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mr. furley

people who own lots of toys... how?

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Saw that name and assumed it was a $cupper alias. Guess not.

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2 hours ago, mr. furley said:

without getting in to the financials here, how do some of you afford the extras?

wife and i do OK. we live in a nice suburb. nice house. we both drive cars. we save money. we take one vacation per year. we're certainly not suffering (for now).

 

then i look at families who i know to be roughly in the same position (seemingly) and they have a cabin, a boat, 2 sea-doos, his & her ATV's, plus one each for the kids... who also have their own motorbikes... kayaks... and snowmobiles, an RV, a pop-up camper.. they just dumped 30k in to a kitchen remodel, and 15k for a new roof, then they're re-doing the driveway once they come back from Mexico for vacation.

what in the ever living #### am i doing wrong? 

are you people leveraged up to your nipples? did your parents buy your first house? did you win the lottery? muling yayo for the cartel?

 

talk to me because i want to be like you

When I first saw this thread I thought you were talking about TOY COLLECTIONS you know like GI Joes, Transformers, Model Trains on a track etc. 

I really have no idea about this but one of the families up the block from me lives in one of the bigger houses in the neighborhood and have a motorized boat that takes up most of their drive way that fits 2 car lengths vertical and can fit 4 decent size cars together in it. They also have a house at the Jersey Shore and went away to Europe a few yrs ago. Just redid their drive way.

The kicker here is I ring them up at my job and they are using EBT card. Something just doesn't pass the smell test on them. The Husband is a real tool as well. There a property with a house right across the street from him house went for sale bought by a company who were gonna redo it, small edition then cut down the trees from a big Side yard (Could've really made a much bigger addition and then put a nice built in pool as well with a great looking yard from the size of it) and put in a bigger house on the property of said yard. Then sell both properties individually. Well the guy with the boat :censored: and moaned about the construction maybe wrecking his bran new sidewalk and drive way despite the fact the Township told him any damage to it THEY"D PAY FOR. The dude was one of the biggest hangups on this project for months. Took almost 8 months before they broke ground on the new house next to the one that was brought. We're now 6 months into it addition on the first complete and they just put the installation in the new house that was built. 

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Anyone able to own a decent amount in equities has seen a pretty good run up over last 10 years or so. Rich have gotten richer.

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2 hours ago, mr. furley said:

without getting in to the financials here, how do some of you afford the extras?

wife and i do OK. we live in a nice suburb. nice house. we both drive cars. we save money. we take one vacation per year. we're certainly not suffering (for now).

 

then i look at families who i know to be roughly in the same position (seemingly) and they have a cabin, a boat, 2 sea-doos, his & her ATV's, plus one each for the kids... who also have their own motorbikes... kayaks... and snowmobiles, an RV, a pop-up camper.. they just dumped 30k in to a kitchen remodel, and 15k for a new roof, then they're re-doing the driveway once they come back from Mexico for vacation.

what in the ever living #### am i doing wrong? 

are you people leveraged up to your nipples? did your parents buy your first house? did you win the lottery? muling yayo for the cartel?

 

talk to me because i want to be like you

I also have a friend who him and his sister were spoiled rotten. Dad went from job to job first as a car salesmen then as a Phys ed teacher and then just a teacher at one of the under privileged schools in West Philly. Mom works in some sort of DR's office but not as a dr. Somehow for yrs they've always afforded cruises, trips to disneyworld, trips to Outer Banks, etc while always complaining about money. They've bought some really nice furniture and newer 50' 4K TVs and the dad is always buying a car to fix up and sell somehow. I think over the last 5 yrs the debt caught up to them especially after they installed a kitchen done by his Sisters now ex husband who took forever on it and just was delayed for whatever reasons before it even got finished.

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2 hours ago, urbanhack said:

I’m currently unemployed but just bought a paddle board.  
 

thoughts?

Judging by the costs of used ones found locally on Facebook Marketplace and what I know new ones to cost, depreciation is nominal

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You can easily come up with 20-30k+ per year after taxes by not saving for retirement and college.    Throw in refis to cash out some equity, that's a lot of fun money.    Then there's what their parents are throwing in.   I save like crazy and live a pretty simple lifestyle but I plan on spending a lot on vacas with my grandkids.    So many factors at play.    

