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Assessing Reggie Bush's Value. People Overpaying? (1 Viewer)

It is obvious that the kid is going to be a star .... that is a given ..... but how much do we as Fantasy Football Owners unload to land this guy? In one league I saw the 1.1 Rookie Pick traded for as low as Kevin Jones and as high as Edgerrin James. Do we assume right out of the gate that he is the next Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson?

In one Dynasty league where I am desperate for help at RB, (Start 2 or 3, With only Edge, Dillon, Gado, Pass and Payton to speak of), I have been offered this trade:

My 1.5, 1.12 and Alex Smith, TBB TE for 1.1.

Is Reggie Bush worth more than say a Laurence Maroney, Vince Young or DeAngelo Williams + a 1.12 pick and Alex Smith?

Where is the line drawn? What are you willing to give up to grab him in your Dynasty League?

 

Imedos

Footballguy
Bush will be overpayed for in most leagues. If he does indeed go to Houston he will be in a rbbc, and that will limit his production.

I have the number 2 pick in one league, and I have no desire to move up at all. If Bush falls to me, then yeah, good flex option, good future investment. If not, then there will likely be another very good rb that is drafted into a position to make an immediate fantasy impact.

 

Dave Baker

Damn glad to meet you
It is obvious that the kid is going to be a star .... that is a given ..... but how much do we as Fantasy Football Owners unload to land this guy? In one league I saw the 1.1 Rookie Pick traded for as low as Kevin Jones and as high as Edgerrin James. Do we assume right out of the gate that he is the next Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson?
I offered Edge + for the rights to Bush and was turned down. If you assumed right out of the gate that he was going to be Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson, he's worth a lot more than them right now because of age (dynasty leagues only, obviously). If you think he'll one day equal those guys, it gets closer. And if you think he'll be nothing but a RBBC player, then he's not worth it.But far too many people are unable to look beyond the next year or two and it sometimes take bold moves to strike it rich.

Me? I think he's going to be monster and am not worried about waiting 2-3 years for it.

 

Bloom

Moderator
It is obvious that the kid is going to be a star .... that is a given ..... but how much do we as Fantasy Football Owners unload to land this guy?  In one league I saw the 1.1 Rookie Pick traded for as low as Kevin Jones and as high as Edgerrin James.  Do we assume right out of the gate that he is the next Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson? 
I offered Edge + for the rights to Bush and was turned down. If you assumed right out of the gate that he was going to be Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson, he's worth a lot more than them right now because of age (dynasty leagues only, obviously). If you think he'll one day equal those guys, it gets closer. And if you think he'll be nothing but a RBBC player, then he's not worth it.But far too many people are unable to look beyond the next year or two and it sometimes take bold moves to strike it rich.

Me? I think he's going to be monster and am not worried about waiting 2-3 years for it.
:goodposting: Ill keep beating the drum - Bush is going to be Marshall Faulk + a 5th gear. I love hearing all this "bush is not an everydown back" talk. Are you friggin kidding me? If you take a player a like Bush, you mold your offense around him, you don't try to just plug him into the system you ran with your last starting RB.

Bush is worth just below the LJ/LT/SA tier in my book. If your league is PPR, that makes it a no brainer, because Bush is automatically one of best receiving RBs in the league from the moment he's drafted.

I would never trade Bush for 1.05, 1.12, and Alex Smith, thats not even close to his value.

Keep things in perspective. One thing I love to cite is that the conventional wisdom was that UT (a top college defense with at least 4 guys who will play on Sundays) "shut down" Bush because they "held him" to 177 yards (on 19 touches, thats over 9 yards a touch, kids) and a TD.

Anyone who trades Bush for anything less than a king's ransom is going to be sorry.

 
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FBGPoker

Fruitcake
My 1.5, 1.12 and Alex Smith, TBB TE for 1.1.
Accept this trade as fast as you can.Bush >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My 1.5, 1.12 and Alex Smith, TBB TEThis will go down as the steal of the century for you.
 
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Bloom

Moderator
My 1.5, 1.12 and Alex Smith, TBB TE for 1.1.
Accept this trade as fast as you can.Bush >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My 1.5, 1.12 and Alex Smith, TBB TE

This will go down as the steal of the century for you.
:goodposting:
 

kellumsboys

Footballguy
we just had a draft in a 12 team keeper on Pro Bowl Sunday.

I tried as hard as I could to trade the # 1 pick, talking up Bush as much as I could, but had no takers.

with all the talk about Bush I was sure someone would be eager to jump on him.

I still couldn't pull the trigger on Bush.

