for now its considered lateral promotion but as long as I prove capable in due time I will get true promotion. I am ok with this. New role has me managing team of people for first time + more responsibilities.

November 2019- Annual review time. Since my old manager was laid off and new manager only managed me for one month, Big Boss gives me final rating.

December 2019- I complete a project with a 12/31 deadline that I jumped in for that the old director was doing. Save my new manager's bacon. Hes very happy!

February 2020- I get final rating. I am rated an Effective Contributor. The year before I was rated as Highly Effective. Pretty pissed. New manager said he wasn't responsible for rating and basically disagrees with it and I was basically lost in the shuffle with all the changes. I ask to speak to Big Boss. I say to Big Boss how I don't understand how I got a lateral promotion with more responsibilities yet in the same breath they say I did worse work last year than the year before. Big Boss basically gives me some dumb reason and says he thinks I am doing a great job and have tons of potential. Also, says no promises, but he is working on getting me the real promotion. Im not holding my breath.

So due to lower job rating than the year before and no increase in salary, I will officially make LESS money this year than last year AFTER a promotion. I've been pissed about this ever since.

 
sorry to hear it brohan i have nothing to offer as you are way over my pay grade but i hope it works out and that you can work through it take that to the bank 

 
:goodposting: Time to start looking. You'll be doing more work without the proper compensation, no thanks.
Bigger issue is that Big Boss isn't competent enough to look at previous year's rating and this year's and reconcile the difference knowing that he is getting paid less.  So unless there were any actual issues, he clearly doesn't know how to run the business and handle his employees properly.  If there was an error or things got lost in the shuffle, then so be it, that happens.  But that should have been an instant fix.  Add in vague reasons and "no promises" and I'd be looking elsewhere ASAP.

 
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Bigger issue is that Big Boss isn't competent enough to look at previous year's rating and this year's and reconcile the difference knowing that he is getting paid less.  So unless there were any actual issues, he clearly doesn't know how to run the business and handle his employees properly.  If there was an error or things got lost in the shuffle, then so be it, that happens.  But that should have been an instant fix.  Add in vague reasons and "no promises" and I'd be looking elsewhere ASAP.
Big boss knew exactly what he was doing, saving money. Knowing that by giving him that rating = no raise allows him to not pay what shady's worth and not promote him.

 
Also to throw a monkey wrench into this thread even further

Big Boss got a promotion and is leaving our team next month. He told me before he leaves he is trying to get me the real promotion. New Big Boss is internal transfer. 

 
I've seen far too many people jump fast over a perceived slight and live to regret it. I'd strongly recommend you take a little time to think about this, consider your options, and see how to proceed. Give yourself some time to cool off a bit. Then sit down with a notebook and a make a some notes - basically layout what you expect/want to happen and why you deserve what you are asking for. Then have a reasoned conversation with those with the ability to make a decision on it. See if you can come to a mutual understanding. Then decide if you can live with those decisions (good, bad, indifferent). Finally decide what course to take in your career path. 

No one here is really in a position to judge a lot of the stuff you need to judge for yourself in this case, IMO - i.e. not nearly enough info to give you definitive advice.

 
Basically im giving Big Boss next month to make things right and if not I will talk to new Big Boss. If still not satisfied I will look elsewhere. 

I do love it here and I am a superstar. For whatever reason I got screwed this year though. 

 
Basically im giving Big Boss next month to make things right and if not I will talk to new Big Boss. If still not satisfied I will look elsewhere. 

I do love it here and I am a superstar. For whatever reason I got screwed this year though. 
So you love it there but are willing to leave because you feel like you got slighted?

So now you get to go somewhere else you might hate and probably get a raw deal there also? 

 
Basically im giving Big Boss next month to make things right and if not I will talk to new Big Boss. If still not satisfied I will look elsewhere. 

I do love it here and I am a superstar. For whatever reason I got screwed this year though. 
Sitting and waiting for someone to "make things right" without having a sensible conversation with them on what that means to you is a recipe for disappointment. Going in guns blazing about things not being right is also likely a bad idea but without having a real conversation about you not being happy and why is a perfectly reasonable course, imo. 

 
So you love it there but are willing to leave because you feel like you got slighted?

So now you get to go somewhere else you might hate and probably get a raw deal there also? 
This. If you like it as much as you say, working to salvage that is probably a good idea. But you have to try as best as possible to remove the emotion from the discussion. 

