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2022 Detroit Lions Season in the books. Slow 1-6 start, started biting kneecaps to finish strong at 9-8. (2 Viewers)

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
In his presser last week, JBC spoke about the lack of execution in third quarter, how it was a problem all year. Earlier this year I brought this up about Austin, but everyone jumped to his defense.

From a philosophical standpoint, this team does not make halftime adjustments. Repeat: neither the OC or DC has ever said "we made some adjustments " They simply don't do it.

Discuss.

 

Interseptopus

Footballguy
The bloom is definitely off the Cooter rose but I wouldn't cut him loose just yet.  I do think Riddick being out really hurt them...guy has a special skillset

Overall though I think it's hard to be positive about 2017
I think you have to look at this as Caldwell's do or die moment. He set a bar of 9-7 with a 1st round playoff loss. If he doesn't exceed, or even equal that maybe, next year then he has to be gone. He has to be able to take this team over the hump.

I think there are a lot of things to be positive about for 2017... defense looks good, could be better. If you have AA and Riddick back that's a completely different skill set in the backfield that opens up the passing game. 

As a divisional opponent fan, I am not terrified of the Lions making a push for the divisional title next year, but they are the most likely to do so

 

Leroy Hoard

Footballguy
As far as the RB issue goes, I heard a radio guy say they have not been in the top half of the league in rushing in this century. Hard to be a consistent winner without that. So instead of those who like to whine about the coach or the QB, they might want to work on that.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/rushing
postseason totals: http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/rushing

Following up on this, it also helps if you can stop the run. Thomas Rawls?

 

WheelsUp

Footballguy
I like Cooter, but how much of his leash is Caldwells conservative gameplan? Is he calling runs on 3rd and 7 because the HCs gameplan dictates a kill the clock moment or is he doing it on his own accord? When Cooter lets loose he can make this offense do things, look at last year with nothing to lose and then this year with everything to win, it just seemed the Lions played and game planned not to lose more than they played to win. Punting on 4th down in the 4th with just a few minutes left against the Seahawks? Running on 3rd and long a few weeks ago trailing in the 4th? Is that Cooter or Caldwell? I know the OC is calling plays, but does he not follow Caldwells gameplan?

 

King of the Jungle

Footballguy
I like Cooter, but how much of his leash is Caldwells conservative gameplan? Is he calling runs on 3rd and 7 because the HCs gameplan dictates a kill the clock moment or is he doing it on his own accord? When Cooter lets loose he can make this offense do things, look at last year with nothing to lose and then this year with everything to win, it just seemed the Lions played and game planned not to lose more than they played to win. Punting on 4th down in the 4th with just a few minutes left against the Seahawks? Running on 3rd and long a few weeks ago trailing in the 4th? Is that Cooter or Caldwell? I know the OC is calling plays, but does he not follow Caldwells gameplan?
Caldwell doesn't look like he has a game plan so I would be shocked if Cooter didn't have nearly 100% control on play calling. Come to think of it I am not sure I have seen Caldwell talk to anyone during a game. He looks like a mall security guard on the sideline......spending his time equally between daydreaming and random observation. 

 

Leroy Hoard

Footballguy
Caldwell doesn't look like he has a game plan so I would be shocked if Cooter didn't have nearly 100% control on play calling. Come to think of it I am not sure I have seen Caldwell talk to anyone during a game. He looks like a mall security guard on the sideline......spending his time equally between daydreaming and random observation
I could see casting him as Kevin James co-worker in the next Mall Cop movie.

 

zftcg

Footballguy
I will never understand the rush to clean house. Throw out Caldwell, Cooter, Austin ... to what end? So Quinn can hire McDaniels to be as good a HC as every other Belichick disciple who's gotten promoted?

I'm not saying Caldwell is a great HC (he's not, though I also think he's not as bad as everyone says) or that he deserves the job for life. But the way you build a consistent winner is not by tearing everything down every couple years and rebuilding. What's wrong with starting out with a team that makes the playoffs two out of three years and trying to gradually improve it?

And as I alluded to upthread, never forget the experience of the past decade. It can get MUCH worse.

 

msudaisy26

Footballguy
I don't think the Lions were winning anyway, but that finger injury to Stafford was huge. He was the main reason the team was 9 - 4. He never looked right after that injury, if you look at a couple of recent quarterbacks that have had finger injuries on their throwing hand they both had major drop offs, Carr this year before he broke his leg and Palmer last year. This team could be headed in the right direction, but needs more talent pretty much across the board.

 

Leroy Hoard

Footballguy
I will never understand the rush to clean house. Throw out Caldwell, Cooter, Austin ... to what end? So Quinn can hire McDaniels to be as good a HC as every other Belichick disciple who's gotten promoted?