Marvin Harrison was my choice at 1.1 .

:banned:

 
I was called crazy but im sticking with my gunz.....I TRADED:

LT and A.Lelie

For

1.01 (Reggie Bush)

F.Gore

P.Rivers

Mike WIlliams

(all of those guys were 1st round dynasty draft picks).

Trade had to do more with what I see Bush and Gore as than anything. I do believe Bush will go to the texans and have an instant impact....Those that think it will be a rbbc is really funny to me, its like saying Put up the mercedes so we can drive the toyota..so we wont put to many miles on the benz....Bush is far more talented than DD and DD will only be used cause Bush Gives the Texans another demension aside just a straight rb...dude would be the best wr on the team instantly...yes he has better hands and runs better routes than AJ. He will be super valueable....I think he may only run the ball about 15-18 times a game but also get 9 targets in the passing game a game. I see superstud all over this guy....so much for me to part with MR might LT.

I also think Gore has alot of upside in him as well, this is adynasty and i do think Nolan may give him a shot next year.

Rivers may be starting now with the recent events with Brees and have a nice surrounding cast to atleast produce nice numbers

M.Martz will give M.Williams every chance to suceed in there offense.

All in all if you dont get this guy you may nver be able to land him once he's on someone else franchise. Especially if he transfers all those skills to the nfl, which i dont see why he wont. They alwasy say the speed on NFL calibure players are faster than college players...well Bush has more speed than FWP Portis Tiki LT among other and if NFL players cant cathc them how in da hell the gone catch Bush?

Only time will tell though, if you feel strong about him the go after him.

I own the 1.01 in 2 diffrent dynastys and have been offered ALOT for him....but im staying put!

 

musicdvm

Footballguy
There is no way I would do this trade. Take a look at what you are getting. In my opinion there is no one in the draft that has more upside than Bush. Yes, he may be a bust, but any of the others may be a bust as well. He, above the other potential RB's, has more of a chance of succeeding.

So what you are basically getting is a 1.5 and 1.12 for 1.1 (I don't even count Smith - he is the garbage add on in order to make the trade looker better). 1.5 + 1.12 doesn't even come close to equaling 1.1. So you are basically trading a top tier RB for a 2nd tier RB plus a second tier WR/QB

If it was me, I would counter with a decent RB from the other guy's team PLUS 1.5 and 1.12. Forget Smith.

Everyone is thinking this guy is going to walk on water. Use that to your advantage. Ask a lot for him. Someone gullible will take. I personally feel his trade value will never be higher than now.

 
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Well, I decided to go ahead and pull the trigger on that one. I had made a trade mid-season in anticipation of this one anyway ..... but a few key factors had made the possibility a little less likely towards end of the season ...

See, about week 10 or so, I was offered a trade from a guy with a 5-5 record ..... His 1st Rd Rook, 3rd Rd Rook, Alex Smith SF QB, and Lamar Gordon for Kevin Jones. At the time, I was 5-5 as well, and assumed I would be landing two mid-1st Rd Picks ..... which I would have easily been able to exchange for the 1.1. Well, then the ******* goes on a 6 game win-streak and takes the league championship ... leaving me with the 1.12 ..... and making that trade seem like one HELL of a bust.

Now however, it seems to have worked in my favor. If you look at it very generally, I traded my 1.5, Kevin Jones & Alex Smith TBB TE for Reggie Bush, Alex Smith SF QB, Lamar Gordon (Garbage throw-in) and a 3rd Rd Rook. In the long run, I think this will pay off quite well for my Dynasty Squad. (But then again you are talking to someone who absolutely HATES Kevin Jones and was more than happy to unload him ...... even for the likes of Ryan Leaf v.2.0)

Speaking of .......... does anyone see him having a better season than last? My QB situation is pretty bleak and I could really use him putting it together for a few games. (Jake Delhomme, Chad Pennington, Aaron Rodgers, Alex Smith, Jamie Martin, Jay Fiedler)

Sorry if this sounds more like a "help" topic than a discussion ..... It was more meant for reassurance than anything.

(And by the way, I am a new immigrant from the M.I.A. FFToday Boards ..... :rant: :yucky: :thumbdown: :confused: :wall: )

 

Simris

Footballguy
For your reference here is a link to an Asst Coach thread I started a bit back.

It is a collection of offers for the #1 pick in dynasty leagues.

I figure if you have the #1 this year you need to wait around for the owner who is willing to pay for RBush as if he were the M. Faulk with an 'overdrive gear', as mentioned above.

