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2025 Detroit Lions: 1-1 Lion crush Da Bears. Still seats available on the Bandwagon. (163 Viewers)
- Thread starter Da Guru
- Start date
WheelsUp
Footballguy
Will the Lions really be 9-4 after this week and secure a winning season with 3 to play?
I have seen a different side of Detroit after yesterday, Rodgers will not go in to Detroit with that crowd if Detroit needs a win and beat them.
This defense may not be fantasy great but they play tough when needed of late.
Detroit beats Bears
Detroit beats Giants
Detroit loses to Cowboys
Detroit beats Packers
11-5.
Miss a bye because of the Seahawk tie, and some people say ties dont matter.
I have seen a different side of Detroit after yesterday, Rodgers will not go in to Detroit with that crowd if Detroit needs a win and beat them.
This defense may not be fantasy great but they play tough when needed of late.
Detroit beats Bears
Detroit beats Giants
Detroit loses to Cowboys
Detroit beats Packers
11-5.
Miss a bye because of the Seahawk tie, and some people say ties dont matter.
jomar
Footballguy
you guys are way more confident than me. we could easily lose to the Bears this week. every week is a dogfight and I see no reason this one won't be tight. even if we do win, I could easily see us losing our last 3. 9-7 is a good possibility. I'm really hoping GB and MIN lose because I couldn't take a week 17 must win game against GB.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Diggs out for the year. That's too bad, he's a decent slot corner.
Then again the 3-safety packages Austin has been going with probably mean they won't have to use rookie Barnes or Bademosi much. Which is good; Quinn, Bush, and Wilson are playing well, Killebrew has been highly effective on 3rd downs.
Saints game defensive snap counts:
Defense
FS Glover Quin 61 100 percent)
CB Darius Slay 60 (98 percent)
LB Josh Bynes 60 (98 percent)
CB Nevin Lawson 57 (93 percent)
SS Tavon Wilson 50 (82 percent)
DE Ezekiel Ansah 45 (74 percent)
DT Haloti Ngata 41 (67 percent)
SS Rafael Bush 41 (67 percent)
DE Kerry Hyder 41 (67 percent)
LB Antwione Williams 34 (56 percent)
DE Armonty Bryant 27 (44 percent)
DE Devin Taylor 23 (38 percent)
SS Miles Killebrew 21 (34 percent)
CB Quandre Diggs 18 (30 percent)
DT Tyrunn Walker 17 (28 percent)
DT Khyri Thornton 15 (25 percent)
DT Stefan Charles 14 (23 percent)
DT A'Shawn Robinson 13 (21 percent)
CB Adairius Barnes 12 (20 percent)
DE Anthony Zettel 11 (18 percent)
DE Brandon Copeland 7 (11 percent)
LB Thurston Armbrister 4 (7 percent)
CB Johnson Bademosi 16 (62 percent)
Then again the 3-safety packages Austin has been going with probably mean they won't have to use rookie Barnes or Bademosi much. Which is good; Quinn, Bush, and Wilson are playing well, Killebrew has been highly effective on 3rd downs.
Saints game defensive snap counts:
Defense
FS Glover Quin 61 100 percent)
CB Darius Slay 60 (98 percent)
LB Josh Bynes 60 (98 percent)
CB Nevin Lawson 57 (93 percent)
SS Tavon Wilson 50 (82 percent)
DE Ezekiel Ansah 45 (74 percent)
DT Haloti Ngata 41 (67 percent)
SS Rafael Bush 41 (67 percent)
DE Kerry Hyder 41 (67 percent)
LB Antwione Williams 34 (56 percent)
DE Armonty Bryant 27 (44 percent)
DE Devin Taylor 23 (38 percent)
SS Miles Killebrew 21 (34 percent)
CB Quandre Diggs 18 (30 percent)
DT Tyrunn Walker 17 (28 percent)
DT Khyri Thornton 15 (25 percent)
DT Stefan Charles 14 (23 percent)
DT A'Shawn Robinson 13 (21 percent)
CB Adairius Barnes 12 (20 percent)
DE Anthony Zettel 11 (18 percent)
DE Brandon Copeland 7 (11 percent)
LB Thurston Armbrister 4 (7 percent)
CB Johnson Bademosi 16 (62 percent)
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Lots of possible scenarios over the last quarter but the easiest path is to just win the two division games at home. A win at MetLife would be a nice bonus & probably render the finale meaningless as the Lions could be 10-5 and the Pack 8-7.
