What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Boehner to sue Obama! (1 Viewer)

I'm pretty sure Congress has sued the President several times in the past. Our resident constitutional lawyers will be able to supply the details.

 
This has nothing to do with Executive Orders and everything to do with elections. There's just no bottom in the GOP cesspool.

 
I'm pretty sure Congress has sued the President several times in the past. Our resident constitutional lawyers will be able to supply the details.
A lot of this depends on the context of the suit (i.e. if Boehner is simply seeking injunctive relief). I'm not sure Obama would be the appropriate party to sue (as opposed to the Secretary of Labor or something). Boehner can't sue over Obama using executive orders too much. He can seek injunctive relief declaring specific executive orders to be unlawful.

EDIT: The foundational opinion in those types of suits is Justice Jackson's concurrence in Youngstown Sheet & Tube Co. v. Sawyer, 343 U.S. 579 (1952).

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I'm pretty sure Congress has sued the President several times in the past. Our resident constitutional lawyers will be able to supply the details.
A lot of this depends on the context of the suit (i.e. if Boehner is simply seeking injunctive relief). I'm not sure Obama would be the appropriate party to sue (as opposed to the Secretary of Labor or something). Boehner can't sue over Obama using executive orders too much. He can seek injunctive relief declaring specific executive orders to be unlawful.
I wasn't aware that this particular action was brewing, so I could be very wrong on the details. I guess I assumed that any kind of lawsuit would involve the bolded part.

More generally though, am I right that Congress has sued the President before? I seem to remember reading about cases along those lines in the past, and the courts generally being reluctant to get involved in power struggles between the other two branches. Again, I could be wrong though and I can't recall specific examples.

 
I'm pretty sure Congress has sued the President several times in the past. Our resident constitutional lawyers will be able to supply the details.
A lot of this depends on the context of the suit (i.e. if Boehner is simply seeking injunctive relief). I'm not sure Obama would be the appropriate party to sue (as opposed to the Secretary of Labor or something). Boehner can't sue over Obama using executive orders too much. He can seek injunctive relief declaring specific executive orders to be unlawful.

EDIT: The foundational opinion in those types of suits is Justice Jackson's concurrence in Youngstown Sheet & Tube Co. v. Sawyer, 343 U.S. 579 (1952).
Pretty sure you aren't sober enough to be a law talking guy right now

 
I'm pretty sure Congress has sued the President several times in the past. Our resident constitutional lawyers will be able to supply the details.
A lot of this depends on the context of the suit (i.e. if Boehner is simply seeking injunctive relief). I'm not sure Obama would be the appropriate party to sue (as opposed to the Secretary of Labor or something). Boehner can't sue over Obama using executive orders too much. He can seek injunctive relief declaring specific executive orders to be unlawful.

EDIT: The foundational opinion in those types of suits is Justice Jackson's concurrence in Youngstown Sheet & Tube Co. v. Sawyer, 343 U.S. 579 (1952).
Pretty sure you aren't sober enough to be a law talking guy right now
It's a long competition. I don't get drunk for every game.

 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?

 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?
Yes, any other president would have been impeached long ago. Its kinda hard when you have the media in your back pocket like obama has.

 
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Or any other presidents for that matter... Linky

Barack Obama - 144 (so far)George W. Bush - 291

Clinton - 364

George Bush - 166

Reagan - 381

Carter - 320

Ford - 169

Nixon - 346

Johnson - 325

Kennedy - 214

Eisenhower - 484

Truman - 907

Franklin D. Roosevelt - 3,522

Hoover - 968

Coolidge - 1,203

Harding - 522

Wilson - 1,803

Taft - 724

Theodore Roosevelt - 1,081

McKinley - 185

Cleveland II - 140

Harrison - 143

Cleveland I - 113

Arthur - 96

Garfield - 6

Hayes - 92

Grant - 217

Andrew Johnson - 79

Lincoln - 48

Buchanan - 16

Pierce - 35

Fillmore - 12

Taylor - 5

Polk - 18

Tyler - 17

Harrison - 0

van Buren - 10

Jackson - 12

Adams - 3

Monroe - 1

Madison - 1

Jefferson - 4

Adams - 1

Washington - 8
 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?
Yes, any other president would have been impeached long ago. Its kinda hard when you have the media in your back pocket like obama has.
Oh yeah, lots of examples through out history of presidents getting impeached for less.

