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Babylon 5 turns 20 (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter casey
- Start date
Spanky267
Footballguy
Agreed. Its too bad that sci fi was so poorly received by the major networks at that time that it couldnt be picked up and truly developed. Only FOX was doing sci-fi at the time but was still a relatively young network.
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Big fan. First season was rough but after that it was great.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
This.
The last season was iffy on the story front for issues that everyone knows about, but on the bright side we got tons of cool fan service where other shows would have had the climax of the main story come to a resolution with 5 minutes left and done a quick send-off.
Rayderr
Footballguy
I think the first season gets a bit of a bad rap. They were doing standalone episodes to be more like ST:TNG, but the undercurrents of the series arc were there.
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Personally, I detest standalone shows so I was ready to shut it down. And when comparing the 1st season to the rest, well, it just doesn't compare. It's like saying Season 5 of The Wire was bad. Still great TV, but not nearly as good as the rest of the seasons.
Rayderr
Footballguy
I totally get that. Season 1 wasn't that great when I first watched it. But a few years, ago I decided to go back and re-watch the whole series. Knowing where it was heading, it was actually kinda nice to see how they were slowly leading us there in the first season (though I still don't know where that Yamaha motorcycle fits in.)
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Still in my top 5 of all time with Soprano's, The Wire, Buffy and Breaking Bad.
I don't think it has aged badly but I am not one that needs the latest and greatest special affects. I still find the old Star Treks enjoyable.
We are about to start a new run on Babylon 5 some time this year. Can't wait.
Also can't believe it has been 20 years (it is actually 21 years now since the pilot was shown a year before the series proper started in Feb. of 1993)
I don't think it has aged badly but I am not one that needs the latest and greatest special affects. I still find the old Star Treks enjoyable.
We are about to start a new run on Babylon 5 some time this year. Can't wait.
Also can't believe it has been 20 years (it is actually 21 years now since the pilot was shown a year before the series proper started in Feb. of 1993)
NCCommish
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Turner is the reason there was a 5th season, not that it was bad.
The show was being run from the old network called PTEN.
PTEN went out of business and as such shows like Babylon 5 were done.
TNT came in late and offered a life line to B5. The life line came very late but early enough that JMS did not show Sleeping in Light. TNT not only provided enough money for a season 5 but also for a bunch of stand alone movies, including the excellent In the Beginning.
Season 5 was a mess in the first half of the season for 2 reasons.
1) Claudia Christian bailed because of money and forced a cast change that did not work (and also ruined the sacrifice Marcus) made
2) The telepath arc was awful, mostly because the lead telepath Byron was miscast
I thought the second half of season 5 was as good as anything that came before it. And of course leading up to arguably one of the best series finale's ever in Sleeping in Light.
Now, back to your original thought, while Turner did every thing they could to help out Season 5, they were, in most fans opinions, the cause of why Crusade failed. I really liked the plot of Crusade and was hoping it would live but much like Fox screwed up Firefly, the suits at Turner really screwed up Crusade.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
The motor cycle was just a plot point to build the relationship between Garibaldi and Lennier. I think JMS wanted to do more with them together but outside of small instances, it never came to fruition.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
The following cast members have passed away.
Richard Biggs - Doctor Franklin
Andreas Katsulas - Gkar
Jeff Conaway - Zach Allen
Michael O'Hare - Commander Sinclair
Tim Shoate - Zathrus
Efrem Zimbalist Jr. out lived all these younger actors. He is 95 now.
Richard Biggs - Doctor Franklin
Andreas Katsulas - Gkar
Jeff Conaway - Zach Allen
Michael O'Hare - Commander Sinclair
Tim Shoate - Zathrus
Efrem Zimbalist Jr. out lived all these younger actors. He is 95 now.
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The Tick
Footballguy
Easily in my top 5, I tend to do a full watch through every couple years. I like to put it on in the background when I start up a big 100+ hour PC game so I can kinda half watch while I play.
I do think it has aged horribly, but not because of the special effects, for me it's more the set design/costume design. It just feels like they were trying to figure out what to make the future look like, and the decided to use the 80's as a model. I really think 15 years from now Battlestar will have aged much better because of the production design.
