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2023 Cleveland Browns - 7-5, Jaguars Limping into Cleveland (9 Viewers)

Browns Make Decision on LT Jedrick Wills Jr. Fifth-Year Option

Browns Make Decision on LT Jedrick Wills Jr. Fifth-Year Option​

Cleveland Browns have decided to pickup the fifth-year option on their left tackle Jedrick Wills Jr.
It seemed to be heading this way but the Cleveland Browns have decided to pick up the fifth-year option on Jedrick Wills Jr.’s contract. Wills is now guaranteed a salary of nearly $14.2 million in 2024 ...
... The $14.2 million would currently not be in the top 15 of the highest-paid left tackles in the NFL. Contracts aren’t getting cheaper for tackles so this choice probably wasn’t all that hard for Cleveland. After all, Wills has shown in the past he’s capable of being that guy long-term. It has been the consistency that’s been the issue...
Go to the link for the full read.
 
Haven't been here in a bit, but man do some things never change.

Like the Tillman pick. If he was in last year's draft, he could've been a 1st/2nd rnd pick easy. I think he came back from his injury too soon (whether it was his decision or the coach's), and that hurt his performance. Given more time off and a good QB throwing to him, I think he'll be an impact on this team.

The DT/NT from Baylor is a big boy. We sorely need that in the front. Put that with Tomlinson and I think he'll grow into a starter with Schwartz.

McGuire is a great late round pick. I think he could flourish opposite Myles. Another steal candidate, IMO.

Jones and Wypler are solid depth. Jones will be good if he gets out of his own way. He made some bonehead moves after the season by putting on weight, leaving the Senior event early, and then refusing to get on a scale at the OSU scout day. Not sure where his head's at, but physically he can be an anchor at RT on this line. Hopefully Callahan can whip these two into shape.

Overall, I think it was a good draft. I didn't see any major reaches, and most areas of need were addressed. I would've like to have seen a LB selected, but it looks like they pulled a few UDFAs to fight for a spot - so I guess we'll see what happens.
 
Dawand Jones@dawandj79
False like where do y'all get this information from
Dov Kleiman@NFL_DovKleiman
Update: #Browns 6'8, 359 pound OT Dawand Jones was mocked by many as a 1st round pick in the 2023 Draft, but he fall to the 4th round, now we learn why.
Jones told teams during interviews his that dream is to play in the NBA, not NFL, which turned them off to him.
He also dealt with weight questions and mishandled the Senior Bowl and Pro Day, per @AlbertBreer
* PFF mocked Jones going 11th overall to the #Titans a day before the draft, 33rdTeam had him as high as 8th overall to the #Falcons
 
we absolutely STOLE him (dawand).

the story sounds like one of those "when I was a kid the nba was my dream" and then when it's silly season that warps into "i dont want to play in the nfl, i want to play in the nba"

i know some guys are dumb... but that's not even dumb that's basically saying these kids told their employer NOT to give him millions so he could pursue an impossible dream (he's 360pnds ffs)
 
Soulfly3 said:
we absolutely STOLE him (dawand).

the story sounds like one of those "when I was a kid the nba was my dream" and then when it's silly season that warps into "i dont want to play in the nfl, i want to play in the nba"

i know some guys are dumb... but that's not even dumb that's basically saying these kids told their employer NOT to give him millions so he could pursue an impossible dream (he's 360pnds ffs)
Click to expand...
With margins as thin as they are in the NFL commitment matters.
 
MAC_32 said:
Soulfly3 said:
we absolutely STOLE him (dawand).

the story sounds like one of those "when I was a kid the nba was my dream" and then when it's silly season that warps into "i dont want to play in the nfl, i want to play in the nba"

i know some guys are dumb... but that's not even dumb that's basically saying these kids told their employer NOT to give him millions so he could pursue an impossible dream (he's 360pnds ffs)
Click to expand...
With margins as thin as they are in the NFL commitment matters.
Click to expand...
agreed. this could be nothing or it could be similar to the Justin Gilbert "I don't do mornings" comment.

at least they took the swing in the fourth round and not the first.

there's actually a fair number of players that hate playing football and are only there for the money.
 
If a team can draft a player who was legitimately projected with 1st round talent in the fourth round then the upside is well worth the 'gamble'.
I think the expectations will and should be lowered as a developmental player who 'could' eventually work in as a RT replacement for Conklin instead of 'lofty' projections that he'd replace Jed at LT.
Considering Conklin's injury history any backup needs to be ready to get real game reps this year so I expect we will get to see what he is capable of by the end of this season.
Add: I've seen enough of these fluff pieces that I don't buy hype but passing along since the OSU pipeline was tapped this draft.
-----------------
Browns: Luke Wypler dubbed as 'draft steal' with pick no. 190
...the Browns may have their future starter.

