6-6 with a team that traded it's best player. Had no QB to speak of. Was probably as low as it gets after trading CMC. Yet he rallied them to play hard and dam near won the division.
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2023 Carolina Panthers: Ok, so... Rome wasn't built in a day (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Jayrok
- Start date
You want to see "average", look no further than Reich. He accomplished less with more talent than Wilks had.
BassNBrew
IBL Representative
No, it got lower when they release Mayfield and he led the hapless Rams to two wins in the final five games. Heck, he almost almost Upset Seattle in the last game. Is anyone anointing him starter for the Rams over Stafford?
Jayrok
Footballguy
I'm cautiously optimistic about the hire. On the one hand, I'm glad Tepper didn't toss the dice at some college or NFL OC with no HC experience. OTOH, I think I'd rather have Reich as the OC vice HC.
If he can hire a good OC and get the QB right, I think the future could be bright. Wish Wilks would stay on as DC but I'm sure that possibility is shot.
We'll see how it plays out. At least it is an offensive minded coach... first one for the Panthers IIRC.
If he can hire a good OC and get the QB right, I think the future could be bright. Wish Wilks would stay on as DC but I'm sure that possibility is shot.
We'll see how it plays out. At least it is an offensive minded coach... first one for the Panthers IIRC.
Deamon
Footballguy
This would have been great. I think Reich is a meh HC but a really good OC. That said, I doubt much thought will go into getting a good OC, Reich will handle those duties too so any OC will basically just be in name.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Plus that division was terrible.
Jayrok
Footballguy
Outside of his coaching staff, seems his first order of business is the QB position. Do they draft one or give him a shot at making Darnold better?
I've seen mocks of Carolina picking Levis. One has Stroud but seems he'll be long gone by then. Not sure what to make of Levis. Do they try to move up? Levis has good size and a strong arm but there are lots of failed QBs that have/had those qualities.
Who will be OC, Kingsbury?
I've seen mocks of Carolina picking Levis. One has Stroud but seems he'll be long gone by then. Not sure what to make of Levis. Do they try to move up? Levis has good size and a strong arm but there are lots of failed QBs that have/had those qualities.
Who will be OC, Kingsbury?
Desert_Power
Footballguy
I don't think he's great at all, but it was a good record for as bad as the team he took over was (then trading the best player). He got the players to buy in and fight for him. I thought that was something to build on. I think that Tampa game goes very different if Horn isn't hurt. Evans abused the backups.
Still, Reich is a good hire. I just think hiring Wilks full time would have been good too.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Klingsbury would probably rather keep chilling in Thailand.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I definitely do not think this moves the needle at all for the panthers if their goal is to go on a deep Playoff run
I never hear about Reich being an offensive innovator
Reich is 61 years old, he's had plenty of time to separate himself as a great head coach
40-33, only 54% he wins...he's about a .500 coach which is average, he's nothing more than average
1-2 in the Playoffs, he's not out coaching his competition
I don't understand why this is exciting for Panthers' fans.
But I don't believe Steve Wilks is the answer either fyi.
If the Niners can go 8-0 with a 7th Rd Rookie QB, trust me there's a lot more problems with Carolina than just QB play.
Carolina would have been better off with a higher draft pick, they should be a Top3 but they inserted a guy with an axe to grind and he did and almost won the South and didn't get the controls until Week 6
Wilks said the right things IMO, nothing wrong with expressing some disappointment for being passed up on a job hiring/interview plus he wasn't interim for a couple games, it felt like his team since he was coaching them most of the season. I think Wilks will get another interview with a different team.
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
This is an excellent point, CMC is in the NFCC and will have to carry the load and more if they are to get past Philly.
But I also believe when you cannot keep a superstar like CMC and make the team work around him.
They don't deserve a franchise QB, look what they did with a franchise RB, some organizations are just bad that way.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Here is what I wrote back in Dec 2019 about Tepper
@BassNBrew and I were discussing the Panthers
"And what does Tepper know about finding his next head coach? From what I've heard Tepper wanted Rivera gone almost as soon as he bought the team. He is a hedge fund guy and he couldn't wait to put his big Wallstreet Beak into the team's operations and I'm scared he will start weighing on draft picks. What qualifies Tepper as being an expert on the NFL? Did I miss where this guy is All World at running a professional football team in the NFL? All he did was buy the team...a lot of businesses fail when their is "New Ownership"
Plus this guy might want to familiarize himself with the Rooney Rule, he can't really jump the gun on hiring anyone and this isn't the NCAA and a rush to recruit HS football players before Christmas, everyone is on a level field int he NFL, many times you have to wait until almost the Super Bowl, the hot OC/DC is on a strong playoff team so i just don't buy that this hedge fund wizard is smarter than anyone else in the NFL. I also think he made a KNEE JERK reaction like a little baby who got his butt beat by Washington, which still has quite a fan base in North Carolina, a stone's throw from D.C. He felt embarrassed and wanted to take it out on someone, why not the guy you're going to fire anyways, right?