 
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Or any other presidents for that matter... Linky

Barack Obama - 144 (so far)George W. Bush - 291

Clinton - 364

George Bush - 166

Reagan - 381

Carter - 320

Ford - 169

Nixon - 346

Johnson - 325

Kennedy - 214

Eisenhower - 484

Truman - 907

Franklin D. Roosevelt - 3,522

Hoover - 968

Coolidge - 1,203

Harding - 522

Wilson - 1,803

Taft - 724

Theodore Roosevelt - 1,081

McKinley - 185

Cleveland II - 140

Harrison - 143

Cleveland I - 113

Arthur - 96

Garfield - 6

Hayes - 92

Grant - 217

Andrew Johnson - 79

Lincoln - 48

Buchanan - 16

Pierce - 35

Fillmore - 12

Taylor - 5

Polk - 18

Tyler - 17

Harrison - 0

van Buren - 10

Jackson - 12

Adams - 3

Monroe - 1

Madison - 1

Jefferson - 4

Adams - 1

Washington - 8
Teddy really kicked things off!

 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?
Yes, any other president would have been impeached long ago. Its kinda hard when you have the media in your back pocket like obama has.
Actually, that's where he keeps his gum. It's in a Trapper Keeper where he keeps the media.

 
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Executive orders issued:

Regan: 381

G.H.W. Bush: 166

Clinton: 364

G.W. Bush: 291

Obama: 147
Doesn't it matter, at least a little, what the content of the orders are?
Like an executive order allowing the NSA to eavesdrop on citizens living within the United States?
Yes, like that.

 
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Executive orders issued:

Regan: 381

G.H.W. Bush: 166

Clinton: 364

G.W. Bush: 291

Obama: 147
Doesn't it matter, at least a little, what the content of the orders are?
Like an executive order allowing the NSA to eavesdrop on citizens living within the United States?
Yes, like that.
Yeah, probably matters at least a little.

 
Reporter: which specific executive actions are you planning to challenge in court?

Boehner: when I make that decision I'll let you know.

:lmao:

Probably needs to do some polling to see which one would best placate tea baggers.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Or any other presidents for that matter... Linky

Barack Obama - 144 (so far)

George W. Bush - 291

Clinton - 364

George Bush - 166

Reagan - 381

Carter - 320

Ford - 169

Nixon - 346

Johnson - 325

Kennedy - 214

Eisenhower - 484

Truman - 907

Franklin D. Roosevelt - 3,522

Hoover - 968

Coolidge - 1,203

Harding - 522

Wilson - 1,803

Taft - 724

Theodore Roosevelt - 1,081

McKinley - 185

Cleveland II - 140

Harrison - 143

Cleveland I - 113

Arthur - 96

Garfield - 6

Hayes - 92

Grant - 217

Andrew Johnson - 79

Lincoln - 48

Buchanan - 16

Pierce - 35

Fillmore - 12

Taylor - 5

Polk - 18

Tyler - 17

Harrison - 0

van Buren - 10

Jackson - 12

Adams - 3

Monroe - 1

Madison - 1

Jefferson - 4

Adams - 1

Washington - 8
Teddy really kicked things off!
Remember The Maine?

 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?
Yes, any other president would have been impeached long ago. Its kinda hard when you have the media in your back pocket like obama has.
Actually, that's where he keeps his gum. It's in a Trapper Keeper where he keeps the media.
Binders full of media.

 
I'm pretty sure Congress has sued the President several times in the past. Our resident constitutional lawyers will be able to supply the details.
I can't remember the last time the opposite party didn't sue the president or call for his impeachment.