 

FreeBaGeL

Footballguy
I have been offered this trade:My 1.5, 1.12 and Alex Smith, TBB TE for 1.1.
Man, that is a ridiculous trade. I'm not even that high on Bush's dynasty value but wow, pull the trigger on that deal before that guy gets replaced by a sane owner. You're giving up practically nothing there.
 

FreeBaGeL

Footballguy
Well, I decided to go ahead and pull the trigger on that one. I had made a trade mid-season in anticipation of this one anyway ..... but a few key factors had made the possibility a little less likely towards end of the season ...

See, about week 10 or so, I was offered a trade from a guy with a 5-5 record ..... His 1st Rd Rook, 3rd Rd Rook, Alex Smith SF QB, and Lamar Gordon for Kevin Jones. At the time, I was 5-5 as well, and assumed I would be landing two mid-1st Rd Picks ..... which I would have easily been able to exchange for the 1.1. Well, then the ******* goes on a 6 game win-streak and takes the league championship ... leaving me with the 1.12 ..... and making that trade seem like one HELL of a bust.

Now however, it seems to have worked in my favor. If you look at it very generally, I traded my 1.5, Kevin Jones & Alex Smith TBB TE for Reggie Bush, Alex Smith SF QB, Lamar Gordon (Garbage throw-in) and a 3rd Rd Rook. In the long run, I think this will pay off quite well for my Dynasty Squad. (But then again you are talking to someone who absolutely HATES Kevin Jones and was more than happy to unload him ...... even for the likes of Ryan Leaf v.2.0)

Speaking of .......... does anyone see him having a better season than last? My QB situation is pretty bleak and I could really use him putting it together for a few games. (Jake Delhomme, Chad Pennington, Aaron Rodgers, Alex Smith, Jamie Martin, Jay Fiedler)

Sorry if this sounds more like a "help" topic than a discussion ..... It was more meant for reassurance than anything.

(And by the way, I am a new immigrant from the M.I.A. FFToday Boards ..... :rant: :yucky: :thumbdown: :confused: :wall: )
I think you got it backwards. He's GETTING the 1.01 (Bush) and GIVING the 1.05, 1.12, and Smith.
 
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me. As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ... :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated :thumbup:

 
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Liquid Tension

Footballguy
It is obvious that the kid is going to be a star .... that is a given .....

Why is it a given? I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, but how many 5'11" guys that weigh 200 lbs are stars in the NFL? If he were shorter and that weight he would have a lower center of gravity and would have more bulk. at 5"11" and 200 he is lean (even if ripped). Tiki is the same weight, but an inch shorter, but he took awhile to reach a top level and still can't push the pile for TD's. Portis may be the best comp as he is the same height and they have the same build. Portis is still 13 pounds heavier. If he can be Portis than that is good, but I don't think anything is a given, even if likely

I think we saw in the Championship game that he didn't look to good and what is he going to do when 245 lb linebackers that run a 4.55 don't let him turn the corner? Surely he won't rely on running over guys.

Finally, what about durability? He is light and hasn't carried the full load.

Just throwing a monkey wrench
 

cscmtp

Footballguy
I think Bush is going to be a star too. That being said, towards the end of last year, I traded Lewis, 2 WRs scrubs, and the 1.1 and 1.5 rookie picks to get Steve Smith, S.Moss, and A. Green. My team really needed WR help, so I felt it was worth moving a potential star for 2 of the best young WRs in the game.

 

J-Money

Footballguy
In z17 the 1.01 pick was traded:

1.01,3.01, Derrick Johnson, and Tynes

for

David Carr, Frank Gore, Derrick Mason, Alex Brown, and 1.10

I couldn't believe the 1.01 for that, i was offering up S-Jax and some other stuff (and asking for additional picks instead of players)

 

Chaos

Footballguy
Does time really take away people's memories about Faulk and his 40 time this quickly?

Faulk was wicked fast and I remember times like 4.29 to 4.35. This is FASTER than Bush.

You know who you are, why do you keep posting things like "Bush is going to be Marshall Faulk + a 5th gear"

If you want to say that Bush is going to Marshall Faulk I could buy it easier than adding in the nonsense about speed.

 

Weiner Dog

Footballguy
Here's the best part about Bush's current value...

Everybody already has him tagged for HOU. People assume he'll be splitting time with DD in '06. Sure, he's probably 90% of the way there. However, a trade in the draft (#1 overall for ???) will only accentuate his value. Don't forget...Denver now has the #15 and #22 overall picks. This would have to look appealing for a rebuilding team like HOU.

