Any thoughts on jets LB converted DE Bryan Thomas? (1 Viewer)

[varmint cong]

Jene, Rovers please chime in. It seems after LB thomas was converted to DE he has been very productive, with 8 and 11 tackles in the last 2 games, he's a FA next yr and playing for a contract, is he a viable fantasy option with Magini and his indecision with the 4-3, 3-4. Thanks

 

[Bizkiteer]

Uhhh, he was drafted as a DE and is the only position is listed as playing. This year, at times he's played as a stand up rusher of sorts, but the NYJ still and always has listed as a DE for what it's worth.

 

[Rovers]

The last two weeks the Jets have stayed with the 3-4 much more often than the prevuios couple of games. Thomas has taken about 80% of his snaps lined up as an OLB in the 3-4 this season would be my estimate. He's been improving in this scheme pretty steadilly, especially in run defense, but he's still an OLB in a 3-4, and his name isn't Meriman.

As long as he's listed as a DE however, he could be a top five depending on the scoring system. There are one of two possibilities as far as his sacks go. He either has no pass rush ability, no outside move, no inside move, no spin move, no bull rush..... or he's been told to just contain on the outside, preventing the opposing QB from rolling to his right. He takes a straight line to the offensive tackle and stops.... does some hand fighting and that's about it.

It's very possible that this is the scheme however. Maningini seems to want the pressure to come up the middle, while containing on the outside. Mangini did single out Thomas for some individual praise this week. He's definitely a better 3-4 OLB than he is a 4-3 DE.

Yes, he's in his contract year. I hope he doesn't prove to be another Farrior.... a guy that took time to develop and then left the franchise only to become a pro bowler for Pittsburgh.

I don't think he'll keep these tackle numbers in the double digits, but as a DE he's an extremely solid play, studly even. I have him in a dynasty league, but I'm not counting on him for next year, when he could be elsewhere or relisted as a LB.

 

[varmint cong]

great insight Rovers as usual..I guess since magini switches from the 3-4 to the 4-3 , some sites (ESPN)(CBS) list him as a DE where he has great value

** Baker in IDP Admission also has a great write up on him

 

[Jene Bramel]

Rovers.

The Jets, as near as I can tell from the post-mortems, played a traditional 3-4 look only rarely despite opening in it against Jacksonville in an attempt to improve their run defense. That didn't work so they've been back in the 3-4 primarily. I haven't seen the past two Jets games to form an educated opinion on why Thomas has suddenly erupted in the box scores. What I saw during the first month makes it difficult to say that he's now more comfortable in the defense, but two games is dangerously close to a trend.

And pay no attention to the NFL.com/NYJ depth chart. Thomas is no more a DE than Willie McGinest, Rosie Colvin, Kamerion Wimbley, Victor Hobson etc are. By convention, he's a linebacker the vast majority of the time.

 

[varmint cong]

thanks Jene, so the assumption is ? IF Thomas can be played as a DE in some leagues , that he has great value?

 

[Jene Bramel]

thanks Jene, so the assumption is ? IF Thomas can be played as a DE in some leagues , that he has great value?

He looks like it. Even his "poor" games end up looking awful nice in most scoring systems from the DL position. If the current trend is the correct one, he'll be top five by years end. Color me a little skeptical -- I didn't like any part of Thomas' game against NE or IND -- but it's difficult to argue that Thomas isn't very good when he's put up 19 total tackles the past two games.

 

[The Man With No Name]

He is listed as a DE at nfl.com. Bryan Thomas player page

If you look at the games he has started the last 2 years, you will see he has put up good stats in those games, with only 1 bad start among them.

