A very brief history of Achilles tears for NFL QB's (1 Viewer)

[TheWinz]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

 

[Soulfly3]

the difference between 32, 35 and 39 for an athlete is pretty massive though.

i don't doubt he can't come back and i don't doubt he can play the whole season. but the physical decline is large

 

[TheWinz]

the difference between 32, 35 and 39 for an athlete is pretty massive though.

i don't doubt he can't come back and i don't doubt he can play the whole season. but the physical decline is large

I would assume you're talking about Rodgers and not Cousins?
Also, I jokingly made this thread because no one can seem to find any other QB to ever tear their Achilles. It's strange.

 

[Birdie048]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

The key I noticed was the age factor. Average age > 35 yo almost makes it like a trend due to the footwork requirements of the position. Wear & tear on the tendons over time.
Do you have data on how well they played when coming back from this injury? Were they Top 12 before AND After?

 

[TheWinz]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

The key I noticed was the age factor. Average age > 35 yo almost makes it like a trend due to the footwork requirements of the position. Wear & tear on the tendons over time.
Do you have data on how well they played when coming back from this injury? Were they Top 12 before AND After?

Marino was QB3 the year before the injury, and once again QB3 the year after

 

[scothawk]

Rodgers rehab feels different from those before. Combination of age, attitude and arrogance would worry me as owner.

 

[Snotbubbles]

Factors Affecting Return to Play After Primary Achilles Tendon Tear: A Cohort of NFL Players

Achilles tendon tears are potentially career-ending injuries for professional athletes. For players in the National Football League (NFL), return requires not only surgery and extensive rehabilitation but also the ability to compete in a market with limited ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The overall RTP [Return to Play] rate was 61.3%. Age, number of prior seasons, position type, or draft round status did not significantly affect RTP when evaluated with Kaplan-Meier analysis. In the season before their injury, players who did RTP played in a significantly greater number of regular season games (13.7) compared with players who did not RTP (8.71) (P = .011). Players who did not RTP exhibited a significant decrease in performance in the season preceding injury (12.7 regular season games played 2 seasons preinjury vs 8.71 regular season games played 1 season prior preinjury;, P = .019). Players who returned did not display a significant change in the number of games played or started in seasons following injury when >1 season after return was evaluated.

 

[Zeppelin]

Rodgers rehab feels different from those before. Combination of age, attitude and arrogance would worry me as owner.

Not to mention Rodgers depends on mobility to extend plays much more than the other QBs listed.

 

[travdogg]

Testaverde was pretty much shot after that. He went from 2 pro bowls in 3 years (back when that kinda meant something) to below average starter/backup.

 

[BobbyLayne]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

The key I noticed was the age factor. Average age > 35 yo almost makes it like a trend due to the footwork requirements of the position. Wear & tear on the tendons over time.
Do you have data on how well they played when coming back from this injury? Were they Top 12 before AND After?

Marino was QB3 the year before the injury, and once again QB3 the year after

Rodgers was QB22 (min 7 g) in his last full season, and is likely to be in a similar range this year.

Good enough to support the two young superstars, which is the most relevant thing for FF this year.

 

[socrates]

Johnny Unitas suffered an Achilles injury in the twilight of his career in an age when such an injury was a career killer.

Marino was not quite the same QB post injury. He was a bit of a statue. His arm was still the best in the game, however. Marino has discussed his recovery:

“It didn’t actually heal all the way,” he said. “It was elongated, so I had to deal with not being able to get up on my toe for the rest of my career, basically. That’s why I used to wear that boot you saw and a lot of people see it in pictures. That helped me kind of move. But I was able to deal with it. You just adjust. You adjust to your body. You adjust to the situation. You adapt to it.”

Similarly, Testaverde lost much of his mobility with the injury. His arm talent was still elite.

Medical advancements have come a long way in recent years, but don't look for either Rodgers or Cousins to return to quite the same QB they were pre-injury. They can still be very successful, but I expect some lost mobility. The injury will not prevent either QB from being successful. The ability to read a defense and the arm talent remain fully intact.

 

[Scoresman]

Wasn't Cousins already a statue in the pocket?

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

it’s a bit different for a pocket passer vs a mobile QB.

If LJax tore his Achilles I’d be much more worried about him coming back on a short timeframe than I would Cousins, for example.

 

[greenmountaingoat]

Given that most of us are really trying to understand the QB ability to sustain fantasy production at WR and overall offensive efficiency, a few stats that might help would be overall yards per game and TD%.