 

Weiner Dog

Footballguy
Does time really take away people's memories about Faulk and his 40 time this quickly?

Faulk was wicked fast and I remember times like 4.29 to 4.35. This is FASTER than Bush.

You know who you are, why do you keep posting things like "Bush is going to be Marshall Faulk + a 5th gear"

If you want to say that Bush is going to Marshall Faulk I could buy it easier than adding in the nonsense about speed.
:goodposting: 4.33/40 for Faulk:

http://www.jockbio.com/Bios/Faulk/Faulk_bio.html

The months leading up to the draft were a time of transition for Marshall. He had every intention of completing his education and getting his degree, but there was little time for schoolwork. Several weeks before draft day, Marshall held a special workout for scouts. During the session, he produced a vertical leap of 37 inches, and ran a 4.33 in the 40-yard dash. While those numbers helped project Marshall as a high-first-round pick, NFL teams still had questions about him. Most concentrated on his size and durability. Marshall’s attitude was also somewhat of a mystery. He was obviously thoughtful and intelligent, but there were concerns about his background and motivation.

 

WhoDat

Footballguy
The highest a player can grade out on a predraft scorecard is an 8. Only 2 RB have ever graded an 8. Those players are O.J. Simpson and Bo Jackson. Early feelings are that Bush could grade out that high or come damn near close. That is coming from two sources, which are a scout within an NFL orgainzation and an agent.

I am not saying I agree or disagree but that is the expectation of pros and scouts of how he should rate after his pro day. If that is in fact the case, a dynasty league owner owning pick 1.1 would be better off holding serve and keeping the rights to that pick until the first weekend of May versus letting it burn a hole in his pocket and dumping it prior to late April.

I also agree with Weiner Dog, which is probably the minority. It is premature to put Bush in a Texans' uniform. If Bush grades that high, the act of Houston trading that pick becomes less than 5%, opinion, but it could happen.

A dynasty owner trading that pick right now is extremely short sighted unless he can reload his team. Still, it is too early to trade out of or off the 1.1. Conversely, if you have the depth to leverage your team to get that pick and an owner foolish enough to trade it away, then do so...immediately.

 

Chaos

Footballguy
20+ posts an nobody has mentioned to this noob that he is in the wrong forum. What is going on here!?!?!?! :shock:
haha, I just really wanted to see where this would go. I love to debate the topic without answering the "what do I do" part.

 

FreeBaGeL

Footballguy
In z17 the 1.01 pick was traded:

1.01,3.01, Derrick Johnson, and Tynes

for

David Carr, Frank Gore, Derrick Mason, Alex Brown, and 1.10

I couldn't believe the 1.01 for that, i was offering up S-Jax and some other stuff (and asking for additional picks instead of players)
Haha, that guy should be booted out of the league. Wow I wish I could get into money leagues with people like this.
 

JohnnyU

Footballguy
It is obvious that the kid is going to be a star .... that is a given ..... but how much do we as Fantasy Football Owners unload to land this guy?  In one league I saw the 1.1 Rookie Pick traded for as low as Kevin Jones and as high as Edgerrin James.  Do we assume right out of the gate that he is the next Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson? 
I offered Edge + for the rights to Bush and was turned down. If you assumed right out of the gate that he was going to be Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson, he's worth a lot more than them right now because of age (dynasty leagues only, obviously). If you think he'll one day equal those guys, it gets closer. And if you think he'll be nothing but a RBBC player, then he's not worth it.But far too many people are unable to look beyond the next year or two and it sometimes take bold moves to strike it rich.

Me? I think he's going to be monster and am not worried about waiting 2-3 years for it.
:goodposting: Ill keep beating the drum - Bush is going to be Marshall Faulk + a 5th gear. I love hearing all this "bush is not an everydown back" talk. Are you friggin kidding me? If you take a player a like Bush, you mold your offense around him, you don't try to just plug him into the system you ran with your last starting RB.

Bush is worth just below the LJ/LT/SA tier in my book. If your league is PPR, that makes it a no brainer, because Bush is automatically one of best receiving RBs in the league from the moment he's drafted.

I would never trade Bush for 1.05, 1.12, and Alex Smith, thats not even close to his value.

Keep things in perspective. One thing I love to cite is that the conventional wisdom was that UT (a top college defense with at least 4 guys who will play on Sundays) "shut down" Bush because they "held him" to 177 yards (on 19 touches, thats over 9 yards a touch, kids) and a TD.

