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Browns 2005 Offseason (1 Viewer)

WTAM 1100 AM (Cleveland) reporting that Romeo Crennell is the top candidate to be the next head coach. :wall:Again, this bumalready coached the Browns defense in 2000 and it was horrible. Butch Davis took the same players and in 2001 showed much improvement. I credit his success in New England to Belichick, not this guy! And Savage wants HIM?! ARGH!

 
Why is it everyone starts yelling for a new QB when the team has a poor year? I did not see much of the Browns in '04, but I am guessing the OL sucked. Garcia was a stud at SF before they went into cap-hell. Let him learn the system and get some blocking for him and Suggs. WRs like Byant and Northcutt are at least as good as what KC is fielding. The OL is what makes the difference.

 
WTAM 1100 AM (Cleveland) reporting that Romeo Crennell is the top candidate to be the next head coach. :wall:Again, this bumalready coached the Browns defense in 2000 and it was horrible. Butch Davis took the same players and in 2001 showed much improvement. I credit his success in New England to Belichick, not this guy! And Savage wants HIM?! ARGH!
Agreed
 
Why is it everyone starts yelling for a new QB when the team has a poor year? I did not see much of the Browns in '04, but I am guessing the OL sucked. Garcia was a stud at SF before they went into cap-hell. Let him learn the system and get some blocking for him and Suggs. WRs like Byant and Northcutt are at least as good as what KC is fielding. The OL is what makes the difference.
Jeff Garcia = product of TO... and is also a WCO QB
 
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WTAM 1100 AM (Cleveland) reporting that Romeo Crennell is the top candidate to be the next head coach. :wall:Again, this bumalready coached the Browns defense in 2000 and it was horrible. Butch Davis took the same players and in 2001 showed much improvement. I credit his success in New England to Belichick, not this guy! And Savage wants HIM?! ARGH!
LOL...you guys ran Belichick out of town and now don't want one of his top henchmen. Sometimes I feel sorry for Cleveland.
 
Get a QB 1st pickStick with SuggsGet a WR 2nd pickUse Winslow like KC does Gonzo
Great idea. Maybe they can tie up lots of money in guys like Tim Couch and Kevin Johnson.
Yup.See Johnson, Morgan, Davis, and Northcutt....all 2nd round picks. If they do that again, I'm gonna lose it. I'd rather see them take Mike Williams than a QB also.
Ok they take Williams and then what stick with Holcomb or Garcia? Can they get it done with Williams A.Davis Suggs and Winslow?
Why does everyone eant them to get a receiver in the first or second round when receiver is probably one of the stronger positions on the team?Bryant/Davis/Northcutt/Winslow should be fine if not better than average. What are making them look bad are the line, the system, and to some degree, the QBs.
 
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Get a QB 1st pickStick with SuggsGet a WR 2nd pickUse Winslow like KC does Gonzo
Great idea. Maybe they can tie up lots of money in guys like Tim Couch and Kevin Johnson.
Yup.See Johnson, Morgan, Davis, and Northcutt....all 2nd round picks. If they do that again, I'm gonna lose it. I'd rather see them take Mike Williams than a QB also.
Ok they take Williams and then what stick with Holcomb or Garcia? Can they get it done with Williams A.Davis Suggs and Winslow?
Why does everyone eant them to get a receiver in the first or second round when receiver is probably one of the stronger positions on the team?Bryant/Davis/Northcutt/Winslow should be fine if not better than average. What are making them look bad are the line, the system, and to some degree, the QBs.
There may not be an O lineman worthy of a #3 selection this year. You can't just take a guy that will go later in the 1st round at #3 because you're trying to fill a void. The Browns have alot of holes, not just the Oline. Because of this I think they go elsewhere.Lets say Leinart and Rodgers go 1-2, then the Browns have a tough decision to make. I would venture to say they go LB or WR at this point. D. Johnson, Williams, and Edwards become the main options.A. Davis gets hurt every year. Bryant has potential, but is labled as a headcase. Northcutt is a slot guy, good possesion, that has alot of value as punt returner. Winslow is a TE, so yes he is a target, but a good tandem of WRs will only make him better.Still, at this point I think the pick is D Johnson until we know more about Leinart and DeBrickshaw (have not heard if he made a decision yet).
 
My plan for the Browns draft this year is the same as last year.1. Take the best player available with the first round choice.2. Trade the second round pick for an established LT. He doesn't have to be a stud, just above average. Then you slide Verba to LG and solve two positions on the OL.3. Package the 3rd and 4th round pick for an established NFL RG.I would do this because this I believe **** Vermiel would do something like this.I didn't like trading the 1st and 2nd round pick to move up one slot. But what's done is done.

