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The Great 2020 All Time Movie Draft- The judging is heavily biased against me. It’s a hoax! Fake news. (1 Viewer)

Interesting. I don't agree at all but i don't want to. Now you have me curious, tho - whither The Apartment, if it got took here instead of 1960s? Nice job, even with the slowroll that would give a poker player a stroke.
It would’ve been placed Top 5 for sure, as that’s something I’ve seen quite a few times and always enjoyed.

... and sorry for the slow roll, this week and weekend have been packed.

 
5. Tootsie (12 pts)

I confess to recency/personal bias on Tootsie—I saw it in the theater with my family when I was 8 years old, and when it would appear on TV after, I’d always stay to check it out. I hadn’t seen it 10 -15 years until last week and was surprised at how strongly the film’s message still resonates now (or again?). It’s a beautifully executed and acted film that’s still laugh-out-loud funny. Twelve points to one of Everyone’s Mom’s favorite movie!

4. His Girl Friday (13 pts)

Prior to this week, I hadn’t seen this film in nearly 30+ years. I honestly didn’t remember much about it, other than I knew I liked it, and that it cast a long shadow for the movies that followed. Then I watched and remembered what I liked about it—the banter, the humor, the chemistry, the script. The movie zips around from plot to plot, and scheme to scheme. When it comes to performance style, this kind of old-school, fast-talking delivery doesn’t usually appeal to me, but everything is top notch about this film, from the acting (great leads and supporting) to the script to the direction.

3. The Lady Eve (14 pts)

I watched this, for the first time ever, on Tuesday evening, after a root canal. And it was delightful. Yes, I’d heard of its greatness, and of the chemistry between Henry Fonda and Barbara Stanwyck, and I’ve read the reviews, but man, Fonda is good, but Barbara runs away with this here. Funny, silly, witty, ridiculous, infectious—and that’s coming from someone who historically has chafed against older films.

In my research, I came across this from an essay on the film:

“If you condense all the wit in Hollywood’s great epoch of the screwball comedy, everything between 1934’s It Happened One Night and 1941’s Philadelphia Story, all the uplifted eyebrows and double entendres, all the cruise ship salons, rustic Adirondack getaways, chic nightspots and Park Avenue penthouses, all the longing glances and all the lovers’ spats, all the mistaken identity subplots, all the glamour and the exquisite costumes, all the wacky rich people trying their hardest to impersonate the joys of poverty, all the pratfalls and slapstick, all the sexy byplay and all the arch, knowing dialogue, and spiced it all with a democratic spirit known only to writer-director-producer Preston Sturges, you’d have the Lady Eve, the greatest of all screwball comedies, bar none.”

That sounds about right. And Barbara f##kin’ Stanwyck.

2. Roman Holiday (15 pts)

Gorgeous, funny, adorable, fantastic . . . Peck, HEPBURN, Wyler, La Dolce Vita before Fellini got around to it . . . Some could argue it’s still ranked too high compared to a couple of others in this tier—after all, there are funnier, more legendary films ranked behind it. But IMO this is an example of a film—in or out of the category—that is remarkably of its time and timeless. It’s perfect.

1. When Harry Met Sally (16 pts)

It’s too obvious to put this at #1, but here it is. Self-absorbed, but classic, it’s the standard by which all modern romcoms are measured today. In my friend’s power-ranking survey, it wound up in the Top Spot 50% of the time, and in the Top 3 90% of the time. External publications were similar with their lists. It loomed so large as a cinematic touchstone for this genre that it’s the only film that hasn’t really moved from its final spot. Meg Ryan’s breakout. Billy Crystal’s crossover. Both are at their best here. Kudos to them, Nora Ephron (her third script on this list), and Rob Reiner—it is still damn funny, clever, touching, and classic.

Obviously, I ran out of gas in my write-ups. This was exhausting. I'm goin' over to the EPL thread now.
You got that right! She’s the absolute best imho... great write ups....

 
I am going to try to start on the 2020s in the next couple nights.  

Throughout the draft I liked a ton of his picks, but it looks like jwb an my opinions vary a bit on new movies, so we are keeping it simple and taking the average of our scores, but the results were interesting....

