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Why Didn't the Republican Party Save Itself? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter wikkidpissah
- Start date
I don't know much about Crenshaw other than the SNL stuff which I thought he handled well. (and Davidson handled terribly with the later backpedalling.) But assuming all the other stuff needed works, I can see someone like him being a guy Republicans could rally around.
I do think Trump showed that there's a definite desire for the alpha angle. A guy like Crenshaw seems a lot different than a Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio or Mitt Romney. A "more reasonable tough guy" might be an appealing option. But again, I say all that knowing next to nothing about Crenshaw. I'm talking more in general.
Tom Hagen
Footballguy
It will be interesting to see. On one hand I feel like if Trump smoothed out some of his rough edges he would have won a second term but on the other hand I feel those rough edges are what a lot of Trump supporters liked about him.
FairWarning
Footballguy
A lot to be said for this. At the end of the day though, tough talk only goes so far. Twitter wars with the media and the dems doesn't improve our lives one bit. There was a Trump Fatigue for sure.
rockaction
Footballguy
I started a thread here about one and half years into his presidency comparing it to Carter fatigue. I think both were and are real and cost them each the election. The media narrative was lousy because they couldn't handle the self-reflection in the public maelstrom that is the presidency.
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The Z Machine
Footballguy
I wasn't around for Carter, and i don't recall your thread. Can you give a synopsis of Carter fatigue?
Certainly Carter and Trump have remarkably different characters.
I have heard many discuss how people got tired of Donald Trump’s shtick. The exaggeration, his braggadocious personality, the pathological lying, the narcissism. I am old enough to remember Carter’s Presidency which was certainly flawed but I had no issue with his personality.
rockaction
Footballguy
Then you've forgotten his widely cracked speech about American energy consumption and his public demeanor during the Iran hostage crisis.
rockaction
Footballguy
Yes, that's true. He was/is a good man. Few people would have you believe otherwise. But his demeanor during the second energy crisis and his demeanor of sort of aloofness about the Iran hostage crisis led people to think he wasn't a very good leader. Perhaps it was the events that led to Carter fatigue, but the media narrative (and I am beholden to that -- I was a youngster in 1980) was that people had had enough of Carter's sort of doom and gloom protectionist nanny statism and preferred Reagan's vision of a "shining city on a hill." Instead of seeing a wasteful, decadent society and conveying that notion, Reagan saw and gave hope for people who saw America's potential for greatness. Which man's vision was right, and the fruition from that vision is debatable whether it is good or bad, but at the time, people had had enough of Carter. It was a big electoral victory, much like Biden's.lazyike said:
Roy L Fewks
Footballguy
To be perfectly honest, I love Trump's shtick, as you put it. I like having a President who acts a little cocky, because let's face it, America is a little cocky!lazyike said:
I'm not worried about the Republican party at all. Republicans did just fine in the 2020 elections, maybe even a bit better than expected. Trump certainly did.
Republicans are gonna win both Georgia senate seats and it won't be close. And they're going to take back the House in 2022. All it takes is "SOCIALISM!" and "DON'T DEFUND THE POLICE!" and we'll be right back where we were in 2015, and once again the Democrats will be left with the stunned look on their faces, muttering to themselves, "What happened?"
FairWarning
Footballguy
He was a much better post-president than president.lazyike said:
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A lot of people don’t mind a little cockiness , when it’s deserved. To try to claim he did a fantastic job with this pandemic is like last weeks a Denver QB claiming he made a lot of nice passes against the Saints. And most people don’t like pathological liars
Sand
Footballguy
She just introduced a bill to ban abortions of pain-receptive babies. Would love to see her switch to the R side (she's pretty much there anyway).
Haley/Gabbard 2024
Sand
Footballguy
After reading On the Wings of Eagles my opinion of Carter got even worse due to his handling of the fall of the Shah, if that's possible. And my opinion of Ross Perot is through the roof.