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1 hour ago, Hastur said:

I always wonder what percentage of people that drive Mercedes-Benz can actually afford them. I'm not talking afford the payment. I'm talking about having manageable debt, are fully funding retirement, have 6 months of cost of living saved, etc.

 

Per my financial guy this is where most people fail. 

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1 hour ago, Cjw_55106 said:

There are a million reasons and everyone has a different situation. Could be all of the things mentioned as well as inheritance. It doesn’t take a huge inheritance to set you well for life. Never happened for me, but simply having parents who paid off their house and left it to you is a magnificent advantage. 
 

My BIL is married to an only child. Her parents have a house and cabin that are paid for. My personal thought is, they would have to make a series of financial blunders for their two kids to not be set up pretty decent later in life, regardless of their personal income or career. 

My Grandparents for yrs had a House up in the Pocono Mountains on one of the Lakes near the Ski Resort (Charter bus took us up the mountain 5-10min drive with stops to ski in winter) we got to go to whenever we wanted for free. My dad being a contractor to pay for us would do work on the house when needed basically for free. My Pop-Pop has had Eagles season tickets since 1961 (At the 1960 game and in the end zone where they stopped GB on the final play) that my Much wealthier uncle (Moms oldest brother) inherited those tickets and still have. My Grandma sold the house after my Pop-Pop past awhile back as it was too much for her to keep up with. Original plan was for the Grandkids and my Mom and her brothers and sister to inherited but it became too much of a hassle. If my Brother who was a little younger at the time and just starting his job as an architect engineer was making what he does now I have no doubt he would've just bought the house from her honestly and my dad and him fix it up. Keep it in the family like it was. My Grandparents at one time use to rent it out and we had a few NASCAR drivers rent it out since Pocono Speedway is stones throw from the place.

So yes inheritance can have something to do with it. That and luck I believe help. 

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11 minutes ago, That one guy said:

Judging by the costs of used ones found locally on Facebook Marketplace and what I know new ones to cost, depreciation is nominal

Right now, absolutely.

Next year? I'm guessing there will be bargains.

I fully expect to buy a SUP and at least a 2nd kayak next year.

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Toys from Adam & Eve? With the ten free gifts?

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, mr. furley said:

without getting in to the financials here, how do some of you afford the extras?

wife and i do OK. we live in a nice suburb. nice house. we both drive cars. we save money. we take one vacation per year. we're certainly not suffering (for now).

 

then i look at families who i know to be roughly in the same position (seemingly) and they have a cabin, a boat, 2 sea-doos, his & her ATV's, plus one each for the kids... who also have their own motorbikes... kayaks... and snowmobiles, an RV, a pop-up camper.. they just dumped 30k in to a kitchen remodel, and 15k for a new roof, then they're re-doing the driveway once they come back from Mexico for vacation.

what in the ever living #### am i doing wrong? 

are you people leveraged up to your nipples? did your parents buy your first house? did you win the lottery? muling yayo for the cartel?

 

talk to me because i want to be like you

I’m 50 and I live in the same house I bought when I was 30 and making far less in salary. Most of my professional peers have gone through 2, 3 or even 4 upgrades over that same time period to larger homes, fancier homes, homes in more expensive neighborhoods, etc. That has made a huge difference in our ability to save for retirement, pay off all our non-mortgage debt, and buy a few toys here and there. Between mortgage payments and property taxes (which are significant in my state), there is a huge delta between the monthly cost of my home and the homes of my peers which are 3 to 4 times the value.

Edited by bigbottom
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2 minutes ago, bigbottom said:

I’m 50 and I live in the same house I bought when I was 30 and making far less in salary. Most of my professional peers have gone through 2, 3 or even 4 upgrades over that same time period to larger homes, fancier homes, homes in more expensive neighborhoods, etc. That has made a huge difference in our ability to save for retirement, pay off all our non-mortgage debt, and buy a few toys here and there. 

Buncha old ####s around here.

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1 hour ago, Buck Bradcanon said:

Tried to PM you but got denied GB.

 

Your scenario makes me jealous..i so want to luck into somewhere to store the dang thing (the thing being a boat I haven't purchased yet).

Where did you get your boat?  What kind etc?

Thanks..hope you are well.

Oh..I'm in SA too in case you didn't remember.

PM'd you.

Lets grab a beer circa 2021.

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6 minutes ago, eoMMan said:

Toys from Adam & Eve? With the ten free gifts?

