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2022 Buffalo Bills - Maybe Next Year (3 Viewers)

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
What's frustrating to me is that our all-pro CB doesn't seem to want to play football
I don't know that that is fair at all. Tre has always seemed to be a stand-up, team first kind of guy. I'm not pitting this slow return to action on his resume.

As we've talked about, this team can cruise to a playoff spot, and based on how they've treated injuries, it almost seems like they've conceded to take that route. As fans, we, of course, want the team to go for the #1 seed, but maybe that's not the best path to the Super Bowl. Maybe resting players is. Who knows...

(Anybody need an extra comma? I have lots of them laying around.)
I don't think I'm ever going to get over the fact that Tre was standing on the sideline watching while we let Justin Jefferson convert 4th and 18. That mattered.
 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
I don't think I'm ever going to get over the fact that Tre was standing on the sideline watching while we let Justin Jefferson convert 4th and 18. That mattered.

Yeah. That play was a huge disappointment. Hopefully it was a learning moment for all the Bills' DBs, especially Cam Lewis.

What's the #1 rule for DBs on 4th down? They teach it from Pop-Warner... Knock it down!

Cam got to the ball first, and easily could have batted it out of bounds, etc. Maybe Tre wouldn't have made that mistake...

Ugh... Anyway... On to stomping the Patsies...
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
The Elam inactive thing is really weird. Gotta be more to it somehow. Either his foot somehow is more of an issue than they’ve been leading on and they’ve been fudging the injury point all week, or there is something off field going on.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
I've been extremely critical of our rookies, but Cook looked legit last night. If that's the player that we're going to get down the stretch, that would be tremendously helpful. Not just in terms of establishing the run game either. Aside from Allen and Diggs, this offense doesn't have playmakers. Now obviously "aside from Allen and Diggs" is doing a lot of work in that last sentence, but if we can give DCs anything else to worry about, that's a lot to handle.
 

ChiefD

Footballguy
I think we can run the table. Really really need CIN to step up Sunday and get a win.
They will. The Chiefs have not played all that great during this last stretch and they are due for a loss. Add to the fact the Cincy is rolling and Chase and Mixon are coming back AND the Bengals simply own the Chiefs lately.

I think the Bengals win.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
And just like we all predicted, Buffalo right back to being the #1 seed in the AFC. They are now in the driver’s seat.
 

SoBeDad

Footballguy
Von done for the year. That is going to hurt come playoff time.
This defense is nowhere near as effective if we can't get pressure with four rushers. Obviously losing Von Miller is a massive blow. This is worse than losing Tre last year IMO.
The Bills are still the heavy favorite to win the AFC East, until Tua and Miami show up in a big time game late in the season. The odds of beating CIN or KC have gone down a little. It just means more Josh. BTW, I drafted BUF DST early am still holding. Miller was a difference maker.
 

ChiefD

Footballguy
I don't think you need to worry about the Chiefs. That Bengals game proved to me they haven't done enough on defense to win the AFC this year.

To me, the Bengals are the biggest threat to you guys. That team is solid up and down, and Burrow is just a stone cold killer.
 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
I don't think you need to worry about the Chiefs. That Bengals game proved to me they haven't done enough on defense to win the AFC this year.

To me, the Bengals are the biggest threat to you guys. That team is solid up and down, and Burrow is just a stone cold killer.
Would you go ahead and change your handle to ChiefDebbie-downer?

:D

I really have no issue with you - not picking a fight. You seem like a very rational person, but I can't figure out if your posts are trying to reverse-jinx, or lower your expectations, or what, but you sure do sell your team short a lot.

Either way, I am still very worried about the Chiefs. If things hold out, and we get them in Buffalo that will be much better, but they are still my top concern.
 

ChiefD

Footballguy
I don't think you need to worry about the Chiefs. That Bengals game proved to me they haven't done enough on defense to win the AFC this year.

To me, the Bengals are the biggest threat to you guys. That team is solid up and down, and Burrow is just a stone cold killer.
Would you go ahead and change your handle to ChiefDebbie-downer?

