The General
Footballguy
What gives you this idea? When ever has he ever shown an ounce of humility? He thinks he’s amazing.RnR said:
This is the problem.
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Government Response To The Coronavirus (8 Viewers)
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This is the problem.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Mr Anonymous said:
Mr Anonymous said:
Get outta here with this nonsense. If Trump told everyone to drink more water, are you also blaming him for the death of someone who drinks hydrogen peroxide because it's got water+ in it?
The wife of an Arizona man who died after ingesting chloroquine phosphate to protect himself from the coronavirus warned the public on Monday not to "believe anything that the president says" and rely on doctors instead.
"We saw Trump on TV — every channel — and all of his buddies and that this was safe," the woman, who is in critical care after taking the drug with her husband, told NBC News' Vaughn Hillyard. "Trump kept saying it was basically pretty much a cure."
https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-kept-saying-basically-pretty-013927321.html
This is what Team Belief begets us. And even worse with Trump as Potus.
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
I look at this thread and I don't see a way out of what is coming our way. Some of you are so entrenched in your hatred of Trump, you are happy when he has a misstep and looking to score a point for "your side" Guess what--there are going to 25k+ voters composted of each political party wishing to vote that day, but they can't because they are gone. This virus doesn't give a hoot who you are and how you vote.
After 9-11 we gathered together and found common ground. Why not now? You can hate Trump. but so many of you are taking an [ll-informed stance. You are not winning anything at this point.
After 9-11 we gathered together and found common ground. Why not now? You can hate Trump. but so many of you are taking an [ll-informed stance. You are not winning anything at this point.
timschochet
Footballguy
I think you’re seriously wrong to believe that people are happy about Trump’s missteps regarding this virus.
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
Tim--go to CNN and count the number of "gotcha" articles there. The press conference questions asked after each session further bolster my point. We have a media that cares about scoring points for their "side" vs. just helping us. We have journalists who want to be "the news" vs reporting the news.
I just want numbers--I want facts--I don't need a slant.
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BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
I agree totally. I responded in the FFA--thank you very much.... I am truly scared for my wife and girls.
Punxsutawney Phil
Footballguy
What do you think about hotels getting bailouts? Anything in the tourism industry is getting absolutely slaughtered right now, but if we bail out the hotel industry Trump is likely to be a recipient. The optics of that look terrible. Then again, I don't think we can ignore the massive hit they have taken.Zigg said:
Punxsutawney Phil
Footballguy
Did they take it the way they are supposed to under Dr. supervision? I thought I heard of people being cured by this? I did hear about some people in Nigeria dying from it as well. Maybe they took too much?
***ETA***
Sorry for the Daily Mail link,
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8144449/Man-dies-wife-critical-care-took-fish-tank-cleaner-cure-coronavirus.html
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Coach Morris Buttermaker
Footballguy
When did Trump say fish tank cleaner was safe and a cure?????? Outrageous the way the media is spinning this. They hate Trump, they want the economy to tank. They want chaos.
In fact a few media outlets were the ones saying this fish tank cleaner had chloroquine in it. They should be held responsible for this.
Capella
Footballguy
It’s not gotcha articles and we aren’t happy he failed. Thousands will die because of his arrogance. That needs to be reported. He’s not getting another pass.
That one guy
Footballguy
msommer
Footballguy
Skoo
Footballguy
Godsbrother
Footballguy
You are right but if you're watching CNN you kind of know what you're getting, just like Fox. I've been watching ABC news and I think they've been pretty good. I don't think it is a gotcha to point out the difficulties in getting masks, ventilators, tests, etc. That stuff is happening and I don't think it is a low blow to point out that we still have shortages months after the initial outbreak.
The Commish
Footballguy
Then stop going to our mainstream media. That's an incredibly easy thing to do. Go to reuters or BBC or even The AP and/or NPR. All those places will give you what you're asking for.
The Commish
Footballguy
https://twitter.com/cspan/status/1240672025989001221
ETA: And to be crystal clear, it's my belief that the muddled incoherent messaging is the issue here. He didn't manage to utter the words "take fish tank cleaner, it will help you" but the way it is presented coupled with the realities people are seeing make dumb people do dumb things. I broke down and took a quick scan through all the usual suspect sites and I didn't find one that said "Trump told people fish tank cleaner was safe and a cure". So I'm not sure where the "media spin" is that you're seeing. It's 100% accurate to say "a guy heard Trump mention drug X as a possible cure and he saw drug X in his fish tank cleaner so he took it".