I'm not saying Caldwell is a great HC (he's not, though I also think he's not as bad as everyone says) or that he deserves the job for life. But the way you build a consistent winner is not by tearing everything down every couple years and rebuilding. What's wrong with starting out with a team that makes the playoffs two out of three years and trying to gradually improve it?

And as I alluded to upthread, never forget the experience of the past decade. It can get MUCH worse.
49'ers are a great current example of what not to do.

 

King of the Jungle

Footballguy
I will never understand the rush to clean house. Throw out Caldwell, Cooter, Austin ... to what end? So Quinn can hire McDaniels to be as good a HC as every other Belichick disciple who's gotten promoted?

I'm not saying Caldwell is a great HC (he's not, though I also think he's not as bad as everyone says) or that he deserves the job for life. But the way you build a consistent winner is not by tearing everything down every couple years and rebuilding. What's wrong with starting out with a team that makes the playoffs two out of three years and trying to gradually improve it?

And as I alluded to upthread, never forget the experience of the past decade. It can get MUCH worse.
I poke fun at Caldwell but agree that swapping him with someone probably doesn't change much. The coach is not on the field dropping passes, missing run blocking assignments, or causing penalties. Now of coarse he has a role to play to improve this squad. However I think this team overachieved this year. Which is fine with me. As a Lion's fan I will take 2/3 years in the post season. Would I like to see improvement....absolutely. But we are talking about the ugliest franchise in the NFL....my bar is probably lower than most fan bases. If we are able to find a way to run with more consistency and improve defensively we should once again be in the playoff race next year.

 

msudaisy26

Footballguy
I poke fun at Caldwell but agree that swapping him with someone probably doesn't change much. The coach is not on the field dropping passes, missing run blocking assignments, or causing penalties. Now of coarse he has a role to play to improve this squad. However I think this team overachieved this year. Which is fine with me. As a Lion's fan I will take 2/3 years in the post season. Would I like to see improvement....absolutely. But we are talking about the ugliest franchise in the NFL....my bar is probably lower than most fan bases. If we are able to find a way to run with more consistency and improve defensively we should once again be in the playoff race next year.
I don't think people are mad at Caldwell for the drops, missed assignments and penalties. It is the mistakes he has made, not challenging several plays over the past few years. not expecting a hail mary at the end of a game. The way he saves his timeouts in the 1st half instead of challenging or maybe changing a play that has a bad look. He did get better this year, but in the past he was a ultra conservative play calling/going for it on 4th and short, although I think his improvement this year was more of a Stafford/JBC thing.

 

Dan Lambskin

Footballguy
this team hasn't won a division title in damn near 25 years.  With the exception of the Browns who didn't even exist for part of that time every other team in football has won their division at least twice in that span, and with a few exceptions (Bills, maybe Jags who were also an expansion team) it's 3 or more

it just pains me to see people accept mediocrity because "it could be worse". 

 

TartanLion

Footballguy
In his presser last week, JBC spoke about the lack of execution in third quarter, how it was a problem all year. Earlier this year I brought this up about Austin, but everyone jumped to his defense.

From a philosophical standpoint, this team does not make halftime adjustments. Repeat: neither the OC or DC has ever said "we made some adjustments " They simply don't do it.

Discuss.
To add I'm pretty sure Caldwell came out earlier in the season and literally said that they ( as in the team, including him, not just the coordinators ) don't make half time adjustments. 

 
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BobbyLayne

Footballguy
TartanLion said:
To add I'm pretty sure Caldwell came out earlier in the season and literally said that they ( as in the team, including him, not just the coordinators ) don't make half time adjustments. 
I've watched or listened to every presser this season for all three. Caldwell's are usually 10-20 minutes, the other two are 2-4 minutes if you don't catch the live feed. Around Weeks 5-7 this kept getting asked & philosophically they feel it's a matter of executing of the game plan & not adjustments. I was astounded.

It was amazing listening to them act genuinely confounded before the WC game that their execution in the third quarter hasn't matched the first two quarters. They acknowledged it was a season long problem. "Just one of those things, for whatever reason...."

I feel sorry for the reporters. You need access to do your job so you have to manage the relationship, but I don't how they resist just shouting "Did you consider maybe it has something to do with other teams making halftime adjustments?? Just throwing it out there, I'm just a writer."

 
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Dan Lambskin

Footballguy
I've watched or listened to every presser this season for all three. Caldwell's are usually 10-20 minutes, the other two are 2-4 minutes if you don't catch the live feed. Around Weeks 5-7 this kept getting asked & philosophically they feel it's a matter of executing of the game plan & not adjustments. I was astounded.