:D

I really have no issue with you - not picking a fight. You seem like a very rational person, but I can't figure out if your posts are trying to reverse-jinx, or lower your expectations, or what, but you sure do sell your team short a lot.

Either way, I am still very worried about the Chiefs. If things hold out, and we get them in Buffalo that will be much better, but they are still my top concern.
:lol:

No, I'm just a realist. I'm not one of these guys who beats his chest and wears rose-colored glasses all the time. There are plenty of those guys out there.

I just like to have good sports discussions, and am willing to see my team's deficiencies. Patrick Mahomes covers a lot of those up, which is why it's good to have that elite QB. But I said before this year I thought the Chiefs were in sort of a rebuilding type year - especially after the Hill trade.

Mahomes cap # is going up so we had to build a younger roster to compensate that. Our D is really, really young. And they haven't hit the rookie wall yet.

Now, next year and the couple years after that? The Chiefs are REALLY positioning themselves to be GREAT on both sides of the ball. That's when I think they will get really scary again.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
Von done for the year. That is going to hurt come playoff time.
This defense is nowhere near as effective if we can't get pressure with four rushers. Obviously losing Von Miller is a massive blow. This is worse than losing Tre last year IMO.
The Bills are still the heavy favorite to win the AFC East, until Tua and Miami show up in a big time game late in the season. The odds of beating CIN or KC have gone down a little. It just means more Josh. BTW, I drafted BUF DST early am still holding. Miller was a difference maker.
No offense, but no Bills fans actually care about winning the AFC East. That's just something that happens on the way to the super bowl. It's not our goal, and nobody is going to be happy with a division title followed by a loss in the AFC playoffs.

Von Miller was not brought to Buffalo to win the division. He was signed for one reason and one reason only: to close out tight playoff games and get us a championship. No point in sugar-coating it.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Von done for the year. That is going to hurt come playoff time.
This defense is nowhere near as effective if we can't get pressure with four rushers. Obviously losing Von Miller is a massive blow. This is worse than losing Tre last year IMO.
The double whammy is that he costs like $15M against the cap next year and he likely won’t be able to play until December. And he probably won’t really be back to 100% next year at all either. And at that point, you gotta think that his performance will start to decline anyway due to his age. So really, they spent all that money and he contributed for 2/3 of a regular season and the rest of his ROI will likely be very low.

It just really really sucks. It really does feel like this franchise is cursed. They got like 2 series total with both Tre White and Von Miller on the field for the year.

This team is going to start looking very different next year as contracts of some key guys start to come up and as Josh’s contract’s big $ starts to hit the cap. Allen will always give them a fighting chance to be a contender, but sure seems like awful luck has made their window a heck of a lot tighter.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
Von done for the year. That is going to hurt come playoff time.
This defense is nowhere near as effective if we can't get pressure with four rushers. Obviously losing Von Miller is a massive blow. This is worse than losing Tre last year IMO.
The double whammy is that he costs like $15M against the cap next year and he likely won’t be able to play until December. And he probably won’t really be back to 100% next year at all either. And at that point, you gotta think that his performance will start to decline anyway due to his age. So really, they spent all that money and he contributed for 2/3 of a regular season and the rest of his ROI will likely be very low.

It just really really sucks. It really does feel like this franchise is cursed. They got like 2 series total with both Tre White and Von Miller on the field for the year.

This team is going to start looking very different next year as contracts of some key guys start to come up and as Josh’s contract’s big $ starts to hit the cap. Allen will always give them a fighting chance to be a contender, but sure seems like awful luck has made their window a heck of a lot tighter.
Oh, I get that part too. :(

I strongly supported this signing at the time, and even now I think it was a good calculated gamble. For the first six games or so, it looked like we finally got our D-line where it needed to be, and there was reason to think that if we could just get a few guys healthy for the playoffs, we'd be fine. But yeah, this decision certainly didn't work out, and it's going to cost us. What can you do though? Sometimes a key guy gets hurt and you're just screwed.
 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
All the more reason they should have closed out that game last year. You never know what will happen to your window or when you will get another decent shot at a ring, even with a franchise QB.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
All the more reason they should have closed out that game last year. You never know what will happen to your window or when you will get another decent shot at a ring, even with a franchise QB.
It's way too early to say something like this, but I do worry sometimes that "13 seconds" is going to go down in history like "homerun throwback." If we cover that kickoff, we're probably in the super bowl that year. Instead that play marks the beginning of The Drought.

