benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
I am biased in favor of Benson. But I am curious as to what the general public would see the starter.
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Cedric Benson or Thomas Jones? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter benson_will_lead_the_way
- Start date
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
It will be GIVEN to Benson.
End of story.
He won't earn jack squat.
End of story.
He won't earn jack squat.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
hahahahaha....simply one of the best posts I have ever seenAre you trying to imply something or should I just read between the lines?
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
couldn't say it better myself....there is a difference between Grade A(Benson) and Grade B(Jones) meat
Shufflin'Crew
Footballguy
What has Benson done other than hold out an entire training camp and pull up lame when the team needed him most last season? On the other hand, all Jones did was essentially provide every bit of offense the Bears mustered the last two years. I'm not happy about his stance with the OTA's, and if he holds out of training camp then I say go with Benson. But, if he shows up and in shape then I say give the ball to Jones until Benson proves he can do something with it.
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
You don't draft a guy 4th overall, pay him millions and let him be a backup if you see the opportunity to GIVE him the job.
Thomas Jones is his own worst enemy by missing VOLUNTARY team activities.
Thomas Jones is his own worst enemy by missing VOLUNTARY team activities.
Shufflin'Crew
Footballguy
That is absolutely correct...he's making the decision for Angelo and Lovie easy.
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
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benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
He was better than Jones if you look at Yards Per Carry
Shufflin'Crew
Footballguy
I'm really not sure how anyone who has actually watched every down of Chicago Bear football the past 2 seasons cannot...1) have the utmost of respect for Thomas Jones as a football player.
2) wonder how miserable the offensive output would have been had he NOT been there.
3) honestly think that Benson, at this point at least, deserves the starting job.
Thomas Jones has really been the only bright spot on an utterly miserable offensive football team for two entire years. He has absolutely earned the starting job without question, provided he makes all the mandatory camps/meetings.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
If you look at statistics....Thomas Jones is pretty much equal to Anthony Thomas in his days with Chicago and only slightly better than James Allen.If you are the #7 overall pick and it take you 6 years to finally gain over 1000 yards in a season....something is seriously wrong.
Chase Stuart
Footballguy
Thomas Jones: 98.4 Y/G; 0.55 TDs/G; 4.12 YPCAnthony Thomas: 75.3 Y/G; 0.41 TDs/G; 3.88 YPC
And by "pretty much" you mean if you discount Anthony Thomas' ####ty 2002 and 2004?Thomas Jones has done nothing short of pulling a miracle producing what he has produced in that offense the past two years.
Edit: infact, Thomas' best season in Chicago still did not equal Jones' 2004 or 2005.
Thomas, 2001: 1183 rushyds, 7 rushTDs, 22 rec, 178 recyds... 178 FPs
Jones, 2004: 948 rushyds, 7 rushTDs, 56 rec, 427 recyds... 180 FPs
Jones, 2005: 1335 rushyds, 9 rushTDs, 26 rec, 143 recyds... 202 FPs
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benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
Where are you getting these stats from?
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
So you are going to discount Thomas Jones' first 4 years in the league as well.I am not talking fantasy numbers but those are pretty close. You fail to include that Anthony Thomas has rushed for over 1000 yards twice in his career and with the bears....neither Thomas Jones has or will do again. Also the YPC which were identicle 4.3 from 2001 with A-train to this past year of 2005 with Jones. It just happened that Anthony Thomas didn't get his starting job until a few games into that season and still was rookie of the year that season....oh wait wasn't Thomas Jones drafted that same season....how did he do...373 yards rushing.
All of this means that he is an average starting running back in my opinion.
Chase Stuart
Footballguy
Lots of places have those numbers. I got them from the data dominator. I looked at the careers of both running backs during their times with the Bears only.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
What are the career numbers?Did you count games not played due to injury?
Bears_Man2
Footballguy
"14 Team Keeper League (QB,RB,RB,WR,WR,WR,TE,K,DEF)
QB-Warner, grossman
RB-Ronnie Brown, Benson, Curtis Martin, Duckett
WR-Holt, Horn, Matt Jones, Mark Bradley, Reggie Williams
TE-Dallas Clark, Mercedes Lewis
K-Elam
DEF-Seattle, Minny"
Hey that's great you need Benson to win the job (I have Benson and not Jones as well in my dynasty), but don't sit here and compare Jones to Ant-Train. If you are, it's readily apparent you aren't/weren't watching Bears games in 2005.