"Adult Toys" 

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41 minutes ago, MTskibum said:

I save 10% of my income for retirement,

 

 

The guideline I keep hearing is 20-25% is a good target to aim for :oldunsure: 

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2 minutes ago, Walking Boot said:

 

The guideline I keep hearing is 20-25% is a good target to aim for :oldunsure: 

Depends on your income and retirement spending expectations.

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Posted (edited)

Also - I am saving for my kid's college but probably won't get beyond 80%-90%.

#### em... I'm buying a boat.  They can have a loan payment for the rest.

Edited by matuski
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the way you live makes a difference too.  i never buy brand new cars and drive the cars into the ground.  consequently, i have no car payments

my mortgage is pretty cheap

my kitchen really needs to be redone.  going to happily lose this battle this year.  but it's time.  cabinets and what not are 30 years old.  been needing it for at least 5 years, probably more.

i have an iPhone 6

etc, etc

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7 minutes ago, bigbottom said:

I’m 50 and I live in the same house I bought when I was 30 and making far less in salary. Most of my professional peers have gone through 2, 3 or even 4 upgrades over that same time period to larger homes, fancier homes, homes in more expensive neighborhoods, etc. That has made a huge difference in our ability to save for retirement, pay off all our non-mortgage debt, and buy a few toys here and there. Between mortgage payments and property taxes (which are significant in my state), there is a huge delta between the monthly cost of my home and the homes of my peers which are 3 to 4 times the value.

Sounds like your coworkers were the type they get into some money and can't resist just not saving. A friend of mine is the someway. Comes into a bit of money and wants to spend spend spend. His grandfather left him a bit in inheritance from his grandmother. Grandfather died before Granny. Both he and his sister when Granny Died and his dad (Dad's mom) got some sort of inheritance from her $$$ wise. I don't think it was a lot. $5k-10K each maybe if that? Got that I want to say 5 yrs ago. My Friend has blown through almost all of it. This is a guy who could use it now as he was on partial unemployment when Covid started. Store closed down at the end of last month got a 3 1/2 week severance package. Now out of a job and on unemployment. He's also addicted to this sports auction site (Can't remember the name) that auctions off autographs and other things. I asked him in a not so blatant way how much that has cost him over the last few months (This was in January or Feb last we publicly went out) as he was doing it for a few months already. He basically said it was non of my business but the way he said it I knew he didn't want to tell me how much he was spending and it was more then he should. He also invest in Team jerseys and sports clothing as thats all he wears. And Video games. 

Then he complains to me about he wished he had $$$ for this or that. He's so thick headed if I told him if he'd save his money and not spend it on all this other stuff, maybe go to Kohls and get some nice shirts at a discount get5-6 of them instead of buying $100-$200 jersey and other things he'd have the money to afford other things. 

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1 hour ago, mr. furley said:

we saw some folks on the river a couple weeks back. boat after boat after boat. pontoons have always intrigued me. seems like it would be relatively low cost, easy to pilot, good for the kids to relax on with friends, etc.

so i got to thinking what if i could afford one? we have a vehicle to tow it. water is close by. i'd love to kill summer weekends floating.

then i looked at the prices..... and hoooooooooooooooly #### i didn't realize they were that far out of my range. it's silly.

Look at used pontoon's .. I've seen some less then 10 year old pontoons go for much lower then you'd think. If we decide to invest In a cabin, it would be on a lake and we'd get a pontoon so I've already been pricing out used ones. :thumbup:

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2 minutes ago, MTskibum said:

I am not worried about retirement savings, we are well ahead of the national average since my wife and I started saving when younger and we put a higher percent of our income in savings before we had kids.

Instead, any extra income is going in my boat savings so the OP can wonder how I can afford it.

 

Fair, though, personally, I don't think the "national average" is a useful metric. The numbers I hear for averages are scary low. I wouldn't want to be anywhere near them.

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2 minutes ago, DA RAIDERS said:

the way you live makes a difference too.  i never buy brand new cars and drive the cars into the ground.  consequently, i have no car payments

my mortgage is pretty cheap

my kitchen really needs to be redone.  going to happily lose this battle this year.  but it's time.  cabinets and what not are 30 years old.  been needing it for at least 5 years, probably more.

i have an iPhone 6

etc, etc

Mines a 6S probably depending on Price right now I can afford an iPhone SE edition as I'm still on my mom's plan which she also has discounts on plus her work discount through the Hospital. It also has over 40GBs more then my 6s. That and a PS5 is my future spending big right now. I have no car payments, rent is fairly cheap and not many other bills. 

