***Chicago Bears Thread*** Ben Johnson hired. The Resurrection Begins! (9 Viewers)

[Chreesto]

It's not out of the realm of possibility for a likely #1 player to not want to play in a specific market. The precedent is there multiple times over. It also lends some credence to the idea that LVR is making staff and player moves to trade up to the #1 spot to take Caleb. It's all speculation and click bait at this point, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Bears do trade down from #1 and if that trade package isn't quite as good as it should be, you can bet that it's because he refused to play in CHI.

In the event that he issued some sort of ultimatum to the Bears, he would reveal himself as a player I wouldn't want anyway. I think star Qbs don't think like that. I suspect, though, that this is all much ado about nothing. As someone else mentioned, it's totally normal to not want to end up in a given city, that is not the same as refusing to play in a city. I suspect that if Caleb Williams came to Chigago, he would very quickly learn to love the city, and if he were to be a top-10 QB, there is no city in the world that would love him more. I don't know that Michael Jordan or Walter Payton were especially thrilled to come to Chicago but they are celebrated like the saints of michigan avenue. I haven't been to Chicago in years, but I suspect that very few cities can equal the mania of the Bears fanbase.

Make no mistake. It has zero to do with the city and everything to do with ownership/coaching. The Bears have set a terrible precedent in the way they hire/fire coaching staff because ownership has been way too slow to make moves. If Flus is fired after 2024, it'll be the 3rd time in a row that they've drafted a high round rookie QB with a lame duck coach in place.

ALso to you first point, John Elway and Eli Manning both refused to play for certain organizations that were planning to draft them. Elway is in the HoF and I'd imagine Eli will make it in as well.

Forgot to mention that I think that sometimes we jump from correlation to causation too quickly. The opinion of a franchise can shift drastically, once they start winning. While I agree that the Bears have been a nightmare, if they were to suddenly have a couple of consecutive winning seasons, people would have a totally different opinion. The bengals became overnight contenders once they had burrow and chase, before that, it was widely considered one of, if not THE, worst ownership groups around. Good players can fix a bad organization, it is just not common for bad organizations to find them.

 

[Max Power]

Totally understand someone dismissing Cowherd. Its a rumor during rumor season. That said... Cowherd does have USC connections so it shouldn't be outright dismissed. The Score staff texted Williams' father about the rumor and he texted back "no comment". Which also doesn't put anyone's concerns at ease.

Cowherd didn't even say he heard it from someone at USC.

https://twitter.com/dave_bfr/status/1753477548917272860?t=_xpJob5cN_6drW1HFS6ymg&s=19

And the family called him out by the way. But what a shock, nobody is as interested in the clarification.

All anyone remembers is the accusation.

This happened a couple hours ago, its not like we're ignoring it. It was a reported rumor that could have had legs. It apparently doesn't... so we're moving on.

 

[Sunday Gravy]

I can see the worry about the lame duck head coach. But this Bears team is much better than the usual first pick team. D is on the cusp of something special, they've got a very good number one receiver and tight end, and a few good pieces on the line. I don't think anyone would be shocked if the Bears were in the playoffs next season.

 

[flapgreen]

Totally understand someone dismissing Cowherd. Its a rumor during rumor season. That said... Cowherd does have USC connections so it shouldn't be outright dismissed. The Score staff texted Williams' father about the rumor and he texted back "no comment". Which also doesn't put anyone's concerns at ease.

Cowherd didn't even say he heard it from someone at USC.

https://twitter.com/dave_bfr/status/1753477548917272860?t=_xpJob5cN_6drW1HFS6ymg&s=19

And the family called him out by the way. But what a shock, nobody is as interested in the clarification.

All anyone remembers is the accusation.

I really just need to turn off sports radio and mute the twitter talking heads until the draft.

