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2022 Buffalo Bills - Maybe Next Year (3 Viewers)

moleculo

Footballguy
So pumped for you guys. Von brings championship swagger, especially after his stint in LA.  I think he has plenty of juice left, enough to still be an every-down linebacker.  You guys are gonna love his pass-rush, but also his run D and ability to draw double-teams.

 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
On a team with few glaring weaknesses the last couple years the one that has stood out is pass rush. Signing the biggest name to fill your biggest hole is a huge win. Already renewed my season tickets….counting the days until the opener. 

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
There goes Beasley.  Not a surprise -- I guess most of us assumed that he was done in Buffalo.  I'm glad we were able to have him here for a few years.  He was a great "bridge" player that helped us go from perpetual irrelevance to championship contender, and he was a fantastic security blanket for Josh.  We couldn't have asked for a better guy for that transition period.  

With Diggs and Davis out wide, I'd just as soon see us draft a rookie who can play the slot (I'm sure McKenzie will get snaps there too of course).  

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
Jordan Phillips.  Shaq Lawson.

I'm halfway expecting to see Fred Jackson in the backfield by the time this all shakes out.

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
Someone remind me how they are going to afford all this?

I did see that they freed up almost 10 mil by restructuring Hyde and Milano.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Someone remind me how they are going to afford all this?

I did see that they freed up almost 10 mil by restructuring Hyde and Milano.
They cut Williams which saved a bunch. They cut Beasley and saved a bunch. 

It’s after the first day of the league year so teams can’t sign new players and go over the salary cap (actually not sure why OverTheCap shows a few teams over the cap because I didn’t think that was allowed at this point). So it’s not about how are they going to get under the cap, they already are.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Jordan Phillips.  Shaq Lawson.

I'm halfway expecting to see Fred Jackson in the backfield by the time this all shakes out.
I expect the Buffalo d-line to be way better against both the pass and run this year. 

This team is already really good. Add a slot receiver, CB, OG, and LB in the draft and they should be good to go.

With all the DT talent, gotta wonder how much longer Star is on this team. They don’t save much cutting him, but I just don’t see much playing time for him on this team.

 

moleculo

Footballguy
They cut Williams which saved a bunch. They cut Beasley and saved a bunch. 

It’s after the first day of the league year so teams can’t sign new players and go over the salary cap (actually not sure why OverTheCap shows a few teams over the cap because I didn’t think that was allowed at this point). So it’s not about how are they going to get under the cap, they already are.
Sometimes it takes OTC a couple days to update because contract details aren't necessarily made public immediately.  OTC is really nothing more than an aggregator of publicly available contract news and estimates of what the league determines the cap is.

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
I expect the Buffalo d-line to be way better against both the pass and run this year. 

This team is already really good. Add a slot receiver, CB, OG, and LB in the draft and they should be good to go.

With all the DT talent, gotta wonder how much longer Star is on this team. They don’t save much cutting him, but I just don’t see much playing time for him on this team.
Yeah I thought Star was pretty much a lock because of his contract, but now I'm not sure about that at all.  Oliver-Settle-Johnson-Phillips looks like a perfectly fine set of DTs to me, especially considering that we can always add a Justin Zimmer type either by bringing Zimmer back or drafting somebody on day three. 

I can't wait to see the terms for Jordan Phillips and Shaq.  At one point, I'm sure the Bills gave serious consideration to extending or resigning those guys for ~$10M/yr each.  It's pretty wild to have them come back as rotational players probably for something not far from the vet minimum.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
The talent coming into the AFC is insane, but I’m actually pretty happy it all keeps going to tbe AFC West for the most part. Go beat each other up, grab like the 3, 6 and 7 seeds while Buffalo cruises to the #1 seed and a bye.

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
The talent coming into the AFC is insane, but I’m actually pretty happy it all keeps going to tbe AFC West for the most part. Go beat each other up, grab like the 3, 6 and 7 seeds while Buffalo cruises to the #1 seed and a bye.
Seems unfair that Tennessee gets the same advantage.  It's not like they suck or anything, but it's weird to look at their roster and realize that that team is a mortal lock to win 11+ games and at least host a WC game.