It was amazing listening to them act genuinely confounded before the WC game that their execution in the third quarter hasn't matched the first two quarters. They acknowledged it was a season long problem. "Just one of those things, for whatever reason...."

I feel sorry for the reporters. You need access to do your job so you have to manage the relationship, but I don't how they resist just shouting "Did you consider maybe it has something to do with other teams making halftime adjustments?? Just throwing it out there, I'm just a writer."
He should be fired immediately 

 

red stripe

Footballguy
I have confidence in Quinn. Another solid draft and we'll be a little further along. It's not like this team is like one FA or one playmaker away from making a deep run. In an honest assessment, there are a lot of needs.

  • QB - we're good
  • HB - not the most pressing need, if healthy Ameer/Riddick/ZZ can be effective
  • WR/TE - Boldin will be 37 next year, 15th year, not sure if early/healthy Marvin is a true #1, Tate's an excellent gadget guy with terrific YAC, Ebron is making strides but can't block - for all the limitations the current group has, the real need is for a true WR1, and this probably isn't the year to chase one.
  • OL - we're getting there, probably gonna need to add at a minimum a replacement for Reiff and pony up for Warford
  • DL - edge rusher to complement Ziggy
  • LB - biggest need in a landslide in my view, they need either a pass rusher, a cover guy, or a run stuffer - but the current group is the weak link
  • DB - pretty solid group when healthy but like the WR group we're lacking key components. We haven't had a big hitting Safety since Delmas. Lawson & Diggs are solid, Slay is very good, it's an OK S group if everyone comes back, but Quinn is going into year 9. Need someone who can cover or else a hard hitter. You're not gonna find Pro Bowl talent DBs on Day 3, stop dreaming you'll find the next Richard Sherman in the 4th/5th and go for a guy early
  • Ks - good for a long time here
A new HC doesn't address the real issue here, which is talent. But I believe Quinn is on the right track. I haven't become a Caldwell fan by any means but he does bring value to the table. He's a good organizer, he's made some good hires, and the players respond to him. I have zero issue with him coaching in 2017.

If Quinn is as ruthless as we all hope he is, the next coach will have three solid drafts to move forward with, and by then (TC 2018) we'll probably have Stafford and Ziggy re-upped. That team could be poised to make a run. This team isn't.
I like this post a lot and agree with most of it.  I cannot buy into all the talk around town about needing a "lead RB".  I can however get behind going for a big physical WR and/or TE in free agency or the draft.  IMO a lot of running game problems were exacerbated by our WRs not being good blockers and the secondary pressing on them.  Getting a good two-way TE like Butt maybe in 2nd or 3rd would really help IMO.  That 4th down play against the Seahawks, I thought Mulligan had the 1st down if he cut back inside Warford's block but instead he ran right at the tackler and got megastuffed.  We went through what 5 guys behind Ebron this year?   Abdullah and Riddick back healthy and we'll be fine.  But yeah agree with giving Caldwell another year and most of the above needs, with emphasis on BPA; if thats CB/WR in the first grab him and move on.

 

zftcg

Footballguy
this team hasn't won a division title in damn near 25 years.  With the exception of the Browns who didn't even exist for part of that time every other team in football has won their division at least twice in that span, and with a few exceptions (Bills, maybe Jags who were also an expansion team) it's 3 or more

it just pains me to see people accept mediocrity because "it could be worse". 
Who said anything about accepting mediocrity? What I object to is the idea that the only way to get better is by cleaning house.

 

zftcg

Footballguy
49'ers are a great current example of what not to do.
Agreed. Also Philly. I've said elsewhere in this thread that Caldwell is kind of a poor man's Andy Reid. The Eagles were consistently good throughout Reid's tenure (until they had one bad year in '12), but could never get over the top. So they got rid of him and hired the hot HC candidate of that year. Reid has gone on to KC and made the playoffs in three out of four years, while Philly has missed three out of four (and implicitly admitted their mistake by hiring back Reid's OC).

The fact is, outside of NE, Seattle and maybe a couple other teams, every team's fans love to complain about their HC, and how the team would be better if they could just get someone else (look at Bradshaw complaining about Tomlin). There's obviously some selection bias going on, but in general the teams who stick with their coaches over the long term tend to also be the ones who perform better.

There's obviously a point where a coach has worn out his welcome and has to go (Schwartz being a good example), or has such a poor track record that the team needs to move on (Bradley, Fischer). But in general I think teams have far too itchy trigger fingers. When a guy has a winning record, is popular with the players and has built a strong team of assistants, it seems short-sighted to get rid of him.