 
The Rock Movie Category Results:

16 - This Is Spinal Tap - EYLive

15 - Pink Floyd’s The Wall - Tuffnut

14 - Almost Famous - Gally Steiner

13 - Eddie And The Cruisers - Dr. Octopus

12 - Bohemian Rhapsody - Joffer

11 - Purple Rain - Higgins

10 - The Blues Brothers - triplemania

9 -   Walk The Line - Andy Dufrense

8 -   Ray - The Winz

7 -  Rocky Horror Picture Show - Mrs.Rannous

6 -  Buddy Holly Story - mphtrilogy

5 -  A Hards Day Night - Tim

4 - Gimme Shelter - Karma Police

3 - The Last Waltz - ilov80’s

2 - 24 Hour Party People - Doug B

1 - Stop Making Sense - jwb

 
From AAA:

Dr. Octopus -- 279
ilov80s -- 273
higgins -- 267
joffer -- 264
Andy Dufresne -- 264
timschochet -- 249
Gally Steiner -- 239
triplemania -- 234
TheWinz -- 233
EYLive -- 230
tuffnutt -- 228
Karma Police -- 226
jwb -- 215
Doug B -- 207
Mrs. Rannous -- 202
mphtrilogy -- 200 

 
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Yikes.  Somebody doesn't like rock docs.  
I put a huge premium on story telling, soundtrack more than “documentary” type rock films. If it was a documentary it would have had to been really special. I did not find any of the rock docs drafted....really interesting. Also the music and the bands has a huge impact on if I can enjoy a rock documentary. Maybe a bias imbedded in that approach, but I am judging on what I find truly great, entertaining etc etc. The top 8,9 are simply great movies with great music and the test of time.

I can tell you what gave Rocky Horror a higher ranking than the actual movie could ever do (Let’s be real....the movie stinks). It is the sheer experience of going to a Rocky Horror Picture Show live performance. If you never were able to attend one back in the 80’s you missed out on a crazy time. For those that went to it....you know exactly what I mean. Plus some songs in there are classics. 

I was surprised no one drafted The Doors which is a fantastic Rock movie featuring one of the great performances ever of a rock star in Val Kilmer's take on Jim Morrison. It was flawless. That easily would have been a top 3 film. 

 
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The Rock Movie Category Results:

16 - This Is Spinal Tap - EYLive

15 - Pink Floyd’s The Wall - Tuffnut

14 - Almost Famous - Gally Steiner

13 - Eddie And The Cruisers - Dr. Octopus

12 - Bohemian Rhapsody - Joffer

11 - Purple Rain - Higgins

10 - The Blues Brothers - triplemania

9 -   Walk The Line - Andy Dufrense

8 -   Ray - The Winz

7 -  Rocky Horror Picture Show - Mrs.Rannous

6 -  Buddy Holly Story - mphtrilogy

5 -  A Hards Day Night - Tim

4 - Gimme Shelter - Karma Police

3 - The Last Waltz - ilov80’s

2 - 24 Hour Party People - Doug B

1 - Stop Making Sense - jwb
The Last Waltz got boned - but my pick did well and that’s all anyone cares about anyway.

 
Yeah, I don't get that at all. Bohemian Rhapsody was awful and it scored 9 points more than The Last Waltz. I guess the rock and roll movie category wasn't what I thought it was. 
I've quit commenting. I appreciate the judging efforts ... I really do. I just invariably disagree with them -- pretty much every time, at least 2/3 of any given judge's rankings -- usually more. It is what it is and there's no point in cultivating bad feelings about it -- I like this crew (drafters, judges, commenters).

Full disclosure -- probably 3/4 of my picks have either been bottom 3, or else are huge classics that have been dinged a bunch of points for unknown reasons (I've spoken up about Fast Times at Ridgemont High, but stayed silent on other ones). Had I scored a bunch of double-figure films/people, I'd certainly feel differently.

 
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I was surprised no one drafted The Doors which is a fantastic Rock movie featuring one of the great performances ever of a rock star in Val Kilmer's take on Jim Morrison. It was flawless. That easily would have been a top 3 film. 
Without upfront criteria, this was all a guessing game. Alot of times, Tim likes to leave things vague and sort it out during the drafting/judging ... sometimes that's fine, sometimes not so much. Guess it depends on how engaged people are in the results.

 
From AAA:

Dr. Octopus -- 279
ilov80s -- 273
higgins -- 267
joffer -- 264
Andy Dufresne -- 264
timschochet -- 249
Gally Steiner -- 239
triplemania -- 234
TheWinz -- 233
EYLive -- 230
tuffnutt -- 228
Karma Police -- 226
jwb -- 215
Doug B -- 207
Mrs. Rannous -- 202
mphtrilogy -- 200 
:sadbanana:

Thought I had a shot at a medal about 1week + ago.  

 
I've quit commenting. I appreciate the judging efforts ... I really do. I just invariably disagree with them -- pretty much every time, at least 2/3 of any given judge's rankings -- usually more. It is what it is and there's no point in cultivating bad feelings about it -- I like this crew (drafters, judges, commenters).