And Doug Farrar at Touchdown Wire thinks the Browns found a gem with Wypler:

“Wypler isn’t the most powerful center in this class at 6-foot-3 and 303 pounds, but he’s smart, tough, and he kept C.J. Stroud clean last season with just one sack and seven total pressures allowed in 449 pass-blocking reps. Wypler is a ready-made technician, and the Browns committed larceny with this pick.”
Click to expand...
At the bare minimum, Wypler serves as a solid and healthy depth piece at a position where the Browns saw three centers suffer injuries (including season-ending injuries to both Nick Harris and Dawson Deaton).

Wypler could be one snap from a starting job in 2023.
 
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Bracie Smathers said:
If a team can draft a player who was legitimately projected with 1st round talent in the fourth round then the upside is well worth the 'gamble'.
I think the expectations will and should be lowered as a developmental player
Click to expand...
I agree with you, but I would also apply this to ALL of their draft picks.

it's fun to be excited about the new players, but round 3 forward, they're all projects.

reality is, most of them are going to suck.
 
amnesiac said:
Bracie Smathers said:
If a team can draft a player who was legitimately projected with 1st round talent in the fourth round then the upside is well worth the 'gamble'.
Click to expand...
... I would also apply this to ALL of their draft picks.
Click to expand...
The only draftee that we took who was 'projected' in the 1st round was Dawand Jones so I recognize the upside on a talent basis. None of the other draftees were projected as 1st round picks so I like the 'potential' upside although we both realize that all of the picks are longshots to become starters.
I think I saw where MKC said that 3rd round picks on had only a 15% chance to become staters so that means if we get one starter from this combined draft class it would be 'slightly' above average. AB did great last year based on Martin Emmerson pick.
 
Total random question.
Say after year 3 or 4 of Watson we wanted to trade him.
What would his cap hit be for a new team, and how much dead cap would we have?
 
ghostguy123 said:
Total random question.
Say after year 3 or 4 of Watson we wanted to trade him.
What would his cap hit be for a new team, and how much dead cap would we have?
Click to expand...
someone other than me can probably do the math based on the current contract.

but it will also depend if they keep restructuring his contract.

my best guess is that a trade would involve yet another restructure/resigning.

so there’s really no way to really know, imo.
 
By
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Attendance at the Browns’ voluntary offseason program will be a little light next week, but coach Kevin Stefanski is totally cool with it.

It’s because quarterback Deshaun Watson is taking his offensive teammates to Puerto Rico for some scenic workouts and plenty of team bonding.

It’s the sequel to last year’s trip to Atlantis in the Bahamas, all on Watson’s dime just months after he signed his fully guaranteed five-year, $230 million contract.
 
amnesiac said:
ghostguy123 said:
Total random question.
Say after year 3 or 4 of Watson we wanted to trade him.
What would his cap hit be for a new team, and how much dead cap would we have?
Click to expand...
someone other than me can probably do the math based on the current contract.

but it will also depend if they keep restructuring his contract.

my best guess is that a trade would involve yet another restructure/resigning.

so there’s really no way to really know, imo.
Click to expand...
Yep - like they did in March this year they will restructure his contract again March 2024. I still chuckle about those nonsense takes this time last year about his contract structure gaming his looming suspension.
 
Bracie Smathers said:
Browns: Luke Wypler dubbed as 'draft steal' with pick no. 190
...the Browns may have their future starter.
Click to expand...
Hmmnn.
Who knows?
Pete Smith
@_PeteSmith_
Wypler's athleticism, range and intelligence at the center position give me J.C. Tretter vibes. Feels more like a 'when' than 'if' with him
Pete Smith@_PeteSmith_
Cleveland #Browns Comprehensive NFL Draft Review: Luke Wypler, C Ohio State https://si.com/nfl/browns/browns-maven-features/luke-wypler-draft-profile
 
4 home games and a BYE in the first 6 weeks of the season. The one road game is Monday night up the street in Pittsburgh. They need to take advantage of the early schedule. with 3 of those games vs division opponents.
 
daveR said:
You know what would be nice? A team that expects to win!
Click to expand...
Agreed. A lot of people are like “ohh, they could be in a huge hole by the bye week!”

How about, damn, they could have a nice lead in the division by their bye week?
 
Z'Darius Smith opposite Myles Garrett could be very interesting, especially since all it cost was turning 2 5th rounders into a 6 and a 7.