 
My plan for the Browns draft this year is the same as last year.1. Take the best player available with the first round choice.2. Trade the second round pick for an established LT. He doesn't have to be a stud, just above average. Then you slide Verba to LG and solve two positions on the OL.3. Package the 3rd and 4th round pick for an established NFL RG.I would do this because this I believe **** Vermiel would do something like this.I didn't like trading the 1st and 2nd round pick to move up one slot. But what's done is done.
So you would deal the Browns 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks for an "established" LT and RG? Check in with the Dolphins and see how this strategy paid off for them last year.BGP- Your team's new GM is supposed to be a draft Guru, why handcuff him from the start???
 
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My plan for the Browns draft this year is the same as last year.1. Take the best player available with the first round choice.2. Trade the second round pick for an established LT. He doesn't have to be a stud, just above average. Then you slide Verba to LG and solve two positions on the OL.3. Package the 3rd and 4th round pick for an established NFL RG.I would do this because this I believe **** Vermiel would do something like this.I didn't like trading the 1st and 2nd round pick to move up one slot. But what's done is done.
Hey Carmen! You'd better change that plan! Last year's ideas didn't work!Trade down And take OFFENSIVE LINEMEN. As many as you can get.But before you do that..1. hire a very good coach and a really good staff, including a top notch line coach.2. make peace with Garcia. You'll need him for another year.3. use FA to get a RB. Suggs is back-up material. The market is loaded, no reason to stick with the guys you have.
 
BGP, let me run this one up the flagpole and see what you think...Leinart to the 49ers, Benson to the 'Phins.Browns trade their 1st and a later pick or functional player to the Cowboys for the 11 and the 20.The Cowboys grab Kiwanuka with the #3 and avoid having to pay 2 first rounders. THey get the speed-rusher they need to make a difference. They might also take Rodgers here, but I don't want to blow up my own scenario by suggesting the unlikely "Cowboys take a qb>"Browns select Rolle or Miller at 11. Browns select Marcus McNeil or Wesley Britt at 20.Thoughts?Colin

 
If you want insight to what the Browns will do under Savage, take a look at what Baltimore has done. The Ravens have a blueprint for franchise-building and I’m willing to bet Savage will follow it pretty closely for at least the first few years.The draft policy is to take the best player available, with absolutely no regard for position. I think Savage will look very hard at CB Rolle with the #3 pick, as Marvin Lewis frequently pointed to the acquisition of McAlister as the key to making the Ravens a dominant defensive unit. Savage will trade down only if he believes there’s no player who grades out high enough to make him worthy of the #3 pick.Also, Savage will not draft an O lineman very high. In their 9-year draft history, the Ravens have picked one O Lineman in the first round (Ogden) and only one other as high as the third. Their philosophy is that to build a team in the salary cap era, you have to save your cap dollars somewhere, and that the position you can stock up on with cheap players and get away with it is the interior of the offensive line. That’s why the Ravens have undrafted free agents Mike Flynn and Bennie Anderson at C and RG and fourth-rounder Ed Mulitalo at LG. He will sift through a bunch of cheap trash to stock the interior OL. And if there isn’t a sure-fire All-Pro available at Tackle in the draft, he will look for a “right-price” veteran (since 2000, the Ravens’ Right Tackles have been Harry Swayne, Kipp Vickers, Ethan Brooks and Orlando Brown). The only time Baltimore paid big money for a veteran Tackle, it turned into Leon Searcy missing the entire season without playing a down. Doubt he’ll go that route again.Finally, there are certain positions where Savage is great at identifying talent. He can sniff out NFL-caliber RBs, TEs, LBs and Safetys in his sleep. The Ravens were very high on William Green in the draft, and were actually a little disappointed when they had to end up “settling” for Ed Reed after Green and Napoleon Harris were taken before their pick. So I’m sure he’ll get a long look, and Savage will also be able to assess whether Suggs is good enough. The other interesting fringe benefit from stocking your team with so many quality RBs, TEs, LBs and Safetys is that those are the positions that provide you with lots of special teams guys, so I look for that area to be much improved.Finally, there are a couple of areas where Savage hasn’t been so good at picking players. Obviously WR and, to a lesser extent, also QB and OL. Wouldn’t be surprised to see him hang onto the Cleveland WRs who are already proven NFL caliber, since he’s not so great at picking them (I’m looking at you, Travis Taylor in the first round, and you, Patrick Johnson, in the second).Bottom line, Browns will draft an All-Star in the first round, every down starters in the second and third, and will have much better depth across the board before they hit the field for training camp. But don’t look for a lot of high-priced help along the O Line.