 

Yenrub

Footballguy
Agreed. Also Philly. I've said elsewhere in this thread that Caldwell is kind of a poor man's Andy Reid. The Eagles were consistently good throughout Reid's tenure (until they had one bad year in '12), but could never get over the top. So they got rid of him and hired the hot HC candidate of that year. Reid has gone on to KC and made the playoffs in three out of four years, while Philly has missed three out of four (and implicitly admitted their mistake by hiring back Reid's OC).

The fact is, outside of NE, Seattle and maybe a couple other teams, every team's fans love to complain about their HC, and how the team would be better if they could just get someone else (look at Bradshaw complaining about Tomlin). There's obviously some selection bias going on, but in general the teams who stick with their coaches over the long term tend to also be the ones who perform better.

There's obviously a point where a coach has worn out his welcome and has to go (Schwartz being a good example), or has such a poor track record that the team needs to move on (Bradley, Fischer). But in general I think teams have far too itchy trigger fingers. When a guy has a winning record, is popular with the players and has built a strong team of assistants, it seems short-sighted to get rid of him.
For those saying the Lions should go in a different direction as far as head coach is concerned. Be careful in what you ask for because the direction the end up going might not be the direction you want.

Look in the division at the Bears. Lovie may not have been a great coach but the Bears were competitive with him as the HC. He went 10-6 in his last season there.

The Bears have not been above .500 in any of the 4 seasons since they fired him, they were .500 the season after he left they have fired Trestman (the guy they replaced him with) and Fox just finished a three win season.

 

jon_mx

Footballguy
Caldwell is a do no harm coach.  He is only as good as his coordinators.  This team will probably get better next year, but will very likily have a worse record as next year's schedule is potentially brutal.  

 

zftcg

Footballguy
Yenrub said:
For those saying the Lions should go in a different direction as far as head coach is concerned. Be careful in what you ask for because the direction the end up going might not be the direction you want.

Look in the division at the Bears. Lovie may not have been a great coach but the Bears were competitive with him as the HC. He went 10-6 in his last season there.

The Bears have not been above .500 in any of the 4 seasons since they fired him, they were .500 the season after he left they have fired Trestman (the guy they replaced him with) and Fox just finished a three win season.
Good example. Even in the prototypical case where this kind of move "worked" -- Bucs firing Dungy because he couldn't get past the first round, then winning the SB in Gruden's first year -- doesn't look so clear cut over the longer term. Dungy built the Colts into a consistent winner (though obviously having Peyton helped with that) and eventually won his own Super Bowl, while Gruden was eight games below .500 over his next six seasons, made the playoffs twice, and yes, lost both times in the first round.

Yes, it's great if you can hire a Belichick, pair him with a Brady, and consistently win 12 games every year. But for everyone else, the best you can hope for is to have a team that makes the playoffs fairly consistently, and hope that in one or two of those years things break your way and you win a Super Bowl. If the Lions can become the NFC version of the Ravens (with a worse coach but a better QB), I'd be very happy.

 

Da Guru

Fair & Balanced
Watching every playoff game so far I have come to the conclusion the Lions are not a playoff caliber team and could not have beat any teams that are in the playoffs.  Just watching yesterday the Packers, Cowboys, Chiefs and Steelers would have destroyed the Lions in a playoff game.

Looking at next years schedule I think 8-8 would be a very lofty goal.

 

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
Watching every playoff game so far I have come to the conclusion the Lions are not a playoff caliber team and could not have beat any teams that are in the playoffs.  Just watching yesterday the Packers, Cowboys, Chiefs and Steelers would have destroyed the Lions in a playoff game.

Looking at next years schedule I think 8-8 would be a very lofty goal.
Had the same thought myself, although i have a different view of next season.

It's obvious the four NFC semi-finalists play the game at a speed and intensity with which the Lions are wholly unfamiliar.

The deficiency in talent is readily apparent, and I don't think the 2016 Lions had enough talent to beat any of them (with AA & Theo maybe a different story.)

That said, I think Quinn is on the right path, building the team from the interior linemen outward, and I expect that talent gap to narrow.

The more I look at the schedule the more I feel like like some of y'all are giving outsized grandeur to thoroughly mediocre teams.

8 home games: I'm not saying the Lions will go 8-0, but I don't think anyone should be surprised if they do. Ford Field is one of the loudest stadiums in the league and the Lions are historically a good home team. 2016 (6-2) won 6 straight at home, 2015 (4-4) mirrored the season - 1-3 first half, 3-1 the second half, 2014 (7-1) total = (17-7) last 3. The 2017 home schedule will be ATL, GB, PIT and 5 teams that finished .500 or worse.

8 away games - as with the home schedule, only 3 teams that finished better than .500: GB, NYG, TB, and 5 who finished .500 or worse. 