Outside of a couple buddies who retweet stuff, I hardly follow any sports guys anymore. Just loud mouth morons like Cowherd trying to generate interest. Huge dork

 

[flapgreen]

I can see the worry about the lame duck head coach. But this Bears team is much better than the usual first pick team. D is on the cusp of something special, they've got a very good number one receiver and tight end, and a few good pieces on the line. I don't think anyone would be shocked if the Bears were in the playoffs next season.

I would be shocked when they ever make the playoffs, but I do agree that they're better than most teams that have picked 1st.

 

[FairWarning]

Totally understand someone dismissing Cowherd. Its a rumor during rumor season. That said... Cowherd does have USC connections so it shouldn't be outright dismissed. The Score staff texted Williams' father about the rumor and he texted back "no comment". Which also doesn't put anyone's concerns at ease.

Cowherd didn't even say he heard it from someone at USC.

https://twitter.com/dave_bfr/status/1753477548917272860?t=_xpJob5cN_6drW1HFS6ymg&s=19

And the family called him out by the way. But what a shock, nobody is as interested in the clarification.

All anyone remembers is the accusation.

I really just need to turn off sports radio and mute the twitter talking heads until the draft.

I did that with thr SB hype, it helps clear the mind.

 

[Max Power]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

 

[ericttspikes]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

 

[Max Power]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

 

[Chreesto]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

I agree that Williams is the pick. It would be just like the Bears to overthink this. That said, if they like Maye, I would entertain an offer to trade down one spot, but it would need to be better than #40 and a 2025 1st. I would listen to any offers, but only take an offer that was overwhelmingly lopsided in the Bears favor. If they can trade Fields for a 2nd (and maybe a 4th?), they have a chance to really load up in a draft that has a lot of talent in key positions of need without trading back. I would also really consider dropping from #9 if Bowers, odunze, and nabers are gone.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

We really won't know the gap between Williams and Daniels/Maye until after the combine if any of the 3 choose to attend and actually do something. I wouldn't be opposed to a trade down to #2 or further and taking Daniels. My suspicion is that Williams goes 1, Daniels will go 2/3 and Maye will go in the middle of the 1st. Nix and McCarthy can do themselves big favors at the combine and possibly jump Maye as QB3 taken.

 

[ericttspikes]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

I guess the Bears just have to keep firing shots until they hit. In my 54 years I haven't seen them hit yet. McMahon was the closest but he wasn't a generational talent or anything. History has shown taking the consensus QB has tremendous risk too. Hoping Waldron can evaluate QBs better than anyone in Halas Hall has over the past half century.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

I guess the Bears just have to keep firing shots until they hit. In my 54 years I haven't seen them hit yet. McMahon was the closest but he wasn't a generational talent or anything. History has shown taking the consensus QB has tremendous risk too. Hoping Waldron can evaluate QBs better than anyone in Halas Hall has over the past half century.

You made me go back and look. The Bears have drafted 6 1st round QBs since 1960. (Fields, Trubs, Grossman, McNown, Harbaugh, and McMahon). That seems like an awful few chances at a franchise QB given the abysmal QB play since then.

 

[ZWK]

They also traded firsts for Jay Cutler, Rick Mirer, and Mike Phipps.

 

[ericttspikes]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

I guess the Bears just have to keep firing shots until they hit. In my 54 years I haven't seen them hit yet. McMahon was the closest but he wasn't a generational talent or anything. History has shown taking the consensus QB has tremendous risk too. Hoping Waldron can evaluate QBs better than anyone in Halas Hall has over the past half century.

You made me go back and look. The Bears have drafted 6 1st round QBs since 1960. (Fields, Trubs, Grossman, McNown, Harbaugh, and McMahon). That seems like an awful few chances at a franchise QB given the abysmal QB play since then.

I think the Browns have the same number and a worse record over that time frame, so sounds about right. They are equally as good at whiffing at QB.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Rumor of the week appears to be Washington trading up to #1 for Williams.

Most floated idea is #2, #40 and 2025 first for #1. I think I'm a no at price although I admit it is a fair offer.