Winning @ DAL on MNF seems highly unlikely. But this Lions team might be able to pull it off. Historically they've done well in Dallas (3-4 the last 7 times they visited.)
Packers toughest game is their next one. They should beat CHI & MIN but they're such a flawed team it's hard to count on it.
Vikings are free falling - no playmakers.
Fun to play with this & dream:
http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs/machine
Winning @ DAL on MNF seems highly unlikely. But this Lions team might be able to pull it off. Historically they've done well in Dallas (3-4 the last 7 times they visited.)
Packers toughest game is their next one. They should beat CHI & MIN but they're such a flawed team it's hard to count on it.
Vikings are free falling - no playmakers.
Fun to play with this & dream:
http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs/machine
Interseptopus
Footballguy
This is where I'm at too.
I posted a few things in the Survivor League thread that I'll paste here:
Detroit's defense has been spot on, as I mentioned above, so that is one positive going for Detroit against Chicago. However, Chicago didn't need to score 20+ to beat them last time (and yes, it was away for Detroit). Maybe you guys see something I don't. Out of all the NFC North teams I dislike Detroit the least. Possibly because they haven't really threatened GB's tenure at the top of the division much the last decade or two. This year's team looks pretty good. Stafford should be in discussion for MVP but unfortunately he won't have much of a shot IMO. So it's not like I'm some cross division hater or something
Detroit is such a weird team to figure out. They lost to Houston, Chicago, and even GB could be put into that category; but beat Washington, Philadelphia and New Orleans. It's not far fetched to say they could lose to Chicago and then beat Dallas. That's how up and down this team is. Luckily for you guys they've had more up than down, especially lately.
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Caldwell probably deserves more credit than we are generally willing to give him.
Think about this:
He's 26-18 through 2.75 seasons. In the Super Bowl era - 51st year, so this is not a small sample size - he's already won more games than any other Lions coach had the previously in their first 3 full seasons. You have to go back to Buddy Parker to find a Lions HC with a better record.
He doesn't have player control, so let's look at the administrative decisions he's made. Austin is generally thought of as one of the better schematic DCs around. He doesn't have a lot of talent outside of Slay and Ansah. Levy has contributed nothing for 2 years. An aging Haloti, savvy vet in Quinn, a bunch of middle to late rounders and UDFAs. Joe Lombardi was a disaster but he made a bold decision to make Cooter the youngest OC in the NFL. He benched Tomlinson - Graham Glasgow has been a huge improvement. He benched Tate when he ran the wrong route in Chicago. Golden got his head on straight & he's made some huge plays.
Those were all positive decisions that were made by Jim Caldwell.
Historically, he has not been a good in game coach. Here I think we see a lot of improvement, especially in clock management. You can give partial credit to the OC or Stafford but ultimately that's his call. We had to drive the length of the field in the last two several times this year & we always have had our timeouts:
- @Indy - started GW drive on 25, 3 TOs
- Phi - Slay singlehandedly won this with the FF & INT in the last 2:46. Saved the season.
- LAR - two long drives in the 4th (17-84 yards & 12-44) melted the clock.
- Was - 1:05 left, 75 yards, 3 TOS, TD with 0:22 left.
- @Min - Tate has said his somersault TD in OT was inspired by Caldwell's Saturday night speech: "Who is going to be the guy that says, 'Watch me when you want something to get done?'"
Anyway, I've never been a big Caldwell fan, but to constantly mock & belittle him is not fair treatment. He's done a good job.
Think about this:
He's 26-18 through 2.75 seasons. In the Super Bowl era - 51st year, so this is not a small sample size - he's already won more games than any other Lions coach had the previously in their first 3 full seasons. You have to go back to Buddy Parker to find a Lions HC with a better record.