 
Sitting and waiting for someone to "make things right" without having a sensible conversation with them on what that means to you is a recipe for disappointment. Going in guns blazing about things not being right is also likely a bad idea but without having a real conversation about you not being happy and why is a perfectly reasonable course, imo. 
They have had those conversations based on what Shady posted. Talked about him taking over the role, see how it goes then promotion. After the middling review they talked about it again, even though new boss says he felt the review was not accurate.

Sounds like they have talked multiple times and even though the big boss thought he was doing a great job still gave him a meh review.

 
Basically im giving Big Boss next month to make things right and if not I will talk to new Big Boss. If still not satisfied I will look elsewhere. 

I do love it here and I am a superstar. For whatever reason I got screwed this year though. 
Start looking now.  You have been "trying out" for this job for over 3 months.  There is only so many answers to why this is happening. 

1.  The company can't afford the position any more. 

2.  The company thinks they got a bargain in an employee who doesn't know his value and is pocketing the money--taking advantage of the situation.  They are operating under the rubber band theory -- treat the employee like a rubber band.  Keep stretching it until it breaks, and then go get another rubber band.

3.  The boss is an idiot, and without being hit by a bolt of lightning, will continue to be an idiot. 

4.  They decided you are not the guy they need. 

5.  You are overestimating your value and importance to the company (at least in the boss' eyes).

IF you decide to stay, and if they decide you are the guy, I would ask for a bonus or back pay for the job you have been doing for the past three plus months.  

 
So you love it there but are willing to leave because you feel like you got slighted?

So now you get to go somewhere else you might hate and probably get a raw deal there also? 
How is doing the work of a mgmt role without the title or pay mean he feels slighted? He was given a path and by all accounts leadership has said he's doing a great job but reviews him in the average range so he doesn't get the promotion. That's not being slighted IMO.

 
So you love it there but are willing to leave because you feel like you got slighted?

So now you get to go somewhere else you might hate and probably get a raw deal there also? 
He didn't get "slighted" or "feel like he got slighted".  He got a pay cut for more work.  And after asking about it, nothing was done to fix it.  That's a huge red flag.

 
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Basically im giving Big Boss next month to make things right and if not I will talk to new Big Boss. If still not satisfied I will look elsewhere. 

I do love it here and I am a superstar. For whatever reason I got screwed this year though. 
This is important.  Grass isn't always greener.  Would you be happier in a job you liked less for more money?  I would work for 2/3rd my salary if I did something I enjoyed.

 
I've seen far too many people jump fast over a perceived slight and live to regret it. I'd strongly recommend you take a little time to think about this, consider your options, and see how to proceed. Give yourself some time to cool off a bit. Then sit down with a notebook and a make a some notes - basically layout what you expect/want to happen and why you deserve what you are asking for. Then have a reasoned conversation with those with the ability to make a decision on it. See if you can come to a mutual understanding. Then decide if you can live with those decisions (good, bad, indifferent). Finally decide what course to take in your career path. 

No one here is really in a position to judge a lot of the stuff you need to judge for yourself in this case, IMO - i.e. not nearly enough info to give you definitive advice.
Again, this isn't a "perceived slight".  They are paying him less money.  They lowered his salary.  All while asking him to do more work.

It's one thing if they explained to him he'd be taking a pay cut for this new role with the expectation it might go up. Or he voluntarily took a pay cut because he likes the new role better and it's worth it to him.  It's another thing to give him a review that lowers his pay AFTER giving him a new role with increased work without letting him know about it and then no promise of fixing it after asking why it happened.  Reeks of incompetence.

So, unless there's more to this story we don't know (i.e. why he got reviewed lower), then there's not much here to misinterpret.

 
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He didn't get "slighted" or "feel like he got slighted".  He got a pay cut for more work.
This part I don't understand.  Where was his pay cut?  I don't see how no raise = pay cut.  Is OP still making $X?

Also - How can someone coming into the job for 1 month be rated as Highly Effective (new gig in Oct; annual review in Nov)?  

I agree it looks like he's being strung along on the actual promotion and pay raise piece of this, but the 2 points above seem off to me.

 
Basically im giving Big Boss next month to make things right and if not I will talk to new Big Boss. If still not satisfied I will look elsewhere. 

I do love it here and I am a superstar. For whatever reason I got screwed this year though. 
You're not doing it right.  Need to work less and kiss a** more.  That's how you get a real promotion.

 
He didn't get "slighted" or "feel like he got slighted".  He got a pay cut for more work.  And after asking about it, nothing was done to fix it.  That's a huge red flag.
I agree with all of this for sure.

However, I think we also need to keep in mind that we are only hearing Shady's side of the story.  Maybe he didn't deserve the raise or promotion in the first place :oldunsure:

Honestly though, there are a ton of other factors that are in play right now that need be considered.  A number of his superiors have moved on, and it's tough for someone to evaluate a new person after one month's time.  And now it seems the new boss is even moving on.