Unless Bears believe Williams is Mahomes and cannot bust, that's a no-brainer IMO.

Williams is the best QB prospect in the draft and I think there is a big gap between him and Daniels or Maye. If the Bears go QB it needs to be Williams. To me that gap is bigger than the #40 pick and a 25 first (which I'd guess falls in the 8-15 range).

I'd be disappointed taking a QB @2. I also don't think MHjr is a tier better than Nabers. Trading down 4-6 spots and getting more future assets feels like the better value to me.

I guess the Bears just have to keep firing shots until they hit. In my 54 years I haven't seen them hit yet. McMahon was the closest but he wasn't a generational talent or anything. History has shown taking the consensus QB has tremendous risk too. Hoping Waldron can evaluate QBs better than anyone in Halas Hall has over the past half century.

You made me go back and look. The Bears have drafted 6 1st round QBs since 1960. (Fields, Trubs, Grossman, McNown, Harbaugh, and McMahon). That seems like an awful few chances at a franchise QB given the abysmal QB play since then.

I think the Browns have the same number and a worse record over that time frame, so sounds about right. They are equally as good a whiffing at QB.

Correct.

 

[Max Power]

They also traded firsts for Jay Cutler, Rick Mirer, and Mike Phipps.

Ah Rick Mirer... There’s a blast from the past that was so short lived I had forgotten about that horrible trade.

 

[flapgreen]

There's no need to trade down and get more picks when they need a QB. The Bears don't have a barren roster and will have another pick at 9 and likely a second rounder for Fields. Draft Williams and keep building the trenches. It's easy.

 

[flapgreen]

Priot to last year, when was the last time the Bears had the opportunity to take the top qb in a draft? I really can't remember. Now, they will have had 2 consecutive drafts with that opportunity. They did the right thing and traded back last year. The right thing is taking a qb this year. If you can't build a team with 2 consecutive top picks in the draft, then it really doesn't matter what else you do.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Priot to last year, when was the last time the Bears had the opportunity to take the top qb in a draft? I really can't remember. Now, they will have had 2 consecutive drafts with that opportunity. They did the right thing and traded back last year. The right thing is taking a qb this year. If you can't build a team with 2 consecutive top picks in the draft, then it really doesn't matter what else you do.

Cleveland says, "hold my beer".

 

[ChiefD]

Priot to last year, when was the last time the Bears had the opportunity to take the top qb in a draft? I really can't remember. Now, they will have had 2 consecutive drafts with that opportunity. They did the right thing and traded back last year. The right thing is taking a qb this year. If you can't build a team with 2 consecutive top picks in the draft, then it really doesn't matter what else you do.

They had the chance in the Mahomes draft when they took Trubisky.

If they don't draft a QB NOW, when are you gonna? That would be three drafts in 6 years where you had a chance at a franchise guy and chose either not to try or pick the wrong guy.

THIS is the draft to do it. It's now or never Bears. If they trade down again they deserve every bit of scorn they receive.

 

[Max Power]

Priot to last year, when was the last time the Bears had the opportunity to take the top qb in a draft? I really can't remember. Now, they will have had 2 consecutive drafts with that opportunity. They did the right thing and traded back last year. The right thing is taking a qb this year. If you can't build a team with 2 consecutive top picks in the draft, then it really doesn't matter what else you do.

They had the chance in the Mahomes draft when they took Trubisky.

If they don't draft a QB NOW, when are you gonna? That would be three drafts in 6 years where you had a chance at a franchise guy and chose either not to try or pick the wrong guy.

THIS is the draft to do it. It's now or never Bears. If they trade down again they deserve every bit of scorn they receive.

The Bears pick the wrong guy or fail to develop a QB on the regular. At least with a haul of picks its harder to screw them all up. We're used to it. If the Bears screw this up we'll just be back here in a couple years still trying to figure it out.