He doesn't have player control, so let's look at the administrative decisions he's made. Austin is generally thought of as one of the better schematic DCs around. He doesn't have a lot of talent outside of Slay and Ansah. Levy has contributed nothing for 2 years. An aging Haloti, savvy vet in Quinn, a bunch of middle to late rounders and UDFAs. Joe Lombardi was a disaster but he made a bold decision to make Cooter the youngest OC in the NFL. He benched Tomlinson - Graham Glasgow has been a huge improvement. He benched Tate when he ran the wrong route in Chicago. Golden got his head on straight & he's made some huge plays.
Those were all positive decisions that were made by Jim Caldwell.
Historically, he has not been a good in game coach. Here I think we see a lot of improvement, especially in clock management. You can give partial credit to the OC or Stafford but ultimately that's his call. We had to drive the length of the field in the last two several times this year & we always have had our timeouts:
- @Indy - started GW drive on 25, 3 TOs
- Phi - Slay singlehandedly won this with the FF & INT in the last 2:46. Saved the season.
- LAR - two long drives in the 4th (17-84 yards & 12-44) melted the clock.
- Was - 1:05 left, 75 yards, 3 TOS, TD with 0:22 left.
- @Min - Tate has said his somersault TD in OT was inspired by Caldwell's Saturday night speech: "Who is going to be the guy that says, 'Watch me when you want something to get done?'"
Anyway, I've never been a big Caldwell fan, but to constantly mock & belittle him is not fair treatment. He's done a good job.
Futz
Footballguy
I'm considering adding the Lions D too...they have been playing pretty well as of late. They did a great job against Brees, and now have the Bears at home...I like 'em
Futz
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
It's a trap. Never trust the Lions
They lost their slot corner, not that the Bears have anyone who can exploit that. Howard (23-111) and the OL steamrolled the Lions Week 4. Eddie Royal had his 3rd 100 yard game in the last 7 seasons. Hoyer threw for 300. I'd look elsewhere. They're not that good.
Lost their (VG) slot corner. But this team has overcome a lot of injuries already this year, next man up. Levy might be back but I think we've been saying that every week for a month. Not sure of Whitehead's status but don't care, Bynes did fine last week.
Schematically they're very sound and they have the fewest missed tackles of any team in the NFL. The 3 interceptions last week was an aberration, they're usually not great at forcing TOs. They get very few sacks. Def a bend but don't break philosophy. If it's DST, I guess you do have the longshot that Roberts takes his 3rd PR to the house.
Of late they have been very, very good at stopping teams on 3rd down. By using three safeties they have solved their TE coverage issues (was a big problem early.)
JFS171
Footballguy
Sold. On to other options!It's a trap. Never trust the Lions
They lost their slot corner, not that the Bears have anyone who can exploit that. Howard (23-111) and the OL steamrolled the Lions Week 4. Eddie Royal had his 3rd 100 yard game in the last 7 seasons. Hoyer threw for 300. I'd look elsewhere. They're not that good.
Lost their (VG) slot corner. But this team has overcome a lot of injuries already this year, next man up. Levy might be back but I think we've been saying that every week for a month. Not sure of Whitehead's status but don't care, Bynes did fine last week.
Schematically they're very sound and they have the fewest missed tackles of any team in the NFL. The 3 interceptions last week was an aberration, they're usually not great at forcing TOs. They get very few sacks. Def a bend but don't break philosophy. If it's DST, I guess you do have the longshot that Roberts takes his 3rd PR to the house.
Of late they have been very, very good at stopping teams on 3rd down. By using three safeties they have solved their TE coverage issues (was a big problem early.)
TartanLion
Footballguy
Think maybe Caldwell's clock management has improved as Quinn mimicked Bellichecks assistant in NE and hired a game clock manager to help Caldwell
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
TartanLion
Footballguy
It's looking like he has made a very solid start. Boldin, Hyder?, Bynes being brought back, Stefan Charles, R Bush, T Wilson have made varying levels of contribution. Marvin Jones despite not putting up big fantasy numbers recently, will continue to be good. He's been banged up for most of the season I think.
Theres been some ones that didn't pan out of course but we have moved on from them quickly.
People have been talking about next man up. One of Quinn's stated first priorities was to increase depth across the board. Looks like he has had relative success doing that.
Not to mention of course that the draft class is looking pretty decent so far.