What OP should probably do is detail everything in his eyes (accomplishments, i.e. project he finished, number of direct reports now under him, etc....) and approach his new boss ASAP with what he sees as his perceive slight and ask what is in play here that he should be looking out for the company to correct this issue.  It's very possible that the compensation aspect was out of the new bosses hands earlier.  And any talk about 'we'll make this right soon' is worth the paper that its written on.  So I'd want things documented so I had at the very least a timeline as to what to expect.  If promises are not kept, well that is good enough for me to see what is really going on.

 
He didn't get "slighted" or "feel like he got slighted".  He got a pay cut for more work.
This part I don't understand.  Where was his pay cut?  I don't see how no raise = pay cut.  Is OP still making $X?

Also - How can someone coming into the job for 1 month be rated as Highly Effective (new gig in Oct; annual review in Nov)?  

I agree it looks like he's being strung along on the actual promotion and pay raise piece of this, but the 2 points above seem off to me.
Yeah, I'm wondering this, too. Is it just that "effectively" you're getting paid less, because you're doing more work (or working more hours?) for the same pay?

 
This part I don't understand.  Where was his pay cut?  I don't see how no raise = pay cut.  Is OP still making $X?

Also - How can someone coming into the job for 1 month be rated as Highly Effective (new gig in Oct; annual review in Nov)?  

I agree it looks like he's being strung along on the actual promotion and pay raise piece of this, but the 2 points above seem off to me.
In the OP, he says he's making less money this year than last year because of the new review.  It's also the title of the thread.  So unless I'm misunderstanding it, he's taking home less money this year than last year.  I thought that was the whole point of including the new rating.  His salary is based on that and it went down.

If it's the same salary, then that's a different story.  Still needs to be addressed, but that's a different situation altogether.  He was told from the outset it was lateral and they'd work on the real promotion.  That's when it becomes a matter of evaluating how long you're willing to wait for a potential promotion and if the new job is worth it for the same salary.

If that's the case, then I would revise all of my responses.  I based my initial responses to him taking home less pay.

 
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I've seen far too many people jump fast over a perceived slight and live to regret it. I'd strongly recommend you take a little time to think about this, consider your options, and see how to proceed. Give yourself some time to cool off a bit. Then sit down with a notebook and a make a some notes - basically layout what you expect/want to happen and why you deserve what you are asking for. Then have a reasoned conversation with those with the ability to make a decision on it. See if you can come to a mutual understanding. Then decide if you can live with those decisions (good, bad, indifferent). Finally decide what course to take in your career path. 

No one here is really in a position to judge a lot of the stuff you need to judge for yourself in this case, IMO - i.e. not nearly enough info to give you definitive advice.
OTOH most every move (read: all but one that turned out to be lateral) I've made after it has become clear I've "capped out" has netted me a better job making more.

 
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This part I don't understand.  Where was his pay cut?  I don't see how no raise = pay cut.  Is OP still making $X?

Also - How can someone coming into the job for 1 month be rated as Highly Effective (new gig in Oct; annual review in Nov)?  

I agree it looks like he's being strung along on the actual promotion and pay raise piece of this, but the 2 points above seem off to me.
OP had salary of X in old job, plus got a great rating so let's say a 5% bonus/merit add-on.  

Now OP has same salary of X, but is in a higher role, doing more work, managing people, etc. and got lower rating, so let's say ony 3% bonus/merit add-on.   Making less money now, same salary, more responsibility.  

October 2019- I speak to Big Boss and ask him if this is a promotion (with job grade & pay increase) and he says for now its considered lateral promotion but as long as I prove capable in due time I will get true promotion. I am ok with this. New role has me managing team of people for first time + more responsibilities.
This is where you messed up.  Sounds like they basically made you acting director, as a quick way to fill a spot without having to go through the hiring rigamarole.  Instead of posting the position, interviewing, hiring, etc. they just said "we'll stick @shadyridr in the spot and bypass all that mess, and after a while if he's doing a good job we'll give him a bump."  Would have loved to see you pin him down, get something in writing:  If X goal is met by Y date, then you get the promotion.   "In due time" is as vague as it gets.  

 
So you love it there but are willing to leave because you feel like you got slighted?

So now you get to go somewhere else you might hate and probably get a raw deal there also? 
Im not willing to leave yet. I'd like to give them an opportunity to make things right. And will have further discussions down the road to do so.