We'll see what the draft & FA brings, but I'm not scared of that schedule.

You ever read about the time when Moses sent twelve spies into Canaan? Only two of them thought it was good idea to go into the promised land. They were the only two that crossed over the Jordan 40 years later (Caleb & Joshua.) 

I'll be dead or infirm if the Lions wander in the desert for another forty years.

:lol:

 

Da Guru

Fair & Balanced
Had the same thought myself, although i have a different view of next season.

It's obvious the four NFC semi-finalists play the game at a speed and intensity with which the Lions are wholly unfamiliar.

The deficiency in talent is readily apparent, and I don't think the 2016 Lions had enough talent to beat any of them (with AA & Theo maybe a different story.)

That said, I think Quinn is on the right path, building the team from the interior linemen outward, and I expect that talent gap to narrow.

The more I look at the schedule the more I feel like like some of y'all are giving outsized grandeur to thoroughly mediocre teams.

8 home games: I'm not saying the Lions will go 8-0, but I don't think anyone should be surprised if they do. Ford Field is one of the loudest stadiums in the league and the Lions are historically a good home team. 2016 (6-2) won 6 straight at home, 2015 (4-4) mirrored the season - 1-3 first half, 3-1 the second half, 2014 (7-1) total = (17-7) last 3. The 2017 home schedule will be ATL, GB, PIT and 5 teams that finished .500 or worse.

8 away games - as with the home schedule, only 3 teams that finished better than .500: GB, NYG, TB, and 5 who finished .500 or worse. 

We'll see what the draft & FA brings, but I'm not scared of that schedule.

You ever read about the time when Moses sent twelve spies into Canaan? Only two of them thought it was good idea to go into the promised land. They were the only two that crossed over the Jordan 40 years later (Caleb & Joshua.) 

I'll be dead or infirm if the Lions wander in the desert for another forty years.

:lol:
I think a 5-3 home record would be a success.

 

Ilov80s

Footballguy
Da Guru said:
Watching every playoff game so far I have come to the conclusion the Lions are not a playoff caliber team and could not have beat any teams that are in the playoffs.  Just watching yesterday the Packers, Cowboys, Chiefs and Steelers would have destroyed the Lions in a playoff game.

Looking at next years schedule I think 8-8 would be a very lofty goal.
Lions just didn't have the talent this year. I have to give a lot of credit to Stafford and the coaching staff for getting a playoff appearance out of this team. Stafford's finger limited him a bit, but the real killer of the season was the loss of Ameer and Theo. Lions whole offense revolves around short quick passes and YAC. Ameer and Theo might be the best pair of backs in the league when it comes to making plays in space. Losing them left the offense pretty impotent. 

 

Leroy Hoard

Footballguy
Lions just didn't have the talent this year. I have to give a lot of credit to Stafford and the coaching staff for getting a playoff appearance out of this team. Stafford's finger limited him a bit, but the real killer of the season was the loss of Ameer and Theo. Lions whole offense revolves around short quick passes and YAC. Ameer and Theo might be the best pair of backs in the league when it comes to making plays in space. Losing them left the offense pretty impotent. 
Excellent point. While I would prefer a more traditional (think this years cowboys) running game, I realize not everyone has the worlds best OL to work with. The short passing game is a decent alternative to it though and without RB1 & RB1A there just wasn't the personnel to make it happen. 

 

kutta

Footballguy
Hate to hijack, but wanted to take a minute thank everyone who gave me suggestions on what to do in Detroit. I had a great time. Here are some highlights.

1. I took a tour of old abondned buildings (https://www.tripadvisor.com/AttractionProductDetail?product=9636P1&d=42139&aidSuffix=xsell&partner=Viator). It was very cool. We went to an old school, the GM plant, an old motor plant, and an old church. Saw lots of cool grafitti as well as some pretty cool architecture. It was freaking cold though!

2. I drove by my old houses. The one I lived in longest is at Hubbel and Grand River. It was amazing to see what has happened to that area (as well as many others). I was amazed how deserted Grand River was.

3. Saw relatives in Detroit and made a trip to Cleveland. It was great seeing everyone.

4. I stayed right across the street from the Sweetwater Tavern, so I spent most of my time there. It was so cold, and I didn't want to drive, so at night I would walk that area and hit a few bars. Jacoby's was right there too, so I spent some time there.

5. I tried to watch the game at Cheli's, but it was closed! I was shocked. So many of the bars downtown were closed So, I made my way back to sweetwater tavern and watched it there. I loved the wings there, and I think I had them 3 nights in a row.

