Belichick: PAT a Waste of Time (1 Viewer)

[just_want_2_win]

Patriots coach Bill Belichick doesnt like extra points. And he wants the NFL to do something about them.

"I personally would love to see the kicking game remain as a very integral part of the game so that the kickoffs are returned and so that extra points are not over 99 percent converted because thats not what extra points were when they were initially put into the game back 80 years ago, whatever it was," Belichick said.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/02/belichick-thinks-extra-points-are-a-waste-of-time/

 

[ebsteelers]

very interesting.. moving it back to the 20 seems most logic of them,

maybe even move it back to the 25

 

[fantasycurse42]

Never even thought about this, but it does make a lot sense.

 

[Ghost Rider]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

 

[Disco Stu]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

But then what about two point conversions? Do you just declare you are going for two and get the ball at a certain spot?

 

[Ghost Rider]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

I don't have to think about it. Why shouldn't the defense have the option of applying the penalty to the PAT?

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I like all of the suggested changes more than what we currently have.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

 

[ebsteelers]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

im confused..

if a team just got scored on so the defense.. why would they want to move the offense back 15 yards for a pat and have them kick from the 17 rather than kickoff at the 20 yard line and end up with the ball around the 40 yard line give or take?

 

[ebsteelers]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

I don't have to think about it. Why shouldn't the defense have the option of applying the penalty to the PAT?

what would be the advantage of having them moving a PAT attempt back? rather than getting good field position on the return

 

[Ghost Rider]

Haha, okay, I see my mistake now. I worded it wrong. D'oh!

But I still think the defense should be able to apply the penalty to the PAT. Say, you are up by 8, and you know the offense is going for for 2 to tie the game, forcing them back to try for 2 from the 17 instead of the 2 is a huge advantage.

 

[BlueDredSo]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

I don't have to think about it. Why shouldn't the defense have the option of applying the penalty to the PAT?

Let's stop ####### around here and explain why this is wrong. It wouldn't be an automatic touchback because the ball is moved further BACK, not forward if the scoring team has been penalized.

 

[BlueDredSo]

Haha, okay, I see my mistake now. I worded it wrong. D'oh!

But I still think the defense should be able to apply the penalty to the PAT. Say, you are up by 8, and you know the offense is going for for 2 to tie the game, forcing them back to try for 2 from the 17 instead of the 2 is a huge advantage.

Great point, agreed.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Let's stop ####### around here and explain why this is wrong. It wouldn't be an automatic touchback because the ball is moved further BACK, not forward if the scoring team has been penalized.

I know. I figured out that I had it backwards several posts up. My bad.

 

[Adam Harstad]

You know who else is in favor of doing away with extra points? John Carney.

 

[pizzatyme]

If it's such a waste of time I wonder why Belicheat trotted Gronk out there last year in a blowout to get his arm broken?

 

[PatsWillWin]

If it's such a waste of time I wonder why Belicheat trotted Gronk out there last year in a blowout to get his arm broken?

Shocking take from you.

 

[PatsWillWin]

This was part of a long tangent Belichick went on about the history of the extra point, and how it wasn't intended to be what it is today (a 99% proposition). The history of the game is pretty much the only thing he'll go on about at length, and it's usually pretty interesting.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

I like the idea of moving the pat back to a missable distance, maybe it would make teams decide to go for 2 more just because of risk/reward rather than only go for 2 when their chart says so.

 

[pizzatyme]

If it's such a waste of time I wonder why

Belicheat trotted Gronk out there last year in a blowout to get his arm broken?

Shocking take from you.

Likewise

 

[Wrigley]

If it's such a waste of time I wonder why

Belicheat trotted Gronk out there last year in a blowout to get his arm broken?

Shocking take from you.

Likewise

get a room

 

[DropKick]

If it's such a waste of time I wonder why Belicheat trotted Gronk out there last year in a blowout to get his arm broken?

Apparently you didn't read/understand the article....