Sitting and waiting for someone to "make things right" without having a sensible conversation with them on what that means to you is a recipe for disappointment. Going in guns blazing about things not being right is also likely a bad idea but without having a real conversation about you not being happy and why is a perfectly reasonable course, imo. 
We've had these discussions. I am not being fully detailed in my posts though as I don't want to make it too wordy.

 
They have had those conversations based on what Shady posted. Talked about him taking over the role, see how it goes then promotion. After the middling review they talked about it again, even though new boss says he felt the review was not accurate.

Sounds like they have talked multiple times and even though the big boss thought he was doing a great job still gave him a meh review.
Exactly. Bog Boss told me he thought I did a better job this past year than prior year. And I said, I wish that was reflected in the rating. I have been completely open and honest about my disapproval of my rating and how it makes no sense that I am getting paid less after a promotion. My new boss even seemed ashamed to hand me my comp statement and promised he will fight for me more next year.

 
This part I don't understand.  Where was his pay cut?  I don't see how no raise = pay cut.  Is OP still making $X?

Also - How can someone coming into the job for 1 month be rated as Highly Effective (new gig in Oct; annual review in Nov)?  

I agree it looks like he's being strung along on the actual promotion and pay raise piece of this, but the 2 points above seem off to me.
New gig in October but rating was for entire year. Since my job grade didn't go up rating should be reflective of current job grade.

 
They have had those conversations based on what Shady posted. Talked about him taking over the role, see how it goes then promotion. After the middling review they talked about it again, even though new boss says he felt the review was not accurate.

Sounds like they have talked multiple times and even though the big boss thought he was doing a great job still gave him a meh review.
Big Boss is about to be gone.  So he should leave a job because of something someone did who doesnt even work there any more?

 
Again, this isn't a "perceived slight".  They are paying him less money.  They lowered his salary.  All while asking him to do more work.

It's one thing if they explained to him he'd be taking a pay cut for this new role with the expectation it might go up. Or he voluntarily took a pay cut because he likes the new role better and it's worth it to him.  It's another thing to give him a review that lowers his pay AFTER giving him a new role with increased work without letting him know about it and then no promise of fixing it after asking why it happened.  Reeks of incompetence.

So, unless there's more to this story we don't know (i.e. why he got reviewed lower), then there's not much here to misinterpret.
They didn't lower my salary. Same salary, 20% lower bonus mostly based on lower job rating than the year before.

 
How is doing the work of a mgmt role without the title or pay mean he feels slighted? He was given a path and by all accounts leadership has said he's doing a great job but reviews him in the average range so he doesn't get the promotion. That's not being slighted IMO.
Again, those people are about be gone.  

 
That’s a really short timeframe with a lot of movement.  I think it’s likely you got caught in the shuffle and it wasn’t a personal decision.

 
That’s a really short timeframe with a lot of movement.  I think it’s likely you got caught in the shuffle and it wasn’t a personal decision.
I'd agree if there wasn't contradictions between the written review and the verbal review from the big boss.

 
OP had salary of X in old job, plus got a great rating so let's say a 5% bonus/merit add-on.  

Now OP has same salary of X, but is in a higher role, doing more work, managing people, etc. and got lower rating, so let's say ony 3% bonus/merit add-on.   Making less money now, same salary, more responsibility.  

This is where you messed up.  Sounds like they basically made you acting director, as a quick way to fill a spot without having to go through the hiring rigamarole.  Instead of posting the position, interviewing, hiring, etc. they just said "we'll stick @shadyridr in the spot and bypass all that mess, and after a while if he's doing a good job we'll give him a bump."  Would have loved to see you pin him down, get something in writing:  If X goal is met by Y date, then you get the promotion.   "In due time" is as vague as it gets.  
For the bolded, that is exactly what happened

As for your second part, that's exactly what happened. The person I replaced was higher grade than me. Lesson learned on my part o get #### in writing.

 
He didn't get "slighted" or "feel like he got slighted".  He got a pay cut for more work.  And after asking about it, nothing was done to fix it.  That's a huge red flag.
Technically he didn't get a pay cut. He just didn't get the raise he thought he should/would have if he didn't change jobs.

 
Again, this isn't a "perceived slight".  They are paying him less money.  They lowered his salary.  All while asking him to do more work.

It's one thing if they explained to him he'd be taking a pay cut for this new role with the expectation it might go up. Or he voluntarily took a pay cut because he likes the new role better and it's worth it to him.  It's another thing to give him a review that lowers his pay AFTER giving him a new role with increased work without letting him know about it and then no promise of fixing it after asking why it happened.  Reeks of incompetence.