Obviously this is a different situation. This team has Josh Allen. None of us is interested in relitigating the QB situation facing the 99 Bills, but let's just say that they did not have Josh Allen under center and leave it at that. This team will be fine next year, and it should continue to be fine as long as we have Allen, because in the modern NFL you can more or less accurately rank teams based on the quality of their QB, with just a handful of exceptions. But this team did probably fritter away a Lombardi trophy last season, and that will loom large if our championship window closes without one.
 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
When did John Brown get brought back?

I'm watching the game with my 7yo, who's been playing Madden 21, and we both looked at each other and said "John Brown?"
 

Steve Tasker

Footballguy
From what I'm reading surfing the internet, I feel like a lot of Bills fans are underestimating the Jets, thinking it's some sort of sky-is-falling disaster that they won by 8. The Jets (and the Dolphins for that matter) are pretty damn good. They're above .500 for a reason, they've both beaten some good opponents, and they've both beaten the Bills for a reason. It's not a fluke that they're where they are in the standings through 12-13 games. I agree the Bills didn't play great today, and they could've put the Jets away sooner - especially given the Jets turnovers - but I'm not gonna look a gift horse in the mouth and be upset about winning this game today.
 

Ghost Rider

Footballguy
From what I'm reading surfing the internet, I feel like a lot of Bills fans are underestimating the Jets, thinking it's some sort of sky-is-falling disaster that they won by 8. The Jets (and the Dolphins for that matter) are pretty damn good. They're above .500 for a reason, they've both beaten some good opponents, and they've both beaten the Bills for a reason. It's not a fluke that they're where they are in the standings through 12-13 games. I agree the Bills didn't play great today, and they could've put the Jets away sooner - especially given the Jets turnovers - but I'm not gonna look a gift horse in the mouth and be upset about winning this game today.
That was a good win today, and it's silly to look at it any other way, A division opponent with a great defense who had beat you earlier in the season. You win that rematch, pretty or ugly, and that is a good win.
 

Steve Tasker

Footballguy
Very early weather forecasts for this weekend showing potential lake-effect snow throughout the weekend. The European model shows a large lake-effect snowband literally sitting across the southtowns, including Orchard Park, at 8 PM Saturday night, dumping snow. Something to keep an eye on for this week. Not sure whether that favors the Bills or the Dolphins as both seem to throw the ball well.
 

SoBeDad

Footballguy
Very early weather forecasts for this weekend showing potential lake-effect snow throughout the weekend. The European model shows a large lake-effect snowband literally sitting across the southtowns, including Orchard Park, at 8 PM Saturday night, dumping snow. Something to keep an eye on for this week. Not sure whether that favors the Bills or the Dolphins as both seem to throw the ball well.
Easy. Bad weather is a major advantage for the running QB with the cannon arm.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Rumors that Cole Beasley is in Buffalo right now. The guy kind of annoyed me with how much of a knucklehead he can be and his attitude towards the team after he left, but they could actually probably use him right about now…
 

TampaMike19

Footballguy
James Cook and Hines seem like perfect antidotes for this team. Shifty, explosive players that can keep chains moving and make players miss. RB receptions or in the slot. They're missing this big time.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
James Cook and Hines seem like perfect antidotes for this team. Shifty, explosive players that can keep chains moving and make players miss. RB receptions or in the slot. They're missing this big time.
Kind of baffling how Cook has nice days against the Browns and Patriots and then barely sees the field on a day when we really wanted to grind out some yards on the ground. There was one play in particular that Singletary took for 15-20 yards where I feel somewhat confident that Cook would have split the defenders and scored. The Jets defensive alignment seems like exactly the kind of alignment where you want a guy who can explode through holes. That's Cook.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
We either just had one of the most catastrophically awful drafts in team history, or this team simply refuses to play the players that it drafted. It's baffling.
 