Jones was facing 8 man fronts every week. Ran off tackle, between the tackles, and played in 15 of the 16 games. (The latter 2 aspects were the entire reason they took Benson in the first place).
And when people say Benson looked no better than Adrian Peterson in 2005, they're 100% correct. Is Peterson getting a crack at the job before Benson? Of course not.
If Bears fans had the choice right now who they'd want for the next 5 years, it'd be a runaway vote for Thomas Jones. Unfortunately $$ talks & Benson will get his shot. And unfortunately they aren't giving Jones his worth to the franchise.
QB-Warner, grossman
RB-Ronnie Brown, Benson, Curtis Martin, Duckett
WR-Holt, Horn, Matt Jones, Mark Bradley, Reggie Williams
TE-Dallas Clark, Mercedes Lewis
K-Elam
DEF-Seattle, Minny"
Hey that's great you need Benson to win the job (I have Benson and not Jones as well in my dynasty), but don't sit here and compare Jones to Ant-Train. If you are, it's readily apparent you aren't/weren't watching Bears games in 2005.
Jones was facing 8 man fronts every week. Ran off tackle, between the tackles, and played in 15 of the 16 games. (The latter 2 aspects were the entire reason they took Benson in the first place).
And when people say Benson looked no better than Adrian Peterson in 2005, they're 100% correct. Is Peterson getting a crack at the job before Benson? Of course not.
If Bears fans had the choice right now who they'd want for the next 5 years, it'd be a runaway vote for Thomas Jones. Unfortunately $$ talks & Benson will get his shot. And unfortunately they aren't giving Jones his worth to the franchise.
Chase Stuart
Footballguy
I only counted games played. I didn't do the career numbers because the only question was which player did better as a Bear.
netnalp
Footballguy
I think Jones deserves and will win the job again. His eaarly years being a bust don't concern me much. The Cards stunk so bad during his time there. Hearst wasn't very good there and he went on to be a pretty good #2 Fantasy back in SF. Not sure what the deal was the one year in Tampa. I have heard that the Tampa offense is hard to pick up, for QBs maybe it is for RBs too. Tampa and Gruden have a history of RBBC. I'm more confident that Jones will keep this job than Dayne will win or keep his, he stunk his first few years and people love him this year.
purestrength
Footballguy
Bears' front office is clueless?
RBM
Footballguy
IMO, last year is as good as it will get for TJ. Dont get me wrong, I love what the guy has brought to the team; great work ethic, enthusiasm, toughness, but like I said I have a feeling thats the best kind of year we will get out of him. As for Benson, I wouldnt be surprised in the least, if he turns into a 1500 yard, 15 td type of player.
Its a nice problem to have honestly
Its a nice problem to have honestly
Verbal Kint
Footballguy
This is eerily reminescent of the Henry/McGahee debate a couple years ago. Not saying I disagree with you, but the fact that one player has carried the team (Henry did it on a broken leg) does not always mean he will keep his job.
M
MLBrandow
Guest
How crazy would this be:
rd1: Peyton Manning
rd2: Terrell Owens
rd3: Plaxico Burres
rd4: Tony Gonzalez
rd5: Derrick Masonn
rd6: Cedric Benson
rd7: LenDale White
rd8: Curtis Martin
rd1: Peyton Manning
rd2: Terrell Owens
rd3: Plaxico Burres
rd4: Tony Gonzalez
rd5: Derrick Masonn
rd6: Cedric Benson
rd7: LenDale White
rd8: Curtis Martin
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B. Nugget
Footballguy
The thing about Jones is that he excels in receiving and blocking, two things that the minicamp reports were saying that Benson supposedly dedicated himself to in the offseason, but was still showing deficiencies. I have TJ, I know the end is probably near in Chicago for him, but this year I think at worst he will be 3rd down back because of what I mentioned above and has a good chance of remaining the starter. Worst case scenario, I think he should be comparable to Chris Perry with huge upside if he keeps the #1 spot.Unfortunately, he hired Rosenhaus and missed that OTA's and I have a feeling that it will end up costing him in the end. Eventually, Benson was going to get a chance to show what he can do, why would you open the door for him?B. Nugget
M
MLBrandow
Guest
I agree with the above if TJ remains a Bear.