Anyone who trades Bush for anything less than a king's ransom is going to be sorry.
I traded for a guy's 1st rd pick 2 years ago (dynasty league), and it turned out to be 1.01. I'll gladly add Bush to the LJ, SJ, and KJ stable.
 

cstu

Footballguy
I was called crazy but im sticking with my gunz.....I TRADED:

LT and A.Lelie

For

1.01 (Reggie Bush)

F.Gore

P.Rivers

Mike WIlliams

(all of those guys were 1st round dynasty draft picks).

Trade had to do more with what I see Bush and Gore as than anything. I do believe Bush will go to the texans and have an instant impact....Those that think it will be a rbbc is really funny to me, its like saying Put up the mercedes so we can drive the toyota..so we wont put to many miles on the benz....Bush is far more talented than DD and DD will only be used cause Bush Gives the Texans another demension aside just a straight rb...dude would be the best wr on the team instantly...yes he has better hands and runs better routes than AJ. He will be super valueable....I think he may only run the ball about 15-18 times a game but also get 9 targets in the passing game a game. I see superstud all over this guy....so much for me to part with MR might LT.

I also think Gore has alot of upside in him as well, this is adynasty and i do think Nolan may give him a shot next year.

Rivers may be starting now with the recent events with Brees and have a nice surrounding cast to atleast produce nice numbers

M.Martz will give M.Williams every chance to suceed in there offense.

All in all if you dont get this guy you may nver be able to land him once he's on someone else franchise. Especially if he transfers all those skills to the nfl, which i dont see why he wont. They alwasy say the speed on NFL calibure players are faster than college players...well Bush has more speed than FWP Portis Tiki LT among other and if NFL players cant cathc them how in da hell the gone catch Bush?

Only time will tell though, if you feel strong about him the go after him.

I own the 1.01 in 2 diffrent dynastys and have been offered ALOT for him....but im staying put!
I'd normally call someone crazy for trading LT, but that is a lot of value for him. High risk, but I like the upside on Rivers and BMW who are probably at the the lowest value they will ever have. I can see this trade looking bad in 2006 but in 2007 and beyond you should be loaded.
 

ratbast

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me. As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ... :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.

 

cstu

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me. As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ... :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.
I don't care what people were like on FFT as long as they don't bring attitude here. I'm sure FFT serves a purpose but the reason FBGs is a great forum is that (for the most part) everyone is "excellent" to each other, even if they strongly differ in opinion.
 

JohnnyU

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me.  As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ...  :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated  :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.
I don't care what people were like on FFT as long as they don't bring attitude here. I'm sure FFT serves a purpose but the reason FBGs is a great forum is that (for the most part) everyone is "excellent" to each other, even if they strongly differ in opinion.
I've posted some at FFT and lurked there as well, and I can tell you that a lot of folks from that board won't last long here unless there are some serious attitude adjustments.
 

ratbast

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me.  As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ...  :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated  :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.
I don't care what people were like on FFT as long as they don't bring attitude here. I'm sure FFT serves a purpose but the reason FBGs is a great forum is that (for the most part) everyone is "excellent" to each other, even if they strongly differ in opinion.
I've posted some at FFT and lurked there as well, and I can tell you that a lot of folks from that board won't last long here unless there are some serious attitude adjustments.
The way FFT is perceived here is wrong. Certain members were jerks and they didnt get banned as fast as they would here. Fine. But these are different sites, with different tolerance. I like it here but slamming FFT doesnt sit well with me (as if I matter;))Back to the topic:

"Is Reggie Bush worth more than say a Laurence Maroney, Vince Young or DeAngelo Williams + a 1.12 pick and Alex Smith?"

What could you get if you turn around and trade Bush right away?

 

JohnnyU

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me.  As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ...  :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated  :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.
I don't care what people were like on FFT as long as they don't bring attitude here. I'm sure FFT serves a purpose but the reason FBGs is a great forum is that (for the most part) everyone is "excellent" to each other, even if they strongly differ in opinion.
I've posted some at FFT and lurked there as well, and I can tell you that a lot of folks from that board won't last long here unless there are some serious attitude adjustments.
The way FFT is perceived here is wrong. Certain members were jerks and they didnt get banned as fast as they would here. Fine. But these are different sites, with different tolerance. I like it here but slamming FFT doesnt sit well with me (as if I matter;))Back to the topic:

"Is Reggie Bush worth more than say a Laurence Maroney, Vince Young or DeAngelo Williams + a 1.12 pick and Alex Smith?"

