Andrew Luck watch (1 Viewer)

[shader]

I think the 49ers and Bengals are the early leaders in the clubhouse for Luck.

Bengals should have done a better job with the Palmer situation. Just a horrible organization.

49ers also look bad at qb...really bad.

 

[Blackjacks]

I think the 49ers and Bengals are the early leaders in the clubhouse for Luck.Bengals should have done a better job with the Palmer situation. Just a horrible organization.49ers also look bad at qb...really bad.

I would throw Washington and Miami in this situation

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

Seattle, too.

 

[eakfootball]

I think it comes down to Washington and Cincy. I hate Washington, and will be rooting for them in a lot of games, so they don't get Luck.

 

[PizzaDeliveryGuy]

Don't be counting Cleveland out. I don't think that their starting roster is as bad as some others and the schedule is easy but if they start having injuries, they have zero depth.

 

[Ilov80s]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

 

[FUBAR]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

 

[FUBAR]

I think it comes down to Washington and Cincy. I hate Washington, and will be rooting for them in a lot of games, so they don't get Luck.

one way or another, I see Luck as a Redskin.

 

[Ilov80s]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

 

[gandalas]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

He was more referring to Jimmy Clausen with the 2nd rounder last year and then Cam this year as the 1.1...

 

[Ilov80s]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

He was more referring to Jimmy Clausen with the 2nd rounder last year and then Cam this year as the 1.1...

Oh yeah, duh. Huge screw-up there. I didn't see much of Carolina last year, but was Clausen really that bad for a rookie?

 

[Crippler]

I think only SF would take LUck out of the ones with a QB only because of Harbaugh. Fortunately they are not in the running because of the division they are in. If Carolina or Cincy ends up #1, I think you see a huge trade by someone wanting to move up. A Ricky Williams type of trade and these teams will have a ton of picks to work with

Washington is still my favourite.

Dont count out the Bills and Raiders either.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

 

[ConnSKINS26]

I think the 49ers and Bengals are the early leaders in the clubhouse for Luck.Bengals should have done a better job with the Palmer situation. Just a horrible organization.49ers also look bad at qb...really bad.

I would throw Washington and Miami in this situation

Seems like the point of starting this thread now would be to take what we see in preseason and use that to predict the worst teams. Whether you agree with using preseason as a gauge or not, I don't see another reason to start a new thread on this in the middle of preseason.That said, did you see Washington last night? I'm not predicting a SB or even the playoffs, but that wasn't one of the worst team's in the league out there. That was a younger, fundamentally sound team that just happens to have Rex Grossman at QB...who plays well in Kyle Shanahan's system.

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

Wasting 2nd rounders is a good way to never amount to anything.

 

[Ilov80s]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

and some of them amount to NFL elite. Drafting a guy in the 2nd and then just throwing in the towel on him the next year is not good team management.

 

[gregjcross]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

Its not necessarily a screw up to take QBs two years in a row but it is to miss on both. If Cam Newton turns out to be average, on top of Claussen being average, they have set themselves back 6 years in a period of 13 months as they should have gotten a Kolb type QB and reinfoced their D and receivers.

 

[Ilov80s]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

Its not necessarily a screw up to take QBs two years in a row but it is to miss on both. If Cam Newton turns out to be average, on top of Claussen being average, they have set themselves back 6 years in a period of 13 months as they should have gotten a Kolb type QB and reinfoced their D and receivers.

I'm not at all sold on Kolb. Instead of giving up a high draft pick for him Kolb or Newton, why not give Clausen a 2nd year and try to put some more weapons around him? He was bad last year, but he was also a rookie on the worst team in the league.

 

[Short Corner]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

 

[Sabertooth]

With the rookie cap, I'd probably take a QB #1 overall twice in a row. QBs have enormous trade value. Look what Philly got for Kevin Kolb. Imagine right now what a team would give for Matt Ryan or Sam Bradford.