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
we are currently doing our first run through Stargate Universe. It was strongly influenced in its production by BSG.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Conaway drank himself to death
Shoate died in a motorcycle accident
Biggs died of a heart problem
Katsulas of lung cancer
O'Hare died of a mental illness that tracks all the way back to season 1 on Babylon 5 when he started to have paranoid delusions which shut down production for a time period.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Rayderr
Footballguy
Never knew that was why OHare left the show. That sucks. JMS did a decent job writing around that tho.
In one of the movies after the show, they said Franklin & Gkar had gone "beyond the rim" as their way to pay tribute to them on screen.
On another subject, I was very disappointed they didn't go moe into the Gkar/Londa storyline at the end. We were pretty much just left wondering.
So if O'Hare never had this problem, Bruce Boxleitner would have never been on the show?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
yeah, this only came out after his death. JMS promised to keep it all a secret to protect his career. Here is the text from wiki that explains the story. JMS only came out with this information in 2013 as he promised he would.
==============
"As Babylon 5 creator J. Michael Straczynski describes it, during the filming of the first season of Babylon 5, O'Hare began having paranoid delusions. Halfway through filming, his hallucinations worsened and the stress of playing a character who was suffering from a similar mental illness was becoming overwhelming. It became increasingly difficult for O'Hare to continue work, his behavior was becoming increasingly erratic and he was often at odds with his colleagues. O'Hare sought treatment for his mental illness, but feared that, as the main character of Babylon 5, taking an extended medical leave of absence would destroy the show just as it was getting off the ground.
Straczynski offered to suspend the show for several months to accommodate O'Hare's treatment for mental disease; however O'Hare refused to put so many other people's jobs at risk. Straczynski agreed to keep his condition secret to protect O'Hare's career. O'Hare agreed to complete the first season but would be subsequently written out of the second season so that he could seek treatment. He reappeared in a cameo appearance early in season two and returned in season three for the double episode "War Without End" which closed his character's story arc. He made no further appearances on Babylon 5.
Although his treatments were somewhat successful, he was never fully cured. Upon his return to Babylon 5, Straczynski promised again that he would keep his condition secret to his grave. O'Hare told him to "keep the secret to my grave", pointing out that fans deserved to eventually learn the real reason for his departure, and that his experience could raise awareness and understanding for people suffering from mental illness. On May 25, 2013, eight months after O'Hare's death, Straczynski fulfilled his promise and finally revealed the reasons behind O'Hare's departure from Babylon 5 at the Phoenix Comicon.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
yeah, I always assumed it was contract or business or they just did not like him. JMS cleared that all up last year (see my post above).
As for Londo and G'Kar we at least know how their story ends in sacrifice and tragedy which ends up saving Sheriden, Delenn and their son David.
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
That show was terrible.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I think if you ever re-watch the season 1, you will see more of the over all arc than you realized you were watching. Yes there were some real clunkers in season 1 (Infection and TKO specifically).
It is fun to see lines that appeared to be nothing more than throw away "You talk like a Minbari" only come back to be major plot points.
Can’t believe it’s been 20 years, I can still remember lying on my bed in the my room watching “Midnight On the Firing Line” on my tiny 20” or so tv the first time it aired. I almost missed it because it had been such a long time between the pilot movie and the series but luckily my local paper had an article on B5 and DS9 going head to head. Which was dumb because there was so little decent sci-fi on tv back then, but man a lot of trekkers hated B5. Dialing in on my 14400 fax modem to check the newest speculation after each episode, great times. So many of the major plot arcs went so differently that what was expected or setup. The Lurker’s Guide to Babylon 5 was an awesome website, the recaps on each episode, the newsgroup questions and answers with JMS, and there were so many things they would catch on the Lurker’s episode pages that would go over my head on the first viewing.
Still in my top 5 as well and I like to break out my DVD’s every once in a while to watch an episode. That 3rd and 4th season are just such a total rush, “Severed Dreams” is easily in my top 10 if not top 5 episodes of any show ever. I agree the look is dated to early 90’s awful styles (like the no collar shirts for example) there’s a commentary track on one of the early episodes where Claudia Christian is making fun of everyone’s hair and her own bushy eyebrows.