This was a rookie/newbie owner move that usually doesn't lead to a lot of long term success, we'll see what happens but so far this owner is not showing the patience needed to earn a Lombardi Trophy anytime soon, IMHO."
BnB actually focused on the Rooney Rule, pointing out that Tepper used to be a small part owner of the Steelers, I knew that but I thought it showcased a glaring point and Tepper has done it yet again. He seems to want to insert a minority as the interim coach and then he never has to interview a minority candidate.
Later in this exchange I posted
"Exactly, so he takes the DBs Coach and let's him run things for 4 weeks so he can skirt the rule.
Zero chance he hires that guy and now he has fulfilled the Rooney Rule"
Matt Rhule came and went, Wilks lasted 12 games, Reich will make his 4th or 5th Head Coach since he bought the team from denim loving Jerry Richardson.
I think we all know in 2-3 years we will be right back here looking for the next Carolina Head Coach
@BassNBrew and I were discussing the Panthers
"And what does Tepper know about finding his next head coach? From what I've heard Tepper wanted Rivera gone almost as soon as he bought the team. He is a hedge fund guy and he couldn't wait to put his big Wallstreet Beak into the team's operations and I'm scared he will start weighing on draft picks. What qualifies Tepper as being an expert on the NFL? Did I miss where this guy is All World at running a professional football team in the NFL? All he did was buy the team...a lot of businesses fail when their is "New Ownership"
Plus this guy might want to familiarize himself with the Rooney Rule, he can't really jump the gun on hiring anyone and this isn't the NCAA and a rush to recruit HS football players before Christmas, everyone is on a level field int he NFL, many times you have to wait until almost the Super Bowl, the hot OC/DC is on a strong playoff team so i just don't buy that this hedge fund wizard is smarter than anyone else in the NFL. I also think he made a KNEE JERK reaction like a little baby who got his butt beat by Washington, which still has quite a fan base in North Carolina, a stone's throw from D.C. He felt embarrassed and wanted to take it out on someone, why not the guy you're going to fire anyways, right?
This was a rookie/newbie owner move that usually doesn't lead to a lot of long term success, we'll see what happens but so far this owner is not showing the patience needed to earn a Lombardi Trophy anytime soon, IMHO."
BnB actually focused on the Rooney Rule, pointing out that Tepper used to be a small part owner of the Steelers, I knew that but I thought it showcased a glaring point and Tepper has done it yet again. He seems to want to insert a minority as the interim coach and then he never has to interview a minority candidate.
Later in this exchange I posted
"Exactly, so he takes the DBs Coach and let's him run things for 4 weeks so he can skirt the rule.
Zero chance he hires that guy and now he has fulfilled the Rooney Rule"
Matt Rhule came and went, Wilks lasted 12 games, Reich will make his 4th or 5th Head Coach since he bought the team from denim loving Jerry Richardson.
I think we all know in 2-3 years we will be right back here looking for the next Carolina Head Coach
Desert_Power
Footballguy
The way this roster has been constructed, I feel this is inevitable regardless of the choice. That’s part of the reason I thought Wilks should get it. Too difficult to get the franchise QB. Take the free roll of a coach the players obviously love.
Yenrub
Footballguy
How is Frank Reich's loss to a two-win Jacksonville team with a playoff berth on the line (last game of the season in 2021) any different than the Panthers loss to Tampa that you describe here?
BassNBrew
IBL Representative
I was hoping for McVeigh.
Not sure Wilkes was the guy to recruit a new QB with that puke display last year. Not confident he was the guy to groom a rookie.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
That vet is going to be Darnold.
Jayrok
Footballguy
Well with how the coaching staff is shaping up, can't blame ownership for the lack of effort. I like McCown as QB coach and the addition of Caldwell. Capers is interesting too. That's a lot of experience joining Reich's staff.
Wonder what they're thinking about the first round pick. Is Derek Carr a panther tomorrow?
Wonder what they're thinking about the first round pick. Is Derek Carr a panther tomorrow?
higgins
Footballguy
When you’ve got that much offensive coaching experience (which would have been emphasized by ex-QB Reich), I would have to guess they’re going rookie?
Jayrok
Footballguy
I wouldn't mind seeing them go after one of the top rookie QBs as opposed to signing and building around Carr. I think Carr would be an upgrade from QBs we've had in previous years but I don't think he's the long term answer. I just wonder if they sign Carr, how will they approach the 9th pick in the draft.
