The Commish
Footballguy
Edit: NM, already covered
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Government Response To The Coronavirus (11 Viewers)
- Thread starter James Daulton
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gianmarco
Footballguy
Morton Muffley
Footballguy
The above resonates and my experience has generally been similar to others (save that I do apparently know some anti-maskers). I have several family members who believe all the conspiracies and who I worried wouldn't take this seriously as they are all older and some are in compromised health. To my surprise they are taking Covid, generally, and mask wearing, specifically, VERY seriously. Conversely, the younger, healthier Trump supporters seem to be the ones taking it less seriously. I attribute this to two things that admittedly might be the same thing:Biff84 said:
- there's a bit of Pascal's wager going on here. They seem to be able to assess their personal risk and adjust their beliefs accordingly
- my experience (warning: gross generalization incoming) is that the biggest attribute difference between liberals and conservatives is empathy. Here I will now disparage both: conservatives tend to feel like if they succeeded then why can't others? They paid their way thru college, why can't others? they overcame sexism, why can't others? They generally have a hard time seeing things from any perspective OTHER than their own. Liberals, conversely, tend to over-index on empathy. They see all inequality as unfair, something to be rectified by the govt. They see everyone else's suffering as "there but for the grace of God, go I". And yes am oversimplifying for effect, but you all know what I mean. Well, older Trump supporters have NO problem complying because people exactly like them are impacted. It's easy to identify and empathize as it is SO close to home.
Anyway, that's my half-baked opinion and as such is open to annihilation by BOTH sides. Have at it.
2Squirrels1Nut
Footballguy
Just got an email that my kid's school bus driver has Covid. :(
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Terminalxylem
Footballguy
I had posted about empathy earlier, but deleted it to avoid the likely backlash created by such a gross generalization. But it’s been studied, and partisan differences in empathy exist. At the extreme, Trumpian narcissism surely allows him to look the other way in the face of overt suffering, but that’s more a function of his personality than politics.The above resonates and my experience has generally been similar to others (save that I do apparently know some anti-maskers). I have several family members who believe all the conspiracies and who I worried wouldn't take this seriously as they are all older and some are in compromised health. To my surprise they are taking Covid, generally, and mask wearing, specifically, VERY seriously. Conversely, the younger, healthier Trump supporters seem to be the ones taking it less seriously. I attribute this to two things that admittedly might be the same thing:
- there's a bit of Pascal's wager going on here. They seem to be able to assess their personal risk and adjust their beliefs accordingly
- my experience (warning: gross generalization incoming) is that the biggest attribute difference between liberals and conservatives is empathy. Here I will now disparage both: conservatives tend to feel like if they succeeded then why can't others? They paid their way thru college, why can't others? they overcame sexism, why can't others? They generally have a hard time seeing things from any perspective OTHER than their own. Liberals, conversely, tend to over-index on empathy. They see all inequality as unfair, something to be rectified by the govt. They see everyone else's suffering as "there but for the grace of God, go I". And yes am oversimplifying for effect, but you all know what I mean. Well, older Trump supporters have NO problem complying because people exactly like them are impacted. It's easy to identify and empathize as it is SO close to home.
Anyway, that's my half-baked opinion and as such is open to annihilation by BOTH sides. Have at it.
ETA In-group vs. out-group empathy is also a thing, with increased concern for those most like oneself, applicable to many qualities including political preference.
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Morton Muffley
Footballguy
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GoBirds
Footballguy
Was curious when you claim we are at the highest number of cases ever can you confirm that they are 100% active cases and there aren’t issues with testing similar to what’s shown in this article per Scientists?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wral.com/coronavirus/are-nc-s-coronavirus-case-numbers-inflated-some-scientists-say-so/19355130/%3fversion=amp
gianmarco
Footballguy
When you decide to answer the simple question I've asked you repeatedly, I'll consider answering yours in return.
GoBirds
Footballguy
If I was making the claims you are this would be worrisome (actually good news overall for everyone) that they may be adding to these numbers cases that aren’t even active. Just curious if you had seen it and vetted it with the all time high claims, this answer works. Have a good night friend.