 

[Rovers]

great insight Rovers as usual..I guess since magini switches from the 3-4 to the 4-3 , some sites (ESPN)(CBS) list him as a DE where he has great value** Baker in IDP Admission also has a great write up on him

Well, that's the problem.... one I have brought up many times in this forum. How does a player get listed? My better leagues use the official NFL.com site, and while it's far from perfect, it does eliminate disputes, and is for the most part pretty accurate. But.... and I think this is silly stooopid, the guy that made up the official depth chart that goes to the NFL, and is then posted at NFL.com, was the PR guy for the Jets. Yeah, the freakin PR guy. Mangini was quoted as saying "He did a pretty good job of it." Nice. Bogus. But, it was what I was banking on in one of my dynasty leagues this year. I'm at .500.... Dallas relisted Greg Ellis as an LB a few weeks ago, and he has very little value now. Thanks for mentioning Baker's article... going off to read it now...PS: I don't like to contradict staff, but Baker went by the Gamebook. The Gamebook can not be trusted. Thomas has played almost exclusivley at OLB the past two weeks. Very little 4-3.

 

[cracKer]

PS: I don't like to contradict staff, but Baker went by the Gamebook. The Gamebook can not be trusted. Thomas has played almost exclusivley at OLB the past two weeks. Very little 4-3.

The Gamebook has shown the Jets opening in a 4-3 defense pretty much every game this year. I understand what you say about Thomas playing the majority of his snaps as an OLB, but have they started the games with a four man front? When you say that the Gamebooks can't be trusted, I assume you're saying the Jets are opening in a 3-4 and they're (GB) noting it wrong.If the Jets truly open with a 4-3 and switch back and forth throughout the game, there's not much that we can do about his designation as a DE. I guess if Mangini officially listed the teams deffense as a 3-4 and switched back and forth from there, his designation would likely change. Needless to say, his longterm outlook as a listed DE doesn't look good. Great player to trade after the season to an unknowing soul.

 

[Jene Bramel]

PS: I don't like to contradict staff, but Baker went by the Gamebook. The Gamebook can not be trusted. Thomas has played almost exclusivley at OLB the past two weeks. Very little 4-3.

The Gamebook has shown the Jets opening in a 4-3 defense pretty much every game this year. I understand what you say about Thomas playing the majority of his snaps as an OLB, but have they started the games with a four man front? When you say that the Gamebooks can't be trusted, I assume you're saying the Jets are opening in a 3-4 and they're (GB) noting it wrong.If the Jets truly open with a 4-3 and switch back and forth throughout the game, there's not much that we can do about his designation as a DE. I guess if Mangini officially listed the teams deffense as a 3-4 and switched back and forth from there, his designation would likely change. Needless to say, his longterm outlook as a listed DE doesn't look good. Great player to trade after the season to an unknowing soul.

They've opened in a 4-3 in only one game that I'm aware of -- Jacksonville -- according to observers and news accounts. Granted, those are as likely to be untrustworthy as the gamebooks, but in the two full games I've seen, IND and NE, they've played little or no 3-4 at all. The gamebooks are essentially using the same depth chart designations they did in 2005. The safeties no longer align R/L as listed and Vilma is probably the WLB in those sets that look 4-3.Usually the spotters that work the gamebook crews get the opening lineups correct -- i.e. make correct adjustments when teams open in a 3 WR or 2 TE set. But it seems (in this case) that they've relied on the original depth chart handed them by the team when the base defense opens the game. With the issues some stadium's spotting crews have had awarding stats this year, I'm becoming more and more leery of using them as an absolute primary source.I'm in agreement, though, about the issues surrounding his IDP designation. I didn't manually switch Thomas in my leagues this season because of all the confusion with the depth charts and because he does line up as a DE rarely. Every coach/player quote I've seen refers to him as a LB, though.

 

[Dave Baker]

PS: I don't like to contradict staff, but Baker went by the Gamebook. The Gamebook can not be trusted.

FYI, I did not go by the gamebook. I went off media reports in New York discussing his position change from LB to DE and it affected him in a positive way. I can try to find something online if it's requested.

 

[gerome]

I don't understand what is going on with the CBS site. There is no consistancy with it. They have Bryan Thomas listed as a LB, but the NFL site has him as a DE. So, the owner has to play him as a LB. The they have Adalius Thomas listed as a LB, but that owner can play him as a DE. Very frustrating. Does MFL have a better handle on things?

 

[Dave Baker]

Does MFL have a better handle on things?