 
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Or any other presidents for that matter... Linky

Barack Obama - 144 (so far)

George W. Bush - 291

Clinton - 364

George Bush - 166

Reagan - 381

Carter - 320

Ford - 169

Nixon - 346

Johnson - 325

Kennedy - 214

Eisenhower - 484

Truman - 907

Franklin D. Roosevelt - 3,522

Hoover - 968

Coolidge - 1,203

Harding - 522

Wilson - 1,803

Taft - 724

Theodore Roosevelt - 1,081

McKinley - 185

Cleveland II - 140

Harrison - 143

Cleveland I - 113

Arthur - 96

Garfield - 6

Hayes - 92

Grant - 217

Andrew Johnson - 79

Lincoln - 48

Buchanan - 16

Pierce - 35

Fillmore - 12

Taylor - 5

Polk - 18

Tyler - 17

Harrison - 0

van Buren - 10

Jackson - 12

Adams - 3

Monroe - 1

Madison - 1

Jefferson - 4

Adams - 1

Washington - 8
Teddy really kicked things off!
Remember The Maine?
Underrated cocktail (also known as McKinley's Revenge).

 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?
Issuing an executive order that has not been held as unconstitutional yet but may be at some point in the future does not qualify as "high crimes and misdemeanors".

By that standard, Boehner would have to impeach himself - I'm sure some law he's voted for in the last two decades has been overturned.

 
Once again its almost as if the W Presidency never happened. Now that pimp could executive order.
Executive orders issued:

Regan: 381

G.H.W. Bush: 166

Clinton: 364

G.W. Bush: 291

Obama: 147
Doesn't it matter, at least a little, what the content of the orders are?
Like an executive order allowing the NSA to eavesdrop on citizens living within the United States?
Yes, exactly. Doesn't that continue under Obama, or did he issue his own?

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2012/07/06/executive-order-assignment-national-security-and-emergency-preparedness-

Have the NSA data seizures ever been challenged on this basis? They should be.

 
I think maybe the most cynical use of an EO or signing order was: Obama's order that he issued almost immediately or contemporaneously with the passage of the ACA re: abortion funding.

The ACA was hung up on one final issue, whether the federal government would be funding abortions as part of the ACA. Anti-abortion Democrats formed a block and would not vote for the ACA as long as there wasn't a provision excluding it. A good number of pro-abortion Democrats wouldn't vote for any bill that didn't provide such funding.

What to do?

Well the president said just include the abortion funding provision and once passed he would immediately sign an EO excluding such a provision. Which he did. Thus Congress never actually voted on the final law, as it is and as it became. And thus anti-abortion Democrats got to say they voted for a law that prohibited abortion funding. And thus pro-abortion Democrats got to tell their constituents they voted for a law which provided for it. One hell of a way to run a "democracy." Appalling, really.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_13535

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Obama has proposed significant reforms to the NSA wiretapping program. I'd love the administration to go farther, but his reforms send more requests to the FISA court, put a public advocate in the proceedings (instead of handling it like a Grand Jury), reduces the amount of data collected based on one "suspicious person", and takes storage of metadata out of the government's hands.

Conservatives who are suddenly concerned about this stuff under the Obama administration are the worst type of opportunistic hacks (we'll spare the few libertarians who actually spoke up about it 10 years ago).

 
Obama has proposed significant reforms to the NSA wiretapping program. I'd love the administration to go farther, but his reforms send more requests to the FISA court, put a public advocate in the proceedings (instead of handling it like a Grand Jury), reduces the amount of data collected based on one "suspicious person", and takes storage of metadata out of the government's hands.

Conservatives who are suddenly concerned about this stuff under the Obama administration are the worst type of opportunistic hacks (we'll spare the few libertarians who actually spoke up about it 10 years ago).
Which raises the question why is the President setting the rules ad hoc (only once discovered by virtue of leaks btw) and not Congress or the Constitution? The 4th Amendment doesn't allow such seizures, period, and the 3rd Amendment says the government can't intrude our privacy. The 1st Amendment says we have a right to free speech. That should all be enough.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Although I doubt he will be, I hope he is successful, the executive branch has become far too powerful.

 
Obama has proposed significant reforms to the NSA wiretapping program. I'd love the administration to go farther, but his reforms send more requests to the FISA court, put a public advocate in the proceedings (instead of handling it like a Grand Jury), reduces the amount of data collected based on one "suspicious person", and takes storage of metadata out of the government's hands.