Might be the most dangerous pass rush in the AFC, as Okoronkwo is an excellent #3.
 
travdogg said:
Z'Darius Smith opposite Myles Garrett could be very interesting, especially since all it cost was turning 2 5th rounders into a 6 and a 7.

Might be the most dangerous pass rush in the AFC, as Okoronkwo is an excellent #3.
Click to expand...
This was Myles Garrett's supporting cast last year in terms of pass rush.
Free Agency Frosty@FrostyTalksFB
Browns Sack Leaders in 2022
16 - DE Myles Garrett
15 -
14 -
13 -
12 -
11 -
10 -
9 -
8 -
7 -
6 -
5 -
4 -
3 - DT T. Bryan
2.5 - LB Deion Jones (11 games)
2 - DT J. Elliot, DE J.Clowney
They’ve now added DT D. Tomlinson and DEs Obo Okoronkwo and Zadarius Smith
I really like Okoronkwo and love they added veteran depth with Zadarius.
We're not 'great' but much-much better than last year.
Jack Duffin
@JackDuffin
In 2022 there were 88 edges with 250 or more pass rushing snaps, here they are ranked in pressure rate:
9th Za'Darius Smith - 15.2%
10th Myles Garrett - 14.9%
22nd Ogbonnia Okoronkwo - 13.4%
Clevta
@Clevta
Myles, Oko and Za’darius three of the top 7 most double teamed edge rushers in the NFL last year. Nascar package with Smith or Garrett inside in obv pass rush situations and there’s nobody to double team
Link to Graph
 
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One of the first things I checked after the trade was the impact on Mike Clay's projections and it definitely increased our EDGE numbers but it didn't make a dent in our total team projected wins so I went to his twitter account to see if he took note of the trade and he didn.
Mike Clay@
MikeClayNFL
Another strong option opposite Myles Garrett for the Browns and a substantial hit to the Vikings pass rush. The AFC adds yet another good player.
Mike Clay@MikeClayNFL
Myles Garrett, Dalvin Tomlinson and Za'Darius Smith on the same defensive line? Pretty pretty pretty good... Updated 2023 Browns projections:
He now has us listed with the third best pass rush in the NFL.
Link to Graph
LINK to Clay's complete projections
daveR said:
Let's not forget the change in DC's!!!
Click to expand...
Cleveland Browns Siaki Ika Categorizes Jim Schwartz's Defense As Forward, Vertical, and Disruptive

Forward, vertical, and disruptive. Those three words Cleveland Browns rookie defensive tackle Siaki Ika used to describe the defense Jim Schwartz is bringing to Cleveland may be new to him, but he's excited about the opportunity.​

PFF
@PFF
"I think this is a potential home run for the Browns" -
@PFF_Steve
on Za'Darius Smith being traded to Cleveland The PFF NFL Show is live
LINK to video
 
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Warren Sharp@SharpFootball
toughest schedule the first 6 weeks:
32. Jets
31. Browns
30. Patriots
29. Titans
28. Buccaneers
27. Chiefs
26. Vikings
25. Panthers
24. Giants
(32 = toughest)
easiest schedule the first 6 weeks:
1. Saints
2. Eagles
3. Bengals
4. Falcons
5. 49ers
6. Bears
7. Ravens
8. Colts
9. Lions
10. Cowboys
 
daveR said:
Let's not forget the change in DC's!!!
Click to expand...
Jake Burns@jake_burns18
I will write up some bigger angles on Schwartz's defense by the end of the week.
One thing is noticeable (outside of the DT stuff we all know). Eagles' use of man coverage under Schwartz (NFL rank):
2017: 8th
2018: 17th
2019: 7th
2020: 5th
Woods was 27th, 28th, 23rd
Mina Kimes@minakimes
Last year, when the Browns defense played zone they ranked 24th in EPA/play—in man coverage, they ranked 2nd and allowed the lowest QBR in football. Expect new DC Jim Schwartz to call a more aggressive defense.
 
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Bengals have started slow each of the last two seasons, if there is a spread > 3 in the first 4 games it'll be in favor of us v Tennessee, and we draw the 9ers off a bye while they're sandwiched between 2 primetime games. I see this as the ultimate test of Stefanski the coach. Given the gauntlet he has to navigate on the other side I think we'll know quickly how much of the problem he's been the last 2 years.
 