Steve Tasker

Footballguy
We either just had one of the most catastrophically awful drafts in team history, or this team simply refuses to play the players that it drafted. It's baffling.
For real.

1. 23rd - Kaiir Elam - has graded generally poorly and can't even get a single defensive snap ahead of Dane Jackson and jouneyman Xavier Rhodes as the season wears on
2. 63rd - James Cook - shown minor flashes but no consistency. Rumors of bad practice habits.
3. 89th - Terrel Bernard - seemingly undersized backup who has done absolutely nothing. Maybe a special teamer?
4. 148th - Khalil Shakir - another backup who has done absolutely nothing (though we'd all like to see him more)
5. 180th - Matt Araiza - cut for obvious reasons
6. 185th - Christian Benford - probably the best draft pick of the class at first glance. Beat Kaiir Elam for a job and was playing fairly well before injury.
7. 209th - Luke Tenuta - cut during camp, has bounced around, now on the Packers
8. 231st - Baylon Spector - special teamer I think?
 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
I think this is a good move. But how bad has the WR situation been managed? Can you imagine another top team having to pick up two WRs from past years that were sitting on the couch. Oof.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
We either just had one of the most catastrophically awful drafts in team history, or this team simply refuses to play the players that it drafted. It's baffling.
The scuttlebutt is that this happened specifically at the request of Josh Allen. Allen specifically requested that the Bills bring back both Brown and Beasley. The question was put out to the players on Beasley and not a single person opposed.

Pretty devastating to the other WRs on the team other than Diggs IMO if true. That’s a total vote of no confidence, mainly from Allen, but also from the rest of the team and the front office. No idea what is going on there, but clearly everyone is convinced that the current receivers just can’t get it done.

I don’t know what that means for Shakir. I don’t know if they’re just not seeing what they need to see out of him in practice, if it’s the team just being incredibly stubborn in not wanting to play rookies, or something else. With as awful as the O-line has been, maybe it’s something as stupid as not blocking well. Or maybe he ends up in the wrong spot too often and Josh can’t trust him. Who knows.

With Elam, it certainly is disappointing there as well. From when they’ve scratched him to when they’ve used him and from comments made, my guess there is that he’s not where they want him to be at all when it comes to zone coverage. He was known to be excellent in press man coverage but had little experience in zone. So that could just be a learning process for him. The Bills played a lot of zone against the Jets and he was inactive. I’m guessing they’ll play more press man this week against the Dolphins, so we’ll see if he is active and gets some time on the field.

Crazy that their best pick from the last year so far appears to be 6th rounder Christian Benford. All this juggling at CB2 may just be keeping the seat warm for when Benford can return.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
I think this is a good move. But how bad has the WR situation been managed? Can you imagine another top team having to pick up two WRs from past years that were sitting on the couch. Oof.
And honestly, both of them seem cooked last year. These scream desperation moves. Brown was a speed guy that could stretch defenses and he clearly lost a step. Beasley had great short area quickness and could gain that separation in short and intermediate areas to get into the holes in the zone and move the sticks. But he also clearly lost that burst. It’s not like Bease has the best hands either.
 

Steve Tasker

Footballguy
Pretty devastating to the other WRs on the team other than Diggs IMO if true. That’s a total vote of no confidence, mainly from Allen, but also from the rest of the team and the front office. No idea what is going on there, but clearly everyone is convinced that the current receivers just can’t get it done.
I mean, if this is true, can you blame him? I read yesterday that the Bills are #1 or #2 in drops this season. They're lucky it hasn't been costing them games.