AndrewClark
Footballguy
AndrewClark
Footballguy
Nvm you said goodnight. Sorry.
GoBirds
Footballguy
No worries, it’s an interesting read if you have time check it out. Have a good one.
AndrewClark
Footballguy
I did and said goodnight. I'm convinced now. Again, as you said goodnight... Let's do it a 4th time!
AndrewClark
Footballguy
In all seriousness. I wasn't trying to be a jack**s last night. This is the only thread in PSF I care about. I appreciate that at least we could have a bit of back and forth fun even on completely opposite ends of our views on this. I don't visit here much, when I do, it's for this thread. I intend to keep my opinions very light and also respect yours. All the best GoBirds
kwille
Footballguy
Politico: The White House’s science policy office on Tuesday ranked “ending the Covid-19 pandemic” atop the list of President Donald Trump’s top first-term accomplishments
"“We have achieved a proud record of results, and under President Trump’s leadership, science and technology will continue to inspire us, unite us, and guide us to ever greater progress.”
The fire hose of inaccuracies sprayed around by this administration is still astounding after almost 4 years. So remarkably dangerous.
"“We have achieved a proud record of results, and under President Trump’s leadership, science and technology will continue to inspire us, unite us, and guide us to ever greater progress.”
The fire hose of inaccuracies sprayed around by this administration is still astounding after almost 4 years. So remarkably dangerous.
There's clearly 2 views of reality at work here: the one the current administration puts forward, and the one that actually exists.
McBokonon
Footballguy
He has never wanted to deal with this because he is lazy, disinterested in the suffering of others, and incapable of being anything but completely self-absorbed.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
[scooter]
Footballguy
BTW, this crazy lady will be part of a Trump campaign event in Texas tonight.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/5dpzna/doctor-who-warned-of-demon-sex-and-touts-covid-conspiracies-is-now-campaigning-for-trump
Morton Muffley
Footballguy
Not to worry, I have been told that this will all go away once the election is over. I booked a round-the-world trip beginning November 4th. Which does bring up a question I've been thinking about:Jackstraw said:
I wonder if that November 4th date holds for Europe too? Maybe they should call an election to get this pandemic over with.
dkp993
Footballguy
https://mobile.twitter.com/RexChapman/status/1321979577632260098
gonna have a vaccine really soon.....
gonna have a vaccine really soon.....
2Squirrels1Nut
Footballguy
dkp993
Footballguy
Was like a 2/3min long video of every time he says we are going to have a “vaccine very soon” all the way back to early March. Feels like literally every week he said it multiple times. So ludicrous. Some how people still believe him too.
Joe Summer
Footballguy
Trump Jr. said on Fox tonight that the number of COVID deaths is "almost nothing, because we’ve gotten control of this.”
I guess their plan is to just lie right to the faces of their supporters, so that on November 4th they can turn around and complain about how President Biden let COVID get out of control.
dkp993
Footballguy
Gr00vus
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
I have it on good authority that this will be gone by Nov 4....don't fall for the fear mongering GB!
Gr00vus
Footballguy
Gr00vus
Footballguy
We went over 100,000 new cases in a day yesterday. 100,000. In a day.
The criminal incompetence and negligence this has administration has exhibited in handling this crisis is reason enough to vote Trump out of office.
The criminal incompetence and negligence this has administration has exhibited in handling this crisis is reason enough to vote Trump out of office.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
It still so weird to me that so many seem to not be concerned about the virus. I’m not suggesting don’t live your life and I’m not worried about dying but not knowing the long term ramifications of the virus to our bodies is enough for me to take this serious.
Gr00vus
Footballguy
There's that, but also, the massive failure this administration has been at handling this is actually intensifying and prolonging the negative impact. We could have been South Korea, or close to it at least. Instead we're doing absolutely nothing at the Federal level and just letting things get worse. It's truly outrageous.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Well, I disagree we could be S. Korea - we just aren’t wired for that, the country is too large and we allow too much personal freedom to get folks in line the way the Koreans did. However, I completely agree that Trump has done a horrible job - incompetence at the highest level.