 
My plan for the Browns draft this year is the same as last year.1. Take the best player available with the first round choice.2. Trade the second round pick for an established LT. He doesn't have to be a stud, just above average. Then you slide Verba to LG and solve two positions on the OL.3. Package the 3rd and 4th round pick for an established NFL RG.I would do this because this I believe **** Vermiel would do something like this.I didn't like trading the 1st and 2nd round pick to move up one slot. But what's done is done.
So you would deal the Browns 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks for an "established" LT and RG? Check in with the Dolphins and see how this strategy paid off for them last year.BGP- Your team's new GM is supposed to be a draft Guru, why handcuff him from the start???
Its what vermiel would do. He likes trading picks to get OL. Not only would I do it this year, but I'd probably keep doing it in more drafts than not.
 
BGP, let me run this one up the flagpole and see what you think...Leinart to the 49ers, Benson to the 'Phins.Browns trade their 1st and a later pick or functional player to the Cowboys for the 11 and the 20.The Cowboys grab Kiwanuka with the #3 and avoid having to pay 2 first rounders. THey get the speed-rusher they need to make a difference. They might also take Rodgers here, but I don't want to blow up my own scenario by suggesting the unlikely "Cowboys take a qb>"Browns select Rolle or Miller at 11. Browns select Marcus McNeil or Wesley Britt at 20.Thoughts?Colin
I'd pull the trigger on that trade.The Browns are going to need a QB as well. All reports say Garcia has burned his bridges with the Browns and that leaves Holcomb (who may also want out) and McCown who is terrible.
 
Bottom line, Browns will draft an All-Star in the first round, every down starters in the second and third, and will have much better depth across the board before they hit the field for training camp. But don’t look for a lot of high-priced help along the O Line.
That's kinda crappy.The biggest problem with the Browns is the offense. I'm trying to model the design after guys who have had success building offenses. But Savage seems weak in that area.

The current model for building a champion seems to be to get a core of difference makers, and then make huge acquistions in free agency and worry about the salary cap later. Almost every recent champion has followed that model (except for the two patriots' teams, but not everyone has Belichick). That doesn't mean it always works (the redskins come to mind) but that most champions do this.

 
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Finally, there are certain positions where Savage is great at identifying talent. He can sniff out NFL-caliber RBs, TEs, LBs and Safetys in his sleep. The Ravens were very high on William Green in the draft, and were actually a little disappointed when they had to end up “settling” for Ed Reed after Green and Napoleon Harris were taken before their pick.
I'm not sure if you are including RB as one of those positions at which Savage is "great" at identifying talent, but, if you are, citing the Ravens as being "very high" on Green is not a good way to make your point.
 
As much as I'd hate to see it, Grimm would be a great choice for Cleveland.IMO, his primary goal would be to build the team through the O & D lines and establish a running attack that would pound people into submission.His reputation as a great O-lineman & great O-line coach could very well lead to the signing of some key O-line FAs. What O-lineman wouldn't want to play for Grimm?Sounds like an AFC North team to me.

 
Finally, there are certain positions where Savage is great at identifying talent. He can sniff out NFL-caliber RBs, TEs, LBs and Safetys in his sleep. The Ravens were very high on William Green in the draft, and were actually a little disappointed when they had to end up “settling” for Ed Reed after Green and Napoleon Harris were taken before their pick.
I'm not sure if you are including RB as one of those positions at which Savage is "great" at identifying talent, but, if you are, citing the Ravens as being "very high" on Green is not a good way to make your point.
Maybe I'd be better off focusing on Priest Holmes as an undrafted free agent, Jamal Lewis as the first RB taken in 2000 when most other people were touting Thomas Jones, or Chester Taylor in the sixth round.
 
Finally, there are certain positions where Savage is great at identifying talent. He can sniff out NFL-caliber RBs, TEs, LBs and Safetys in his sleep. The Ravens were very high on William Green in the draft, and were actually a little disappointed when they had to end up “settling” for Ed Reed after Green and Napoleon Harris were taken before their pick.
I'm not sure if you are including RB as one of those positions at which Savage is "great" at identifying talent, but, if you are, citing the Ravens as being "very high" on Green is not a good way to make your point.
Maybe I'd be better off focusing on Priest Holmes as an undrafted free agent, Jamal Lewis as the first RB taken in 2000 when most other people were touting Thomas Jones, or Chester Taylor in the sixth round.
Much better! :thumbup:
 
