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Footballguy
Gomes kicked the #### out of 'em that day, btw.
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2019 NCAA Tourney Thread: Nation has to watch Virginia again (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Capella
- Start date
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Coaching rumors...
Buzz Williams to A&M
Wojo to Virginia Tech.
Stackhouse to Vanderbilt. Really?
What is UCLA going to do? I heard Tony Bennett a month ago but I can't imagine he's going to leave UVA. He's the perfect fit for them.
Buzz Williams to A&M
Wojo to Virginia Tech.
Stackhouse to Vanderbilt. Really?
What is UCLA going to do? I heard Tony Bennett a month ago but I can't imagine he's going to leave UVA. He's the perfect fit for them.
Tells it like it is. Love it. Just finished watching the Calhoun project on e60.
shuke
Black Ice Skeptic
urbanhack
Fight The Power!
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I'm not sure I understand his career path. Left Marquette to go to Virginia Tech. Possible leave VT to go to Texas A&M.
If I was an AD, I wouldn't want to hire this guy. Don't get me wrong, I think he's a great guy, but he is all over the map.
BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
After doing some scouting of TT, I’m geeked to see the defensive matchups for this game.
Should be a war defensively. Hopefully the refs let them play and don’t become part of the game flow.
Should be a war defensively. Hopefully the refs let them play and don’t become part of the game flow.
Don't Noonan
Footballguy
If anyone wins besides Michigan State I will be happy
trader jake
Footballguy
Buzz left Marquette & Wojo may soon. It made sense when Tom Creen left for Indiana, but leaving for the Virginia Tech's of college basketball just doesn't make much sense. More coaches need to stick around instead of bolting for the first 'stepping stone' job that's offered.Ramblin Wreck said:
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
i agree that it is certainly an odd career trajectory. but i assume it is basically about money. after what A&M gave Jimbo, Buzz probably really cashed in. If you want more a of "legacy", then you maybe do it differently (not that that worked out so well for Crean), but ultimately you are only hot for so long and they want to get as much dough as they can.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
As a huge Cincinnati fan, I hope Cronin takes the UCLA job.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
It will be really odd if Marquette loses two coaches in a row to Va Tech. When Buzz left Marquette, there was some speculation that he was running from a problem or was squeezed out because he didn't quite fit the Jesuit model. This would really raise some eyebrows with alumni. I'd have to assume Wojo has completely given up on being K's successor at Duke?
apalmer
Footballguy
Almost as odd if Jamie Dixon goes to UCLA. If Ben Howland didn't work out there, why would his disciple?
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Saw Kevin Willard to VT instead of Wojo this morning.
What does Marquette pay? I'm surprised VT couldn't match A&M's offer.
Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
I'm not, but I'm also sure that VT is the better job. Money has to be the only reason he left.
Brunell4MVP
Footballguy
As a Hokie I wanted to keep Buzz. But there's no way VT is going to pay what A&M offers. VT would have gone up some, then A&M would have just gone higher.
SEC schools are larger and have more money. You have to look at it on the whole of the SEC vs ACC, since there is revenue sharing amongst the schools. SEC has way, way more $s from the football.
A&M is 2.5x the size of VT enrollment wise so lots more alumni $s too. For instance, A&Ms endowment is $9.8B and VT's is $1.6B.
And most importantly, the politicians in Richmond don't like the commonwealth universities paying top of the line salaries that some of these coaches get. I'm surprised Bennett hasn't been offered big bucks somewhere like UCLA. I know he's in the top 5 already salary wise, but what's another $1-2M for a UCLA.
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Shankopotamus
Footballguy
Buzz and his wife are from Texas. It was more about a chance to go home than $. Happy wife, happy life.
I think he was planning this for a while. And having his only solid recruit in the last 3 recruiting classes most likely going pro (along with all the seniors), now was the time because next year was going to be a step back.