 

[ericttspikes]

Priot to last year, when was the last time the Bears had the opportunity to take the top qb in a draft? I really can't remember. Now, they will have had 2 consecutive drafts with that opportunity. They did the right thing and traded back last year. The right thing is taking a qb this year. If you can't build a team with 2 consecutive top picks in the draft, then it really doesn't matter what else you do.

They had the chance in the Mahomes draft when they took Trubisky.

If they don't draft a QB NOW, when are you gonna? That would be three drafts in 6 years where you had a chance at a franchise guy and chose either not to try or pick the wrong guy.

THIS is the draft to do it. It's now or never Bears. If they trade down again they deserve every bit of scorn they receive.

The Bears pick the wrong guy or fail to develop a QB on the regular. At least with a haul of picks its harder to screw them all up. We're used to it. If the Bears screw this up we'll just be back here in a couple years still trying to figure it out.

Right. My question is; are the Bears a Caleb Williams aways from turning the program around and competing for championships? My gut says no. I think Caleb Williams can be a good NFL QB in the right situation. I'm not convinced the Bears are the best situation for him to succeed. Some of the positives I hear about taking Williams is that he's young and will be cheaper than Fields. So? What if he continues to fumble and turn it over at the next level? Are the Bears really going to compete with the ascending teams in the North with a rookie QB thrown out there day 1? He'd really have to produce like Stroud did last year for this team to take a jump, and that is a 40/60 proposition at best IMO. The Bears really don't have the luxury of blowing this pick. If they can trade it and get a 2025 #1 plus a bunch of good picks, and maybe players, this year I think they have to take it. They aren't good enough not to.

 

[Max Power]

Priot to last year, when was the last time the Bears had the opportunity to take the top qb in a draft? I really can't remember. Now, they will have had 2 consecutive drafts with that opportunity. They did the right thing and traded back last year. The right thing is taking a qb this year. If you can't build a team with 2 consecutive top picks in the draft, then it really doesn't matter what else you do.

They had the chance in the Mahomes draft when they took Trubisky.

If they don't draft a QB NOW, when are you gonna? That would be three drafts in 6 years where you had a chance at a franchise guy and chose either not to try or pick the wrong guy.

THIS is the draft to do it. It's now or never Bears. If they trade down again they deserve every bit of scorn they receive.

The Bears pick the wrong guy or fail to develop a QB on the regular. At least with a haul of picks its harder to screw them all up. We're used to it. If the Bears screw this up we'll just be back here in a couple years still trying to figure it out.

Right. My question is; are the Bears a Caleb Williams aways from turning the program around and competing for championships? My gut says no. I think Caleb Williams can be a good NFL QB in the right situation. I'm not convinced the Bears are the best situation for him to succeed. Some of the positives I hear about taking Williams is that he's young and will be cheaper than Fields. So? What if he continues to fumble and turn it over at the next level? Are the Bears really going to compete with the ascending teams in the North with a rookie QB thrown out there day 1? He'd really have to produce like Stroud did last year for this team to take a jump, and that is a 40/60 proposition at best IMO. The Bears really don't have the luxury of blowing this pick. If they can trade it and get a 2025 #1 plus a bunch of good picks, and maybe players, this year I think they have to take it. They aren't good enough not to.

At the end of the day I don't love Justin Fields. I think he has been mishandled by the Bears and has more potential than he has shown so far. I think his teammates have faith in him which is a big vote of confidence in my book. I'd like to see what he can do with a different OC and more weapons.

That said if I had start my Franchise from scratch with Caleb or JF, I'm taking Caleb all day long. I think he has more upside, but also has a small but real bust risk.

I think what sways me will ultimately be the package that is offered. If its too good to pass up, I'm all for taking it. If Poles says Caleb is the next coming, I support that and don't think I'd settle for anything less the biggest haul in NFL history.

 

[Sunday Gravy]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

 

[Max Power]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

 

[Max Power]

Rome Odunze has done a couple interviews with Chicago Media personalities, and I like how the kid comes across. He seems like a good person and a guy you really want to root for. I still think he is the #3 WR in the draft, but would love the Bears to pick him at #9.