I do have a bunion issues thanks to excess toe walking on my right foot but the dr said until I'm in pain or I can't do everyday things I wouldn't worry about getting it fixed 

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These are the same people that don't save up for their kids' college funds, then those kids cry about student debt and how big of a scam tuition is and demand debt forgiveness. Then they pass those financially irresponsible habits to their kids and so on and so forth...

I'm all about the DINK life, Dual Income No Kids. We don't have any toys, but we love to travel and dine out.

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Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, mr. furley said:

what in the ever living #### am i doing wrong? 

 

 

Thanks

Edited by GordonGekko
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12 minutes ago, GordonGekko said:

You don't know the demons they carry.

Gecko alias 2020, the pessimist.  The defeatist.

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blast from the past

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1 hour ago, bigbottom said:

I’m 50 and I live in the same house I bought when I was 30 and making far less in salary. Most of my professional peers have gone through 2, 3 or even 4 upgrades over that same time period to larger homes, fancier homes, homes in more expensive neighborhoods, etc. That has made a huge difference in our ability to save for retirement, pay off all our non-mortgage debt, and buy a few toys here and there. Between mortgage payments and property taxes (which are significant in my state), there is a huge delta between the monthly cost of my home and the homes of my peers which are 3 to 4 times the value.

This is a challenge for a lot of people. As their means increase, their lifestyle follows, and upgrading the house and the cars are the two biggest components. We've been in ours for 16 yrs, and we didn't buy nearly what we "could afford" according to industry metrics when we did purchase. It makes a big difference. We were also married longer than most before we decided to have kids, so we had a decent financial base built rather than having to struggle through daycare and buying all the babycrap when we didn't really have the money. I think that's one area where the millennials seem to have the right idea. 

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1 hour ago, Walking Boot said:

 

Fair, though, personally, I don't think the "national average" is a useful metric. The numbers I hear for averages are scary low. I wouldn't want to be anywhere near them.

I attended a CLE on bankruptcy today and heard a stat that no less than 25% of Americans would be financially devastated in the event an unexpected bill of $400 or more popped up in a given month. 

 

So, yeah, the "average" saver in America may not make for the best barometer. 

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Posted (edited)

So I see a lot of people's financials through my job.  Like for hundreds of new people each year.  And the one thing I've learned is you never know from the outside looking in what someone's financial picture is.

I've seen the old lady next door in the dumpy house driving an old Toyota, with a net worth of $10M+.  I've seen the family with all the luxury items in the $4M house that has a negative net worth.  I've seen CEOs of Hedgefunds that lives in an 80 year old meager house, while their underlings live it up in mansions with gadgets galore.  And I've seen the uber rich that live uber rich, with yachts and 5+ houses and planes.  I've also see the dirt poor, like living day to day just to eat. 

But more often than not, I see the suburban family living a decent life than lives responsibly within their means.

There's nothing revolutionary here... the way to get richer than what you currently are is to: 1) make more money and/or 2) have appreciating assets.  It isn't skipping Starbucks or cutting back on a meal out.   It's making more.  I won't go into the job.  Everyone has a unique situation.  So if you can't make more,  then buying assets that will over time appreciate (homes, stocks, etc) is the next way.  Buy a rental property.   Buy stocks.  It's all low risk in the long, long run.  Too many people buy cars or boats or clothes or etc.  All of those are the opposite of an  appreciating asset.

And more importantly, don't assume those neighbors are doing as well as their toys imply.  You don't know if those neighbors are over leveraged, or heck they could be living well below their means and are skimping on even better toys.  It's impossible to tell from the lifestyle you see on the outside.

 

 

Edited by Brunell4MVP
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13 minutes ago, Zow said:

I attended a CLE on bankruptcy today and heard a stat that no less than 25% of Americans would be financially devastated in the event an unexpected bill of $400 or more popped up in a given month. 

 

So, yeah, the "average" saver in America may not make for the best barometer. 

 

Right. Someone I heard the other day quoted the "average American" has less than $20,000 in retirement savings, total. So I wouldn't feel super confident heading into my golden years with, like, $60,000 in savings and running around saying "I'm fine! I've got triple the average!"

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No kids sucking away at my life savings certainly helps. 