What could you get if you turn around and trade Bush right away?
The last thing I want to say about FFT, is that a lot of their problems stem from allowing posters to get personal and allowing bad language. It escallates confrontations to the point where nothing is gained by it.Now regarding Bush, I don't think many having the 1.2 or 1.3 picks in dynasty leagues care that much about trading up for Bush. As crazy as it sounds, those owning the 1.1 pick would have an easier time trading the pick for a very good established RB (Edge, Portis, Rudi Johnson, Lamont Jordan, Barber, S Jackson, etc. etc..). Now the exact opposite will be true after the hype of the draft is worn off, and it becomes clear certain rookies won't be the starters in 2006 (see Cedric Benson from 2005). My advice to those owning the 1.1 pick is to trade it for a very good YOUNG rb (someone in their twenties), or just keep the pick.

 
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Scarpaggio

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me. As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ... :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.
I don't care what people were like on FFT as long as they don't bring attitude here. I'm sure FFT serves a purpose but the reason FBGs is a great forum is that (for the most part) everyone is "excellent" to each other, even if they strongly differ in opinion.
I've posted some at FFT and lurked there as well, and I can tell you that a lot of folks from that board won't last long here unless there are some serious attitude adjustments.
The way FFT is perceived here is wrong. Certain members were jerks and they didnt get banned as fast as they would here. Fine. But these are different sites, with different tolerance. I like it here but slamming FFT doesnt sit well with me (as if I matter;))Back to the topic:

"Is Reggie Bush worth more than say a Laurence Maroney, Vince Young or DeAngelo Williams + a 1.12 pick and Alex Smith?"

What could you get if you turn around and trade Bush right away?
The last thing I want to say about FFT, is that a lot of their problems stem from allowing posters to get personal and allowing bad language. It escallates confrontations to the point where nothing is gained by it.Now regarding Bush, I don't think many having the 1.2 or 1.3 picks in dynasty leagues care that much about trading up for Bush. As crazy as it sounds, those owning the 1.1 pick would have an easier time trading the pick for a very good established RB (Edge, Portis, Rudi Johnson, Lamont Jordan, Barber, S Jackson, etc. etc..). Now the exact opposite will be true after the hype of the draft is worn off, and it becomes clear certain rookies won't be the starters in 2006 (see Cedric Benson from 2005). My advice to those owning the 1.1 pick is to trade it for a very good YOUNG rb (someone in their twenties), or just keep the pick.
So do you think a DD owner with the #3 pick would be interested if houston drafts him?
 

Traders2001

Footballguy
It is obvious that the kid is going to be a star .... that is a given ..... but how much do we as Fantasy Football Owners unload to land this guy?  In one league I saw the 1.1 Rookie Pick traded for as low as Kevin Jones and as high as Edgerrin James.  Do we assume right out of the gate that he is the next Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson? 
I offered Edge + for the rights to Bush and was turned down. If you assumed right out of the gate that he was going to be Priest/Alexander/Tomlinson, he's worth a lot more than them right now because of age (dynasty leagues only, obviously). If you think he'll one day equal those guys, it gets closer. And if you think he'll be nothing but a RBBC player, then he's not worth it.But far too many people are unable to look beyond the next year or two and it sometimes take bold moves to strike it rich.

Me? I think he's going to be monster and am not worried about waiting 2-3 years for it.
I think he is going to be the biggest bust in history.I would take White and Williams a mile before i would take Bush.

 

Traders2001

Footballguy
How do you overpay for Marshall Faulk Jr.?
Says who.Dont compare this guy to Faulk please . And even if he was as good as Faulk .

Faulk would never have been this productive if he had not been traded to the Rams ( he was good with the Colts but not nearly as productive as he did with the Rams )

So if he ends up in Houston and stays in Houston he might put up average numbers even if he is that good .

Of course if he ended up in Indy then its a different story.

So watch out where he ends up before you pick him, lots of good RB's could never blossom because they ended in a bad situation .

 

-OZ-

Footballguy
Now regarding Bush, I don't think many having the 1.2 or 1.3 picks in dynasty leagues care that much about trading up for Bush. As crazy as it sounds, those owning the 1.1 pick would have an easier time trading the pick for a very good established RB (Edge, Portis, Rudi Johnson, Lamont Jordan, Barber, S Jackson, etc. etc..). Now the exact opposite will be true after the hype of the draft is worn off, and it becomes clear certain rookies won't be the starters in 2006 (see Cedric Benson from 2005). My advice to those owning the 1.1 pick is to trade it for a very good YOUNG rb (someone in their twenties), or just keep the pick.
FWIW, I've offered McGahee for the pick, got rejected.Bush may very well be a bust, but if he is, he'll be the biggest bust in history, due to the hype and potential. If he does bust, it will be due to injury or misuse by the coaching staff.