Full disclosure -- probably 3/4 of my picks have either been bottom 3, or else are huge classics that have been dinged a bunch of points for unknown reasons (I've spoken up about Fast Times at Ridgemont High, but stayed silent on other ones). Had I scored a bunch of double-figure films/people, I'd certainly feel differently.
Yeah I’m not mad, it’s all for fun. Just surprised.

 
I've quit commenting. I appreciate the judging efforts ... I really do. I just invariably disagree with them -- pretty much every time, at least 2/3 of any given judge's rankings -- usually more. It is what it is and there's no point in cultivating bad feelings about it -- I like this crew (drafters, judges, commenters).

Full disclosure -- probably 3/4 of my picks have either been bottom 3, or else are huge classics that have been dinged a bunch of points for unknown reasons (I've spoken up about Fast Times at Ridgemont High, but stayed silent on other ones). Had I scored a bunch of double-figure films/people, I'd certainly feel differently.
Well at least the current draft isn’t reliant on judges and the winner will be determined where it belongs - on the fake football field.

 
I've quit commenting. I appreciate the judging efforts ... I really do. I just invariably disagree with them -- pretty much every time, at least 2/3 of any given judge's rankings -- usually more. It is what it is and there's no point in cultivating bad feelings about it -- I like this crew (drafters, judges, commenters).

Full disclosure -- probably 3/4 of my picks have either been bottom 3, or else are huge classics that have been dinged a bunch of points for unknown reasons (I've spoken up about Fast Times at Ridgemont High, but stayed silent on other ones). Had I scored a bunch of double-figure films/people, I'd certainly feel differently.
The draft results have totally been about whether or not you aligned with the judges criteria for the category.  I have noticed that Todem and Team Gallstein are on the same page as far as how we approached drafting for this exercise.  More entertainment and how the movies moved you personally.   Others that have used more of a critics based approach have hammered us in the scores. 

This is only my second Tim draft and the first (Sports) seemed to be a lot more standard as far as how to judge categories.  More straightforward with most everyone on the same page.  This one is a 180 on how to approach the judging.  It's all over the place which makes it much more random.  Something this subjective may have less controversy if the judges criteria are published up front.  Then at least the drafters know what they are getting into for each category.  The hardest part for the reveal here is that two categories are judged by exact opposite criteria......and neither is the wrong way to go.  Just different but with harsh consequences if the drafter and judge were on different ideas. 

No matter what it's still been educational.  I mean I even have Casablanca cued up to watch for the first time.  Should be interesting. 

 
Team Gallstein:

Gold - 2 (All The Presidents Men & Empire Strikes Back)

Silver - 4 (All Quiet on the Western Front, The Natural, Julia Roberts, & Christopher Walken)

Bronze - 2 (Steven Spielberg & Almost Famous)

@jwb's - 4 (Hell's Angels, Rounders, 48Hrs, & Pretty Woman)

Total Value:   -23

Total Pts:  239

 
Team Gallstein:

Gold - 2 (All The Presidents Men & Empire Strikes Back)

Silver - 4 (All Quiet on the Western Front, The Natural, Julia Roberts, & Christopher Walken)

Bronze - 2 (Steven Spielberg & Almost Famous)

@jwb's - 4 (Hell's Angels, Rounders, 48Hrs, & Pretty Woman)

Total Value:   -23

Total Pts:  239
:lmao:

You have as many as me - maybe we should call them JWG's? 

 
I was surprised no one drafted The Doors which is a fantastic Rock movie featuring one of the great performances ever of a rock star in Val Kilmer's take on Jim Morrison. It was flawless. That easily would have been a top 3 film. 
I'm a huge Doors fan, and yes, Kilmer's performance was other-worldly. The other Doors at the time said it was almost eerie in how much he channeled Jim.

But it's an awful movie otherwise.

 
Hey all, I apologize that I have not provided any updates since last Tuesday irt the 60s, 70s and 80s categories. I have had a rough week and haven't had time to participate in any of my favorite threads.

I haven't posted here about it, but I've been living with and caring for my 82 year old Mom since December.

Her health has taken a down turn, and I've spent this past week trying to find adequate medical care that balances her needs with the risk of Covid for inpatient hospital treatment.

This has taken up all of my time, and we are still working on our options.

Thus, I've not watched any movies since Wednesday (Raiders of the Lost Ark).

I'm not saying that I can't fulfill my role, but - honestly - it is not on my to-do-list at the moment.