 

[Donsmith753]

If you draft a Qb in the first two years in a row and he turns out to be the next Manning it sets back a franchise far less than passing on a guy because you're too proud to admit you screwed up the year before.

Barring anything strange happening this year I'd imagine any of the 32 teams would draft Luck first overall, any.

 

[Sabertooth]

If you draft a Qb in the first two years in a row and he turns out to be the next Manning it sets back a franchise far less than passing on a guy because you're too proud to admit you screwed up the year before. Barring anything strange happening this year I'd imagine any of the 32 teams would draft Luck first overall, any.

The NFL has done a pretty darn good jobs of assessing Quarterbacks too. Over 50% of first rounders hit. I like those chances.

 

[Unwrittenlaw]

Barring anything strange happening this year I'd imagine any of the 32 teams would draft Luck first overall, any.

I disagree. STL, SD, GB and a couple of other teams I would imagine would trade that pick for a boatload of picks.

 

[Donsmith753]

Barring anything strange happening this year I'd imagine any of the 32 teams would draft Luck first overall, any.

I disagree. STL, SD, GB and a couple of other teams I would imagine would trade that pick for a boatload of picks.

I agree it'd be close and the new CBA may make these sort of trades more plausible but things change quickly in the NFL and if he truly is a once in a generation type prospect I suspect they'd take him.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

and some of them amount to NFL elite. Drafting a guy in the 2nd and then just throwing in the towel on him the next year is not good team management.

Passing on the most sure-fire QB prospect since Peyton Manning is not good team management.You don't pass on a guy like that because you're worried about "wasting" your 2nd round pick, the majority of which end up busts anyhow, from the year before.

 

[AmosMoses]

Redskins OL looked like it knew what it was doing.

Based on what we know now, it looks like Luck will be banished to Cincy, and he'll change his middle name to "Bad".

 

[FreeBaGeL]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

Its not necessarily a screw up to take QBs two years in a row but it is to miss on both. If Cam Newton turns out to be average, on top of Claussen being average, they have set themselves back 6 years in a period of 13 months as they should have gotten a Kolb type QB and reinfoced their D and receivers.

I'm tired of the "drafting a QB bust early on sets your team back for years" meme. I'm a Dolphins fan, and NOT drafting a qb early has set this team back TWELVE years, and counting.

 

[FUBAR]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

and some of them amount to NFL elite. Drafting a guy in the 2nd and then just throwing in the towel on him the next year is not good team management.

Passing on the most sure-fire QB prospect since Peyton Manning is not good team management.You don't pass on a guy like that because you're worried about "wasting" your 2nd round pick, the majority of which end up busts anyhow, from the year before.

I could be wrong but I don't think he's any better than bradford. Bradford's only real question was the injury.

 

[Lash]

don't forget TEN without CJ, they want in this battle!!!!

 

[Instinctive]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

and some of them amount to NFL elite. Drafting a guy in the 2nd and then just throwing in the towel on him the next year is not good team management.

Passing on the most sure-fire QB prospect since Peyton Manning Sam Bradfordis not good team management.You don't pass on a guy like that because you're worried about "wasting" your 2nd round pick, the majority of which end up busts anyhow, from the year before.

Fixed

 

[[scooter]]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

He was more referring to Jimmy Clausen with the 2nd rounder last year and then Cam this year as the 1.1...

Oh yeah, duh. Huge screw-up there. I didn't see much of Carolina last year, but was Clausen really that bad for a rookie?

Clausen performed like you would expect a typical 2nd round rookie QB to perform. Which is why Carolina didn't think twice about taking Newton.

 

[msommer]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

same can be said for Carolina.

Epic screw up if Carolina takes QBs with the 1st pick 2 years in a row. I don't see that happening.

He was more referring to Jimmy Clausen with the 2nd rounder last year and then Cam this year as the 1.1...

Oh yeah, duh. Huge screw-up there. I didn't see much of Carolina last year, but was Clausen really that bad for a rookie?