 

Traders2001

Footballguy
I was called crazy but im sticking with my gunz.....I TRADED:

LT and A.Lelie

For

1.01 (Reggie Bush)

F.Gore

P.Rivers

Mike WIlliams

(all of those guys were 1st round dynasty draft picks).

Trade had to do more with what I see Bush and Gore as than anything. I do believe Bush will go to the texans and have an instant impact....Those that think it will be a rbbc is really funny to me, its like saying Put up the mercedes so we can drive the toyota..so we wont put to many miles on the benz....Bush is far more talented than DD and DD will only be used cause Bush Gives the Texans another demension aside just a straight rb...dude would be the best wr on the team instantly...yes he has better hands and runs better routes than AJ. He will be super valueable....I think he may only run the ball about 15-18 times a game but also get 9 targets in the passing game a game. I see superstud all over this guy....so much for me to part with MR might LT.

I also think Gore has alot of upside in him as well, this is adynasty and i do think Nolan may give him a shot next year.

Rivers may be starting now with the recent events with Brees and have a nice surrounding cast to atleast produce nice numbers

M.Martz will give M.Williams every chance to suceed in there offense.

All in all if you dont get this guy you may nver be able to land him once he's on someone else franchise. Especially if he transfers all those skills to the nfl, which i dont see why he wont. They alwasy say the speed on NFL calibure players are faster than college players...well Bush has more speed than FWP Portis Tiki LT among other and if NFL players cant cathc them how in da hell the gone catch Bush?

Only time will tell though, if you feel strong about him the go after him.

I own the 1.01 in 2 diffrent dynastys and have been offered ALOT for him....but im staying put!
Bush production will never ever come close to LT's production.Gore is nothing more then a back up Rivers and Williams are losers.

So you traded LT and Lelie for Bush. Bad Bad trade.

 

UnknownCoach

Footballguy
Bush is overhyped and will be overpayed for.

However, none of those deals were overpaying. The 1.1 pick is worth more than that. I'd probably take Williams over Bush and I'd pay more than any of those offers. Seems to me that people are undervalueing rookie 1.1.

 

Avery

Footballguy
I am one of the many with the 1.2 rookie pick; where I will get my "pick of the rest" of the RBs.

Even if I am convinced that Bush is the next coming, there is not allways a direct correlation between "football star" and "fantasy football star" and visa-versa.

My point is, for fantasy purposes, someone like D. Williams, depending on where he goes, could represent long-term fantasy football production on par with the vaunted Reggie Bush.

I'm not saying Bush isn't going to live up to they hype and score a lot of fantasy points, just that the shark move may be to stay put at 1.2 instead of trading the farm to get to 1.1.

 

JohnnyU

Footballguy
Thank you for the quick, knowledgeable help you gentleman have given me.  As a long time FFToday member, I grew accustomed to most posts either being totally ignored, or receiving a snide remark or two ......... just because I actually felt the need to ask for advice ...... as opposed to the geniuses who ALWAYS seem to win these huge high-dollar leagues EVERY year ...  :no: :bs: :no:

I have already felt welcomed here though ..... and that is truly appreciated  :thumbup:
Interesting. I remember you vividly and you were a terrible poster. You wanted to fight everybody and all you did is ask advice and never gave any input. (why should you not have to follow the rules?)Apparently you are happy now....good.

To this board I offer thanks for the refuge. I now have two sites I go to regularly.
I don't care what people were like on FFT as long as they don't bring attitude here. I'm sure FFT serves a purpose but the reason FBGs is a great forum is that (for the most part) everyone is "excellent" to each other, even if they strongly differ in opinion.
I've posted some at FFT and lurked there as well, and I can tell you that a lot of folks from that board won't last long here unless there are some serious attitude adjustments.
The way FFT is perceived here is wrong. Certain members were jerks and they didnt get banned as fast as they would here. Fine. But these are different sites, with different tolerance. I like it here but slamming FFT doesnt sit well with me (as if I matter;))Back to the topic:

"Is Reggie Bush worth more than say a Laurence Maroney, Vince Young or DeAngelo Williams + a 1.12 pick and Alex Smith?"