So, unless there's more to this story we don't know (i.e. why he got reviewed lower), then there's not much here to misinterpret.
Again, he didn't actually get a pay cut. 

 
Exact words my new manager used.
My guess is this is the case.

You have two people above you moving out/up.  They take precedence over you and your promotion.  

Your review and rating got glossed over since your direct boss was no longer there and he is the person that can appropriately evaluate you.  The big boss likely doesn't have the day-to-day information to rate you appropriately --- but he knew you were a good employee and gave you a positive review.  Giving you an "excellent" review or anything lower than what he did was more likely to cause more commotion than what he was willing to accept (especially since he may have known about his own promotion), so he went "good".  This neither hurts nor helps you, it keeps you status quo.

The big boss saying he will try to promote you officially, may be sincere.  However, with all of the other things that I am sure he is dealing with with his move, you very well may get put on the back burner (after all, you got a promotion, you should be happy, right?). 

I am with the crowd that says give it a bit more time, especially if you love it there.  You need to be a squeaky wheel with the big boss right now, because once someone new comes in, they won't be inclined to raise salaries or make promotions until they have had ample time to evaluate everyone's performance.  You need to get locked in to the new position and  the corresponding pay scale -- the only issue may be they may handcuff the big boss' ability to do that knowing he is on his way out.  He may need to pull some strings, but you need to stay on him.  And really, what does he care if the team's overall payroll goes up if he is moving elsewhere, its just a matter of the inconvenience to him of pushing it through.

 
Im not willing to leave yet. I'd like to give them an opportunity to make things right. And will have further discussions down the road to do so.

We've had these discussions. I am not being fully detailed in my posts though as I don't want to make it too wordy.
:thumbup:

Sounds like you have your head on your shoulders and are proceeding in a logical manner. This is a great place to vent, IMO. Put the emotion here and keep it out of the negotiations there. Pretty much can just wish you luck in the process and hope that you can find some peace in the matter - either getting what you feel is a fair deal or moving on as necessary. I won't even pretend to be able to tell you which is the proper move - every situation is different, IMO. I've done both over the years - worked out differences and parted ways when it was time.

 
Again, he didn't actually get a pay cut. 
I was expecting a check. Instead I got enrolled in a jelly club. Seventeen years with the company. I've gotten a bonus every year but this one. You don't wanna give bonuses, fine! But when people count on them as part of their salary......well, what you did just plain--

- Sucks.

Thank you, Russ.

 
His salary stays the same.  That's fine.

At best, he should have gotten a higher bonus to compensate for the increased work he's doing.  He didn't get that.

At worst, he should have gotten the same bonus because, well, that's what he earned the year before and his performance hasn't declined (at least per Shadyridr, which makes sense if they gave him a new role).  He didn't get that either.

Instead, they lowered his bonus based on the review so they are paying him less money this year than last.  That's ridiculous unless there's something Shady isn't telling us about his work performance that merits that.  Highly unlikely given his "promotion".

 
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My guess is this is the case.

You have two people above you moving out/up.  They take precedence over you and your promotion.  

Your review and rating got glossed over since your direct boss was no longer there and he is the person that can appropriately evaluate you.  The big boss likely doesn't have the day-to-day information to rate you appropriately --- but he knew you were a good employee and gave you a positive review.  Giving you an "excellent" review or anything lower than what he did was more likely to cause more commotion than what he was willing to accept (especially since he may have known about his own promotion), so he went "good".  This neither hurts nor helps you, it keeps you status quo.

The big boss saying he will try to promote you officially, may be sincere.  However, with all of the other things that I am sure he is dealing with with his move, you very well may get put on the back burner (after all, you got a promotion, you should be happy, right?). 

I am with the crowd that says give it a bit more time, especially if you love it there.  You need to be a squeaky wheel with the big boss right now, because once someone new comes in, they won't be inclined to raise salaries or make promotions until they have had ample time to evaluate everyone's performance.  You need to get locked in to the new position and  the corresponding pay scale -- the only issue may be they may handcuff the big boss' ability to do that knowing he is on his way out.  He may need to pull some strings, but you need to stay on him.  And really, what does he care if the team's overall payroll goes up if he is moving elsewhere, its just a matter of the inconvenience to him of pushing it through.
:no:

It DOES hurt him.  He's getting a 20% lower bonus than the previous year.

 
nothing to add, sorry, but reading this makes me so glad I left corporate office life....big boss...little boss..lateral moves...somewhat maybe efficient ratings....Fudge that noise. And companies wonder why corporations are less efficient, too much time and effort jerking around with internal policy and ranking that in the end just piss employees off and less time doing actual work. 

 

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