6. I tried Fishbone's one night. I thought it was good but not great. I had ribs and a crab appetizer.

7. I LOVED the stadium area. Ford Field right by Comerica Park is super cool. I can't wait to come back for a game.

Overall, I loved it there. It was great to see home again after all this time. It's good to see some of the revitalization going on, and I couldn't help but think that I'd lke to get involved in that somehow. I may actually start looking at some buildings to purchase for apartments, as I've been doing some apartment investments here in Phoenix, so it seems like a good fit.

I'll be back for sure for the Cardinals game next year. Hopefully I'll get the chance to meet some of you guys for real.

 

Snorkelson

Footballguy
A nice step forward this year would have been a home playoff game. Still, making the playoffs 2 out of 3 years seems like progress. The online seemed to be better this year than recent memory, love the youth movement but Reiff looks like he wants to test FA as a LT. Defense played better as the year went on, but still has a lot of needs. 

One thing I notice watching the packers is all the wr they have that they drafted. Part of it is Rodgers just making them all look good, but they seem to take a wr every year if not 2. DET waited on fuller for years, and I like jones, but it seems we draft one guy and try to wait 4 yrs to see what we have (outside of the Millen era of course). We need depth in the wr core (te included), depth on the online, and a difference maker on defense (along with depth). I'd be ok with boldin being back. 

I think if we draft a rb it will be a later round banger, but we may ignore the position to be honest. Zenner looked like he can bang it, and Washington looked good early. Riddick and Abdullah are great pass catchers, and AA can be a factor in the return game as well, freeing up a wr spot (unless you really like Roberts, is rather see some youth). I keep writing some of this and walking away so I feel like I'm rambling. Go lions!

 

Da Guru

Fair & Balanced
Nice to see Kyle Van Noy  contributing for the Super Bowl bound Pats.    Lions are really weak at LB could use a player like him.

 
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Snorkelson

Footballguy
Receiving core in 2017 could look way different behind Tate, jones, and ebron. Boldin pondering retirement, moving on from Roberts, tj jones is a fa (I think), wouldn't blame him if he moved on after being the 5th wr with 4 on the roster. Let's say Abdullah/Washington are options on special teams (or hey, maybe let Tate return punts!) jace billingsly may be an option off psquad, still room for 1-2 wr and 1-2 backup te. There is certainly a role in this offense for another relevant player.  I would love to see 2 years of desean Jackson here, but that may be too pricy. Marques Wilson would be a field stretching tall downfield target, kamar Aiken would be a boldin possession replacement. Perhaps they resign tj jones for that role as well. I don't see them using a premium pick on a wr or one of the talented tes at the top of a stacked te class. Perhaps a dark horse landing spot for Cory Davis if they do use an early pick. Could be bpa in rd 1.

Id like to see a vet te backup signing, maybe kick the tires on Julius (assuming he's a cap cut) or Vernon Davis. 

I see an oline/defense heavy draft, meaning we likely roll the committee of rbs out again. Maybe use a mid round pick to add someone to pound it with zenner and Washington ends up on psquad or somewhere else. Try to fix the run game by adding oline talent. 

 

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
Unrestricted Free Agents (20)

QB Dan Orlovsky (33 years old)
RB Joique Bell (30)
WR Anquan Boldin (36)
WR Andre Roberts (29)
TE Clay Harbor (29)
TE Matthew Mulligan (31)
TE Tim Wright (26)
OT Riley Reiff (28)
G Larry Warford (25)
G Garrett Reynolds (29)*
DE Devin Taylor (27)
DE Armonty Bryant (26)
DT Stefan Charles (28)
DT Tyrunn Walker (26)
LB Jonathan Bostic (25)
LB Josh Bynes (27)
CB Asa Jackson (27)
CB Crezdon Butler (29)
S Rafael Bush (29)
LS Don Muhlbach (35)

Restricted Free Agents (2)

RT Cornelius Lucas (25)
DT Khyri Thornton (27)

Exclusive-rights Free Agents (4)

WR TJ Jones (24)
DT Kerry Hyder (25)
LB Brandon Copeland (25)

The priorities, IMO, s/b Boldin, Roberts (to keep AA & Tate off KR/PR), Warford, Bush & Hyder. Let TJJ walk he's never been consistent. 

Def want to see LB/OL/DB emphasized in the first two days. Keep building it from the inside out. Personally I'd wait a year to invest heavily in RB/WR but wouldn't be surprising if they decided to upgrade the latter.

The nice thing about the EE option is they don't need to decide until May - after FA signings & the draft.

 

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
Amazing stat I read today:

In 16 games, Lions LBs failed to record a sack, forced fumble or interception.

That is astonishing lack of impact.