Davis is boom-or-bust. Either he's a vertical threat monster or completely invisible. McKenzie has a role on this team but he's better suited as a gadget player, not a 50%-snap-count slot receiver. Knox is overpaid and is not as good as people make him out to be (sorry, it's true); he's a fine NFL player but is out of place in a pass-heavy offense like this and doesn't offer enough in the receiving game. Shakir barely gets on the field. Singletary isn't much of a receiver. Cook seems like a decent receiver but they barely use him. We know Nyheim Hines is a decent receiver, but he plays like 1 offensive snap a game. I'm intrigued by Quintin Morris but he's obviously very raw, and we have no way of knowing whether he's a competent receiver.

Other than Diggs, the pass-catching options have been a letdown this season.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Pretty devastating to the other WRs on the team other than Diggs IMO if true. That’s a total vote of no confidence, mainly from Allen, but also from the rest of the team and the front office. No idea what is going on there, but clearly everyone is convinced that the current receivers just can’t get it done.
I mean, if this is true, can you blame him? I read yesterday that the Bills are #1 or #2 in drops this season. They're lucky it hasn't been costing them games.

Davis is boom-or-bust. Either he's a vertical threat monster or completely invisible. McKenzie has a role on this team but he's better suited as a gadget player, not a 50%-snap-count slot receiver. Knox is overpaid and is not as good as people make him out to be (sorry, it's true); he's a fine NFL player but is out of place in a pass-heavy offense like this and doesn't offer enough in the receiving game. Shakir barely gets on the field. Singletary isn't much of a receiver. Cook seems like a decent receiver but they barely use him. We know Nyheim Hines is a decent receiver, but he plays like 1 offensive snap a game. I'm intrigued by Quintin Morris but he's obviously very raw, and we have no way of knowing whether he's a competent receiver.

Other than Diggs, the pass-catching options have been a letdown this season.
I think Knox actually does have the ability to be a very good pass catching option, just like Cook and Hines. The problem is that the O-line is so awful that they have to keep those guys in to help block way too often. Knox can’t be a threat in the passing game if he’s always having to help double Spencer Brown’s guy so that Allen doesn’t get insta-flattened. Cook can’t go run a route if he has to try to pickup the DT who just ran through Bates or Saffold. I’m guessing that’s exactly why we saw Singletary a lot more than Cook against the Jets. The Bills needed Singletary for his pass blocking ability against New York’s fierce D-line otherwise things would have been even uglier for Allen.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
We either just had one of the most catastrophically awful drafts in team history, or this team simply refuses to play the players that it drafted. It's baffling.
The scuttlebutt is that this happened specifically at the request of Josh Allen. Allen specifically requested that the Bills bring back both Brown and Beasley. The question was put out to the players on Beasley and not a single person opposed.

Pretty devastating to the other WRs on the team other than Diggs IMO if true. That’s a total vote of no confidence, mainly from Allen, but also from the rest of the team and the front office. No idea what is going on there, but clearly everyone is convinced that the current receivers just can’t get it done.

I don’t know what that means for Shakir. I don’t know if they’re just not seeing what they need to see out of him in practice, if it’s the team just being incredibly stubborn in not wanting to play rookies, or something else. With as awful as the O-line has been, maybe it’s something as stupid as not blocking well. Or maybe he ends up in the wrong spot too often and Josh can’t trust him. Who knows.

With Elam, it certainly is disappointing there as well. From when they’ve scratched him to when they’ve used him and from comments made, my guess there is that he’s not where they want him to be at all when it comes to zone coverage. He was known to be excellent in press man coverage but had little experience in zone. So that could just be a learning process for him. The Bills played a lot of zone against the Jets and he was inactive. I’m guessing they’ll play more press man this week against the Dolphins, so we’ll see if he is active and gets some time on the field.

Crazy that their best pick from the last year so far appears to be 6th rounder Christian Benford. All this juggling at CB2 may just be keeping the seat warm for when Benford can return.
Well, the part about the non-Diggs WRs is true. Davis has been a huge disappointment this year. McKenzie is the same guy he's always been, and now he's basically being asked to play out of position. Crowder got hurt. I don't know what the deal with Shakir is. Kumerow is just a ST guy. Honestly, let's throw Knox in there too -- he's been MIA all year up until last week and even then he had a key end-of-game drop.