Clausen performed like you would expect a typical 2nd round rookie QB to perform. Which is why Carolina didn't think twice about taking Newton.

And if Dalton performs like a typical 2nd year rookie - CIN won't hesitate either. Guess it doesn't hurt that the first pick is a bit cheaper these days

 

[Dr. Awesome]

If you draft a Qb in the first two years in a row and he turns out to be the next Manning it sets back a franchise far less than passing on a guy because you're too proud to admit you screwed up the year before. Barring anything strange happening this year I'd imagine any of the 32 teams would draft Luck first overall, any.

 

[Jason Wood]

I think the Bills have to be in the running. I don't see anyone on offense that's a plus. Steve Johnson is solid, but he's not an elite #1, he would be an elite #2 of course. The rest of the WR/TE stable is mind bogglingly uninspired. Fred Jackson is a nice player but, again, he's not star. Same for Fitz. And that o-line? I could see this team struggling mightily on both sides of the ball, struggling to win more than 3-4 games.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I think the Bills have to be in the running. I don't see anyone on offense that's a plus. Steve Johnson is solid, but he's not an elite #1, he would be an elite #2 of course. The rest of the WR/TE stable is mind bogglingly uninspired. Fred Jackson is a nice player but, again, he's not star. Same for Fitz. And that o-line? I could see this team struggling mightily on both sides of the ball, struggling to win more than 3-4 games.

I sure hope you're right.Not interested in seeing a 5 or 6 win season.I don't think Gailey needs stars for an effective offense though, and this defense looks like it will be significantly better.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I think the Bills have to be in the running. I don't see anyone on offense that's a plus. Steve Johnson is solid, but he's not an elite #1, he would be an elite #2 of course. The rest of the WR/TE stable is mind bogglingly uninspired. Fred Jackson is a nice player but, again, he's not star. Same for Fitz. And that o-line? I could see this team struggling mightily on both sides of the ball, struggling to win more than 3-4 games.

I sure hope you're right.Not interested in seeing a 5 or 6 win season.I don't think Gailey needs stars for an effective offense though, and this defense looks like it will be significantly better.

The Bills still can't stop the run. But I agree that the offense has enough components and enough guys that do certain things well that Gailey can fabricate a pretty interesting offense.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I think the Bills have to be in the running. I don't see anyone on offense that's a plus. Steve Johnson is solid, but he's not an elite #1, he would be an elite #2 of course. The rest of the WR/TE stable is mind bogglingly uninspired. Fred Jackson is a nice player but, again, he's not star. Same for Fitz. And that o-line? I could see this team struggling mightily on both sides of the ball, struggling to win more than 3-4 games.

I sure hope you're right.Not interested in seeing a 5 or 6 win season.I don't think Gailey needs stars for an effective offense though, and this defense looks like it will be significantly better.

The Bills still can't stop the run. But I agree that the offense has enough components and enough guys that do certain things well that Gailey can fabricate a pretty interesting offense.

this is preseason and their nickel D was the one getting shredded.Dareus and Merriman look like significant upgrades, and Barnett/Davis inside should be better than Poz/Ayodele were.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I could be wrong but I don't think he's any better than bradford. Bradford's only real question was the injury.

Passing on the most sure-fire QB prospect since Peyton Manning Sam Bradfordis not good team management.

You don't pass on a guy like that because you're worried about "wasting" your 2nd round pick, the majority of which end up busts anyhow, from the year before.

Fixed

Nuts.How they'll each turn out as a pro is still very much in question, but as far as prospects go there's absolutely no comparison between the two.

By the time next year's draft rolls around people will have been talking about intentionally losing to get a shot a Luck, and the race to get Luck, etc for an entire year. No one EVER talked about that kind of stuff with Bradford. He wasn't even the consensus #1 until just before the draft and even then there was a large contingent that thought Suh should go ahead of him even though the team drafting 1st was desperate for a QB.