 
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The Duff Man

Footballguy
I don’t know what to make of Lawson and Phillips returning. I am not sure if they are good at this point?

McDermott rolls with the wrong player on occasion.  Bates and Davis didn’t see the field as much as they should have last year.  I am hoping these former players returning aren’t going to get rewarded with more playing time than they should get based on performance. 

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
The Duff Man said:
I don’t know what to make of Lawson and Phillips returning. I am not sure if they are good at this point?

McDermott rolls with the wrong player on occasion.  Bates and Davis didn’t see the field as much as they should have last year.  I am hoping these former players returning aren’t going to get rewarded with more playing time than they should get based on performance. 
I don't recall who said this, but I was watching somebody last night who compared this to the Patriots dynasty, where players would get drafted, be awesome, get huge contracts in free agency, flop with their new teams, and return to NE on the cheap and play pretty well.  I can't think of specific examples of that phenomenon because I didn't follow NE's every personnel move while the Bills were mired in mediocrity, but I do remember it being a thing.

Lawson was actually pretty good when he was here.  Never truly great, but by all accounts we seriously considered retaining him.  Same with Phillips.

These guys were early round picks (Shaq was a 1st, Phillips was a 2nd).  They have talent.  And they performed well here in the past.  They're returning to the exact same defense with the same defensive staff.  Our staff seems to do a pretty good job of helping players play up to their potential.  And we only need these guys to be part of a rotation.  Shaq won't even be the primary backup* to either edge rusher if Basham and Epenesa do what they're supposed to do.  Phillips isn't going to displace Oliver or anything like that, and he probably enters camp as our our fourth DT (with the understanding that our various DTs technically play slightly different positions).    

My guess is that both dudes were willing to take very short term contracts near the veteran minimum to rebuild their resume and get a ring while playing someplace where they legitimately wanted to be.  It really does sound like Buffalo is an attractive franchise right now.  We shouldn't look that gift horse in the mouth.  Not after what we all suffered through.

* Actually, I'm calling it now that Lawson may not make the 53 man roster.  Without knowing the details of his contract and without seeing how the draft or the rest of free agency play out, I'd only give him like a 75% chance to make the team and I think that may be too high if anything.

 
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The Duff Man

Footballguy
With Ryan joining Indy it seems like the Bills have the inside track to the 1, with the easiest division and a decent NFC cross over where the two hardest teams, GB and Min both come to Buffalo. 

I feel good about the chances to sweep NE and go 6-0 in division. 

They blew a golden opportunity last year for the #1, or at a minimum the #2 and hosting KC in that crucial game. They can’t make those mistakes again and need to show up every week. 
 

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
With Ryan joining Indy it seems like the Bills have the inside track to the 1, with the easiest division and a decent NFC cross over where the two hardest teams, GB and Min both come to Buffalo. 

I feel good about the chances to sweep NE and go 6-0 in division. 

They blew a golden opportunity last year for the #1, or at a minimum the #2 and hosting KC in that crucial game. They can’t make those mistakes again and need to show up every week. 
 
When you look at just the QBs by division, it’s almost unfair the level of advantage Buffalo has in their division compared to what’s going on in the rest of the AFC.

Allen, Tagovailoa, Wilson, Jones

 Burrows, Watson, Jackson, Trubisky

Ryan, Tannehill, Lawrence, Mills

Wilson, Mahomes, Herbert, Carr

The AFC South was pretty brutal until the Colts got Ryan. That’s a 2 horse race now in that division plus they have to play the AFC West this year.

 

Hot Sauce Guy

Footballguy
Jameson Crowder is a nice depth addition.

Makes me more confident that Gabe Davis is on the ups. 

Crowder gives the Bills an nice slot receiver. I don’t see him as a threat to Davis ascension. 

