Daniel Shirley
Footballguy
Is Buster Skrine still in the starting lineup? 2TT last game, but vs the Chiefs (WRs need to catch the ball to be tackled I suppose).
No, he's not.CB Joe Haden and CB Sheldon Brown are the starters. Skrine is the third corner.He got a start against Dallas when Haden was OUT and he was starting when Haden was out suspended and then CB Dimitri Patterson went down with an injury.D-Pat is coming back from his injury and both Haden and Sheldon Brown are back so the best Buster would see now is nickel or dime packages.The Browns may or may-not see RG III Sunday so the Skins could have a run heavy attack so Skrine possibly may not see the field much. Next week against the Broncos I'm sure we will see a lot of heavy DB packages but Buster isn't starting.Is Buster Skrine still in the starting lineup? 2TT last game, but vs the Chiefs (WRs need to catch the ball to be tackled I suppose).
Not sure what you call awful. Looking at his stat line from last year it looks like he has the perfect balance for fantasy football CB. He had 72 tackles, which means he played the run well enough and wasn't a shut down corner that forced QB's to throw away from him. He didn't have any INT's but he had 11 pass break ups. If he has a 25% increase due to more playing time, he could be a top 10 corner.He was awful last year. If he plays like that in september someone else will be starting in October.
Could you be any more specific? I quoted his states playing in the Nickel most of the year. Are you saying his coverage sucked? Are you saying he sucks at tackling? If he had 72 tackles, did he miss another 72?He sucked too much as an actual football player, any sort of repeat and the new guys are likely to replace him.
Skrine really was awful.Not sure what you call awful. Looking at his stat line from last year it looks like he has the perfect balance for fantasy football CB. He had 72 tackles, which means he played the run well enough and wasn't a shut down corner that forced QB's to throw away from him. He didn't have any INT's but he had 11 pass break ups. If he has a 25% increase due to more playing time, he could be a top 10 corner.He was awful last year. If he plays like that in september someone else will be starting in October.
A productive fantasy corner needs to suck a little in order to make tackles after the catch.
He has the skills desired of a corner, but makes too many bad mistakes in games. It cost the Browns dearly in 2012, multiple times. Safe to assume this staff is aware of the issue, a couple of repeats in 2013 and the leash will be pulled. All the skills in the world don't matter if you can't do it on Sunday. Skrine makes enough plays to keep him around, but the only way he will stick is if he manages his bad plays significantly better.Could you be any more specific? I quoted his states playing in the Nickel most of the year. Are you saying his coverage sucked? Are you saying he sucks at tackling? If he had 72 tackles, did he miss another 72?He sucked too much as an actual football player, any sort of repeat and the new guys are likely to replace him.
I agree if he plays poorly he won't play all year, but fantasy football is about points. As far as waiver wire CB's, he may put up points early.
He must be doing something right, he's in a battle for the starting CB spot.
Which would put his floor back to last years numbers? Which was top ten in our league.MAC_32 said:He has the skills desired of a corner, but makes too many bad mistakes in games. It cost the Browns dearly in 2012, multiple times. Safe to assume this staff is aware of the issue, a couple of repeats in 2013 and the leash will be pulled. All the skills in the world don't matter if you can't do it on Sunday. Skrine makes enough plays to keep him around, but the only way he will stick is if he manages his bad plays significantly better.KCitons said:Could you be any more specific? I quoted his states playing in the Nickel most of the year. Are you saying his coverage sucked? Are you saying he sucks at tackling? If he had 72 tackles, did he miss another 72?MAC_32 said:He sucked too much as an actual football player, any sort of repeat and the new guys are likely to replace him.
I agree if he plays poorly he won't play all year, but fantasy football is about points. As far as waiver wire CB's, he may put up points early.
He must be doing something right, he's in a battle for the starting CB spot.