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4 hours ago, mr. furley said:

what in the ever living #### am i doing wrong? 

Thinking all that stuff will improve your quality of life. Live simply, my friend.

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2 minutes ago, Terminalxylem said:

Thinking all that stuff will improve your quality of life. Live simply, my friend.

Easy to say for the guy living in Hawaii! 😉

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Posted (edited)

Could also depend on when they moved into an area. Here if you bought a house in the 80's you could have got it for 10% of what someone would pay now. Even just the difference between 2013 and 2017 could have meant one person pays 60% more than the other. Or maybe there is just a difference in income, if it is just a couple with no kids, maybe a 3 bed 2 bath is plenty big for them, even though they could afford a 5 bed 4 bath if they wanted. 

Also, those things don't improve the quality of your life if you own them, only if a friend owns them.

Edited by huthut

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, mr. furley said:

we saw some folks on the river a couple weeks back. boat after boat after boat. pontoons have always intrigued me. seems like it would be relatively low cost, easy to pilot, good for the kids to relax on with friends, etc.

so i got to thinking what if i could afford one? we have a vehicle to tow it. water is close by. i'd love to kill summer weekends floating.

then i looked at the prices..... and hoooooooooooooooly #### i didn't realize they were that far out of my range. it's silly.

I see nice used pontoons for sale all the time here in Tampa Bay between $5k-$10k. Pontoons usually have easy hours on them, unlike fishing or ski boats, so used ones are usually pretty nice in comparison and a pretty low risk buy.

Edited by Wingnut
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2 minutes ago, Wingnut said:

I see nice used pontoons for sale all the time here in Tampa Bay between $5k-$10k. Pontoons usually have easy hours on them, unlike fishing or ski boats, so used ones are usually pretty nice in comparison and a pretty low risk buy.

I heard the pontoon tube thingies are filled with air...why don't they pack them with some kind of foam? 

If you crack open a tube, are you screwed?

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16 minutes ago, Terminalxylem said:

Thinking all that stuff will improve your quality of life. Live simply, my friend.

A boat greatly improves the quality of life.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, eoMMan said:

I heard the pontoon tube thingies are filled with air...why don't they pack them with some kind of foam? 

If you crack open a tube, are you screwed?

Theyre not inflated, theyre just air tight tubes...most these days have sectioned baffles and compartments in their tubes that confines any punctures/damage to that section of the tube, which makes fixing pretty simple and not very pricey.

Edited by Wingnut
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simple.  I’m single with no kids.

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, bigbottom said:

Easy to say for the guy living in Hawaii! 😉

My ex brought me here. I love it, but it’s not a choice I would’ve made in a vacuum. That being said, my original statement still applies. 

Edited by Terminalxylem

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4 hours ago, AAABatteries said:

1. Debt

4. Inheritance

6. Debt

This

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17 minutes ago, MTskibum said:

A boat greatly improves the quality of life.

Maybe. Not a water guy, buy I think I’d rather an ocean kayak than something fancy. From my understanding, boats require a lot of maintenance, and I’ve made it a habit to avoid those types of things.

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5 hours ago, mr. furley said:

without getting in to the financials here, how do some of you afford the extras?

wife and i do OK. we live in a nice suburb. nice house. we both drive cars. we save money. we take one vacation per year. we're certainly not suffering (for now).

 

then i look at families who i know to be roughly in the same position (seemingly) and they have a cabin, a boat, 2 sea-doos, his & her ATV's, plus one each for the kids... who also have their own motorbikes... kayaks... and snowmobiles, an RV, a pop-up camper.. they just dumped 30k in to a kitchen remodel, and 15k for a new roof, then they're re-doing the driveway once they come back from Mexico for vacation.

what in the ever living #### am i doing wrong? 

are you people leveraged up to your nipples? did your parents buy your first house? did you win the lottery? muling yayo for the cartel?

 

talk to me because i want to be like you

My wife and I have this conversation a lot. Almost exactly the same situation as you described, by almost any definition we are in upper middle class. Yet every one of our casual friends seems to be living a full “level up” despite the fact I know they make the same (or less) then we do.  The defining difference we’ve seen time and time again is financial help via one of the parents. Neither myself or my wife have a situation where our families could help us financially even if we were inclined to allow it. The friends we have that seem to have all the toys are also the ones that seem to have the parents that will take them all on the vacation to Hawaii or help them with the down payment on the new house.  One of my best friends in the world makes deep six figures yet just got 50K from the in-law’s because those parents had just given 50K for a house down payment to the sibling and they wanted to be fair.  