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
When you look at just the QBs by division, it’s almost unfair the level of advantage Buffalo has in their division compared to what’s going on in the rest of the AFC.
This is what it was like for New England for the better part of two decades.  Not feeling too guilty about it.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
This is what it was like for New England for the better part of two decades.  Not feeling too guilty about it.
Yup. Bill Barnwell asked on Twitter who was the best AFC East QB during Brady’s time in NE and….yuck. Drew Bledsoe? Chad Pennington? Brett Favre? Ryan Fitzpatrick? Ryan Tannehill? Not a lot of great choices.

If you’re willing to accept 1 year, then it would have to be 2001 Peyton Manning when the Colts were still in the AFCE I think.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
All these WRs getting paid $$$$$ and meanwhile Diggs sitting there needing a new deal. Not ideal for Buffalo’s salary cap situation. Definitely not ideal as Diggs turns 29 this year.

 

The Duff Man

Footballguy
All these WRs getting paid $$$$$ and meanwhile Diggs sitting there needing a new deal. Not ideal for Buffalo’s salary cap situation. Definitely not ideal as Diggs turns 29 this year.
I was coming to post the same thing. Might be a very small window to win with Diggs. And Davis is going into his 3rd year, if he shows like I think he will that is going to cause cap problems also. 
Really going to need WR in the draft now.
 

Problem is that they also need CB, OG is still a little concerning unless Bates is retained, and most other teams are going to see what is happening at WR and be looking for good young options on rookie contracts also. 

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
I'm going to be honest and admit that I was going to lose my #### if we carried Bates on our roster all these years as a development project, and then just let him walk in FA when he finally gets a chance to do something and plays well.  I know it wouldn't have been the end of the world or anything, but it would have been irrationally annoying. 

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
I'm probably going to be happy with whoever the Bills draft this week.  They don't have a lot of glaring needs, and Beane has a good track record, so I'll get on board with whatever we do regardless.  

That said, this fan base has gotten really weird about not wanting to take a RB in the first round.  I would have been fine with Etienne last year, and I'd be fine with Breece Hall at 25 this year.  Pick #25 is really more like a 2nd round pick than it is like a top-10 pick.  Aside from P and PK, I think any position can be a perfectly okay pick at that point.  Also, if any team can justify picking a RB in the first round, it's a team that has a wide-open championship window with a franchise QB and top-shelf offense already in place.  A quality RB can absolutely be the piece that allows us to close out tight, one-possession games in the playoffs.  Five years from now, if the Bills are still as good as they are today, we let this guy walk and draft his replacement.  No need to extend the guy, and five years of good RB production on a cost-controlled contract is a darn good use of a late-first.  

If we take a CB or G or whatever in the first, that's fine too.  Just plugging the RB position now so people can't say that being a homer when I stick up for a hypothetical Breece Hall pick on Friday morning.

 

Dr. Octopus

Footballguy
I'm probably going to be happy with whoever the Bills draft this week.  They don't have a lot of glaring needs, and Beane has a good track record, so I'll get on board with whatever we do regardless.  

That said, this fan base has gotten really weird about not wanting to take a RB in the first round.  I would have been fine with Etienne last year, and I'd be fine with Breece Hall at 25 this year.  Pick #25 is really more like a 2nd round pick than it is like a top-10 pick.  Aside from P and PK, I think any position can be a perfectly okay pick at that point.  Also, if any team can justify picking a RB in the first round, it's a team that has a wide-open championship window with a franchise QB and top-shelf offense already in place.  A quality RB can absolutely be the piece that allows us to close out tight, one-possession games in the playoffs.  Five years from now, if the Bills are still as good as they are today, we let this guy walk and draft his replacement.  No need to extend the guy, and five years of good RB production on a cost-controlled contract is a darn good use of a late-first.  

If we take a CB or G or whatever in the first, that's fine too.  Just plugging the RB position now so people can't say that being a homer when I stick up for a hypothetical Breece Hall pick on Friday morning.
As a fan of an opposing team. I really don't see how adding another weapon on offense would be such a terrible thing. I think Hall makes the offense unstoppable (if it's even stoppable now).