I see a Cadillac/Pittman-type relationship here. he should embrace the backup role and do what he can to support the better RB.
Pittman, despite only carrying the ball a handful of times in spelling Cadillac, enjoyed career highs in YPC and %C40+.
While not the starter, he still has a chance to be an integral catalyst to give this offense an extra dimension, and he shouldn't pout, but just play.
Fantasy-wise, say hello to Cedric the Entertainer
I see a Cadillac/Pittman-type relationship here. he should embrace the backup role and do what he can to support the better RB.
Pittman, despite only carrying the ball a handful of times in spelling Cadillac, enjoyed career highs in YPC and %C40+.
While not the starter, he still has a chance to be an integral catalyst to give this offense an extra dimension, and he shouldn't pout, but just play.
Fantasy-wise, say hello to Cedric the Entertainer
metoo
Footballguy
redraft or dynastyi only play dynasty,no way benson or white can be had that late. burress and mason should go later. swap wr for rb.How crazy would this be:
rd1: Peyton Manning
rd2: Terrell Owens
rd3: Plaxico Burres
rd4: Tony Gonzalez
rd5: Derrick Masonn
rd6: Cedric Benson
rd7: LenDale White
rd8: Curtis Martin
M
MLBrandow
Guest
I live in the now... so I'm not much of a dynasty player.Naturally, this is a redraft roster.redraft or dynastyi only play dynasty,no way benson or white can be had that late. burress and mason should go later. swap wr for rb.How crazy would this be:
rd1: Peyton Manning
rd2: Terrell Owens
rd3: Plaxico Burres
rd4: Tony Gonzalez
rd5: Derrick Masonn
rd6: Cedric Benson
rd7: LenDale White
rd8: Curtis Martin
As a Bears fan that has watched every minute of Bears games the last two years, this post is spot on. Jones has actually been the Bears Offensive MVP in my opinion the last two years. He has gone against the eight man fronts and he has made something out of nothing. I understand that there are a lot of fantasy owners out there who have been burnt by Jones in the past, but that does not take away from the fact that Jones has done very well the last three years (his final year in Tampa included). I would also agree that Peterson looked better than Benson did last year. I think it is a very good problem for the Bears to have, Jones has shown he is susceptable to injury and we have 2 very good backups. Eventually Benson will be forced into the starting lineup due to the fact that he was taken 4th overall, but it will not be because Jones has under performed.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Last year, I got beat up pretty bad on this board for suggesting that the Bears were dumb for drafting Benson, when they had Thomas Jones on the roster.
I argued that his time in AZ was a joke and that he looked great in Tampa when given limited opportunities.
I also pointed to Jones' decent first season with the Bears and yet got blasted by nearly every poster on the thread.
As a result of the Jones hate, the Bears offense and the Benson situation, I drafted Jones in the 10th round!
I plan to get him very late again this year, so keep the hate rolling fellas.
Thomas Jones will outplay Ced Benson AGAIN and will be my cheap #2 or #3 back.
I argued that his time in AZ was a joke and that he looked great in Tampa when given limited opportunities.
I also pointed to Jones' decent first season with the Bears and yet got blasted by nearly every poster on the thread.
As a result of the Jones hate, the Bears offense and the Benson situation, I drafted Jones in the 10th round!
I plan to get him very late again this year, so keep the hate rolling fellas.
Thomas Jones will outplay Ced Benson AGAIN and will be my cheap #2 or #3 back.
M
MLBrandow
Guest
try again.Bears and Jones lovers fail to understand that this isn't about Jones' inability to produce, but Benson's ability to outproduce Jones... by a lot.
I honestly feel bad for Jones. He's a very solid RB. I was hoping TB would have been able to hold onto him and let Pittman go instead...
While it seems Jones can't catch a break, and he's a great guy and a good RB, Benson will be the starter, not because he earned it, but because he will be the better RB.
This is why Jones has been asking for a trade this whole time.
He was a steal last year though
. People forgot that in '04 he led the league in Rushing until Grossman got hurt.This year though, don't make the mistake trying to be a
, unless you also plan on drafting him as your RB5 who could go the entire year without starting a game.
RBM
Footballguy
try again.Bears and Jones lovers fail to understand that this isn't about Jones' inability to produce, but Benson's ability to outproduce Jones... by a lot.