My wife and I have just accepted that it’s not a life we will ever live and will have to work our ###’s off for everything we have.

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44 minutes ago, Terminalxylem said:

Thinking all that stuff will improve your quality of life. Live simply, my friend.

oh, no way. i'm low frills. 

just twinge of jealousy here and there when i see folks piling off to the lake with their family boat for a 4-day weekend. it's something i'd like to do, but even living as cheaply as we do it's just not possible. i'm ok with it.  

 

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37 minutes ago, Wingnut said:

I see nice used pontoons for sale all the time here in Tampa Bay between $5k-$10k. Pontoons usually have easy hours on them, unlike fishing or ski boats, so used ones are usually pretty nice in comparison and a pretty low risk buy.

must be local prices then. probably a bit more scarce around here. i was seeing 20k+ for used and 50-60k+ for new.

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4 hours ago, Hastur said:

I always wonder what percentage of people that drive Mercedes-Benz can actually afford them. I'm not talking afford the payment. I'm talking about having manageable debt, are fully funding retirement, have 6 months of cost of living saved, etc.

 

I’m on the other end of the spectrum. I can completely afford it. 7 figures in retirement, 6 figures in cash, no credit card debt, 6 years left on a 15 year mortgage at 2.75%. 3 kids cars, + college expenses paid off and one wedding down. My wife and I both drive 15 year old cars. Cadillac CTS For me with 115K and GMC Yukon at 150K for her. I paid $19K cash for mine in 2007 with 6K miles on it. Bought hers new. $51K financed over too many years still the worst purchase I’ve ever made. But haven’t had a car payment in 10 years and I’m addicted to not having one. Keep saying we’re going to get new cars but never drive and they still look/run good. But what am I waiting for? Sometimes I think my friend who just bought a sweet convertible Jag for $70K has the right idea. 

By the way I’m not frugal. Was more leveraged when I was younger and making less. Different mindset now. Paid off a $200K second for house remodel, etc cause I didn’t want that hanging over my head. I don’t want debt/stress at this stage of my life 

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Both live in the South and have careers. 2 kids but it's very affordable to live here, otherwise.  Don't have a lot of toys, except for a pool and hot tub. Go out on my buddy's boat or borrow my dad's. Life is good and saving for retirement. 

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21 minutes ago, mr. furley said:

must be local prices then. probably a bit more scarce around here. i was seeing 20k+ for used and 50-60k+ for new.

You can buy a nice, reliable, family friendly boat for 10k.  I see them quite frequently as I search for my boat.

 

Where do you live and are you really interested in a boat?

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30 minutes ago, dkp993 said:

My wife and I have this conversation a lot. Almost exactly the same situation as you described, by almost any definition we are in upper middle class. Yet every one of our casual friends seems to be living a full “level up” despite the fact I know they make the same (or less) then we do.  The defining difference we’ve seen time and time again is financial help via one of the parents. Neither myself or my wife have a situation where our families could help us financially even if we were inclined to allow it. The friends we have that seem to have all the toys are also the ones that seem to have the parents that will take them all on the vacation to Hawaii or help them with the down payment on the new house.  One of my best friends in the world makes deep six figures yet just got 50K from the in-law’s because those parents had just given 50K for a house down payment to the sibling and they wanted to be fair.  

My wife and I have just accepted that it’s not a life we will ever live and will have to work our ###’s off for everything we have.

The thought of asking my parents for money is plain silly. They do okay but are fully retired and don't have much. If anything we'll help them.

We're lucky that our good friends here are pretty reasonable.  Not really frugal, but we can hang out without feeling like we're missing out or blowing through money.

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2 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

The thought of asking my parents for money is plain silly. They do okay but are fully retired and don't have much. If anything we'll help them.

We're lucky that our good friends here are pretty reasonable.  Not really frugal, but we can hang out without feeling like we're missing out or blowing through money.

Yeah for sure. Both my wife and myself grew up with parents who were very very working class poor. As an adult I’ve never borrowed money from my parents and certainly wouldn’t take any as a “gift”. 

We are lucky too as the friends we consider close are very grounded as well, even the ones I referenced above. There’s no “show” with them, they are just lucky and have some breaks that my wife and I don’t seem to get. 

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