He's battling for a starting CB position because no meaningful free agents would meet the Browns asking price. They inquired with most (all?) of them, but did not sign anyone meaningful. It's obvious they are looking to upgrade the position. They drafted McFadden day 2 and acquired Owens to compete with Skrine. Skrine's out in front by default because the other two aren't on the field. At this point, McFadden's 2013 is all but lost unless one of them gets hurt, or Skrine repeats 2012, because he's missed so much time. Owens is probably coming back too late to make a run at week 1, but any Skrine slip up's and I think we'll see Owens get an opportunity moving Skrine back to nickel and dime duties - only.
No, his floor is being benched week 3, rendering him totally useless.Which would put his floor back to last years numbers? Which was top ten in our league.MAC_32 said:He has the skills desired of a corner, but makes too many bad mistakes in games. It cost the Browns dearly in 2012, multiple times. Safe to assume this staff is aware of the issue, a couple of repeats in 2013 and the leash will be pulled. All the skills in the world don't matter if you can't do it on Sunday. Skrine makes enough plays to keep him around, but the only way he will stick is if he manages his bad plays significantly better.KCitons said:Could you be any more specific? I quoted his states playing in the Nickel most of the year. Are you saying his coverage sucked? Are you saying he sucks at tackling? If he had 72 tackles, did he miss another 72?MAC_32 said:He sucked too much as an actual football player, any sort of repeat and the new guys are likely to replace him.
I agree if he plays poorly he won't play all year, but fantasy football is about points. As far as waiver wire CB's, he may put up points early.
He must be doing something right, he's in a battle for the starting CB spot.
He's battling for a starting CB position because no meaningful free agents would meet the Browns asking price. They inquired with most (all?) of them, but did not sign anyone meaningful. It's obvious they are looking to upgrade the position. They drafted McFadden day 2 and acquired Owens to compete with Skrine. Skrine's out in front by default because the other two aren't on the field. At this point, McFadden's 2013 is all but lost unless one of them gets hurt, or Skrine repeats 2012, because he's missed so much time. Owens is probably coming back too late to make a run at week 1, but any Skrine slip up's and I think we'll see Owens get an opportunity moving Skrine back to nickel and dime duties - only.
I get that you could lose the CB position. But the floor seems fairly high. Especially for waiver wire fodder at a position that is difficult to pin down from year to year.
But why would he be benched? If he played poorly last year, yet they still used him as the nickel DB, who will take those snaps from him this year. I can agree if he sucks, he could lose his starting CB job to Owens.No, his floor is being benched week 3, rendering him totally useless.Which would put his floor back to last years numbers? Which was top ten in our league.MAC_32 said:He has the skills desired of a corner, but makes too many bad mistakes in games. It cost the Browns dearly in 2012, multiple times. Safe to assume this staff is aware of the issue, a couple of repeats in 2013 and the leash will be pulled. All the skills in the world don't matter if you can't do it on Sunday. Skrine makes enough plays to keep him around, but the only way he will stick is if he manages his bad plays significantly better.KCitons said:Could you be any more specific? I quoted his states playing in the Nickel most of the year. Are you saying his coverage sucked? Are you saying he sucks at tackling? If he had 72 tackles, did he miss another 72?MAC_32 said:He sucked too much as an actual football player, any sort of repeat and the new guys are likely to replace him.
I agree if he plays poorly he won't play all year, but fantasy football is about points. As far as waiver wire CB's, he may put up points early.
He must be doing something right, he's in a battle for the starting CB spot.
He's battling for a starting CB position because no meaningful free agents would meet the Browns asking price. They inquired with most (all?) of them, but did not sign anyone meaningful. It's obvious they are looking to upgrade the position. They drafted McFadden day 2 and acquired Owens to compete with Skrine. Skrine's out in front by default because the other two aren't on the field. At this point, McFadden's 2013 is all but lost unless one of them gets hurt, or Skrine repeats 2012, because he's missed so much time. Owens is probably coming back too late to make a run at week 1, but any Skrine slip up's and I think we'll see Owens get an opportunity moving Skrine back to nickel and dime duties - only.
I get that you could lose the CB position. But the floor seems fairly high. Especially for waiver wire fodder at a position that is difficult to pin down from year to year.
