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AITA? Friends and money (1 Viewer)

-fish-

Footballguy
I have a friend, T, that owns a business. I'm very familiar with it and it' is worth a significant amount of money. Covid caused the yearly income to decrease, but the overall value is still solid. His distribution took a hit, so this year he was cash poor. I loaned him some money with a formal loan agreement and promissory note. He didn't tell his wife they were struggling, or about the loan.

I have another mutual friend, H, that is an interior designer who started working for a high end furniture store on commission. Shel's never done sales before but is doing pretty well. T's wife came in and spent a day picking out new furniture that would represent a pretty big commission. T's wife wants to come back next week again. H told me about this and I told her not to waste her time because her husband would never pull the trigger on the furniture. She argued with me that she was serious and she thought she could close the deal and make a big commission. I told her it was never going to happen. Eventually after a bunch of back and forth I let her know that they didn't have the money to do it and they owed me more than the furniture they were looking at. She now doesn't want to waste her time and is cancelling their next appointment.

Did I do anything wrong here? I feel very conflicted.
 

brun

Footballguy
You may have more info, but I wouldn't assume adequate knowledge of their personal finances to make that call just because I know the business is struggling.
 

The Z Machine

Footballguy
You may have more info, but I wouldn't assume adequate knowledge of their personal finances to make that call just because I know the business is struggling.
Yeah, for all you know the wife might have her own source of income or wealth. That couple may keep their finances separate.
 

IvanKaramazov

Footballguy
I wouldn't go so far as apply the A in AITA, but I do think you erred by disclosing the existence of this private loan between friends. T obviously wanted to keep this quiet, and it feels like a violation of his confidence.

I've made similar or worse mistakes in social settings.
 

jvdesigns2002

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
 

Dr. Octopus

Footballguy
. T's wife wants to come back next week again. H told me about this and I told her not to waste her time because her husband would never pull the trigger on the furniture.
You betrayed your friend’s confidence because another friend may have “wasted” an hour of her day on a customer that may or may not buy something. That’s pretty much her job. Were you really protecting her or trying to show off a little?

The guy didn’t want his wife to know and yet you set it up so that’s exactly what will happen? She’s now going to go back to the store and the other woman isn’t going to want to “waste her time”.

I think it’s you - but I think he probably know that already.
 

AAABatteries

Footballguy
Of the 4 people in the story I think I could make an argument for 3 of them doing an A behavior. But everybody does at times so I’m not throwing stones.
 

-fish-

Footballguy
. T's wife wants to come back next week again. H told me about this and I told her not to waste her time because her husband would never pull the trigger on the furniture.
You betrayed your friend’s confidence because another friend may have “wasted” an hour of her day on a customer that may or may not buy something. That’s pretty much her job. Were you really protecting her or trying to show off a little?

The guy didn’t want his wife to know and yet you set it up so that’s exactly what will happen? She’s now going to go back to the store and the other woman isn’t going to want to “waste her time”.

I think it’s you - but I think he probably know that already.
It's not an hour. She's a designer. Wasting two days on someone who can't buy something costs her a lot of time and lost opportunity
 

-fish-

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.
 

-fish-

Footballguy
You may have more info, but I wouldn't assume adequate knowledge of their personal finances to make that call just because I know the business is struggling.
I am aware of their personal and business finances in detail.
 

E Street Brat

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.

It is not your place to tell others of your arraignment.

Answer the question. Is he repaying you under the terms of your agreement?
 

Dr. Octopus

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.
But you have an enforceable contract to try and collect if he defaults on his obligations. If I got a loan from a bank, I wouldn't expect the loan officer to follow me around the mall to see if I'm going to buy something really expensive.
 

E Street Brat

Footballguy
Sounds like somebody wanted to be a hero and save the day, but is now having second thought and is acting like a douche.
 

thecatch

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.
But you have an enforceable contract to try and collect if he defaults on his obligations. If I got a loan from a bank, I wouldn't expect the loan officer to follow me around the mall to see if I'm going to buy something really expensive.
Exactly this. The answer to the OP's question is yes.
 

jvdesigns2002

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.
No it isn’t. Did your loan arrangement with him specify that you had say on what he is and isn’t allowed to buy? If he breaks the terms of the loan with you- you handle things legally. Its not your place to handle things the way you are. Besides that- you asked a question searching for opinions. In my opinion- you were out of line. If you asked the question only looking for validation- then you really weren’t looking for opinions- were you?
 