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
I'm probably going to be happy with whoever the Bills draft this week.  They don't have a lot of glaring needs, and Beane has a good track record, so I'll get on board with whatever we do regardless.  
Same

If we take a CB or G or whatever in the first, that's fine too.  Just plugging the RB position now so people can't say that being a homer when I stick up for a hypothetical Breece Hall pick on Friday morning.
I'm not going to be upset if they walk away with Hall in the 1st, but I think my preference is slowly turning toward CB. It's not as sexy, but with Tre coming off injury, and being thin at CB, I think that makes the most sense.

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
Anyone in favor of something like this?

2.25, 5.25, 2023 3rd or 4th to go up for Breece Hall?

It depends how far he falls, but I'm going to start getting antsy if he doesn't go pretty quickly when things get started tonight. Reminds me of a few years ago when I was screaming at the TV for them to go up for DK.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Anyone in favor of something like this?

2.25, 5.25, 2023 3rd or 4th to go up for Breece Hall?

It depends how far he falls, but I'm going to start getting antsy if he doesn't go pretty quickly when things get started tonight. Reminds me of a few years ago when I was screaming at the TV for them to go up for DK.
No way am I ok with that. They still have some positions where they need to add guys, so trading a bunch of picks when they didn’t have a bunch to begin with isn’t what I want to see from them. I’m already not thrilled that they traded their 4th I move up 2 spots. Beane is like a 4 year old with $10 in his pocket. He just can’t wait to spend it. He clearly doesn’t buy into the idea of trading down and stockpiling more picks.

The Bills really should be looking to add depth/potential at OG or Center. They need to be looking to add a LBer. They need to be planning a replacement for Poyer. They probably need more depth at TE. And I agree that they probably need a better RB. But I’m betting it doesn’t happen. I think they like Singletary just enough and I also think they put more blame on the O-line than they did on their RBs. I’m not saying I think they are right, but I think it’s very possible how they view things.

All that being said, I could absolutely see Beane trading a bunch of picks to move up to grab Hall if he thinks he is a difference maker.

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
I guess I am on the other end of the spectrum. I don't see this team needing to add much in terms of depth, outside CB and LB. So, I'd rather secure 3 solid, safe, contributors early, then maybe 1 or 2 flyers in rounds 6/7. I just don't see room for 7 more players on this roster.

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
Anyone in favor of something like this?

2.25, 5.25, 2023 3rd or 4th to go up for Breece Hall?

It depends how far he falls, but I'm going to start getting antsy if he doesn't go pretty quickly when things get started tonight. Reminds me of a few years ago when I was screaming at the TV for them to go up for DK.
That seems like too much value to give up, when we "know" we can get a perfectly fine RB if we just sit tight.  Or address some other position if we don't like the RBs available.  I remember wanting the Bills to make a move for DK Metcalf.  I also remember wanting the Bills to make a move for JK Dobbins.  We all remember the moves we were rooting for that would have worked out great -- we forget about the ones that it's just as well that we didn't do.  

I would have been happy with Hall, but CB was the one and only position on this team (other than punter) where a rookie can walk right onto this roster and become an unquestioned starter by Week 1.  We've been trying to replace Levi Wallace for years, and this year we had no choice in the matter. The Bills obviously really like Elam, and this team knows what it's doing with DBs.  Talented player at a premier position that also happens to fill the single hole in our starting roster?  Cool.  

That said, add me to the list of people who is kind of annoyed that we keep trading away mid-round picks for very little reason.  Beane knows more about what's going on around the league than I do, but this is becoming part of his MO, and those picks are really valuable.  I have no objection to the team lighting 6th and 7th rounders on fire, but 4th rounders are going to make our roster and some of those guys will develop into the next Taron Johnson or Gave Davis or Matt Milano or Wyatt Teller or whatever.  There's talent in the middle rounds and Beane does about as well as anybody at nailing those picks.  Let's stop wasting them.

 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
For that matter, I was thrilled when we traded up to draft Cody Ford.  I thought that was a great pick -- worst case scenario he has a long career as a top-shelf G, best case scenario we have our starting RT for the next 10 years.  Well, I over-estimated the worst case scenario.  

The draft is an inexact science.  I really like strategy of accumulating picks (within reason) and not getting locked into any one particular player.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
For anyone thinking that 4th round picks don’t have much value anyway, the Bills drafted both Gabe Davis and Taron Johnson with 4th round picks. They also used 4th round picks to move up to the last pick in the 3rd round to draft Dawson Knox. 