So then you're saying Owen takes his place at CB and McFadden takes his place in nickel? Time will tell, but I agree. Why would the current staff have him penciled in as the starter right now if he's not doing at least some things right.New staff has no ties to him. They have ties to Owens and McFadden.
Because in the NFL crappy CBs get picked on and while they remain on the field that equals tackle opportunities.Why is there an IDP thread devoted to Buster Skrine?
He was ####### garbage.Anyone watch the Browns/Dolpins game? Hearing that not much has changed from last year with Skrine. Still putting up points. But, for how long?
Owens sucked warm dog feces thru a straw. He was the one getting singed by Jerry Rice -- err Brian Hartline.MAC_32 said:He was ####### garbage.KCitons said:Anyone watch the Browns/Dolpins game? Hearing that not much has changed from last year with Skrine. Still putting up points. But, for how long?
Owens is going to force him inside soon enough and then once the season gets out of hand McFadden will get a look as the nickel back demoting Skrine to Dime only.
Skrine was "on" Hartline for most of his receptions.Owens sucked warm dog feces thru a straw. He was the one getting singed by Jerry Rice -- err Brian Hartline.
I had heard somewhere that it was Owens who was responsible for 8 of Harline's catches but don't recall where I heard that so don't quote me on that number but that is what I recall hearing.Skrine was "on" Hartline for most of his receptions.Owens sucked warm dog feces thru a straw. He was the one getting singed by Jerry Rice -- err Brian Hartline.
Wait til Haha Clinton-Dix hits the NFLHis name makes me laugh every time I see it.
J.R. Sweezy and Buster Skrine. We're in a golden age of names.
According to PFF Chris Owens was targeted 10 times and gave up 9 receptions. A 90% catch rate.Neither played well, but skrine gave up the big plays.he had the penalty leading to the clinching td too. Victim to a double move and critical penalty leading to tds. Vintage skrine.
don't blame the pass rush running out of gas either, the offense sucks.
Interesting readI don't need your permission to point out things so I will mention that the pass rush wore down which obviously hurts the ability of DBs to cover. I pointed out my opinion that the reason the pass rush wore down is because the offense couldn't covert on third downs, 1 out of 14. Three of the sacks came in the first half and the other came in the first 10 seconds of the second half.
1st Quarter
- 3-6-CLE 23 (14:17) (Shotgun) 17-R.Tannehill sacked at CLE 31 for -8 yards (92-D.Bryant).
2nd Quarter
- 1-10-MIA 27 (11:18) 17-R.Tannehill sacked at MIA 23 for -4 yards (54-Q.Groves).
- 3-14-MIA 23 (9:52) (Shotgun) 17-R.Tannehill sacked at MIA 19 for -4 yards (92-D.Bryant).
3rd Quarter
- 2-10-MIA 17 (14:50) (Shotgun) 17-R.Tannehill sacked at MIA 16 for -1 yards (99-P.Kruger).
People can spin it any way they want but the pass rush wore down. Why? The atrocious 3rd down conversion rate for the offense kept the defense on the field too long thus the guys rushing the passer got gassed.
Well, our offensive personnel isn't much different than last year. A season wiser with a veteran wr to replace the veteran te but that's really it. Scheme can't be any worse but that doesn't necessarily mean it will be better either. Usually takes a year to adjust and by then we will probably have a different qb.I don't have numbers in front of me but I would submit part of our problem on defense stemmed from the offense not staying on the field long enough to give our guys a blow coupled with the fact that teams were ahead and pounding the run. That takes its toll in the 4th quarter.Why have we consistently been run over the last seevral years up the middle then? You could argue it was our DL for a while, but as that has beefed up it's becoming more and more apparent LB is the issue. You're using height, weight, and bench press to support your case. I'm using the product on the field. I think the field product is 10x more important than the underwear olympics. Stop someone in the 4th quarter and then I can believe we have the guys to man up vs. the run. We couldn't do it in a 4-3 which is friendlier for LB's, the 3-4 is more difficult, why should I believe we will improve in a more difficult (and new) scheme?