ETA: If you do actually read it, note the last option is to bring back the dropkick... I've been waiting for that for 40 years...

 

[Run It Up]

If it's such a waste of time I wonder why Belicheat trotted Gronk out there last year in a blowout to get his arm broken?

Apparently you didn't read/understand the article....

ETA: If you do actually read it, note the last option is to bring back the dropkick... I've been waiting for that for 40 years...

The time is now! DO EEEEEET

 

[mr roboto]

I don't think the modern ball is very good for the drop kick.

 

[Da Guru]

99.6 conversion rate this year. Time to back that ### up!

 

[fantasycurse42]

99.6 conversion rate this year. Time to back that ### up!

Missing an extra point should result in losing points.

 

[RBM]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

 

[Run It Up]

99.6 conversion rate this year. Time to back that ### up!

Missing an extra point should result in losing points.

Move it back to the 10 for 2pt conversion attempts and the 20 for PATs, bring back conversion safeties and allow defenders to return tries for a point, done and done imo.

 

[Time Kibitzer]

99.6 conversion rate this year. Time to back that ### up!

Missing an extra point should result in losing points.

Move it back to the 10 for 2pt conversion attempts and the 20 for PATs, bring back conversion safeties and allow defenders to return tries for a point, done and done imo.

No one would attempt 2pt conversions from the 10 yard line though.

 

[coolnerd]

There is about nothing in the world that works 99.6 percent of the time. I mean the sun rising in the east and water is wet are both impressed by that number. that said, the kicking game itself is nearly useless:

86.5: That was the average field goal success percentage, league-wide, which was actually up 2.6 points from last season. There were only six misses on 242 attempts inside 30 yards, and kickers hit 93 percent of their kicks inside 40 yards. It's not even a challenge anymore. In fact, they hit 67 percent of their field goals from beyond 50 yards. That's a mark that had never been reached on field goals of any length until the 1981 season. A record 99.6 extra points were converted this year.

http://www.bloguin.com/thisgivensunday/2014-articles/january/seven-interesting-stats-from-the-2013-nfl-season.html

Edit: this means that even if the ball is moved back to the 10 year line, it won't make any noticeable difference, and moving it to the 20 means that extra points will be still hit at about 18.5 per every 20 kicks.

 

[Bri]

doesn't seem he said they were a waste of time

 

[Long Ball Larry]

There is about nothing in the world that works 99.6 percent of the time. I mean the sun rising in the east and water is wet are both impressed by that number. that said, the kicking game itself is nearly useless:

86.5: That was the average field goal success percentage, league-wide, which was actually up 2.6 points from last season. There were only six misses on 242 attempts inside 30 yards, and kickers hit 93 percent of their kicks inside 40 yards. It's not even a challenge anymore. In fact, they hit 67 percent of their field goals from beyond 50 yards. That's a mark that had never been reached on field goals of any length until the 1981 season. A record 99.6 extra points were converted this year.

http://www.bloguin.com/thisgivensunday/2014-articles/january/seven-interesting-stats-from-the-2013-nfl-season.html

interesting.

 

[Run It Up]

99.6 conversion rate this year. Time to back that ### up!

Missing an extra point should result in losing points.

Move it back to the 10 for 2pt conversion attempts and the 20 for PATs, bring back conversion safeties and allow defenders to return tries for a point, done and done imo.

No one would attempt 2pt conversions from the 10 yard line though.

Okay, the 5 then, or move PATs back to the 25, or both.

 

[Riversco]

I seriously love the arena league goalposts and nets. I'd love to see those go into the game.

 

[voiceofunreason]

Personally I'd just get rid of them and make td's worth 7pts automatically. You could keep 2 pt conversions as they are. But that would cut down on the 5 minutes of commercials inbetween a td and the next offensive play.