It's easy to talk about Bradford like that NOW because he had such a successful rookie season, but how he was viewed as a prospect wasn't even on the same plane of existence as the way people value Luck right now.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I think the Bills have to be in the running. I don't see anyone on offense that's a plus. Steve Johnson is solid, but he's not an elite #1, he would be an elite #2 of course. The rest of the WR/TE stable is mind bogglingly uninspired. Fred Jackson is a nice player but, again, he's not star. Same for Fitz. And that o-line? I could see this team struggling mightily on both sides of the ball, struggling to win more than 3-4 games.

I sure hope you're right.Not interested in seeing a 5 or 6 win season.I don't think Gailey needs stars for an effective offense though, and this defense looks like it will be significantly better.

The Bills still can't stop the run. But I agree that the offense has enough components and enough guys that do certain things well that Gailey can fabricate a pretty interesting offense.

this is preseason and their nickel D was the one getting shredded.Dareus and Merriman look like significant upgrades, and Barnett/Davis inside should be better than Poz/Ayodele were.

Well, the Bills are going to play in the nickel the regular season too. Hopefully you're right, but so far the run defense doesn't inspire me.The O-line seems brutal too. As if we haven't seen that before. Urbik and Howard are terrible.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Well, the Bills are going to play in the nickel the regular season too. Hopefully you're right, but so far the run defense doesn't inspire me.The O-line seems brutal too. As if we haven't seen that before. Urbik and Howard are terrible.

any decent NFL offense should be able to run the ball on 2nd and long against a nickel defense.it's the first preseason game after the shortest offseason ever. seems way too early to start concluding that they won't get better.the offensive line is awful. Luck might get killed playing back there.

 

[nysportsfan]

Luck will go to the Bills and become the next Tim Couch.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Random thoughts - the Bengals schedule is way too favorable IMO for us to probably end up 1st. A team like Buffalo has a much better chance based on the competition they'll have to face alone. The same can be said for Carolina (they can be like the Lions of QBs and take one every year .

I think if the Bengals do end up with the #1 however there's a better chance that they trade the pick for a hefty package. Now that there's a reasonable rookie scale, the #1 pick has value again in terms of teams wanting to trade up. They'd be able to get quite a ransom for him I think. I think they pass on Luck for a couple of reasons: 1) Mikey Boy is stubborn, 2) see the recent experience with a #1 overall QB - they'll see Dalton as a "safer" play (i.e. affordable) and I do think they've bought into the kid. Remember, they got Boomer in Round 2 (Mikey surely will remember that).

Of course a hilarious scenario would be they get the #1 pick and package it along WITH Palmer to a team - putting Palmer into the position of having to groom his replacement elsewhere (I know, this wouldn't really happen, but it'd be funny).

Anyhow, preseason week 1 is a wee bit early to make these kind of pronouncements. Sometimes teams make a rapid descent - heck the Panthers were 12-4 two years before they finished 2-14. Who knows, you could be looking at a team like the Giants having a disaster, getting a couple key devastating injuries and suddenly they're there (for example).

-QG

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

landing a good backup QB is not a waste. If Dalton develops, they could always trade him like the Falcons did after they developed Schaub behind Vick or like the Packers did with guys like Aaron Brooks and Matt Hasselbeck behind Favre. Jaguars traded Brunell's backup Rob Johnson for a 1st round pick that got them Fred Taylor.Having 2 good young QBs is a good thing. Far from a waste.

 

[Instinctive]

I could be wrong but I don't think he's any better than bradford. Bradford's only real question was the injury.

Passing on the most sure-fire QB prospect since Peyton Manning Sam Bradfordis not good team management.

You don't pass on a guy like that because you're worried about "wasting" your 2nd round pick, the majority of which end up busts anyhow, from the year before.

Fixed

Nuts.How they'll each turn out as a pro is still very much in question, but as far as prospects go there's absolutely no comparison between the two.