BGP, let me run this one up the flagpole and see what you think...Leinart to the 49ers, Benson to the 'Phins.Browns trade their 1st and a later pick or functional player to the Cowboys for the 11 and the 20.The Cowboys grab Kiwanuka with the #3 and avoid having to pay 2 first rounders. THey get the speed-rusher they need to make a difference. They might also take Rodgers here, but I don't want to blow up my own scenario by suggesting the unlikely "Cowboys take a qb>"Browns select Rolle or Miller at 11. Browns select Marcus McNeil or Wesley Britt at 20.Thoughts?Colin
Good stuff here. I have not thought much about trade possibilities yet, but this one would work for the Browns. Rolle would be a great pick, but at #3 I'm not sure yet, so #11 sounds great.Looks like the teams that want to move up this year will want to give up less than in the past, based on the players available. Once the playoffs are over, we'll dig into this more I'm sure.
 
Finally, there are certain positions where Savage is great at identifying talent. He can sniff out NFL-caliber RBs, TEs, LBs and Safetys in his sleep. The Ravens were very high on William Green in the draft, and were actually a little disappointed when they had to end up “settling” for Ed Reed after Green and Napoleon Harris were taken before their pick.
I'm not sure if you are including RB as one of those positions at which Savage is "great" at identifying talent, but, if you are, citing the Ravens as being "very high" on Green is not a good way to make your point.
Maybe I'd be better off focusing on Priest Holmes as an undrafted free agent, Jamal Lewis as the first RB taken in 2000 when most other people were touting Thomas Jones, or Chester Taylor in the sixth round.
Much better! :thumbup:
and the idea was for Green to be b/u plan for Lewis, who had just missed an entire season w/his 2nd ACL surgery......as opposed to looking at Green as a rock solid starter typeBillick was very concerned at the lack of RB depth the year after the SB winn...Holmes left for KC, as he felt he was starter material ('ya think?) and Lewis was drafted as the every down backhis worst nightmare bore fruit, as Lewis got put on the shelf prior to the season starting, and Moe Williams and a bunch of guys no longer around came in to tote the rockas long as Billick is around, there will always be a brusier-type RB 2 on the roster, so as not to 'change the profile of this team'I wouldn't be suprised to see Savage trade down out of the 3 for additional picks...IMO,he'd rather have the bulk in picks than pay the #3 money--he is solid in understanding that teams are built w/draft picks, not FA's, due to the cap ramifications
 
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On the 2005 "Super Bowl Round Table" they are discussing what the Browns may look like under Romeo Crennell.On defense, you switch to the 3-4. Gerard Warren played a bit better towards the end of the year and is your nose tackle. You get 4 linebackers. Probably draft LB in round 1.On offense, the base formation will be 2 TEs and a FB. You have Shea, Heiden, and Winslow. Terrell Smith at FB.

 
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On offense, the base formation will be 2 TEs and a FB. You have Shea, Heiden, and Winslow. Terrell Smith at FB.
going 1 wide, w/all those WR's listed earlier? :confused: 2 tight in a single back set, maybe, but 2TE-FB only leaves 1 WR on the field
 
On offense, the base formation will be 2 TEs and a FB. You have Shea, Heiden, and Winslow. Terrell Smith at FB.
going 1 wide, w/all those WR's listed earlier? :confused: 2 tight in a single back set, maybe, but 2TE-FB only leaves 1 WR on the field
Yeah well, we kept taking WRs in round 2, and now we're out of WRs. :shrug:
 
On the 2005 "Super Bowl Round Table" they are discussing what the Browns may look like under Romeo Crennell.On defense, you switch to the 3-4. Gerard Warren played a bit better towards the end of the year and is your nose tackle. You get 4 linebackers. Probably draft LB in round 1.On offense, the base formation will be 2 TEs and a FB. You have Shea, Heiden, and Winslow. Terrell Smith at FB.
From the PD today:Crennel confirms his wishes to continue the 3-4 defense and that he would have an offense similar to NE. Also there seems to be speculation that Eric Mangini will come along as the D Coord. Anyone have any info on Eric? LINK
 
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Some Q&A with Phil Savage:Anytime you are talking about the draft, you are in shark invested waters - its no guarantee. Want to make sure you don't bust. Quarterbacks are noted for busting.On quarterbacks: gloss over the top QB picks in the draft and focused on a couple mid-round signal-callers.Focusing on getting Holcomb resigned.William Green and Gerard Warren's agents have been told they might want to explore opportunities with other teams. It was reccommended that they find a trade for their clients.I am paraphrasing from actual audio clips of Phil Savage played on WTAM 1100 AM just moments ago.

 

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