Testaverde Pre injury (age 32-36 seasons)- interesting note is that he was much worse from age 27-32. 32-36 seems like his it was his peak.
1995- 221.8- 4.3%
1996- 261.1- 6.0%
1997- 228.5- 3.8%
1998- 232.6- 6.9%
Post injury:
2000- 233.3- 3.6%
2001- 172.0- 3.4%
2002- 99.8- 3.6%
2003- 197.9- 3.5%
2004- 220.8- 3.4%

Vinny had a very uneven career in terms of when he delivered yardage and high TD% years. He had a couple of decent seasons after the Achilles

Marino Pre injury (age 29-32 seasons)
1990- 222.7 - 4.0%
1991- 248.1- 4.6%
1992- 257.3- 4.3%
1993- 243.6 - 5.3%
Post injury:
1994- 278.3- 4.9%
1995- 262.0- 5.0%
1996- 215.0- 4.6%
1997- 236.3- 2.9%
1998- 218.6- 4.3%

When you factor in typical age related decline, Marino had better years following. I don't recall what other factors were in play in terms of surrounding talent. His best years were his age 23-27 seasons. Old Marino seems like he didn't really change much in terms of delivering yards and TDs to his weapons.

Also of note, there are therapies available now that are more advanced than what was available 20-30 years ago. If you throw, your back foot wants to come up through the toe so I can see why there's more worry about Cousins.

Cousins last 4 seasons:
2020- 266.6- 6.8%
2021- 263.8- 5.9%
2022- 267.5- 4.8%
2023-291.4- 5.8%

I have him projected right now for 243.4 with 5.1% TDs. Maybe I'm being too conservative but I have to think that with this OLine and running weapons, they're going to lean more to the run game. This still puts London at 1153 yards and 8 TDs and Pitts 900/6 based on 24.5% and 20% TS respectively.

Rodgers last 4 seasons:

2019- 250.1- 4.6%
2020- 268.7- 9.1%
2021- 257.2- 7.0%
2022- 217.4- 4.8%

The Adams TD connection was unreal and having a bunch of unproven pass catchers obviously was something he was unhappy about. I have him at 253.8 per game with a 5% TD. Might be a little too high but I feel like he's going to pepper Wilson who I have at 1300/9 on a 28% TS.

 

[-OZ-]

the difference between 32, 35 and 39 for an athlete is pretty massive though.

i don't doubt he can't come back and i don't doubt he can play the whole season. but the physical decline is large

Absolutely.
But then, 2023 is a lot different than 1999.

 

[Gruden's Keyboard]

Don't forget the advancements in modern medicine, aka stem cells and steroids... Also the achilles surgical repair procedure was supposedly improved a few years back when guys started coming back faster, but maybe that's just due to the stem cells and steroids.

 

[Terpman22]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

I remember as a kid when Marino came back, it was almost like a miracle that he came back the next year. That guy was just ....fun to watch sling that ball around. He would absolutely destroy the modern NFL with the way the rules and game are now. 48 TDs in '84 was just so insane.

 

[travdogg]

Personally, I think both the Jets and Falcons offenses are likely be overvalued right now. Especially the WR's.

A lot of similarity between Cousins/Testaverde actually, with age, and both teams spending a 1st round pick on a QB the year after the Achilles tear.

I'm confident both QBs will be better than Testaverde was in 2000, when he was awful with 4 more INTs than anyone in the NFL, and an embarrassing rating even for 2000.

 

[Bri]

@jenpiacenti
·
17h
But worth noting-

Rodgers injured his lead/plant achilles

Cousins injured his power/drive foot

I am more concerned about Cousins than Rodgers

 

[Bri]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

I remember as a kid when Marino came back, it was almost like a miracle that he came back the next year. That guy was just ....fun to watch sling that ball around. He would absolutely destroy the modern NFL with the way the rules and game are now. 48 TDs in '84 was just so insane.

Sidenote- somehow Duper and Clayton are not revered as one of the best receiving duos or get much praise as individuals anymore

 

[Terpman22]

29 Oct 2023
Kirk Cousins tears his Achilles during week 8. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

11 Sep 2023
Aaron Rodgers tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 39 yrs old at the time.

12 Sep 1999
Vinny Testaverde tears his Achilles during week 1. He was 35 yrs old at the time.

10 Oct 1993
Dan Marino tears his Achilles during week 6. He was 32 yrs old at the time.

If you're worried about Cousins or Rodgers for 2024, don't be. Every other NFL QB who has ever torn their Achilles has come back the following year and played the entire season. It's almost like tearing your Achilles is a good thing for a QB.

I remember as a kid when Marino came back, it was almost like a miracle that he came back the next year. That guy was just ....fun to watch sling that ball around. He would absolutely destroy the modern NFL with the way the rules and game are now. 48 TDs in '84 was just so insane.

Sidenote- somehow Duper and Clayton are not revered as one of the best receiving duos or get much praise as individuals anymore

Yeah looking back, each of their 1984 seasons - both going over 1300 yards AND 18 YPC and both being 5'9 guys...also insane