By the time next year's draft rolls around people will have been talking about intentionally losing to get a shot a Luck, and the race to get Luck, etc for an entire year. No one EVER talked about that kind of stuff with Bradford. He wasn't even the consensus #1 until just before the draft and even then there was a large contingent that thought Suh should go ahead of him even though the team drafting 1st was desperate for a QB.

It's easy to talk about Bradford like that NOW because he had such a successful rookie season, but how he was viewed as a prospect wasn't even on the same plane of existence as the way people value Luck right now.

Actually, he was viewed as that type of prospect leading up to the season...and then he had a major injury. That's where all the questions came from. In fact, going into that year, he was constantly referred to as "the best prospect since Manning." The injury and subsequent re-injury and surgery changed all that.

 

[Instinctive]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

landing a good backup QB is not a waste. If Dalton develops, they could always trade him like the Falcons did after they developed Schaub behind Vick or like the Packers did with guys like Aaron Brooks and Matt Hasselbeck behind Favre. Jaguars traded Brunell's backup Rob Johnson for a 1st round pick that got them Fred Taylor.Having 2 good young QBs is a good thing. Far from a waste.

Didn't the Packers also develop Brunell behind Favre?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Didn't the Packers also develop Brunell behind Favre?

yes. Packers did this better than anyone. Draft a guy late, develop him, and then move him for quality picks that improve your team.Tougher to do when you burn a 2nd round pick on a guy, but I'm sure the Bengals could get value for him if he turns out to be a legit starting-caliber QB.As another example, I don't think drafting Drew Brees was a waste for the Chargers just because they wound up drafting Eli and then trading him for Rivers a little while later.

 

[Insein]

With the new rookie wage scale, 1st round QB busts don't hurt as much as they used too. With a manageable salary and number of years, teams can afford to admit a mistake and draft a better player without the hardship of the monstrous cap hit. Instead of being stuck with a Jarmarcus Russell contract, a team can get out from under the dead weight within a year or two as opposed to 6 (Alex Smith). If a team with a solid starting QB somehow has a bad year and gets the #1 pick, it'll be worth a king's ransom because of the new pay scale.

 

[[scooter]]

Didn't the Packers also develop Brunell behind Favre?

yes. Packers did this better than anyone. Draft a guy late, develop him, and then move him for quality picks that improve your team.

Mark Brunell was drafted in the 5th round and then traded for 2 draft picks (which turned out to be William Henderson and Travis Jervey)

Aaron Brooks was drafted in the 4th round and then traded for 2 draft picks (K.D. Williams and Heath Evans)

Matt Hasselbeck was drafted in the 6th round and then traded for a 3rd round pick (Torrance Marshall)

Also, the Packers had 7 other quarterbacks on their roster from 1992-2007 that would eventually leave via free agency and start for other teams (Don Majkowski, Ty Detmer, Steve Bono, Rick Mirer, J.T. O'Sullivan, Henry Burris, and Kurt Warner).

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Actually, he was viewed as that type of prospect leading up to the season...and then he had a major injury. That's where all the questions came from. In fact, going into that year, he was constantly referred to as "the best prospect since Manning." The injury and subsequent re-injury and surgery changed all that.

Link to the "Sam Bradford watch" thread?

 

[AmosMoses]

If Cinci takes Luck, they flushed a high 2nd round pick down the drain this year. That is pretty sad for a team with so many holes.

The vast majority of teams end up flushing their 2nd round pick down the drain every year. The majority of those guys never amount to anything anyway.

and some of them amount to NFL elite. Drafting a guy in the 2nd and then just throwing in the towel on him the next year is not good team management.

Passing on the most sure-fire QB prospect since Peyton Manning Sam Bradfordis not good team management.You don't pass on a guy like that because you're worried about "wasting" your 2nd round pick, the majority of which end up busts anyhow, from the year before.

Fixed

No, you broke it.