As mentioned in a few posts above, when Michael O’Hare passed last year JMS finally revealed what really went on with him leaving the show after year one. Tons and tons of speculation over the years on that.
Still in my top 5 as well and I like to break out my DVD’s every once in a while to watch an episode. That 3rd and 4th season are just such a total rush, “Severed Dreams” is easily in my top 10 if not top 5 episodes of any show ever. I agree the look is dated to early 90’s awful styles (like the no collar shirts for example) there’s a commentary track on one of the early episodes where Claudia Christian is making fun of everyone’s hair and her own bushy eyebrows.
As mentioned in a few posts above, when Michael O’Hare passed last year JMS finally revealed what really went on with him leaving the show after year one. Tons and tons of speculation over the years on that.
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Good show and definitely heavily influenced by BSG. Wish they had got another season or two, it was way better than Stargate Atlantis and that got 5 seasons.
Conaway had a rough life. Did tons of drugs and booze that ruined his career in the 80's. He actually auditioned for like a day part on B5 as a nobody and they eventually got him worked in over the years as a regular. Then downhill again after B5 when he eventually appeared on Celebrity Rehab. Guy was messed up bad by the time of Celebrity Rehab, amazing he lasted much longer.
Biggs was an unknown congenital heart defect IIRC and was the first to pass when he was only in his early 40's. Interesting fact about him, he was mostly deaf and had to learn not only his own lines, but everyone elses in a scene and then he would read their lips to know when it was his cue.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
we are big Stargate fans in our family, having watched all 15 seasons and 3 movies so we wanted to watch SGU to complete the cycle.
We are all enjoying it while also acknowledging how different the show is from the other two Stargate franchises. We are early into season 2.
Rayderr
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Just to be clear, we are talking about SGU being influenced by BSG. The creators of SGU publicly stated they looked to BSG for inspiration. Some people feel they went too far is making the show look and feel like BSG calling it a blatant ripoff.
http://www.commentarium.net/2010/11/battlestargate-universe/
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Rayderr
Footballguy
ah. ok. that makes sense. Although it should be noted that the ancient egyptions being aliens mythos has been around far longer than either show.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
It was not the mythos per say. It was the look and feel of the show, the harsh character conflicts and extremely similar CGI affects.
Hunterbeer
Footballguy
Absolutely loved this show. Still in my top-5. You can not stress enough how much the newsgroups helped expand the love for this show. I was on them immediately after each episode. Those groups and the Lurker's guide were amazing companions to the show. I am still in the League of Non-Aligned Fantasy Football with a bunch of people from those newsgroups.
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
I didn't really see B5 until I binge-watched it in law school about 5 years ago. For me, it's an exceptionally plotted show, but not always a well-written show. I definitely enjoyed going through the story, but I don't think I've ever re-watched an episode. Whereas there are episodes of Buffy or Firefly that I've probably seen 20 times.
The big exception is the evolution of G'Kar and Andreus Katsulos' performance, which was extraordinary, IMO. I already knew that actors could give great performances in genre shows, but that's probably the first great performance I've seen under full creature make-up.
The big exception is the evolution of G'Kar and Andreus Katsulos' performance, which was extraordinary, IMO. I already knew that actors could give great performances in genre shows, but that's probably the first great performance I've seen under full creature make-up.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
JMS keeps teasing he wants to reboot this.
GregR
Footballguy
Have been making my way back through the series for the first time in many years. At the end of season 3 now. It always turns out to be even better than I remember. Some clunkers of episodes, but the overall story lines and a few of the character relationships (G'kar and Londo for example) still appeal.
I also couldn't help but get a bit of a chill when I got to the Nightwatch stuff about the same time I watched the Citizen Four documentary about Edward Snowden and the data the government is capturing about citizens. Not that I'm saying this is the start of what happened in Bab 5, but it was similar enough to send me off thinking about how more fragile our democracy is becoming in the digital age.
I also couldn't help but get a bit of a chill when I got to the Nightwatch stuff about the same time I watched the Citizen Four documentary about Edward Snowden and the data the government is capturing about citizens. Not that I'm saying this is the start of what happened in Bab 5, but it was similar enough to send me off thinking about how more fragile our democracy is becoming in the digital age.