 

Yenrub

Footballguy
What can you guys tell me about Rieff? Is he a guy the Giants should be looking at for help at LT? Is he going to cost them a ton of money?

 

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
Yenrub said:
What can you guys tell me about Rieff? Is he a guy the Giants should be looking at for help at LT? Is he going to cost them a ton of money?
He's not gonna cost LT money.

He was thoroughly mediocre at LT, marginally better at RT. That was the book on him coming out of college, perfectly competent OT but not good enough to be an elite blind side protector.

You don't want the Giants to sign him IMO.

 

Ilov80s

Footballguy
Hate to hijack, but wanted to take a minute thank everyone who gave me suggestions on what to do in Detroit. I had a great time. Here are some highlights.

1. I took a tour of old abondned buildings (https://www.tripadvisor.com/AttractionProductDetail?product=9636P1&d=42139&aidSuffix=xsell&partner=Viator). It was very cool. We went to an old school, the GM plant, an old motor plant, and an old church. Saw lots of cool grafitti as well as some pretty cool architecture. It was freaking cold though!

2. I drove by my old houses. The one I lived in longest is at Hubbel and Grand River. It was amazing to see what has happened to that area (as well as many others). I was amazed how deserted Grand River was.

3. Saw relatives in Detroit and made a trip to Cleveland. It was great seeing everyone.

4. I stayed right across the street from the Sweetwater Tavern, so I spent most of my time there. It was so cold, and I didn't want to drive, so at night I would walk that area and hit a few bars. Jacoby's was right there too, so I spent some time there.

5. I tried to watch the game at Cheli's, but it was closed! I was shocked. So many of the bars downtown were closed So, I made my way back to sweetwater tavern and watched it there. I loved the wings there, and I think I had them 3 nights in a row.

6. I tried Fishbone's one night. I thought it was good but not great. I had ribs and a crab appetizer.

7. I LOVED the stadium area. Ford Field right by Comerica Park is super cool. I can't wait to come back for a game.

Overall, I loved it there. It was great to see home again after all this time. It's good to see some of the revitalization going on, and I couldn't help but think that I'd lke to get involved in that somehow. I may actually start looking at some buildings to purchase for apartments, as I've been doing some apartment investments here in Phoenix, so it seems like a good fit.

I'll be back for sure for the Cardinals game next year. Hopefully I'll get the chance to meet some of you guys for real.
Very cool. Hit me up if you need advice. Do you like cocktails and nice food? Detroit food and drink scene is out of control right now.

 

Ilov80s

Footballguy
Hyder, Taylor, Ebron and Warford need to be back IMO. We don't have the talent to let any of them walk. Priorities need to be getting a legit deep threat at WR. Kenny Stills maybe? Need something at LG. Maybe they think someone can develop, but Laken looks like a total bust. The whole front 7 needs help. Ziggy, A'Shawn, Taylor and Hyder seem like the only guys we have that are worth building around. I am worried Levy just might be done. Kawann Short or Chandler Jones would be huge. There are also a lot of good corners/safeties out there. It wouldn't hurt to get one in FA. The good news about the draft is that it's loaded with defensive players so Detroit should get what they need. 

 

Snorkelson

Footballguy
What can you guys tell me about Rieff? Is he a guy the Giants should be looking at for help at LT? Is he going to cost them a ton of money?
The LT free agent class is pretty weak, I see some team going after reiff as a LT. I don't blame him really, he has some experience, he is probably better than what some teams have, not a lot of standout LT in the draft, and he will make more money. Hopefully a nice chunk so we get a nice comp pick. 

Hyder, Taylor, Ebron and Warford need to be back IMO. We don't have the talent to let any of them walk. Priorities need to be getting a legit deep threat at WR. Kenny Stills maybe? Need something at LG. Maybe they think someone can develop, but Laken looks like a total bust. The whole front 7 needs help. Ziggy, A'Shawn, Taylor and Hyder seem like the only guys we have that are worth building around. I am worried Levy just might be done. Kawann Short or Chandler Jones would be huge. There are also a lot of good corners/safeties out there. It wouldn't hurt to get one in FA. The good news about the draft is that it's loaded with defensive players so Detroit should get what they need. 
I don't see stills in our price range. We have some cap space I believe, so hopefully we can resign some of our needs and make one splash in fa then go after cheap guys. Draft bpa, even if it's a wr or te.

 

bicycle_seat_sniffer

Smells like chicken
Very cool. Hit me up if you need advice. Do you like cocktails and nice food? Detroit food and drink scene is out of control right now.
So many cool new places that nobody can keep up unless you live down there.  My bil and my cousin both have apartments in downtown now and its really amazing

 

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
Orlovsky wait...eh, it was a run.