And you have to keep in mind that they have some guys with some huge contracts and that money is going to really start hitting next year especially with Allen’s deal. If you’re not constantly looking to draft several guys a year who can contribute on cheap rookie deals, the team is going to weaken really quickly. 

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
For anyone thinking that 4th round picks don’t have much value anyway, the Bills drafted both Gabe Davis and Taron Johnson with 4th round picks. They also used 4th round picks to move up to the last pick in the 3rd round to draft Dawson Knox. 

And you have to keep in mind that they have some guys with some huge contracts and that money is going to really start hitting next year especially with Allen’s deal. If you’re not constantly looking to draft several guys a year who can contribute on cheap rookie deals, the team is going to weaken really quickly. 
In general, I totally agree. But, if I'm running this team right now, I am not worrying about 2024+. They are so close that I'd be swinging for the fences (to some degree) to try to finally get that 1st ring - similar to what the Rams did last year. The Stafford/Miller/OBJ deals are going to hurt (but probably not destroy) that team real soon, but at least they made it pay off.

 

Obie Wan

Footballguy
Anyone in favor of something like this?

2.25, 5.25, 2023 3rd or 4th to go up for Breece Hall?

It depends how far he falls, but I'm going to start getting antsy if he doesn't go pretty quickly when things get started tonight. Reminds me of a few years ago when I was screaming at the TV for them to go up for DK.
for a Superstar RB, strange the the entire league passed on him.

no need to waste draft assets to move up

functional RBs will be there in rds 3-4 

Damien Pierce   could be one

look for safety, TE, IOL to be on the target list

 

humpback

Footballguy
I'd rather they just signed a guy for fairly cheap like Michel (Gordon would have been great) and kept their draft picks. Unfortunately it doesn't seem like they're too interested in upgrading at RB.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
FWIW, I’m not sure where he is projected to go, but I’d be fine if the Bills sat tight and got James Cook in the 2nd or 3rd round. I think he could be a Kamara/Ekeler type guy. Great 3rd down back with elite receiving ability for a RB that can stretch defenses vertically and burn them with speed but who can also mix it up with quick darts up the middle as well on earlier downs as well at times too.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Could see the Bills going RB, IOL, or LB. A few RBs with great traits and some LBers that seem to have fallen. Both of those positions are long term needs but also places guys could contribute right away. Could maybe see safety as well.

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
I hope you trade-down guys are happy now. :P

Anyway, I'm hoping LB here. Still lots left on the board, so a great move to trade down a couple times here if that is what they are thinking.

I wouldn't be too upset with taking Cook, either. Not sure it's an upgrade over Motor, but worth a shot. (I think???)

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
I hope you trade-down guys are happy now. :P

Anyway, I'm hoping LB here. Still lots left on the board, so a great move to trade down a couple times here if that is what they are thinking.

I wouldn't be too upset with taking Cook, either. Not sure it's an upgrade over Motor, but worth a shot. (I think???)
Love the homerun threat of Cook and his ability as a receiver. He’s a RB that can stress a defense in a lot of ways.

 

Grigs Allmoon

Footballguy
What are the details on these trade-downs? My brother said they now have 4 6ths. If they have a 5th, 4 6ths, and a 7th they need to unload some of those for capital next year or to move their 3rd or 5th up. No way they can roster 6 players drafted in rounds 5-7.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
What are the details on these trade-downs? My brother said they now have 4 6ths. If they have a 5th, 4 6ths, and a 7th they need to unload some of those for capital next year or to move their 3rd or 5th up. No way they can roster 6 players drafted in rounds 5-7.
Yeah, they netted 2 6ths on those trade downs and have 4 total now. Gotta think they’ll use them to move around a bit. Maybe move up in the 3rd and/or trade back into the 4th round.

 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
BTW, lotta chatter about how Cook is small, and he is on the smaller side, but he’s the same exact height as Jamaal Charles was and has almost exactly the same Relative Athletic Score.

 

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