Zow

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.

It is not your place to tell others of your arraignment.

Answer the question. Is he repaying you under the terms of your agreement?
Eh, that's likely public record anyway.
 

E Street Brat

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.

It is not your place to tell others of your arraignment.

Answer the question. Is he repaying you under the terms of your agreement?
Eh, that's likely public record anyway.

That's what I get for trying to use big words.
 

Zow

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.
I completely understand your feeling and sentiment in this post. And your situation exemplifies why it's just a bad idea to either lend or borrow a significant sum* to or from friends and family.

As somebody already mentioned above, you have a contractual arrangement with this friend now comparable to a bank loan. And, most certainly, it would be "out of bounds" for a bank to be following around its borrowers to see what they're spending money on - especially if there's no default yet. Similarly, what they're spending their money on prior to defaulting on you isn't "[your] business."

Given that you're friends with H, I take no issue with you vaguely telling her to not waste her time because T won't go for it. That makes sense as you're protecting H from losing time. But I do think you are the "*******" for sharing details about the loan.


*I generally try to live by a philosophy where anything I lend to friends or family is an amount where it doesn't impact me if I don't get it back and therefore, while I obviously want it back and expect them to honor the loan, it's only my feelings that'll be significantly hurt if it's not paid back. Otherwise, it would just get too weird like your situation.
 

Skipdog77

Footballguy
You overplayed your hand. Shark move would have been to let them buy the furniture. Then, the first time you are over at their house after the furniture is received, you stare your friend in the eye as you soil their new couch, Poppie-style.

ETA: ...and don't lend money to friends.
 

Dr. Octopus

Footballguy
I do want to say, because I said a few negative things, that you were a good friend in the first place for lending him the money.

I’m just not sure why you felt it necessary to tell some one else his business when there you could have just told her you’re very sure she wouldn’t make a sale and at most go as far as “trust me on that”. Then it’s up to her and who knows maybe down the road she gets the sale.

Anyway, you helped him and many wouldn’t I’m sure it will be ok in the end.
 

Zow

Footballguy
I do want to say, because I said a few negative things, that you were a good friend in the first place for lending him the money.

I’m just not sure why you felt it necessary to tell some one else his business when there you could have just told her you’re very sure she wouldn’t make a sale and at most go as far as “trust me on that”. Then it’s up to her and who knows maybe down the road she gets the sale.

Anyway, you helped him and many wouldn’t I’m sure it will be ok in the end.
Yeah, FWIW, I understand the OP's sentiment, emotion, etc.
 

GroveDiesel

Footballguy
Wasn’t your place to discuss your friend’s financial situation with others. The loan that you gave your friend is a separate transaction that should have remained confidential. The only thing T owes you is repayment of the loan under the terms you guys agreed to. Its not your role to discuss those terms or the loan to anyone else. It’s also none of your business what your friends choose to buy
He owes me a lot of money. It is absolutely my business if they're spending money on luxury expenses.
But it sounds like that wasn’t actually your concern, right? Your concern was about H wasting her time because you said you knew that they weren’t going to buy the furniture.

Sure seems like the real conversation should have been with T, not H. If the concern was about wasting H’s time, then reaching out to T and asking him to stop the furniture browsing now and not waste H’s time seems way more appropriate than disclosing the loan and financial problems to H. Maybe a general heads up to T that you didn’t think the purchase was going to happen after that, but nothing more.
 

Dezbelief

Footballguy
who knows maybe down the road she gets the sale.

Anyway, you helped him and many wouldn’t I’m sure it will be ok in the end.
This is what I was thinking, either the wife is planning out what she wants to buy in the future or the husband hasn't been honest with her about their finances and she thinks that they are rolling. It's possible the OP knows more about the T's finances than Mrs. T. A thought that immediately popped into my head is how extended is Mr T? Maybe he's going to extend himself further to support his wife's spending. Fish you are a good friend and I hope everything works out for you.
 

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