NutterButter
Footballguy
Howland had some really good yearsapalmer said:
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Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
I was going to say the same thing, but I think there was still an issue with his brand of basketball not jiving with UCLA’s style, though in the end it should just be about winning.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I love ya, GB, but Cronin is terrible. First off, he's a terrible human being. But if we're talking about coaching, he is a resume padder. Every year he schedules terrible non-conference games and inflates the team's record to look good. And while it's great that he's been able to win a bunch of conference titles, he's only made it to the Sweet 16 ONCE in his career (13 seasons, I believe.) When Bob Huggins was running that team, they were going after National Titles. Now, we're having trouble making it to the second weekend. And keep in mind, we're not trying to pull upsets to get to the second weekend. We're losing as favorites. He's not a good coach. So I guess if you don't include that he's a terrible person and a terrible coach, I guess I can see your point and think he's good.
And I know I'm not alone here. I still have a bunch of friends from my UC days. And not one of them like this guy. I love my Bearcats and I'm not cool with making it to the Sweet 16 once every two decades. That's 2nd tier level college basketball. Small time programs are happy with that. I'd say Southern Illinois would be happy with that, but they have TWO trips to the Sweet 16 in the same time frame.
So, yeah. Good job to Mick for getting a team of this caliber to the tourney. But it's HIS team. I guess we can add bad recruiter to the list, as well? And I get it: the city of Cincinnati loves to keep mediocre coaches around for as long as possible. Look at Marvin Lewis. But it's time to let this bum walk and bring in someone who can get us out of the first weekend of the tournament so we can be as good as the Southern Illinois basketball program.
Shankopotamus
Footballguy
Since Cronin's name was popping up for the VT job, I actually looked at this yesterday to see whether Cronin was really as bad as his reputation. What I came up with was somewhat surprising (moreso on Bob Huggins than Cronin).
Cronin/Cincy (2011-2019) - In tourney every year, 4 first round losses (2x as lower seed and 2x getting upset), 4 second round losses (only one time getting upset - Nevada), 1 sweet 16, two wins over single digit seeds (2012 FSU and 2015 Purdue). Not great, but not wholly awful either.
Huggins/Cincy (1992-2005) - His first two NCAA teams 1992-1993 with Nick Van Exel and Cory Blount were really good. But looking at his last 12 years in comparison to Cronin. In tourney every year, 2 first round losses (both in 8/9 games), 8 second round losses (6!!!!!! as the better seed), 2 sweet 16, only two wins over single digit seeds in 12 years (1996 Temple and 1996 Ga Tech).
That is only a result oriented comparison and doesn't include external factors like Kenyon Martin's injury impacting one season, but I came away with Cronin is mostly mediocre and Huggins was really not as good as I had recalled. I can't comment on bad person side of things but seeing as VT AD Whit Babcock was at Cincinnati earlier this decade, I would guess he has a really good feeling for what type of person Cronin is. As a Tech fan, I would probably prefer they go elsewhere.
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
I actually really enjoy the CBI. The finals tend to be really a close hard fought series. Last nights game was not very good though for an OT game. Lots of fouls, things got chippy, and the OT period only became close because of a bench technical with like 40 seconds left.
Depaul sure scores a lot of points though. 90 pts in 6 of their last 7 i think.
tri-man 47
Footballguy
You'd hate little Grinnell College in Iowa, then. They have a $1.8 billion endowment (more than VTech, mentioned above) ...for a school with 1,700 UG students ...and it funds 55% of the school's budget ...and the school still charges $52,000+ in tuition and fees!
ChiefD
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I'm not saying Huggins was the greatest ever. But he had us contending a lot. And, yeah, we had some down years. But I'll take some great years and some bad years, rather than all mediocre years. Cincinnati should not be a school that is happy to just make it to the tournament every year. Not saying they have to win a title, but at least be competitive. Xavier sits 3 miles away, has a fraction of the students, and is able to outperform us for the past 2 decades. We should be better than that.