THIS is the danger with incoherent rambling messages of nonsense. When introduced to an already panicked group who believe almost everything he says this is what can happen. Ultimately this lands at the feet of the individual taking the action...no one forced him to do it. Dumb decision to be sure.
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
This is an interview with the woman.
- This is a weird argument. You can tell without checking that right wing media is assailing CNN for this - for reporting it (it is newsworthy) and for including Trump’s past statements on it (which happened). - I agree the President shouldn’t be responsible for stupid people doing stupid things but this did happen. - A bigger problem is hydrochloroquine not being available for approved treatment and studies, which is happening, not to mention this magic bullet approach to the crisis. And frankly this is consistent, in Trump’s past crises fantasy, magic bullet theories have been ultimate go-to methods for Trump.
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Ilov80s
Footballguy
The relationship between the media and Trump is awful. It's either full on hatred or a love-fest for the most part but that seems representative of the country as a whole. I think it is an unfortunate result of a few factors:
1. The instant news media where we have to get stories out first so even if something may not be totally accurate, it is getting reported right away
2. We have allowed the news media to become a profit center. The corporate owners of the news media want profit and the way to generate that usually isn't with sound quality journalism.
3. Americans don't have an appetite for nuanced, detail oriented reporting. We want splashy headlines, loud talking heads and snappy sound bytes.
4. Trump is a jerk and antagonizes or whines about anything negative connected to him. He has done nothing to try to foster a good relationship with the media.
So here we are. If we wanted, facts, figures, rationality, etc. we would not have elected Trump and we wouldn't tune into to Fox or MSNBC. It seems we really just want to be entertained. We as a country have made our choices and we are living through the nightmarish result of it. A
1. The instant news media where we have to get stories out first so even if something may not be totally accurate, it is getting reported right away
2. We have allowed the news media to become a profit center. The corporate owners of the news media want profit and the way to generate that usually isn't with sound quality journalism.
3. Americans don't have an appetite for nuanced, detail oriented reporting. We want splashy headlines, loud talking heads and snappy sound bytes.
4. Trump is a jerk and antagonizes or whines about anything negative connected to him. He has done nothing to try to foster a good relationship with the media.
So here we are. If we wanted, facts, figures, rationality, etc. we would not have elected Trump and we wouldn't tune into to Fox or MSNBC. It seems we really just want to be entertained. We as a country have made our choices and we are living through the nightmarish result of it. A
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fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
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The Commish
Footballguy
Fortunately, I'm pretty sure they do. And speaking of governors, I feel it necessary to acknowledge the good decision here in Florida (yes, some dumb ones too as outlined in the Florida thread) that DeSantis has stopped all passengers coming in from NY/NJ without a mandatory 14 self quarantine and correctly points out "staying with other family" doesn't meet the criteria of self quarantine.
He's been relatively flexible allowing the local municipalities to come up with solutions they believe are smart for them. Some I agree with, others I don't, but this one seems like a no brainer.
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The Commish
Footballguy
Everyone needs to bookmark this page and refer back to it as new data comes in. And pay attention to what SK, Japan, Singapore etc have done and see how it's paying off for them. We are over half way to where China's at already. I find that pretty alarming given our inadequate testing. We'll be well passed China when this is all said and done IMO.
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honky kong
Footballguy
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Assuming that all travel destinations, sports, concerts, restaurants, retail stores and movie theaters were opened tomorrow are you going there? Until there is a decline in the outbreak and effective drug treatment telling people to go back to work isn't going to do all that much to convince people it is okay to resume normal day-to-day to living.
Unfortunately I don't think there is a quick and easy fix for the economy no matter what the government does
Tom Skerritt
Footballguy
Assuming most people have seen TX Lt. Governor Dan Patrick suggesting that old people take one for the team. Makes me want to remake the quote from Dumb & Dumber.
Skoo
Footballguy
Heck no. I think it’s insane this is even being discussed right now. We haven’t even gotten to the bad part yet and people just wanna ditch every precaution put in place.
We should’ve shut the country down two weeks ago.
timschochet
Footballguy
This is exactly true. Trump is like the Mayor of Amity trying to convince everyone to get in the water.
sho nuff
Footballguy
No...we need to stop the bogus assertion that because people are posting his screw ups that we are happy about him screwing this up. That is far far far from the case. There is literally zero to base that on in here yet we see the accusation multiple posters. His missteps on this are costing us all money...possible safety and health of our own self, family, or friends. Millions are hurting because of this both healthwise and financially. Nobody is happy he has screwed this up.