Lastly, retaining Caldwell who had/has two coordinators working well under him that are his men, has been important for stability and continuity.
Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
This is Belichik-level corporate espionage.
Dateline: February, 2016, Allen Park.
Caldwell: Hey Joique, c'mon in.
Joique: No problem, coach, what's up?
Caldwell: Martha had a plan based on geneology.
Joique: You mean that hot dead chick from Bewitched?
Caldwell: No, Joique, no. You know, with Henry and Edsel conspiring to have their offspring marry other car component heiresses to bring them all into the fold?
Joique: I drive an Escalade, no idea what you're talking about, coach.
Caldwell: Well, at least you're driving American. Anyway, I have some good news and some bad news. Bad news is that we're letting you go. The good news is that we are "letting you go" [makes finger quotes in the air].
Joique: Now you're just being oblique, coach.
Caldwell: Wha? How do you know that word?
Joique: It's my business to know words with "que" in them, coach.
Caldwell: Never mind that. Here's what we want you to do -- we're going to put you on the free market, but we'll retain you under the table.We want you to offer your services --
Joique: You mean my marque
Caldwell: -- to the Bears. Get in good with them, get yourself signed for depth. You know, ingratiate yourself. Be a team player. But really, you still work for me, got it?
Joique: I'm your coquet, boss. A veritable masquer will I be.
Caldwell: Great! Then, once you've learned the playbook and how they break us down, you can just be your regular old sucky self, we'll hire you back, and then you can download all the stuff you heard, saw, and learned. Got it?
Joique: Is this the part where you hand me my cheque?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
This should be a blowout.
Futz
Footballguy
Not buying it. Familiarity is a big equalizer in the NFL and tends to level the divisional playing field. Chicago's defense has improved since the last time we lost.
I see a win but it might be a struggle. 23-17 Leos.
I was early on the "Caldwell is underrated" train. I think his strengths aren't as visible as those of, say, Belichick or Carroll. But he's a good manager, his players all love him, and, as you point out, he's hired well. The two things people mostly hold against him are his game management and his overall placid demeanor. The latter is BS; everyone has their own style. As for the former, maybe it's the time-management assistant that he hired this year, but as you say, a lot of the Lions 4th-quarter comebacks can be chalked up to smart use of TOs. And honestly, if he did recognize his own weakness and take steps to address it, that speaks very well to his self-awareness.
I'm sure there will always be people who want to discount everything he does. First it was, "He only went to the SB because of Manning." (Right, because when Dungy coached Manning he made the SB every year.) Also the same people who refused to credit him going 14-2 with Manning weren't willing to cut him any slack for going 2-14 with Curtis Painter. Then he went 11-5 in his first year with the Lions, but that didn't count because he didn't really beat anyone. Then he went 6-2 in the second half of last year, but all anyone remembers was the Rodgers Hail Mary (which, to be fair, he should take some heat for, but it was also a pretty amazing play.) And this year, he lost his best offensive player and has basically been without his best defensive player for most of the year, and has still managed to overachieve.
At some point, we have to accept that he's a good coach. Not a great one, probably won't win a SB anytime soon, but he's definitely made the Lions respectable, which is more than any of the Millen-era coaches can say.
I was really bummed out when he was hired, especially when Whisenhunt chose the Titans over Detroit. But at this point, I think it's safe to say that the Lions ended up with the right guy.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
2001-2005: 17-63
2006-2010: 23-57
2011-2016: 47-45
2006-2010: 23-57
2011-2016: 47-45
kutta
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
This is the kind of progress you like to see from a Lions fan. Now complaining about the underperforming WR5.matuski said:
matuski
Footballguy
He is being targetted like a WR2-3 lately.
I don't think he got credit for a couple targets on thanksgiving because he was nowhere near where he was supposed to be. The Blake Bortles of route running.
WheelsUp
Footballguy
Barkley on the road in a dome stadium against a hungry defense who has a reason to play?
Familiarity is thrown out the window when you have a QB starting his first road game against a team for the first time.
Howard is all they have in Chicago, if they shut him down, they win. Detroits D is not SFs.
Familiarity is thrown out the window when you have a QB starting his first road game against a team for the first time.