I won't completely hijack a thread that is supposed to take a closer look at Ray Horton's defense into a full fledged Browns personnel thread so I wil contribute directly to the topic after addressing the statement that the offensive perssonnel isn't much different from that of last year.Well, our offensive personnel isn't much different than last year. A season wiser with a veteran wr to replace the veteran te but that's really it. Scheme can't be any worse but that doesn't necessarily mean it will be better either. Usually takes a year to adjust and by then we will probably have a different qb.
True on one account, the names are the same. False in assuming that if the personnell isn't much different that we should assume the same production. Plain and simple, we drafted RB Trent Richardson and assumed that rookie would start the season. We drafted QB Brandon Weeden and assumed that rookie would start the season. We drafted ORT Mitchell Schwartz and assumed that rookie would start the season. Never in the history of the NFL had a team ever started a rookie, QB with a rookie RB and a rookie ORT. Add in supplemental rookie WR Josh Gordon who started three weeks into the season due to injury, making FOUR ROOKIES starting on offense.
This year:
- QB Brandon Weeden isn't a rookie and early reports of OTAs are positive and the new scheme fits his talents
- RB Trent Richardson isn't a rookie and he's not facing surgery on his knee to keep him out of training camp/preseason or impared with busted ribs
- ORT Mitchell Schwartz isn't a rookie and is already being talked-up as one of the best right tackles in the league
- WR Josh Gordon isn't a rookie and he's had a full offseason and will go into camp as the #1 WR so he'll get first unit reps
Add in:
- OG Jason Pinkston has been cleared and was just talked about on last nights Audible, go to the podcast at the 58 minute mark where Waldman said Pinktson was thought of as one of the best up-and-coming guards in the NFL before he went down with blood clots and he asked Doctor Jene about whether or not he felt Pinkston would be ok and Jene summed up his take by saying that since the team took soo much time and care and caution and proceeded with caution and they cleared him to pratice that he felt he'd be back. Waldman thinks the Browns offensive line is one of the best in the league with Pinktson and I agree, huge addition to have a healthy Jason Pinkston since Shaun Lavaua was the weak link IMHO and now he'll be the backup and Grecko and Pinkston will start.
- WR Greg Little came on strong down the stretch last season. He's not the same guy.
Same personnell on paper but additions can come from individual personnell making logically anticipated progress so our offense is the same in one reguard but it is not the same expereience-wise so we should logically anticipate improvements from six players on offense.
Back on topic:
Taken right from the horses mouth. Go read what Ray has to say about his defense. Just came out a few hours ago.
http://www.cantonrep.com/browns/x1910058184/Fiery-Horton-stoked-about-Browns-defense
Fiery Horton stoked about Browns defense
Its a situational defense, third downs, red zone, fourth quarter. The scheme is built to attack and is focused on those key situations in games.Horton's scheme is less effective when the opposing offense knows they probably only need 20 points to win, if that. I wouldn't put a ton of stock into those numbers in Arizona. If the Browns continue to suck on offense it absolutely will effect the defensive performance though.
Last year Horton only had one linebacker who got after the QB, Daryl Washington, and he had a part-time backup in Quentin Groves who did ok but other than that not much. On his D-Line he only had Calias Cambell, that was it.
Now he's got, Sheard, Kruger, Mingo,and he's also go Groves. On the D-Line he's got, Desmond Bryant, Ahtyba Rubin, and Phil Taylor. Not as good as Calias Cambell but they all can push back the pocket and make traps.
Horton has the coaching chops and now he's got the personnel.
We are stacked to win those key situations in games.
I'm confident the offense can muster one TD and one FG per half and that is all I think we need to win games.
Won't be easy and the schemes will take time to set in place but we can win this year with these coaches and the current roster even if a long-term answer at QB is a year or two from being added to the team but we could have that guy right now if we give him a chance and it seems Norv is going to provide him a leigt shot.
http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=17&post_id=18091
yep, any big play has one of them near enough to expect it is their fault.It really is hard to determine if Skrine or Owens is worse.