I honestly feel bad for Jones. He's a very solid RB. I was hoping TB would have been able to hold onto him and let Pittman go instead...
While it seems Jones can't catch a break, and he's a great guy and a good RB, Benson will be the starter, not because he earned it, but because he will be the better RB.
This is why Jones has been asking for a trade this whole time.
He was a steal last year though
This year though, don't make the mistake trying to be a
Whats more moronic is people trying to make a big deal out of Peterson out-producing Benson last year. Benson hasnt gotten a real chance yet, and part of that is his own fault, but like I said up above, this guy has the pedigree to be one of the best backs in the league. This is a perfect offense for his strengths, and if he starts from day 1 I expect huge #s. More than TJ, at his best, could give.I agree that Benson got hurt in his first half as a starter, but I'm just saying that Peterson is probably among the best 3rd string running backs in the league. I know it was against the 49ers, but Peterson went for 120 yards and a touchdown in what was primarily just the second half after Benson got hurt. He is no real threat to be named the starter over Jones or Benson, however it could probably ease the decision to trade Jones in the future. In a related note, KFFL just mentioned that Peterson was signed to a three year extension.try again.Bears and Jones lovers fail to understand that this isn't about Jones' inability to produce, but Benson's ability to outproduce Jones... by a lot.
I honestly feel bad for Jones. He's a very solid RB. I was hoping TB would have been able to hold onto him and let Pittman go instead...
While it seems Jones can't catch a break, and he's a great guy and a good RB, Benson will be the starter, not because he earned it, but because he will be the better RB.
This is why Jones has been asking for a trade this whole time.
He was a steal last year though
This year though, don't make the mistake trying to be a
Bears | Peterson agrees to extension (KFFL) Larry Mayer, of ChicagoBears.com, reports the Chicago Bears have agreed to terms with RB Adrian Peterson on a three-year contract extension through the 2009 season. Financial terms of the deal were not disclosed.
Either this means that Hollings has no chance at making the roster, or it might add substance to the Jones trade rumors.
M
MLBrandow
Guest
we ought to merge the Peterson extension with this thread, then just add it as a subtitlle note.. basically the same debate here
MLBrandow I am also curious as to why you think this. I admitedly did not watch a lot of Benson in college, besides highlight reals. I know that picking them 4th overall the Bears must have seen something pretty special, and I understand he had good numbers and some sweet plays at Texas, but I don't know if I would put him in the ultra-special zone. As a Bears fan having watched studs like Enis and Salaam fizzle out, I am a little cautious and Jones hasn't shown me anything that would say that he should lose his job.
K.C. Joyner, the stat guy on ESPN, had a chat yesterday & had this to say about Jones/Benson:
This may go a long way in explaining why the Bears don't consider Jones the answer as a full time RB. Obviously, he is a very good RB, but he does have some weaknesses.
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Rev
Footballguy
Wow this pole is close. Surprising! I love TJ, but Benson seems to have climbed in value as Jones is upset with management. Benson will get a shot this year, and that should scare Jones owners. But Benson could easily be a bust, and with an RB like Jones standing beside you, you really need to be outstanding to hold the spot.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
That is a telling stat and in Chicago it is all about getting the opportunity. Once the Bears gave Anthony Thomas a shot, he out produced James Allen. The same can be said of Benson over Thomas Jones. Jones is a good back but he would be so much better in a Zone-blocking running team(I.E. Atlanta, Denver, and now GB to name a few) b/c he is a scat back that has that quick little cut. But in a power running team Benson will prove to be the difference and now with Peterson backing him up and locked up for a while(at the league minimum) Chicago's running game will be amazing for years. Now the Bears just need to find a good FB that can stay healthy...Runnels?
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
If you saw Benson in college or limited opportunities last season with the Bears you would see the SPECIAL part of his game. Curtis Enis tore his knee and basically had a degenerative condition with it and his knee cap that would have prevented him from playing for a extended period of time after the injury. Salaam rushed for over 1000 yards his rookie season and showed talent(exclude fumbles) but he just smoked too much weed.
Do you consider KiJana Carter, Robert Edwards, Enis busts? I really don't because it was just injuries. Also with todays advances in the medical field players can come back from ACL injuries to be the same player they were before the injury.
Not many RB's lately have just been busts(without injuries) it is one of those positions.....except Lawrence Phillips.
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