After 911 we gathered together and had more unity sure...much of that also came from the top...now we get division starting at the top...complete lies starting at the top. I will not unite around lies and will not agree with stances that are against medicine, science, and logic in order to be unified as a country. A country unified around BS is not strong. If the president wants unity...he needs to start acting that way...he needs to lead, to let the experts talk and do their work, to stop the daily lies and propaganda he pushes. But he does not seem capable of that. And many of his supporters don't seem capable of admitting even how wrong he has been on much of this. Some like to preach unity...yet refuse to see the side opposing this president's lies...are the side to be unified with.
Mile High
Footballguy
Trump is just blowing out his ### now. He has no control because he refused to take control at the beginning. Also as posted a lot of people won't go to entertainment places, restaurants and bars anyway if it's not oked by the medical side.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Ive see CNN and the articles...none of which points to people being happy about it. The questions asked bolster what point? That some will try to hold the man accountable for his words and actions? ITs not about scoring points for a side...other than the side of this country. They are reporting the news...they are asking pertinent questions...and getting lies and insults as answers. Nobody is forcing Trump to make those errors.
If you want numbers and facts...you should like the media...that is what they are reporting...vs the slant and lies out of Trump. This is not hard to see.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Spin on this would be claiming the man's actions had zero to do with chloroquine being pushed by people...like Trump.
Tom Skerritt
Footballguy
Just a reminder... if everyone had sheltered in place a month ago (or Christ even 2 weeks ago), and had we isolated the positive cases at that time, this would mostly be over by now.
RnR
Footballguy
mcintyre1
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
I'm not sure this is true, but we would definitely be closer to it being over than not. Its still tough to know exactly where we're at given our lack of testing ability.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Very true here as well...as much as I disagree with his overall stance.Then stop going to our mainstream media. That's an incredibly easy thing to do. Go to reuters or BBC or even The AP and/or NPR. All those places will give you what you're asking for.
ABC hasn't been bad...but my go to apps on my phone are the BBC, Reuters, and AP News. At home my station if I turn the news on is typically ABC...mainly because I prefer their local coverage of things anyway.
Tom Skerritt
Footballguy
Agreed. That assumes we had the ability to test a month ago... which we did not unfortunately.
sho nuff
Footballguy
RnR
Footballguy
Not a chance we can prove this is actually true, but sure. Let's go with that because it give you an unarguable tool with which to attack our government officials.
I can come up with some great hypotheticals that eliminate the virus, too. Those and a dollar will but me a $1 coffee this morning. Just like your assertion.
To anyone wanting just facts and numbers, please keep in mind that the numbers out there are completely meaningless since we are not testing. The only number that has a basis in reality is deaths.
I do not think it is spin or gotcha-ism to question why we are not following the example of countries that have had success containing this - by testing as many people as possible and by limiting social contact for anyone who has it. Our problem is that without testing, we have to assume EVERYONE has it, thus EVERYONE needs to be locked down.
I do not think it is spin or gotcha-ism to question why we are not following the example of countries that have had success containing this - by testing as many people as possible and by limiting social contact for anyone who has it. Our problem is that without testing, we have to assume EVERYONE has it, thus EVERYONE needs to be locked down.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Agree with a lot of this...#2 is one that seems to be an issue all around in this country. Too many industries have become profit centers rather than intended purposes. Think healthcare/medicine. Profit seems to be the goal of the system vs. informing/treating.
The Commish
Footballguy
Oh...then absolutely...we'd be WAAAAAY further ahead than where we're at. The lack of testing and the lack of will to test early will be the key to this whole thing when the history books are written on this topic.
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
It's why I asked @jon_mx yesterday what he believed we'd be able to extrapolate from the raw death numbers. We have a big fat large elephant of unknown sitting right in our faces that needs to be addressed before we start attempting those kinds of conversations. We are still in the "we don't know what we don't know" phase of this whole thing...getting ready to start our third month.
That last sentence by itself is a huge red flag. Granted, we know exactly why everything started so slow in reacting to this, but the fact that it's being considered to reopen everything in the middle of this just makes it that much worse.
It's why I asked @jon_mx yesterday what he believed we'd be able to extrapolate from the raw death numbers. We have a big fat large elephant of unknown sitting right in our faces that needs to be addressed before we start attempting those kinds of conversations. We are still in the "we don't know what we don't know" phase of this whole thing...getting ready to start our third month.
sho nuff
Footballguy
In those charts you see an illustration of why I say we have done a poor job in this country. Third chart down I believe (Country by Country: how coronavirus case trajectories compare)...that rate for the US is pretty bad.
On down to the other countries comparing them to Italy and look at Turkey...wow, not good there if that keeps up.
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