I don't pretend to know what's happening with this group. Like you mentioned, none of us are privy to what the staff sees on the practice field and in the locker room. I'm open to the argument that much of this has to do with our new OC still finding his sea legs. But it seems obvious just from watching the games that the offense has regressed this year even though that doesn't show in the stats.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
I think Knox actually does have the ability to be a very good pass catching option, just like Cook and Hines. The problem is that the O-line is so awful that they have to keep those guys in to help block way too often. Knox can’t be a threat in the passing game if he’s always having to help double Spencer Brown’s guy so that Allen doesn’t get insta-flattened. Cook can’t go run a route if he has to try to pickup the DT who just ran through Bates or Saffold. I’m guessing that’s exactly why we saw Singletary a lot more than Cook against the Jets. The Bills needed Singletary for his pass blocking ability against New York’s fierce D-line otherwise things would have been even uglier for Allen.
Has Cook ever stayed in to block anybody? I don't think I've seen him do that a single time and I've been watching for it. When Cook is on the field, he's getting the ball or he's running a route.

Edit: I'm agreeing with your point about why they probably feel like they have to keep Singletary in.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
The WRs haven’t been good enough, but IMO, the bigger hindrance to the offense is the awful O-line. It seems like Dorsey/Allen want to stretch the field more and have more slower developing plays and the O-line just can’t hold up long enough to do that. And Dorsey/Allen have not been able to make the adjustment to just take the short stuff. Heck, the O-line is so bad that there’s not even enough time for the short stuff at times. The WRs need improving, but that doesn’t fix the bigger root issue I don’t think.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
The WRs haven’t been good enough, but IMO, the bigger hindrance to the offense is the awful O-line. It seems like Dorsey/Allen want to stretch the field more and have more slower developing plays and the O-line just can’t hold up long enough to do that. And Dorsey/Allen have not been able to make the adjustment to just take the short stuff. Heck, the O-line is so bad that there’s not even enough time for the short stuff at times. The WRs need improving, but that doesn’t fix the bigger root issue I don’t think.
Yep. I'll never criticize a GM for missing on a particular draft pick, because drafting is hard. A draft class that produces a single pro bowler and a couple of decent starters is generally considered pretty good, so we need to keep draft picks in perspective. That said, we whiffed on Cody Ford and while the jury is still out on Spencer Brown, he has not been good. And we haven't really put any other significant draft capital into the line. Morse was a good FA signing, but the other folks we've signed have just been bargain signings -- they've been okay, but just okay. I guess we can toss the Wyatt Teller trade into this conversation too.

With the exception of Morse, I can't think of any decision we've made involving the OL under this regime that really worked out. It's showing up on the field.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Geez. McKenzie dropped 11.5% of passes last year and 9.1% this year. Gabe Davis dropped 7.9 last year and 9.9 this year. Gross.
 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
Is it crazy to think Beasley could play a decent role this week, 4-6 catches?

I am expecting Miami to pressure like crazy. That has been their strategy in general and especially with Buffalo’s o-line struggles it makes sense.

Buffalo is going to need quick hitters to beat that and the current group outside of Diggs isn’t strong in that area. Beasley is (or was and could be again?)
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Is it crazy to think Beasley could play a decent role this week, 4-6 catches?

I am expecting Miami to pressure like crazy. That has been their strategy in general and especially with Buffalo’s o-line struggles it makes sense.

Buffalo is going to need quick hitters to beat that and the current group outside of Diggs isn’t strong in that area. Beasley is (or was and could be again?)
There are already reports that they expect him to be elevated this week to the roster. So it would seem they clearly plan on playing him. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if he is in there on 3rd downs quite a bit. I don’t think he’ll be anywhere near fantasy relevant, but he may be real life relevant in helping move the sticks.
 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
I am bummed there is forecast to be so much snow. A little is perfect. When there are inches coming down during the game it turns into a weird one where the underdog has a better chance.
 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
Attending with my 15 yr old daughter. She toughed out the cold to watch Allen crush the Pats in the playoffs, hoping she can tough out the snow ⛄️
 

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