Howard is all they have in Chicago, if they shut him down, they win. Detroits D is not SFs.
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Interested to see who will be the slot corner this week. Probably one of the rookies - Barnes or Killebrew in that 3-safety set that has been so effective the last 3-4 games.
coachbobbyfinstock
Footballguy
Any word on Abdullah coming back. I think him coming back, which will allow Riddick to return to strictly pass receiving will be a significant boost to the O.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Likely they'll use the designated to return from IR move on Bostic, who is close. AA is not & probably will get officially shut down in the next week or two.
Levy supposedly back this week.
Swanson out, GG in @ C. Shouldn't be much dropoff but if Tomlinson is back at LG :X
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Levy is still alive?
coachbobbyfinstock
Footballguy
BobbyLayneI read that about Bostic as well, but as stated above by @Leroy Hoard mentioned there really hasnt been too much news since he visited dr andrews.
So, they never IRed Levy I guess? Hasnt he been out since week 1.
Detriot could be getting healthy here, watch out!
So, they never IRed Levy I guess? Hasnt he been out since week 1.
Detriot could be getting healthy here, watch out!
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Yep, he's been doing awesome work for #ourissue and Regenerate Detroit. Dre is the man.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Arrived today.
https://postimg.org/image/bbmlgftnn/
(ETA: for MetLife on 12/18)
My last one was #88 - Charlie Sanders - circa Forazano
https://postimg.org/image/bbmlgftnn/
(ETA: for MetLife on 12/18)
My last one was #88 - Charlie Sanders - circa Forazano
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Pettigrew cut today.
Longest tenured Lions are now LS Don Muhlbach (13th year?), Stafford & Levy (both 2009 draft.)
Longest tenured Lions are now LS Don Muhlbach (13th year?), Stafford & Levy (both 2009 draft.)
The Captain
Footballguy
Would be nice if he'd start Sunday and do some work for the Lions D! I love what he does outside football. Wish he'd start doing something on the field as well.Yep, he's been doing awesome work for #ourissue and Regenerate Detroit. Dre is the man.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Bruh has an awesome IG feed as well - he's probably gone to more obscure locations than anyone in the league.
He's still listed as questionable so I'm not expecting to see him. Until I see him on the field, nothing has changed in the last month that would lead you to believe he's close. Beat writers think he'll be on the field no more than 15-30 snaps. Such a weird situation with virtually no info.
It's too bad, he was the best cover LB in the league two years ago. Gave him $33M & it's been nothing but injuries since.
Will be interesting to see how they handle Ansah in the off-season. After last year (14.5 sacks) it would have probably cost them $80-100M to lock him up. You wonder if they'll go for a discounted LT deal or just let him play out his last season without a deal in place.
I thought for sure after they locked up Slay ($48M) that Ziggy would be next. Instead they gave deals to Martin, Prater & Riddick.
Stafford is up after 2017 as well. First two deals were 6/$72M & 3/$53M. If he beats GB again and wins a playoff game this year, we're probably looking an Eli situation, e.g., he might be at the halfway point of his tenure in Detroit. He's still only 28; if he stays healthy - 92 straight starts - and if he keeps playing the way he has the last 20 games, he'll still be the Lions QB when my daughter is applying to college.
(she's in 3rd grade)
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The Captain
Footballguy
If Quinn really is a Belichick disciple Id expect them to let Ziggy go. As you mentioned they're about to tie up a boatload of cap in Stafford. The rest of the contracts Quinn hands out will need to be team friendly.BobbyLayne said:
Need to hope Quinn can continue to draft well.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Bears front 3 are pretty disruptive. Very good pass defense. Howard is a tough runner. You have pieces here and there to build around.
But need a different franchise QB. 2017 doesn't look like the best year to be hunting for one.
RenegadeGM
Footballguy
Theo Riddick (wrist) is inactive today per NFL Network
TartanLion
Footballguy
Riddick. Hmmm. And D Wash a bit hobbled. Swanson not there. Not liking this !
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
TartanLion
Footballguy
Biggest concern for me is a two fold one for Stafford - real life and fantasy - Riddick is so important for moving chains with pitches and short passes as well as being a very successful red zone target for Stafford.