Mookie
Footballguy
“You know in Germany,” he told a crowd in Waterford Township, Michigan, “if you have a bad heart and you’re ready to die or if you have cancer and you’re going to be dying soon, and you catch COVID, that happens we mark it down to COVID. You know our doctors get more money if somebody dies from COVID, you know that, right. I mean our doctors are very smart people. So what they do is they say is, I’m but you know sorry everybody dies of COVID. But in Germany and other places, if you have a heart attack or you have cancer, you’re terminally ill, you catch COVID, they say you died of cancer, you died of a heart attack. With us, when in doubt, choose COVID. It’s true, no it’s true. No, they’ll say, Oh it’s terrible what he said, but it’s true. It’s like $2,000 more. So you get more money. This could only happen to us.”
Unbelievable. So Trump is now saying that doctors in the USA make more money when someone dies of COVID-19, as if to say that doctors have a vested interest in seeing people die from it. I'm going for a bike ride with a physician friend in an hour, I'll get back to you with his reaction. What galls me even more is that even IF it is true, it demonstrates that our health care system is immeasurably messed up, and what has Trump done to make it better? People are cheering this? Come on.
Unbelievable. So Trump is now saying that doctors in the USA make more money when someone dies of COVID-19, as if to say that doctors have a vested interest in seeing people die from it. I'm going for a bike ride with a physician friend in an hour, I'll get back to you with his reaction. What galls me even more is that even IF it is true, it demonstrates that our health care system is immeasurably messed up, and what has Trump done to make it better? People are cheering this? Come on.
This has been discussed numerous times in various threads. Hospitals get paid a certain amount if a patient is diagnosed with COVID. The hospitals don't get paid based in what is on the death certificate, but rather what the medical charts say. The hospital gets paid for all covid diagnosis, not just for patients that die of it.
Mookie
Footballguy
I don't think that's accurate, but I'm not the best person to explain since I don't understand it 100%. It's my understanding that the claim about hospitals getting paid more for covid cases is related to Medicare reimbursements. Here is a decent summary. Link
"Medicare — the federal health insurance program for Americans 65 and older, a central at-risk population when it comes to COVID-19 — pays hospitals in part using fixed rates at discharge based off a grouping system known as diagnosis-related groups.
The Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services has classified COVID-19 cases with existing groups for respiratory infections and inflammations. A CMS spokesperson told us exact payments vary, depending on a patient’s principal diagnosis and severity, as well as treatments and procedures. There are also geographic variations.
An analysis by the Kaiser Family Foundation looked at average Medicare payments for hospital admissions for the existing diagnosis-related groups and noted that the “average Medicare payment for respiratory infections and inflammations with major comorbidities or complications in 2017 … was $13,297. For more severe hospitalizations, we use the average Medicare payment for a respiratory system diagnosis with ventilator support for greater than 96 hours, which was $40,218.”
It is true, however, that the government will pay more to hospitals for COVID-19 cases in two senses: By paying an additional 20% on top of traditional Medicare rates for COVID-19 patients during the public health emergency, and by reimbursing hospitals for treating the uninsured patients with the disease (at that enhanced Medicare rate)"
The Commish
Footballguy
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
England shut down starting Thursday, through December 2. All pubs, restaurants, non-essential businesses nationwide are closed.
This is a real lockdown, not the kind we've had here.
"People in England will only be allowed to leave their homes for specific reasons, such as education, work or food shopping."
Government furlough payments extended through November.
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-england-to-enter-month-long-lockdown-from-thursday-pm-announces-12120114
This is a real lockdown, not the kind we've had here.
"People in England will only be allowed to leave their homes for specific reasons, such as education, work or food shopping."
Government furlough payments extended through November.
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-england-to-enter-month-long-lockdown-from-thursday-pm-announces-12120114
The Z Machine
Footballguy
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