Jackson McCurry@JackMcCurry08
The way Schefter spoke on his podcast regarding DHop, sounds like barring a team out of nowhere…..it’ll be Kansas City or Cleveland landing DeAndre Hopkins
Report: DeAndre Hopkins 'open' to signing with Cleveland Browns, reuniting with Deshaun Watson
According to ESPN's Jeremy Fowler, DeAndre Hopkins is 'open' to signing with the Cleveland Browns after being released by the Arizona Cardinals.
Jack Duffin@JackDuffin
I’m not a fan of this move but explaining the process of dHop A WR will want out due to no targets for them. DPJ most likely as a FA in 24 To balance that move with a cap consequence, Cooper not here for 2024 Personally I keep the current WR room and add DT in FA instead
 
at this stage of the game, i feel like hopkins will help cooper dominate even more by keeping defenders honest. he HAS to be covered, so cooper will have more space to end defenders w his routes...

i like it.
 
Soulfly3 said:
i like it.
Click to expand...
Cardinals reportedly were unhappy that DeAndre Hopkins sat out last two weeks of 2023

Why was DeAndre Hopkins suspended? Cardinals WR to make 2022 debut after failed PED test
Why the Patriots should pursue neo-free agent DeAndre Hopkins, and why they should not
...His age, as noted above, is a definitive problem here. He will turn 31 in June, and has already appeared in a combined 151 regular season and playoff games. This wear and tear might eventually catch up to him, which in turn makes projecting his future success a difficult endeavor: he might be able to return to the All-Pro play he showed earlier in his career and maintain that level for a few more years, but it is no less likely that that will not happen.
Clevta
@Clevta
Pretty surprising but here is the entire list of WRs aged 31 or more with 1k Rec yards in a season since 2015.
None in the last 3 seasons
Link to Graph
 
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Sign Hop. 3-4 year deal, low cap hit for two years.
Come 2025 this will need to be a complete tear down rebuild situation anyway. We have a 2 year window. Let's do it
 
LINK to Clay's Interior Defensive projections
24 Cleveland Browns
Dalvin Tomlinson, Jordan Elliott, Perrion Winfrey, Maurice Hurst, Siaki Ika
LINK to Clay's complete projections
2023 Cleveland Browns Projections
UNIT GRADES
INT 1.1
Overall grades are weighted based on positional importance.
The scale is 4.0 (best) to 0.1 (worst). A full rundown of Unit Grades can be found on page 51.
Our DT room is wafer thin.
Dalvin Tomlinson hasn't played a full season in years and we have virtually NOTHING behind him
We desperately need to add a vet DT before signing Dehop IMHO.
 
Soulfly3 said:
dhop is past his prime, imo. he's a sure handed wr2 for us. this is coop's house.
Click to expand...
Yeah, now just convince D-Hop of that and to accept a contract commiserate with his expected production instead of this:
An offer he couldn't refuse? How the Ravens' $15M deal with OBJ made team history
ghostguy123 said:
you sound like a whiney quitter with this post
Click to expand...
Your idea isn't based in reality and we both know it will never happen and doesn't guarantee anything.
Our best option is go with the WRs we have and fill the biggest hole on the roster at DT so we have a chance to make the playoffs because we will get killed with the current DTs we have and Watson HAD BETTER play like a Pro Bowl QB or it won't matter what we have at WR but if he returns to form our WRs will be fine as is.
We need a veteran DT more than the D-Hop cracktastic crowd understands.
 
The Good and bad in Potentially Acquiring Free Agent WR DeAndre Hopkins
...“He can’t run anymore,” one source said in the report. “Does not love to practice, I can’t imagine that’ll get any better. And when things don’t go well, you’re always gonna be leery, All right, what kind of drama are we gonna get from this guy? When things are great, he’s great. When things go south, his true colors show a little bit.”
...the price he may come at could be similar to Beckham’s $15 million he got from the Baltimore Ravens ...
Pete Smith
@_PeteSmith_
Even people who like Hopkins say he doesn't want to practice. Hopkins has credibility as a player, but none in the Browns locker room. Not surprised Kevin Stefanski said he's happy with the WR room as it is.

...Kevin Stefanski noted at the Browns Foundation golf outing, "I really, really like our wide receiver room. I love the guys that are in there. Andrew and his crew are always looking at every avenue, so I won’t comment specifically on the player other than to say that I really like our roster.”
 
I'm fine with not signing DHop. I'm not sure they need him right now. If he brought a level of veteran leadership/accountability to the WR room, then maybe. But I see him more as a hired gun - similar to OBJ. Just shows up to get a paycheck and make a play here or there to stay relevant. I'd rather spend the money on a backup RB or LB.
 