The Commish
Footballguy
RIP Jerry
Birdie048
Footballguy
Joined by Miles Sanders
The Commish
Footballguy
You jump ship GB? I don't blame you but I'm still holding on and I agree...this is a bad deal. If they end up taking Stroud, I'll likely hop off the bandwagon. Stay away from him and they could be back to 500 in a few years.
True
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
What if they take Bryce?
ARich?
I’d rather have Stroud than Richardson. I know he looks like Cam, that doesn’t make him play like Cam.
Why the Stroud hate? Kid looks like a winner.
The Commish
Footballguy
Stroud's had one good game against a really good team in his career at OSU, IMO and that was the game against UGA in the playoff this year. Any time he's run across a team that has a remotely decent NFL type defense, he struggles. I don't see him being any better than Justin Fields and the Panthers need a much larger ceiling based on what they gave up in this ridiculous trade.
I'm not sold on this lot of QBs, but Bryce seems like the best of the lot to me. I don't believe he's worth what the Panthers gave up either. They got worked pretty good on this one.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
That’s just not accurate at all.
BassNBrew
IBL Representative
Yeah, I moved on to SF with Cmac. Cats will still be my NFC South team.
Lehigh98
Footballguy
Desert_Power
Footballguy
I am not really sold Young or Stroud, but this seems a very reasonable price to pay to move to #1
Jayrok
Footballguy
Not sure how I feel yet. Guess it depends on who they pick. Hate losing DJ and not loving losing the 1st rounder in 2024, but the rest of the picks don't bother me as much.
Awful thin at WR now. Surely they'll sign one in FA. Easier to find a good WR than a QB, so I'll give give the new staff time to develop this team.
Torn between Young and Stroud. Don't want Levis and despite the combine numbers, I don't think the Panthers would have needed to go to #1 to get him.
I guess time will tell if it's a good trade. Cautiously optimistic. Looking forward to see how it pans out.
Awful thin at WR now. Surely they'll sign one in FA. Easier to find a good WR than a QB, so I'll give give the new staff time to develop this team.
Torn between Young and Stroud. Don't want Levis and despite the combine numbers, I don't think the Panthers would have needed to go to #1 to get him.
I guess time will tell if it's a good trade. Cautiously optimistic. Looking forward to see how it pans out.
Jayrok
Footballguy
I feel this way about the Jags. Never really had an AFC team but being a Clemson fan, this young Jags team fits the bill. Pulling for them.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Yeah, right now his college receivers would far exceed his pro. That's no way to enter the NFL
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
That 1 game was pretty good, also, of course. His pocket presence is uncanny - this play was brilliant. Mahomsian escapability & throw.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
To be fair, if an NFL team had Olave, JSN, Wilson,Marvin Harrison Jr and Egbuka it would potentially be the greatest WR room in NFL history.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
On the other hand, the Panthers showed a much improved offensive line and have some (IMO) elite defensive players. There are worse ways to enter the NFL.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Yeah, Stroud is legit.
At age 20, against UM, MSU, Oregon, Utah, Penn State he averaged 73%, 437 yards, 3.6 TDs, 0.4 Ints
At age 21, against ND, Wisc, MSU, Iowa, PSU, UM, UGA he averaged 70%, 307 yards, 3.4 TDs, 0.7 Ints
Not sure what else you can expect him to do. In the biggest game of his career, against the best team in college football, he was the best player on the field.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Can say it any better than that.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
I have liked what I've seen from both Stroud and Young at the college level. Firmly believe OSU wins that game if Harrison doesn't get hurt. There is a clean tier break after them IMO.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Yeah - agreed. Underwear Olympics got the hype trains roaring down the track, but it looks like 2 QBs and 2 projects.
It’ll be interesting to see if the NFL sees it the same way.
That's Van's Dad yeah? I could see him getting traded for a late pick. DHop I guess but doesn't seem they are ready to make a move like that. There's a few WR they could sign reasonably in FA. DJ Chark or Thielen could start for this team. Jakobi Meyers obviously would be a 1 here.
Yes Van's dead and he's not much but then they don't have much, they just passed the Giants as worst WR group in the league.
As for Hop I have no idea, just spitballing and maybe they'd prefer to go in a different direction but a lot reasons for it to make sense, at least to me.
I think he's a WR1, I don't view Meyers or those others in that regard. Would be a big assist to whoever they draft. They don't have a #1 or #2 pick next year so no reason to try and delay the process of trying to compete. Their defense is strong, the division is weak, and if the rookie can provide them competent play they might think they can win the division.
As for Hopkins he is from South Carolina, not quite returning home but in the close vicinity, and Shawn was his WR coach last year.
Probably never happen, lol.
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