Shankopotamus
Footballguy
I would agree, Cincinnati should be better than Xavier and they have clearly not been, and you could say coaching is the reason why. Xavier's line of coaches (Gillen, Prosser, Matta, Miller, Mack) are about as impressive a 30 years coaching run you could ask for at a school of that pedigree/size.
shuke
Black Ice Skeptic
I guess we'll have to disagree on where Cincinnati stands in regards to the pantheon of college basketball. We're not Kentucky or Duke. We are a 2nd tier team that has been in 2nd tier conferences forever except our stint in the Big East. As a team not in one of the power 5 conferences, I'm pretty content with 9 straight NCAA tourney appearances.
I loved Huggins, but can we stop pretending he was contending for national titles every year? He made one final 4, as a 4 seed beating a 13, 5, 9, and 6 on the way. Huggins' later teams were bounced early just as often as Cronin's.
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
Only one more day. Bittersweet though. Only three more games.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I'm not saying we're a Duke or Kentucky. But if we look in our own backyard, we can see a school that has much less but is way out performing us. Cincinnati should be on par with other schools that are not elite basketball schools. One Sweet Sixteen in 13 years is something teams in the Patriot League celebrate.shuke said:
Ron Swanson
Footballguy
I know nothing of Cincinnati. Out of curiosity, is it a commuter school like UCF and UH?
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
When I was there, I'd say yeah with a slight shoulder shrug.
I commuted. As did a lot of others. But I don't know what constitutes a commuter school.
heckmanm
Footballguy
IDK, but they have one of the coolest-looking buildings I've ever seen
eta - seen in person; lots of other cool Gehry work and others on the interwebs.
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BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
Can’t wait until Saturday night
GOGREEN
GOGREEN
Ron Swanson
Footballguy
I think it's just significantly more students commuting than living on campus. UH is a major example of it and they have always until recently had lower expectations (despite a few notable bursts) with their sports teams despite a ton of students. I think schools like that tend to draw fewer fans from the community and they aren't as devoted. Not sure where I'm going with this, it's just interesting to me and I was wondering if Cincinnati was similar especially since they're in the same conference now.
BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
Moe.
Footballguy
I think you are spot on with that comparison @Ron Swanson. During the last round of possible Big 12 expansion I wanted them to get U of H and UC and they seem to be similar in that regard, but moving away from the commuter school rep.
Don't Noonan
Footballguy
I don't really have anything against Michigan State personally. If they lose Saturday I will win 2 rather large bracket pools.
Frostillicus
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Well, college basketball is like a pro sport in Cincinnati. And both X and UC have amazing facilities that they fill constantly. So the community is definitely behind them 100%. More so than any other city schools I've seen in the places I've lived. It's pretty much a town divided. Either you love UC and hate X, or you hate X and love UC. And 99.32% of the people fall into one of those categories. And even though football is starting to become a UC thing, there was talk about scuttling the program when I was there because they were so bad. So they are basically basketball only schools. At least they were.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
whoknew
Footballguy
This is official. Not sure what to think about it. He was the G League coach of the year a couple of years ago. Beyond that ... who knows? I hope it works. #Anchordown
Nipsey
Footballguy
Seems like one of those "be careful what you wish for" situations. If Cronin left or was ousted that program could easily fall into the dumpster and never come back. Guy has 89 wins in last 3 years. I get that it's all about March but who's out there that would do a better job and not bolt once they had a little success?
Frostillicus
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Again, it would be one thing if the guy was a likable guy. But he's not. And wins don't mean that much when they're against cupcake teams in November and December. And I also get that you might not get a great hire, but take a chance. And I want to point out, I'm not saying fire the guy. As much as I hate him, I think that would be a bad move. But if he leaves, that's awesome.
It's easy to say "Who would you get?" But the truth is, there's always someone out there that is the "new up and comer." Or the guy that makes his name at his first coaching gig. Hell, it might be one of the assistant coaches. I don't know. But if your fear is that you might not succeed, you're destined to always be mediocre.