Bracie Smathers said:
LINK to Clay's Interior Defensive projections
24 Cleveland Browns
Dalvin Tomlinson, Jordan Elliott, Perrion Winfrey, Maurice Hurst, Siaki Ika
LINK to Clay's complete projections
2023 Cleveland Browns Projections
UNIT GRADES
INT 1.1
Overall grades are weighted based on positional importance.
The scale is 4.0 (best) to 0.1 (worst). A full rundown of Unit Grades can be found on page 51.
Our DT room is wafer thin.
Dalvin Tomlinson hasn't played a full season in years and we have virtually NOTHING behind him
We desperately need to add a vet DT before signing Dehop IMHO.
Click to expand...
i wouldn't use the word "desperately", but other than that i support this message.

listening to Schwartz on the radio earlier, he's planning on rotating DL early and often in the games to keep the players fresh and keep an attack mentality.

if he can get this defense playing well, and Watson can just be "good to very good," it could be a fun season coming up.
 
No interest in Nuk. This offense is strong enough to as is to be one of the best in the league if Watson bounces back and if he doesn't then Nuk isn't gonna be the elixir anyway.
 
amnesiac said:
listening to Schwartz on the radio
Click to expand...
Jim Schwartz on Browns’ defensive line: Keep them fresh throwing 100 mph fastballs
...Schwartz said he’s going to rotate his defensive linemen more than they’re accustomed to, meaning they may each play fewer snaps, but they’ll be more fresh and able to go harder on every play...
...“We’ll roll through eight, maybe even nine guys at times trying to keep guys fresh and keep ’em throwing a 100-miles-per-hour fastballs,” Schwartz said...
If that is the plan, then we need quality depth at DT and DE to make the plan viable.
If we want to get to the playoffs we need 'quality' and depth on the D-Line.
LINK to Clay's Interior Defensive projections
24 Cleveland Browns
Dalvin Tomlinson, Jordan Elliott, Perrion Winfrey, Maurice Hurst, Siaki Ika
Tomlinson is a quality DT but we can't expect a full season from him so we will have to rely on depth at DT.
I can't express how much I LOVE what Schwartz says here because this has always been my philosophy on defense.
Get to the QB and disrupt-terrorize him.
Cleveland Browns Defense Dropped Plenty Of Hints Today About 2023 Plans
...The key quotes are the ones you want to hear about the Browns' desire to get home in the pass rush.

"We sort of let those guys go and be disruptive," Schwartz said. "I know this, over the course of my career I have talked to a lot of offensive coaches and I have talked to a lot of quarterbacks over the years, and the way you affect the game the most in this league is by the pass rush."
...his approach to creating pressure, Schwartz discussed his philosophy of getting five players into pass rush. "I mean, I won't keep any secrets," he said. "You'll probably see five guys in pass rush a lot of times.
...POSITION HINTS
We have been searching for answers with the Browns' interior defensive line as it feels like the group is a player or two short. ..
...While they still might add more talent to this interior defensive line ...
... a devastating pass rush goes a long way,"
That idiot Perrion Winfrey is tailor-made for this scheme if he can hold his water and do his damn job. Opportunity of a lifetime if he can just be a decent person off the field and get to practice because he could be a star in this scheme.
 
Last edited:
Bracie Smathers said:
...POSITION HINTS
We have been searching for answers with the Browns' interior defensive line as it feels like the group is a player or two short. ..
...While they still might add more talent to this interior defensive line ...
Click to expand...
Did anyone else notice Z Smith hinting at playing the zero? Sounds like they're gonna mix him inside at times. I'd also add that the DTs haven't had a chance to play an attacking position yet, so it's hard to throw them on the trash heap just yet.
 
amnesiac said:
listening to Schwartz on the radio
Click to expand...
How Many Wins Is a NFL Coach Worth? Rating Impact of Biggest Coaching Staff Changes

Jim Schwartz, Cleveland Browns​

2022 Record: 7-10
Projected 2023 Record: 11-6
Difference: +4
Despite a heavy emphasis on the quarterback position in Cleveland, the Browns' biggest issues over the last three seasons involved a soft defensive interior and consistent coverage breakdowns...
Jeff-LJ-Lloyd
@Jeff_LJ_Lloyd
... Schwartz wants his D line to crush the pocket, Ward says the new system should correct communication breakdowns
...Browns D will be better but a vet DT is needed To make the playoffs they must play well vs the division
 
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Bracie Smathers said:
That idiot Perrion Winfrey is tailor-made for this scheme if he can hold his water and do his damn job. Opportunity of a lifetime if he can just be a decent person off the field and get to practice because he could be a star in this scheme.
Click to expand...
This.
 
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