 

[ebsteelers]

Personally I'd just get rid of them and make td's worth 7pts automatically. Yothe u could keep 2 pt conversions as they are. But that would cut down on 5 minutes of commercials inbetween a td and the next offensive play.

and thats why it would never happen

 

[Catbird]

Narrow 'em

 

[ShaHBucks]

Personally I'd just get rid of them and make td's worth 7pts automatically. You could keep 2 pt conversions as they are. But that would cut down on the 5 minutes of commercials inbetween a td and the next offensive play.

Maybe if Vince McMahon becomes commish. He tried that in the XFL. IIRC they even allowed you to go for 3pt if you back up further.

 

[Nucker101]

Makes a lot of sense to me.

 

[Da Guru]

Just ban soccer style kicking. Make it a rule that all kickers must approach the ball in a direct straight line like the old days. That will bring down the % a little and make it more interesting.

 

[Insein]

All kickers must kick barefoot. Done.

 

[DropKick]

99.6 conversion rate this year. Time to back that ### up!

Missing an extra point should result in losing points.

My fantasy league does that... that one always hurts.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

Lots of things about football have changed since initially instituted. I wonder what he thinks about the forward pass and if he thinks we should go back to limited substitutions.

 

[Spike]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

On a related note, I think it is stupid that the team that just got scored against cannot apply a post-score penalty, like a 15-yard penalty for excessive celebrating, to the PAT, instead having it applied to the kickoff, which then ensures a guaranteed touchback.

Think about this a bit and report back.

You have the most American avatar I've ever seen. Nice!

 

[DiStefano]

Belichick needs some instruction on the history of the game. Far from being instituted "80 years or so ago", it has been an integral part of the game from the beginning, and in fact, a more important part. To understand that, you have to understand that American football was a separate shoot growing out of soccer and rugby, all of which were being codified at about the same time. In those early days, there was much more emphasis on kicking the ball (hence the name "football"), and indeed that part of the game was emphasized more than the touchdown (or try, in rugby). In the 1880's, when Walter Camp was codifying American football for universities, a touchdown was worth 4 points, a conversion 2 points, and a field goal 5 points. The gradual evolution of the game has brought about an increasing emphasis on the touchdown (as it has for the "try" in rugby), and a de-emphasis on the kick.

That doesn't change the logic of Belichick's position; but I thought a little history might be in order.

 

[Not Sleeping]

Let me bring some of the "logic" from over in the playoff reseeding thread to this thread:

"The rules are the rules. Why bother scoring points at all then? Why not just declare the winner based on total yardage, or number of off-field felonies?"

"What did Goodell say when you discussed this with him?"

"Look, everybody knew you kick the extra point from the 2-yard line this year. If you don't like it, then stop scoring touchdowns."

"Sounds like a bunch of whiny Saints fans in here who still haven't gotten over Carney's miss."

and of course..."the point after has to be kicked from the two because it always has been!"

 

[DiStefano]

Let me bring some of the "logic" from over in the playoff reseeding thread to this thread:

"The rules are the rules. Why bother scoring points at all then? Why not just declare the winner based on total yardage, or number of off-field felonies?"

"What did Goodell say when you discussed this with him?"

"Look, everybody knew you kick the extra point from the 2-yard line this year. If you don't like it, then stop scoring touchdowns."

"Sounds like a bunch of whiny Saints fans in here who still haven't gotten over Carney's miss."

and of course..."the point after has to be kicked from the two because it always has been!"

 

[Not Sleeping]

Let me bring some of the "logic" from over in the playoff reseeding thread to this thread:

"The rules are the rules. Why bother scoring points at all then? Why not just declare the winner based on total yardage, or number of off-field felonies?"

"What did Goodell say when you discussed this with him?"

"Look, everybody knew you kick the extra point from the 2-yard line this year. If you don't like it, then stop scoring touchdowns."

"Sounds like a bunch of whiny Saints fans in here who still haven't gotten over Carney's miss."

and of course..."the point after has to be kicked from the two because it always has been!"

Exactly! You got it!