If people are anxious for results, I won't mind if other options are used, but if you all are cool with some uncertainty, I won't quit. I just can't promise any timeline.

I hope to learn more soon about Mom's options, and that should give me a better idea of my time in the coming days.

I'll update more when I can.

And, thanks for keeping me in good spirits here while the world has been pretty chaotic this year.

❤️

 
Andy Dufresne said:
Ohhh I've got some good titles left and I'm within striking distance! 
don't know if you saw it, but Back to the Future Trilogy announced on 4K blu-ray for October

 
don't know if you saw it, but Back to the Future Trilogy announced on 4K blu-ray for October
You know I did! :excited:

Wish they were releasing them separately instead of a set, but BTTF is worth it at that price alone, so I don't care if I never watch the other two. 

 
1 point - Bambi (1942)
*boom*
*reload*

2 points - The Simpsons Movie (2007) - Seems unfair, but this most certainly scores higher without the television series' existence. The characters are great, the humor is on point, you know the drill. This felt like older Simpsons too, the good years. And the animation is very clean, quite appealing. But expectations have been set and this winds up feeling like an extra long episode of the tv show.

3 points - Zootopia (2016) - Ruh roh, talking animals. But they're in the city and acting like humans! Mhm. This is a fine and very fun movie, with a good message about ableness, but it does not touch greatness.

4 points - Who Framed Roger Rabbit? (1988) - The world needs less of the alliterative companions to broomsticks and more of the alliterative clients of Eddie Valiant. The story is a straightforward one, but is executed so very well. I really enjoy the simple things the artists are able to convey... like by just how much Roger Rabbit outkicked his coverage. I think the moment this film becomes great is pretty late in: Valiant, finally learning the real culprit of his brother's murder, reconnects with the Toon world and uses the powers of animation to his advantage (a scene that no doubt inspired the similar epiphany by MJ in Space Jam). It's a bit of a cliche, sure, but 1940s Hollywood was a bit of a cliche on the whole; it fits.

5 points - Ratatouille (2007) - Really stunning animation work here. Were I judging on technical merits alone, I think this scores some very high marks; the way the ingredients used by Remy and Linguini are presented on screen is mesmerizing, especially when paired with such an excellent score. This is a freaking tough cut to only be receiving 5 points, but lines have to be drawn somewhere, and I'm drawing them at the fact this is the first time I ever fell asleep in the movie theater. I have since given myself chances to rewatch this beauty and am happy I did so. Greatness is achieved when Remy and Linguini are working in the kitchen.

6 points - The Iron Giant (1999) - Brad Bird's second entry here, this being his directorial debut. A great piece of western illustration and animation, in many ways touching upon a lot of what I admire so much about the greatest Japanese works (more on those later). The story is a good one too: it's not often you'll find such a critique on the American military-industrial complex. There is greatness in making us care about a giant robot all the while evoking a fear of something so large and powerful in an expert study on scale and perspective.

7 points - Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse (2018) - Slick animation, above average plot, and does the Spider-Man franchise a world of justice. This movie might start a change in animation subject matter, but it may also be a lone beacon. A definite contributing factor to holding the points down here is recency. Does it stand the test of time? Will it create a legacy (more on that later)? Do another timdraft in, say, just 5 years and the value could appreciate by several points.

8 points - The Incredibles (2004) - This movie has style in spades. I love the character models, especially Mr. Incredible. Great music. It lacks on the worldbuilding, but by my estimation is the second or third easiest rewatch of this bunch.
Wow, I am just burnt out it seems. Was trying to get into this again but words escape me. Let me give a few thoughts before I reveal the rest of the judging, along with a couple of comments with each selection.

Animation as a medium has come a long way. I think Studio Ghibli, especially Hayao Miyazaki, are the standard bearers. The studio's works are largely hand-drawn with minimal computer input; that's a large reason why the company is on a hiatus (set to resume with a 2021 release, while Miyazaki himself is slated for a new release in 2023) - it's expensive to make a movie this way. Broadening beyond Ghibli, Japan's highest tier just does it better than the west's highest tier (there is plenty of mediocre work to go around between the two). The subject matter is more complex, the worldbuilding is deeper and I get a sense of art from the works as opposed to most western animation. Judging is a subjective thing, and those are my views based on my hours of consumption of the product.

9 points - My Neighbor Totoro (1988) - mixes Japan's rich animism tradition with a story of two girls dealing with the potential death of their mother (oh yeah, western animation has themes like these all the time), all the while being an uplifting piece of whimsy and fantasy. Beautiful watercolors throughout, and Totoro has become a lasting character within Japanese pop culture.