Rudock will be the #2 QB next year

Lions @ $32.8M in Cap space, 16th in the NFL

New scoreboards and other stuff - $100M renovation. Hard to believe this will be their 16th year at Ford Field.

 

Leroy Hoard

Footballguy
Orlovsky wait...eh, it was a run.

Rudock will be the #2 QB next year

Lions @ $32.8M in Cap space, 16th in the NFL

New scoreboards and other stuff - $100M renovation. Hard to believe this will be their 16th year at Ford Field.
No-brainer imo. Orlovsky was near the bottom when it comes to backups. Hopefully an upgrade is in the works, with Rudock as the #3 guy on the practice squad.

http://sidelionreport.com/2017/02/19/detroit-lions-dan-orlovsky-still-likely-sign-backup-2017/

 

BobbyLayne

Footballguy
No-brainer imo. Orlovsky was near the bottom when it comes to backups. Hopefully an upgrade is in the works, with Rudock as the #3 guy on the practice squad.

http://sidelionreport.com/2017/02/19/detroit-lions-dan-orlovsky-still-likely-sign-backup-2017/
Staff was the only QB to take every snap last year, right? Meh, not much of a concern since he's had 99 straight starts. Just looked it up, 11th all-time, needs 11 more to move into 10th (Eli, Rivers & Ryan ahead of him on the active list.) If they all stay healthy for a couple more years, the top 4 active streaks could all be in the top 6 (Farve, Peyton.)

Looking at mocks it seems like edge rusher is the consensus at #21, the only question is which one. The Ebron decision is after FA & the drafts, though personally I'd rather see LB, OL & DB addressed before we look for a TE replacement.

 

Leroy Hoard

Footballguy
D Front 7 BPA for me, RB & OL in middle rounds and/or FA's. I think Quinn knows more than the last few guys making these decisions but things still have to fall your way.

 

Ilov80s

Footballguy
Not sure how they handle FA, but they have enough money to make a couple splash moves. Looking at tackle options out there at tackle in the draft and FA makes it pretty clear we should brig Reiff back. I guess the same with Warford although he played his best football as a rookie. 

Guys I like in the draft:

Reuben Foster (LB) from Bama .He is exactly the big, strong, athletic guy we need making plays at the 2nd level. Sounds like he will likely be gone, but he's got a shoulder injury that could cause his stock to cool. 

Derrek Barnett (DE) is the rare college player with 3 years of high level play. Recording 9,10 and 13 sacks in his 3 season with the Vols. Add in another 52 tackles for loss and you get a really consistent player that showed the ability make plays in the backfield against the best competition in college football. Bama is the ultimate measuring stick, DB has played Bama 3 times and taken on several NFL players. Here is his stat line from those games:  11 tackles, 4.5 tackles for loss, 2 sacks 1 interception, 1 forced fumble. For some reason the knock I have heard is that he will struggle to rush the passer in the NFL. That seems like a weird thing to say to about a DE that led the SEC in sacks. He would look great compliment to Ziggy. DB is less athletically gifted but bigger and stronger. 

Budda Baker, is an undersized safety from Washington but what he lacks in size, he makes up for with short area bust, deep long speed, cover skills and the extra level athleticism to make big plays. When he finds a guy that needs tackling, he gets there so quickly that it seems to constantly catch ball carriers off guard. He seems to have the skills to be a very versatile DB, covering slot guys and playing CF. Budda has a guy that I have seen mocked as late as the 3rd round and as early as the top 20. His combine will really impact where he goes. He has gotten some Bob Sanders comparisons, but I don't think he's anywhere near as physical as Bob was which maybe will allow Budda to stay healthier. Budda is fun to watch fly around and make plays.

Jarrad Davis. See everything I said about Reueben Foster, but replace Bama with Florida and  shoulder with ankle. 

Karlos Henderson. WR from LA. Tech can add the speed that the Lions must get in the offseason. There was no deep threat and teams could crowd the Lions offense. Detroit desperately needs the element of speed to make space for Tate, Ameer, Ebron, and Riddick. Karlos is small burner but he has a outside WR mentality. The nice part is that besides the go routes that he runs with his blazing speed, he also excels at quick passes and beating defenders with the ball in his hand. We know how important that is for the Lions offense and how much they missed that when Theo and Ameer were both out.  Could Karlos add a Tyreek Hill electricity to the Lions offense?

 

Snorkelson

Footballguy
Jace billingsly looked pretty good last preseason. While I think he would be a decent add to the roster, I hope it's as wr4 or 5. We need an option in the red zone. With a very good te class maybe we find a guy later that would normally be drafted higher. 

Didnt list any CBs or oline, could be some good options on the board when we pick. 

 

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