Conservatives who are suddenly concerned about this stuff under the Obama administration are the worst type of opportunistic hacks (we'll spare the few libertarians who actually spoke up about it 10 years ago).
Which raises the question why is the President setting the rules ad hoc (only once discovered by virtue of leaks btw) and not Congress or the Constitution? The 4th Amendment doesn't allow such seizures, period, and the 3rd Amendment says the government can't intrude our privacy. The 1st Amendment says we have a right to free speech. That should all be enough.
You have a habit of sounding like an idiot when you talk about the Constitution. Which is to be expected, because you rely on press reports from ideologues to tell you what it means. Just for starters, the 3rd Amendment prohibits one very specific thing. Which is the government requiring private citizens to quarter troops. It most certainly does not say anything like "the government can't intrude our privacy.."

The Fourth Amendment prohibits "unreasonable searches and seizures" in the absence of "probable cause." Reasonable people can disagree over whether the collection of metadata, for instance, is an unreasonable search and seizure or whether the FISA court process (established, by Congress, in 1978) ensures probable cause. But as the chief executive, the President is absolutely entitled to propose, and to even implement in the absence of a contrary law passed by Congress) reforms aimed at achieving those goals.

 
In a memo to House members announcing next month's vote, Boehner indicated the legal action would cover a number of issues but did not cite specific cases of executive overreach.
So Boehner's asking all the Republicans to fill out a wish list.

 
According to the article, Boehner is suing because he believes the Presidrnt is violating the Constitution. Seems to me that if Boehner truly believes this, he should be calling for impeachment, no?
Yes, any other president would have been impeached long ago. Its kinda hard when you have the media in your back pocket like obama has.
:goodposting: Amen to that.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I think maybe the most cynical use of an EO or signing order was: Obama's order that he issued almost immediately or contemporaneously with the passage of the ACA re: abortion funding.

The ACA was hung up on one final issue, whether the federal government would be funding abortions as part of the ACA. Anti-abortion Democrats formed a block and would not vote for the ACA as long as there wasn't a provision excluding it. A good number of pro-abortion Democrats wouldn't vote for any bill that didn't provide such funding.

What to do?

Well the president said just include the abortion funding provision and once passed he would immediately sign an EO excluding such a provision. Which he did. Thus Congress never actually voted on the final law, as it is and as it became. And thus anti-abortion Democrats got to say they voted for a law that prohibited abortion funding. And thus pro-abortion Democrats got to tell their constituents they voted for a law which provided for it. One hell of a way to run a "democracy." Appalling, really.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_13535
That's just good politics right there. :thumbup:

 
Obama has proposed significant reforms to the NSA wiretapping program. I'd love the administration to go farther, but his reforms send more requests to the FISA court, put a public advocate in the proceedings (instead of handling it like a Grand Jury), reduces the amount of data collected based on one "suspicious person", and takes storage of metadata out of the government's hands.

Conservatives who are suddenly concerned about this stuff under the Obama administration are the worst type of opportunistic hacks (we'll spare the few libertarians who actually spoke up about it 10 years ago).
Which raises the question why is the President setting the rules ad hoc (only once discovered by virtue of leaks btw) and not Congress or the Constitution? The 4th Amendment doesn't allow such seizures, period, and the 3rd Amendment says the government can't intrude our privacy. The 1st Amendment says we have a right to free speech. That should all be enough.
You have a habit of sounding like an idiot when you talk about the Constitution. Which is to be expected, because you rely on press reports from ideologues to tell you what it means. Just for starters, the 3rd Amendment prohibits one very specific thing. Which is the government requiring private citizens to quarter troops. It most certainly does not say anything like "the government can't intrude our privacy.."

The Fourth Amendment prohibits "unreasonable searches and seizures" in the absence of "probable cause." Reasonable people can disagree over whether the collection of metadata, for instance, is an unreasonable search and seizure or whether the FISA court process (established, by Congress, in 1978) ensures probable cause. But as the chief executive, the President is absolutely entitled to propose, and to even implement in the absence of a contrary law passed by Congress) reforms aimed at achieving those goals.
Oof.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top