10 points - Pinocchio (1940) - big legacy points here, being the first animated film to win competitive categories from the Academy. I also find it to be the boldest of Disney's original fairytale feature-length films

11 points - Princess Mononoke (1997) - Miyazaki's epic. Was the first animated feature to win Japan's national film award. Where Pinocchio was bold by Disney's standard, Princess Mononoke is bold. Period. A warrior princess fighting against the destruction of nature. When I said epic, I meant it. Absolutely staggering landscape art.

12 points - Akira (1988) - the west's gateway into Japanese culture; was a smashing box office success. A 100% hand-drawn masterwork in science fiction. It borrowed on a few tropes developed in western sci-fi along with creating a few of its own that have been found throughout different media that came after (including a Kanye West music video lol). Its ranking is boosted by the aforementioned cultural impact of the film; I suggest doing some light reading on it, very fascinating.

13 points - Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (1937) - the one that started it all. Disney's first feature film, venturing out from the world of musical shorts. I don't think it's a particularly engaging rewatch, but it's hard to deny the importance, and therein greatness, of this film. "Heigh Ho!" is a classic and the red apple is an unmistakable icon.

---

Top 3 time. #3 is probably a surprise, but I 100% stand by it.

14 points - Shrek (2001) - This might just be my pick for the most rewatchable film in the entire draft. I can already hear sighs of desperation by some of you dear readers, but really I think this movie is worthy. Nearing its twentieth anniversary, in my opinion Shrek will prove to be a timeless classic so long as movies are a thing. Was a big deal, too, for a studio like Dreamworks to have the audacity to take the fight to Disney, and they didn't pull any punches! This is the anti-Disney fairytale satire that had been needed for decades. I also find the design and animation style to be far less plastic than the average Pixar flick (imo that studio started with toys and most of their following characters, no matter their subject matter, still look like toys), which gets big points in my book. Plus, the opening sequence is "All Star" by Smashmouth, what an excellent meme.

15 points - Spirited Away (2001) - Miyazaki's masterpiece. I'll just requote my selection write-up, from way back in Round 2: "Miyazaki has the uncanny ability to thrust the mundane into the fantastical, and vice versa. We meet Chihiro, a young girl who is moving across the country. She lacks confidence, does not know what it means to be responsible, and relies heavily on her parents for everything in life. She's young, this is par for the course. Crossing over into the spirit world, she takes up employment at a bathhouse for spirits in the most visually stunning animated film of all time, by my reckoning. The stills from this film range from jaw-dropping gorgeous, to absurdly mystifying, to it all revolving around a young girl learning how to take control of her life."

16 points - Toy Story (1995) - When I took my selection in Round 2, I had decided there was one movie that I felt would be OK scoring higher than it. This is it. What Pixar was able to do with computer generated art is legendary. As a nine-year old, the cinematic experience for Toy Story was an overwhelming sensation of

W O N D E R

and that particular sensation has not been recreated to the same level for me in a theater. Then again, I am no longer the same age as Andy, sitting in my reclined chair watching what Andy's toys were up to while simultaneously wondering now what MY toys were up to. The world built by Pixar was believable then and believable now, a striking homage to our childhood and our imagination run wild.

 
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In June 2008, the American Film Institute presented a list of its "10 Top 10"—the best ten films in each of ten classic American film genres—after polling over 1,500 people from the creative community. Bambi placed third in animation

 
Top 3 time. #3 is probably a surprise, but I 100% stand by it.

14 points - Shrek (2001) - This might just be my pick for the most rewatchable film in the entire draft. I can already hear sighs of desperation by some of you dear readers, but really I think this movie is worthy. Nearing its twentieth anniversary, in my opinion Shrek will prove to be a timeless classic so long as movies are a thing. Was a big deal, too, for a studio like Dreamworks to have the audacity to take the fight to Disney, and they didn't pull any punches! This is the anti-Disney fairytale satire that had been needed for decades. I also find the design and animation style to be far less plastic than the average Pixar flick (imo that studio started with toys and most of their following characters, no matter their subject matter, still look like toys), which gets big points in my book. Plus, the opening sequence is "All Star" by Smashmouth, what an excellent meme.
I completely agree with this and I am pleasantly surprised it scored so well.  Although, I would put it up this high I didn't think a judge would.  As I put in my write up when we made this selection I have watched this probably more than any other movie ever because it was my daughters favorite movie when she was 4-6 yrs old.  The best part of Shrek is it's rewatchability.  Every time I watched it there was something I missed going on in the background that was hilarious.  There is so much going on and it's just a very enjoyable movie to watch. 

 
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