Hey KC,Are you guys complaining as Browns fans? or as fantasy football owners?
'cause, I'm perfectly fine with the play of Skrine as my fantasy corner.
I think we're going to be out of it midseason and they will want to see what they have in the rookie before the offseason. I'd target the bye week, and we're a late bye this year. So, Skrine may be a good start for the regular season, but keep this in mind as the playoffs near.Bracie Smathers said:Hey KC,KCitons said:Are you guys complaining as Browns fans? or as fantasy football owners?
'cause, I'm perfectly fine with the play of Skrine as my fantasy corner.
You're fine with Skrine.
Leon McFadden has the talent but he was injured in camp and fell behind, missing critical installs. He doesn't know the scheme and has looked lost in the little bit I've seen of him. The Browns are already starting a free agent at free safety and can't afford to put a rookie corner out there in a Ray Horton scheme where he'll be asked to play lots of zero cover considering how often Horton bltizes. Lost of communication going on and last minute change ups and the corner opposite of Joe Haden is going to see more action than any DB for the Browns.
Obviously Skrine has struggled and the team has to put in their nickle DB, Owens, and he's struggled even more than Skrine due to lack of, well he's just no good. Too small, can't high point, doesn't come up in run support, doesn't play the ball-plays the man after the catch, no hops, weak, just really-really bad. He isn't a threat to take over Skrine's job but considering so many pick and rub crossing plays when teams run bunched sets they are often in the same area.
McFadden won't see reps in practice and won't in games unless their is an injury.
I think he will eventually prove to be better than Skrine and that is what Mac is hinting at but he's not there yet and he didn't see much, if any, PT yesterday. I don't recall seeing him and the Ravens were doing a good job of rubbing out Joe Haden and passing Torey Smith off two the gruesome twosome at the other corner and nickel slot, Skine/Owens.
But you should be fine if you keep plugging in Skrine. He won't be replaced anytime soon and he is actually good coming up in run support. He made two good stops yesterday in that department and he also did make two nice PDs when he wasn't struggling in coverage.
Thanks for both of the inputs. I know I have trouble differentiating between my Bears as an NFL team and Bears players on my fantasy team. So, I just wanted to be clear.I think we're going to be out of it midseason and they will want to see what they have in the rookie before the offseason. I'd target the bye week, and we're a late bye this year. So, Skrine may be a good start for the regular season, but keep this in mind as the playoffs near.Bracie Smathers said:Hey KC,KCitons said:Are you guys complaining as Browns fans? or as fantasy football owners?
'cause, I'm perfectly fine with the play of Skrine as my fantasy corner.
You're fine with Skrine.
Leon McFadden has the talent but he was injured in camp and fell behind, missing critical installs. He doesn't know the scheme and has looked lost in the little bit I've seen of him. The Browns are already starting a free agent at free safety and can't afford to put a rookie corner out there in a Ray Horton scheme where he'll be asked to play lots of zero cover considering how often Horton bltizes. Lost of communication going on and last minute change ups and the corner opposite of Joe Haden is going to see more action than any DB for the Browns.
Obviously Skrine has struggled and the team has to put in their nickle DB, Owens, and he's struggled even more than Skrine due to lack of, well he's just no good. Too small, can't high point, doesn't come up in run support, doesn't play the ball-plays the man after the catch, no hops, weak, just really-really bad. He isn't a threat to take over Skrine's job but considering so many pick and rub crossing plays when teams run bunched sets they are often in the same area.
McFadden won't see reps in practice and won't in games unless their is an injury.
I think he will eventually prove to be better than Skrine and that is what Mac is hinting at but he's not there yet and he didn't see much, if any, PT yesterday. I don't recall seeing him and the Ravens were doing a good job of rubbing out Joe Haden and passing Torey Smith off two the gruesome twosome at the other corner and nickel slot, Skine/Owens.
But you should be fine if you keep plugging in Skrine. He won't be replaced anytime soon and he is actually good coming up in run support. He made two good stops yesterday in that department and he also did make two nice PDs when he wasn't struggling in coverage.