What could you get if you turn around and trade Bush right away?
The last thing I want to say about FFT, is that a lot of their problems stem from allowing posters to get personal and allowing bad language. It escallates confrontations to the point where nothing is gained by it.Now regarding Bush, I don't think many having the 1.2 or 1.3 picks in dynasty leagues care that much about trading up for Bush. As crazy as it sounds, those owning the 1.1 pick would have an easier time trading the pick for a very good established RB (Edge, Portis, Rudi Johnson, Lamont Jordan, Barber, S Jackson, etc. etc..). Now the exact opposite will be true after the hype of the draft is worn off, and it becomes clear certain rookies won't be the starters in 2006 (see Cedric Benson from 2005). My advice to those owning the 1.1 pick is to trade it for a very good YOUNG rb (someone in their twenties), or just keep the pick.
So do you think a DD owner with the #3 pick would be interested if houston drafts him?
Not if Maroney, White, or Williams is there at 1.3 and they are drafted by Denver, Indy, or Pittsburgh. DD could eventually get traded and now they could be in position to have 2 starters. Which is better, having DD and Bush, and giving up the world to get him, or having DD and the starter for Pitt, Indy, or Denver, while keeping what you would have to give up to get Bush?
 
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Sigmund Bloom

Footballguy
Staff member
Does time really take away people's memories about Faulk and his 40 time this quickly?

Faulk was wicked fast and I remember times like 4.29 to 4.35. This is FASTER than Bush.

You know who you are, why do you keep posting things like "Bush is going to be Marshall Faulk + a 5th gear"

If you want to say that Bush is going to Marshall Faulk I could buy it easier than adding in the nonsense about speed.
Bush will run that fast, and something square is the mid 4.2s in possible. I think his "game speed" is even faster than Faulk's. I don't think I've seen another college RB that could get to the corner as fast as Bush. I do honestly believe that Bush's game will translate to Faulk's with even more breakaway runs and huge passing plays. The 5th gear comment is not to downplay Faulk's speed, it's to underscore that Bush could be Faulk, but even faster, which is mind-boggling.
 
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FreeBaGeL

Footballguy
How do you overpay for Marshall Faulk Jr.?
Faulk would never have been this productive if he had not been traded to the Rams ( he was good with the Colts but not nearly as productive as he did with the Rams )
Actually Faulk likely would have been just as good in Indy as that ended up being another great situation with Peyton and Harrison coming in. Faulk's "glory" years were 2000 and 2001 with the Rams. In 2000 Edge went for 2300 yards and 18 TDs....I don't think it's a stretch by any means to think that Faulk would have done at least as well there.And I don't get why everyone thinks Houston is such a bad situation. For all their line's pass blocking woes they are pretty solid run blockers and have churned out good rushing numbers from every RB that's been put behind them and they also throw to their RBs a good amount, which is one of Bush's biggest strengths. In 2004 DD went for 1766 yards and 14 TDs and I think it's pretty safe to say DD isn't anywhere on the same planet as the RB Bush has the potential to be (again the discussion in your post was that even if Bush lives up to his potential he still could do poorly based on the situation he's in).

I get the whole RBBC thing, but does anyone here actually think that if Bush is as good as people think he can be (again that's what was discussed in the post I'm replying to so we're going to assume it here) that that is going to last more than a year or at the very most two years?

 

UnknownCoach

Footballguy
I am one of the many with the 1.2 rookie pick; where I will get my "pick of the rest" of the RBs.

Even if I am convinced that Bush is the next coming, there is not allways a direct correlation between "football star" and "fantasy football star" and visa-versa.

My point is, for fantasy purposes, someone like D. Williams, depending on where he goes, could represent long-term fantasy football production on par with the vaunted Reggie Bush.

I'm not saying Bush isn't going to live up to they hype and score a lot of fantasy points, just that the shark move may be to stay put at 1.2 instead of trading the farm to get to 1.1.
Other than the LT year, it seemed like I was always able to get my number one choice at 1.2. I really dont see any value difference between 1 and 2 this year as Williams is first on my list still as of this moment. Now if the consensus had Williams going first, I'd consider trading up. Its not something I'd pay the farm to do though. I'd be almost as happy with Bush. I remember the Larry Johnson/McGahee year. Now the dynasty newcomers were taking WRs before either player that year but those two RBs were the top choices of us veterans. Still to this day, I cant say for sure either would have been the better pick. Larry has the most current value, but he's only produced for owners one season and he's older. I could bring up the same type of debate about last year's trio of RBs. While Williams outproduced the other two for the rookie year, he didnt run away from the other two as the long term choice. After the Jamal Lewis/Thomas Jones/Ron Dayne/Shaun Alexander draft, only Jamal Lewis owners were happy that first year. Alexander, Jones, and Dayne were all on the bench. I think the evidence really supports staying tight at 1.2 unless there is only one top RB in the draft. This year there looks to be 3 if White is still up there come draft day.

 

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