Summer Wheat
Footballguy
Parties are not forward thinking. That is why the POTUS, senate and house always flip flop. When whoever is in control the opposition seems to have more power going forward.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
She gets a F from the NRA, supports free college for those making under 125/yr. and wants a lot of Wall Street reform - those were just the first couple of things I found doing some searching. The idea that she's pretty much a Republican seems rather far-fetched to me. Granted it worked for Trump so maybe it will work for her too.
Sand
Footballguy
Yep - she's not in lock step with the orthodoxy. One of the reasons I like her. I don't like everything she thinks, but I respect her willingness to develop beliefs that show she's thought through these issues thoroughly.
Also the reason I like Yang - I disagree with just about everything he believes in, but you have to hand it to a guy who literally put *everything* out there on his site as far as positions go. Huge props, there.
The Commish
Footballguy
Then she'll never survive in the partySand said:
Sand
Footballguy
Probably true, but I'll go on the record as saying a Haley/Gabbard ticket would be good for about 95% of the male US vote.Then she'll never survive in the party
I don't think Trumpism will be stronger under Biden than it was under Trump, but I'm not 100% certain. Christianity didn't really take off until after Jesus made his departure, after all.
The Commish
Footballguy
ok??
Sea Duck
Footballguy
The Arizona Republican Party has proposed a resolution to censure Cindy McCain.
Among the reasons cited by the party? "past drug abuse" and "condemning the President for criticizing her husband".
https://twitter.com/yashar/status/1348043697204596736
Among the reasons cited by the party? "past drug abuse" and "condemning the President for criticizing her husband".
https://twitter.com/yashar/status/1348043697204596736
ShamrockPride
Footballguy
Some of yall in here are weird and obsessive. "Trumpism" is dead the second he leaves office.
FairWarning
Footballguy
Trump's political career will be very dead. Now Trumpism will live on I suspect.
JAA
Footballguy
This can’t be real. If it is the GOP is truly fractured. This would not bode well for 2022.The Arizona Republican Party has proposed a resolution to censure Cindy McCain.
Among the reasons cited by the party? "past drug abuse" and "condemning the President for criticizing her husband".
https://twitter.com/yashar/status/1348043697204596736
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
BigJim®
Footballguy
Not really, JMHO. Unless you want to ignore that it took centuries of hiding and a far more appealing doctrine.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
what is more appealing than unfettered selfishness and always being right no matter the evidence?!
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Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
Honestly can’t believe some of the things Mulvaney said on Meet the Press. “I never thought people would take him literally.”
The guy sending pipe bombs to Democrats and the group plotting to kidnap Whitmer didn’t give you a clue?
The guy sending pipe bombs to Democrats and the group plotting to kidnap Whitmer didn’t give you a clue?
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Unfortunately, voter suppression tactics delayed me from stuffing the ballot box for years
Sea Duck
Footballguy
Those people aren't going anywhere. If the Republican party ceases to exist, then the authoritarian/nationalist types will just join a different party.
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MAC_32
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
Sea Duck
Footballguy
Don't underestimate the number of independents and disaffected Democrats who will join them.
timschochet
Footballguy
BladeRunner
Footballguy
By having members like AOC, Talib, Omar, Warren, Sanders, Hirono already in the Democrat Party - and that contingent grows larger every election - they already are for authoritarianism and nationalism.
Stop pretending this is a "right side only" ideology. Communism/Marxism/Socialism are all kissing cousins and they ALL have components of Nationalism (Ever see a NK or Russian military parade?) and Authoritarianism (100+ million people dead and counting from in 20th century alone [Stalin, Mao, PolPot, etc...]).
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timschochet
Footballguy
I don’t think it’s accurate to claim that the people you name are nationalists. But would I mind to see some of them leave the Democratic Party? I would not.
mr roboto
Footballguy
The current GOP is CLEARLY pushing authoritarianism and nationalism as a PRIMARY ELEMENT of its party.
The socialists on the left (who BTW would be mainstream liberals in literally any other 1st world country) are a minority element of the DNC. Their party nominated and elected a boring centrist career politician w/out any personal gravitas.
Let’s stop with the both sides can we?
BladeRunner
Footballguy
As per the bolded red above: I disagree 10000%. This is made up nonsense for dramatic purposes only.
I stated in my previous post that THAT contingent grows larger every year. By purposefully minimizing it you're attempting to fool people into thinking it isn't an issue. I've stated repeatedly how ignoring it now is going to be to your detriment. It's already a problem in the Democrat Party and it's only going to get worse.
Cleanup you side of the house first and then worry about everyone else's side.
mr roboto
Footballguy
See this is the problem, I’m not a democrat or a liberal in any sense of the word. You think that there’s two sides and everybody falls into those categories. Partisans presume what other people believe based on one or two clues like it’s some sort of Yankees versus Red Sox rivalry game or something.
I think the far left in the Democratic Party is getting stronger in large part because they are actually offering solutions for the same type of disaffected voters that Trump courted I am not a fan of the far left side of the democratic party but it’s hard to argue that they are in power over there isn’t it?
It’s incredibly hard to take you seriously if you don’t see the authoritarian tendencies. Majority of house GOP members literally joined a lawsuit to overturn the results of an election with no real evidence of fraud. There were 60+ court cases all but one of which were lost by the Trump campaign, appeals to state judges some of them were appointed by Trump himself and literally no reason to object to the vote other than Trump wanted them to.
I’m sorry but this both sides stuff is just intellectually lazy at a time like this. I would love a real conservative party that got rid of the anti-democratic personality worship stuff and the winking nod to white nationalism. I voted for more Republican presidential candidate for the Democratic in my lifetime and honestly eight years ago I couldn’t imagine voting for a Democrat for national office.
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BladeRunner
Footballguy
I whole-heartedly disagree with your assertions above about the Republican Party, especially the "white-nationalism" part. However, I agree with your right to express it.
mr roboto
Footballguy
I don’t believe that ‘Republicans are all white nationalists.’ But they’ve courted them. Kinda impossible to not see that.
Have you seen signs/symbols/clothing at a Trump rally?
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
heartily agree with your first statement, disagree as strongly with your 2nd and applaud your 3rd.
if the money and what little machine there is left in the Democratic Party wasnt squarely in the center, this would be Bernie's/AOC's party already. i believe the polling has it about 2/3 avowed leftist.
as one of the most leftist people on this board, that should please me, but it doesnt. i'd like my outlook to be represented as the majority opinion once in my life, but these arent the people to carry my water. they believe in redress over progress; inclusion over excellence; what's correct more than what's right. dont want Human Resources running my company OR my country.
i'm too old to see the America i wanted and old enough not to want to suffer its inevitable crash, so i'll hop aboard the train of the first person to sensibly advance a methodology for a togetherness platform, no matter their politics.
Sea Duck
Footballguy
We both know that isn't going to happen.
Anyway, I thought this Gallup poll was interesting -- only 25% of Americans self-identify as "Liberal", which is significantly lower than the 36% who self-identify as "Conservative". But what I found most interesting is that the number is actually ~10 points higher than it was when the Republican party started it's War On Liberalism. That's an indication that the Republican party has helped to create the very same bogeyman that it has been crying wolf about for the past 30 years.
mr roboto
Footballguy
Appreciate your thoughts. And @BladeRunner as well.
Blade - do you really fear UBI or Medicare for All or higher minimum wage or banking reform is a first step toward Maoist China or USSR? This is what I don’t get. You can argue for socialistic policies without the slippery slope fallacy. Look at Europe and Canada. I don’t see Communism coming any time soon.
The right has scared us into thinking any policies meant to help the bottom by taxing the rich a bit more is basically scary communism.
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