My experience is that MFL does poorly as well, although the commish can change a player's position.Since Ourlads now is pay, I'm in a league that started using FBGs as their official positional guide.

 

[cracKer]

I don't understand what is going on with the CBS site. There is no consistancy with it. They have Bryan Thomas listed as a LB, but the NFL site has him as a DE. So, the owner has to play him as a LB. The they have Adalius Thomas listed as a LB, but that owner can play him as a DE. Very frustrating. Does MFL have a better handle on things?

Unless manually adjusted by the commish, I believe that B.Thomas is listed as a DL and A.Thomas is a LB in MFL.They seem to keep the positions pretty well in line and I don't think that I'd count this Bryan Thomas situation as a fault of MFL's. Until the Gamebook people (whoever they are) actually get in line with the Jets to determine what their base defense is, we won't have a clear cut answer.

What position does Thomas play when the Jets are in a 4-3? (which they are listed in on both Gamebooks and NFL.com depth charts)

 

[Jene Bramel]

I don't understand what is going on with the CBS site. There is no consistancy with it. They have Bryan Thomas listed as a LB, but the NFL site has him as a DE. So, the owner has to play him as a LB. The they have Adalius Thomas listed as a LB, but that owner can play him as a DE. Very frustrating. Does MFL have a better handle on things?

Unless manually adjusted by the commish, I believe that B.Thomas is listed as a DL and A.Thomas is a LB in MFL.They seem to keep the positions pretty well in line and I don't think that I'd count this Bryan Thomas situation as a fault of MFL's. Until the Gamebook people (whoever they are) actually get in line with the Jets to determine what their base defense is, we won't have a clear cut answer.

What position does Thomas play when the Jets are in a 4-3? (which they are listed in on both Gamebooks and NFL.com depth charts)

DE.Cracker is right. BThomas = DE, AThomas = LB in the MFL system. And I agree, the Thomas designation shouldn't be blamed on MFL.

 

[varmint cong]

So just to reiterate, Thomas' tackle numbers make him a great DL but his potential for sacks may be limited by his sacking abilities and possible schemes. You guys have been extremely helpful, thanks again

 

[Rovers]

I went back and looked at some articles on Thomas after last week's game. They are VERY misleading. Last week the Jets opened in the 3-4. This allignment shows three down linemen, with the two OLB's up on the line and not in a 3 point stance. Thomas was up and was at LOLB. He made the first tackle from that spot as well. So, the Gamebook is most definitely incorrect. I can asure any and all that Thomas has been the LOLB for the past two weeks, and even some articles I've read have gotten that fact wrong.

Thomas might have taken two snaps at DE the last two weeks, at the VERY most. The Jets simply are not running the 4-3. Ellis, VonOllenhoffen, Hamilton and Ball are the 3-4 DE's. Thomas hasn't taken even one snap as a DE in the 3-4. He does move to DE in the 4-3, which the Jets simply aren't using for the past two games.

Thomas has been getting these numbers from the LOLB spot. That's a hard cold fact. NY area reporters aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer.

 

[code]

FYI...MFL publishes all player position changes here...of note, they changed Greg Ellis to LB last week...

 

[cracKer]

I went back and looked at some articles on Thomas after last week's game. They are VERY misleading. Last week the Jets opened in the 3-4. This allignment shows three down linemen, with the two OLB's up on the line and not in a 3 point stance. Thomas was up and was at LOLB. He made the first tackle from that spot as well. So, the Gamebook is most definitely incorrect. I can asure any and all that Thomas has been the LOLB for the past two weeks, and even some articles I've read have gotten that fact wrong.

Thomas might have taken two snaps at DE the last two weeks, at the VERY most. The Jets simply are not running the 4-3. Ellis, VonOllenhoffen, Hamilton and Ball are the 3-4 DE's. Thomas hasn't taken even one snap as a DE in the 3-4. He does move to DE in the 4-3, which the Jets simply aren't using for the past two games.

Thomas has been getting these numbers from the LOLB spot. That's a hard cold fact. NY area reporters aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer.

Bottom line...ride him while you can and hope they don't get their #### together with the designation

:marquescolston: