***Chicago Bears Thread*** Ben Johnson hired. The Resurrection Begins! (7 Viewers)

[flapgreen]

I meant #3 this year. It's like fitting a square peg into a round hole.

Outside of some analysts saying this, I'm not sure how you could know this.  If you look at a lot of the earlier mock drafts from some of these guys, they have two qbs going in the first three picks. Now, no qbs are in the top three picks. That should tip you off. No games have been played but somehow the mocks are changing. These guys are clueless. If Pace doesn't take one of these guys and the Bears continue to flounder, Pace will be jobless. No one will look back and say nothing none of it was his fault because he  didn't  have the opportunity to get a good qb. Not how it works. 

 

[flapgreen]

You draft a qb, pass rusher, or OT with a top 5 pick.  If the Bears pass on a qb, they better take a pass rusher. Taking a safety at 3 would be foolish. And there are no top flight OTs available 

 

[Interseptopus]

What point are you trying to make? Qbs keep being drafted in the top 10 for a reason. 

But your point is no one makes it far into the postseason without a top 10 QB pick. It's just not the case. 

 

 

[Hawkeye21]

You draft a qb, pass rusher, or OT with a top 5 pick.  If the Bears pass on a qb, they better take a pass rusher. Taking a safety at 3 would be foolish. And there are no top flight OTs available 

I honestly don't care what position they play, other than K/P, I want the most NFL ready player with my first pick.  All this talk about how you don't take a S that high is just ridiculous to me.  If a S is the most NFL ready, difference making player in the draft then you take him.  You don't pass on him because of some unwritten rule and allow a team behind you to get him.  That's just stupid in my opinion.  That's how teams stay bottom feeders in the NFL.

 

[Christo]

I honestly don't care what position they play, other than K/P, I want the most NFL ready player with my first pick.  All this talk about how you don't take a S that high is just ridiculous to me.  If a S is the most NFL ready, difference making player in the draft then you take him.  You don't pass on him because of some unwritten rule and allow a team behind you to get him.  That's just stupid in my opinion.  That's how teams stay bottom feeders in the NFL.

Right, at #3 you take the best player available.

 

[flapgreen]

I honestly don't care what position they play, other than K/P, I want the most NFL ready player with my first pick.  All this talk about how you don't take a S that high is just ridiculous to me.  If a S is the most NFL ready, difference making player in the draft then you take him.  You don't pass on him because of some unwritten rule and allow a team behind you to get him.  That's just stupid in my opinion.  That's how teams stay bottom feeders in the NFL.

It's not an unwritten rule. Safeties don't ever not get drafted in the top 5 because of an unwritten rule. It's positional value and about taking players that make the biggest impact on the game. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

It's not an unwritten rule. Safeties don't ever not get drafted in the top 5 because of an unwritten rule. It's positional value and about taking players that make the biggest impact on the game. 

I get that but if a safety just happens to be the biggest impact player in the draft why wouldn't you take him.  I get that the QB position is the most important position but if the guys in the draft are not considered to be good enough to start right away why take them.  If that safety is considered to be the best player in the draft and be a difference maker on day one then I want him over a QB that may never start just because "safeties never go that high in the draft."

I'm saying this hypothetically of course.  I'm not saying that I actually believe that's what they should do this year.  I'm just saying that if the Bears feel that way then they should do it and ignore all the crap about how certain positions never get taken that high.

 

[Interseptopus]

I get that but if a safety just happens to be the biggest impact player in the draft why wouldn't you take him.  I get that the QB position is the most important position but if the guys in the draft are not considered to be good enough to start right away why take them.  If that safety is considered to be the best player in the draft and be a difference maker on day one then I want him over a QB that may never start just because "safeties never go that high in the draft."

I'm saying this hypothetically of course.  I'm not saying that I actually believe that's what they should do this year.  I'm just saying that if the Bears feel that way then they should do it and ignore all the crap about how certain positions never get taken that high.

I agree with this. 

Why waste a high draft pick on a player just because he's a QB, even though he may have to sit for a year or two, versus a Safety who can start day 1 and be the cornerstone of your defense for the next decade. 

This QB class is so incredibly weak if I'm Chicago I would pass and shore up your OL and Defense so that when you draft one of the QBs coming out for next year's excellent class that you can have a good cast around him so he doesn't get killed.

Especially when you consider how the rest of the division is getting better... it's very possible the Bears are drafting in the top 3, if not #1 next year. It'll be a fight with the Jets for that pick I think. And that pick will be the next big thing at QB IMO. Why not take a chance on that rather than Kizer, Trubisky, Watson. Even the QB3 next year's draft class is likely to be better than any of the QBs this draft. This year just screams QB Class 2016 rather than one of the better QB classes such as 2004. 

For the sake of GB I hope Chicago invests heavily in one of these QBs and sticks with him for 3-4 years and is doomed to another decade of obscurity. However for the sake of flap's sanity (long term) I hope they pass. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

I agree with this. 

Why waste a high draft pick on a player just because he's a QB, even though he may have to sit for a year or two, versus a Safety who can start day 1 and be the cornerstone of your defense for the next decade. 

This QB class is so incredibly weak if I'm Chicago I would pass and shore up your OL and Defense so that when you draft one of the QBs coming out for next year's excellent class that you can have a good cast around him so he doesn't get killed.

Especially when you consider how the rest of the division is getting better... it's very possible the Bears are drafting in the top 3, if not #1 next year. It'll be a fight with the Jets for that pick I think. And that pick will be the next big thing at QB IMO. Why not take a chance on that rather than Kizer, Trubisky, Watson. Even the QB3 next year's draft class is likely to be better than any of the QBs this draft. This year just screams QB Class 2016 rather than one of the better QB classes such as 2004. 

For the sake of GB I hope Chicago invests heavily in one of these QBs and sticks with him for 3-4 years and is doomed to another decade of obscurity. However for the sake of flap's sanity (long term) I hope they pass. 

I don't think the Bears draft in the top 5 next year.  I see them as a 6 win team.

 

[Interseptopus]

I don't think the Bears draft in the top 5 next year.  I see them as a 6 win team.

I don't know... like I said the division is getting tougher; they could go 0-9 in the division

Then they play: 
ATL
CAR
CLE
PIT
BAL
CIN
NO
TB
PHI (They play the last place NFC east team from 2016 I think)
SF (Last place from NFC West) 

Off that list I'm not sure there's 6 teams they beat. In fact, 5 of those teams could be playoff teams, and 2 of their divisional opponents could be playoff teams, giving them 9 games versus playoff teams. 

That means they'd have to beat:
CLE
BAL
CIN
NO
PHI
SF
Split with MIN

I'm not real sure that happens. I can see them being a 2-14 team next year easily. flapper might have to check into a psych ward (love you flapper! all in good fun)
 

 

[Hawkeye21]

I don't think GB or Det are getting much better.  How are the Packers getting better?

 

[Interseptopus]

I don't think GB or Det are getting much better.  How are the Packers getting better?

Offense:
RB: We were fine by the end of the year without Lacy, I imagine we will draft someone and have a 1-2 punch.  This is a wash from the same group that got us to the NFC Championship last year. 
OL: Losing Lang is a big deal but we can do some musical chairs and be just fine and/or draft someone round 1-2. 
TE: Bennett/Kendricks >>> Cook/Rodgers
The rest of our offense is status quo

Defensively we were really banged up last year. Martinez, Ryan, Matthews all had their fair share of injuries. Our CBs will be better with House and a draft selection. Our DL was pretty solid.

I wouldn't go as far as to say GB is making great strides in the offseason but their outlook this year is much better than last year. They made it to the NFC Championship game playing a bunch of no namers at LB and CB. They're very young on defense and you would have to imagine at least 1-2 of them would take the next step along development. Ryan was just declared the third most improved of 2nd year players last season: here. He has great potential. Martinez played awesome as a rookie last year and unfortunately got hurt. "Blake and Jake" are going to be what people know GB's defense for, not Clay Matthews. 


As far as Detroit goes... I don't know how you can look at their offseason and say they haven't gotten better. If you say GB's OL got worse by losing Lang then you must say DET's OL has gotten better by adding him. Defensively they have Slay and added Hayden. That's crazy good... their defense is young and incredibly promising. I'm quite worried about Detroit as a Packer fan TBH. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

I just look at the Lions and Packers and see more of the same.  That's not saying their bad but I just don't see how they're much better.  Rodgers and Jordy are still great but for how much longer?  Their defense hasn't been anything special.

I look at last year when the Bears had the worst team I've ever seen and they should have beaten the Packers and did beat the Lions.  Two of their three wins last year were division games and I don't see that changing this year.

 

[Interseptopus]

I just look at the Lions and Packers and see more of the same.  That's not saying their bad but I just don't see how they're much better.  Rodgers and Jordy are still great but for how much longer?  Their defense hasn't been anything special.

I look at last year when the Bears had the worst team I've ever seen and they should have beaten the Packers and did beat the Lions.  Two of their three wins last year were division games and I don't see that changing this year.

Both are 32-33... A lot of the great QBs played into their late 30s. I would argue this chart would say Jordy has another 2 years left. I fully expect GB to draft a WR somewhere in this draft to eventually climb the depth chart. Geronimo, Adams, and any rookie they get could very possibly be the future of GB. Cobb is only 26

defensively, they ranked 8th against the run. It's against the pass that they need desperate help. And I think that comes from healthy LBs and an overhaul at CB

 

[Hawkeye21]

Both are 32-33... A lot of the great QBs played into their late 30s. I would argue this chart would say Jordy has another 2 years left. I fully expect GB to draft a WR somewhere in this draft to eventually climb the depth chart. Geronimo, Adams, and any rookie they get could very possibly be the future of GB. Cobb is only 26

It's possible but it's also possible the Bears play much better too.  So, looking at their team right now I don't see too much to be scared of.  Overall I don't think their team is that great but they have the one major key to success and that's Rodgers.  Without him I think the Packers are an average team.

 

[Interseptopus]

It's possible but it's also possible the Bears play much better too.  So, looking at their team right now I don't see too much to be scared of.  Overall I don't think their team is that great but they have the one major key to success and that's Rodgers.  Without him I think the Packers are an average team.

parity in the NFL is awesome

You are correct, without Rodgers the Packers are a losing team. I wouldn't even say average. 6-10, 7-9 at best. 

 

[flapgreen]

Per @BradBiggs, Bears will hold a private workout with DeShone Kizer. Private workouts are much better when evaluating a QB than a Pro Day

 

[flapgreen]

Per Greg Gabriel, an actual former scouting director for Bears:

DeShone Kizer won't be the first QB drafted, maybe not the 2nd, but in 3 years he will be the best QB to come out of this class. Book it! In 2014 I wrote that Derek Carr was hands down the best QB in that class. I feel the same away about Kizer this year

 

[Interseptopus]

Per Greg Gabriel, an actual former scouting director for Bears:

DeShone Kizer won't be the first QB drafted, maybe not the 2nd, but in 3 years he will be the best QB to come out of this class. Book it! In 2014 I wrote that Derek Carr was hands down the best QB in that class. I feel the same away about Kizer this year

I held the same opinion that Carr was the best QB in that class as well. Kizer is also the best in this class. I would be surprised to see him not be the 1st or 2nd QB taken just because Trubisky seems to have hurt his value, but I think he is stilleven better than people think. Watson may be taken first (which I believe he is most likely to bust) but I would be surprised if Kizer fell that far. Would be a huge steal for the Bears in the 2nd round, and especially 3rd if he falls even to them round 3. 

I think this will be a draft where you'll see 1, maybe 2 teams trade back into the last couple picks of round 1 to grab one of these QBs

 

[Limp Ditka]

Finally this franchise makes a bold move and signs Mark Sanchez.

 

[William Munny]

Finally this franchise makes a bold move and signs Mark Sanchez.

Would've been bolder if they signed FC42. 

 

[William Munny]

I think this will be a draft where you'll see 1, maybe 2 teams trade back into the last couple picks of round 1 to grab one of these QBs

That's the move if Kizer is still around in the 20s. No brainer. No chance Trubisky or Watson fall that far. 

 

[KCitons]

Finally this franchise makes a bold move and signs Mark Sanchez.

Still love my Bears. But this one makes my stomach turn.

 

[flapgreen]

Smh. I'm just not gonna comment any on this. 

 

[tdmills]

Outside of some analysts saying this, I'm not sure how you could know this.  If you look at a lot of the earlier mock drafts from some of these guys, they have two qbs going in the first three picks. Now, no qbs are in the top three picks. That should tip you off. No games have been played but somehow the mocks are changing. These guys are clueless. If Pace doesn't take one of these guys and the Bears continue to flounder, Pace will be jobless. No one will look back and say nothing none of it was his fault because he  didn't  have the opportunity to get a good qb. Not how it works. 

Well nobody "knows" what will happen with any of these prospects. David Terrell was the "safest pick in the draft" and we know how that one turned out. From what i've studied(I coached D1 college QBs) I don't see any of these QBs worth a top 3 pick. Drafting a QB just to draft a QB didn't work out well for Buffalo when they took EJ Manuel.

I want Chicago to take Myles Garrett, Soloman Thomas, trade down, Jamal Adams.

-Thomas is exactly what Chicago needs to continue to put pressure on QBs in this division and help our weak secondary. Trading down in a deep draft would give them more picks to address all the weaknesses on this team. Adams would fix the bandaid which has been the safety position in Chicago for a long time. 

See what Glennon is for 1 year, if he's terrible. Draft or trade the farm to move up to get Rosen or Allen in 2018.

 

[flapgreen]

Trading the farm goes completely against what Pace preaches. 

 

[flapgreen]

Adams is a SS.  If you're going to draft a DB in the top 10, it better be Lattimore.  If they're just dead set on getting a safety after getting lucky and trading down, Hooker is the guy.  He's the top FS in the draft. 

 

[JNox3]

Can we get Theo to take over for the Bears as well?   He couldn't do any worse

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Still love my Bears. But this one makes my stomach turn.

I honestly think you guys will change your opinion once you see his leadership and attitude during the offseason and into camp.

 

[flapgreen]

The Bears move on from Cutler and leave themselves with Glennon, Shaw, and Sanchez.  Move on from Marshall, Bennett, and Alshon and leave themselves with Meredith, White, and Miller.  

I'm not sure what Pace is doing here but giving him the "rebuild" excuse will run out soon.  There's less talent and he's signed a bunch of guys with a long injury history to an already injury-riddled roster. Even if Fox was a great coach, he's being put in an impossible spot to win. Fangio knew that, which is why he wanted out.  This is not a plan that looks good. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

Trading the farm goes completely against what Pace preaches. 

Very rarely does a team come out on top from trading up like that.  It usually hurts the team more long term than anything.  I hope Pace never does that.

Can we get Theo to take over for the Bears as well?   He couldn't do any worse

So basically you want the Bears to do what the Browns are doing.  They are pretty much using the "moneyball" technique right now.  I think it will eventually work as soon as they have a decent coaching staff put together to coach up all the talent they keep drafting.

 

[Hawkeye21]

The signing of Sanchez is basically a move to bring in a capable back up that will help mentor a rookie QB.  The move tells me they are serious about drafting a QB this year.  Apparently Sanchez was a key part to Dak's success in Dallas last year.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

The signing of Sanchez is basically a move to bring in a capable back up that will help mentor a rookie QB.  The move tells me they are serious about drafting a QB this year.  Apparently Sanchez was a key part to Dak's success in Dallas last year.

Like I said, he's not the greatest QB in the world, but he is one of the greatest teammates, leaders and mentors around. He may have been a great QB as well if Rex Ryan didn't literally ruin him physically and mentally.

 

[flapgreen]

The signing of Sanchez is basically a move to bring in a capable back up that will help mentor a rookie QB.  The move tells me they are serious about drafting a QB this year.  Apparently Sanchez was a key part to Dak's success in Dallas last year.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/columnists/ct-sanchez-signing-bears-haugh-spt-20170324-column.html

 

[JNox3]

So basically you want the Bears to do what the Browns are doing.  They are pretty much using the "moneyball" technique right now.  I think it will eventually work as soon as they have a decent coaching staff put together to coach up all the talent they keep drafting.

One big difference, the Bears have no farm team full of talent to pull from and are lacking in talent imo

 

[Hawkeye21]

One big difference, the Bears have no farm team full of talent to pull from and are lacking in talent imo

I wasn't saying they could do what the Cubs are doing but the Browns are using a similar strategy that's used in baseball.  They just showed it when they made that Osweiler move.

 

[flapgreen]

Bears: "We can do better than Jay Cutler at QB"

*Signs Mark Sanchez and Mike Glennon https://t.co/S6pxbx75ZE

 

[Hawkeye21]

Bears: "We can do better than Jay Cutler at QB"

*Signs Mark Sanchez and Mike Glennon https://t.co/S6pxbx75ZE

To be fair, I don't think they planned on doing better than Jay through FA.  I'm pretty sure the goal is to fix that position through the draft only.

 

[tdmills]

Trading the farm goes completely against what Pace preaches. 

He almost traded up for Mariota, so

 

[Hawkeye21]

He almost traded up for Mariota, so

Those were the rumors.  I was glad he didn't at the time.  I'm not so sure at the moment now but they already don't have a lot of draft picks.

 

[tdmills]

Very rarely does a team come out on top from trading up like that.  It usually hurts the team more long term than anything.  I hope Pace never does that.

So basically you want the Bears to do what the Browns are doing.  They are pretty much using the "moneyball" technique right now.  I think it will eventually work as soon as they have a decent coaching staff put together to coach up all the talent they keep drafting.

Only ones I can remember off hand

It worked

Giants trade #5 overall, 3rd rounder, future 1st, 5th rounder for Eli Manning = 2 super bowl rings

Didn't work

RGIII

I'm fine with Chicago continually loading up on talent. But i'm against them drafting a QB at #3 to draft a QB because it's a QB and QB is the most important positions and you need a franchise QB.  But if Glennon is trash and they could give up 2 1sts and other smaller picks to get Josh Rosen or Josh Allen, do it.

 

[flapgreen]

Again, there's no way to know the differences between Rosen/Allen and the top 3 qbs coming out of this draft yet. Taking chance on one of those guys being better next year and giving more picks to do so, while not just using your one first round pick this year to take a qb makes no sense. Allen would've came out this year if he was better at this point. 

 

[Interseptopus]

Again, there's no way to know the differences between Rosen/Allen and the top 3 qbs coming out of this draft yet. Taking chance on one of those guys being better next year and giving more picks to do so, while not just using your one first round pick this year to take a qb makes no sense. Allen would've came out this year if he was better at this point. 

True. If he were better he'd be the #1 QB taken. There'd be no incentive to stay unless he just really really didn't want to be a Brown/49er/Bear. Then he's hoping a different bad team is at the top next year. Which is just dumb but I know some QBs have done this in the past. 

 

[jagbag]

Sanchez was signed as a BACKUP QB not a starter. If he was signed as a starter I'd be #######' livid.

Did you actually think there was a QB left on the market that was going to take us to the playoffs ?  Hell no.

If so, he would have been the starter.

Take around the league, how many good backup QB's are out there. Not a whole lot lot.

Am I happy with what we have as a team ? Hell no. Does Sanchez make us a worse team ? I doubt it.

Are there any other backup QB's that are going to make a difference ? I highly doubt it.

 

[flapgreen]

Sanchez was signed as a BACKUP QB not a starter. If he was signed as a starter I'd be #######' livid.

Did you actually think there was a QB left on the market that was going to take us to the playoffs ?  Hell no.

If so, he would have been the starter.

Take around the league, how many good backup QB's are out there. Not a whole lot lot.

Am I happy with what we have as a team ? Hell no. Does Sanchez make us a worse team ? I doubt it.

Are there any other backup QB's that are going to make a difference ? I highly doubt it.

This is a rambling mess with no point. 

 

[rschroeder1]

Perhaps my fears regarding Sanchez are unfounded.  As a mentor for a young QB, makes complete sense.  However, I fear the conflicting motives between John Fox and Ryan Pace.

I am skeptical that Fox was really the #1 candidate Pace wanted to hire in the 2015 offseason.  After the Trestman debacle, I would not be surprised if the McCaskeys leaned on Pace to go for the "safe" hire.  So here we are today:  is Fox coaching for his job in '17?  And if he is, will he be tempted to use Sanchez, the veteran?  I fear a short leash for Glennon, and in case of an injury to Glennon, the loss of a developmental opportunity for someone like Connor Shaw (I have no reason to believe he's anything, but can it hurt?).

Hopefully I'm just a delusional fan.

 

[Gustavo Fring]

If he can buttfumble our way to the first pick in the draft next year, it's a good signing.  I'd much rather have Sanchez and go 1-15 than Glennon and go 5-11 or 6-10 with a no chance at one of the stud QBs next year.  It's going to be a tough year no matter what as a Bears fan, so I'd much rather see them tank to try and get one of the top 2 QBs next year, so we at least have some hope of a brighter future sooner rather than later.  

 

[Village Idiot]

The same conversation all of you are having regarding taking a QB with your 1st pick, is the same conversation going on at another site in a Browns thread.

Some are arguing you can't usually get a great QB unless you draft one high (yeah lol Brady there are always exceptions), and the counter argument is this years crop isn't all that great, don't over draft and get someone to help fill the other gajillion holes. 

 

[ZWK]

The Sanchez signing seems fine. He is one of the top 60 QBs in the NFL, so he should be the backup QB on some team. And his $2M salary is reasonable for a backup QB.

 

[flapgreen]

The mentoring justification makes zero sense. Mentor who?! A possible rookie qb who's 3rd string? So Glennon is starting while Dirty Sanchez is mentoring a rookie on the bench? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.