My #9 preferences in order are Odunze, Bowers, Turner, trade down, Alt/Fashanu, Verse/Latu

 

[Sunday Gravy]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

He's going before Daniels. Will be a lock after the evaluations. Maye is a special talent.

 

[Max Power]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

He's going before Daniels. Will be a lock after the evaluations. Maye is a special talent.

I've watched a couple UNC games and some tape on Maye and I don't see it. His W-L isn't great. Record vs top 25 teams is horrible. He had the 35th best QBR in the NCAA last season.

Yes he has the size and tools to be a good QB. Calling him special is a reach imo. He might be better than Daniels, but Daniels is coming off an amazing season. Maye isn't. I can see that tilting the scales to Daniels.

 

[Sunday Gravy]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

He's going before Daniels. Will be a lock after the evaluations. Maye is a special talent.

I've watched a couple UNC games and some tape on Maye and I don't see it. His W-L isn't great. Record vs top 25 teams is horrible. He had the 35th best QBR in the NCAA last season.

Yes he has the size and tools to be a good QB. Calling him special is a reach imo. He might be better than Daniels, but Daniels is coming off an amazing season. Maye isn't. I can see that tilting the scales to Daniels.

You're putting way too much stock into team factors. NC was bad. He had nobody to throw to. Daniels was throwing to what will probably be two first round receivers.

You know who didn't have a great year either... Caleb.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

He's going before Daniels. Will be a lock after the evaluations. Maye is a special talent.

I've watched a couple UNC games and some tape on Maye and I don't see it. His W-L isn't great. Record vs top 25 teams is horrible. He had the 35th best QBR in the NCAA last season.

Yes he has the size and tools to be a good QB. Calling him special is a reach imo. He might be better than Daniels, but Daniels is coming off an amazing season. Maye isn't. I can see that tilting the scales to Daniels.

You're putting way too much stock into team factors. NC was bad. He had nobody to throw to. Daniels was throwing to what will probably be two first round receivers.

You know who didn't have a great year either... Caleb.

Maye didn't have a Heisman year either. Dude is athletic and has a big arm. His accuracy has been a big issue throughout his career. He barely hit top 50 in completion percentage (63%) in 2023. In 2023, with Josh Downs and all those WR weapons, he barely managed 66%. Maye could very well be coached up a ton, but he won't be a CJ Stroud / Justin Herbert kind of prospect that will come in and light up the league.

 

[Max Power]

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

He's going before Daniels. Will be a lock after the evaluations. Maye is a special talent.

I've watched a couple UNC games and some tape on Maye and I don't see it. His W-L isn't great. Record vs top 25 teams is horrible. He had the 35th best QBR in the NCAA last season.

Yes he has the size and tools to be a good QB. Calling him special is a reach imo. He might be better than Daniels, but Daniels is coming off an amazing season. Maye isn't. I can see that tilting the scales to Daniels.

You're putting way too much stock into team factors. NC was bad. He had nobody to throw to. Daniels was throwing to what will probably be two first round receivers.

You know who didn't have a great year either... Caleb.

UNC was a pre-season top 20 ranked Team. They had a Heisman candidate QB and a National Championship winning coach. That team had talent but played .500 ball in the weakest power 5 conference. A lot of that falls on Maye.

The same way a lot of the Bears struggles fall on Fields. You're quick to point at JFs stats as why he isn't good so I'm applying the same philosophy to Maye.

Williams for all his faults still had a pretty impressive year. It just wasnt as good as his Heisman year so it gets discounted.

Its fair to chalk a lot of Daniels success up to his WRs. I full believe those two made him look better than he is.

 

[Chreesto]

Turne

Maye is closer to Williams than a lot of you think. I've heard multiple times this week from Vegas that if Williams was not in this draft, Maye would be the clear one pick. He absolutely deserves to get a fair evaluation in case Washington really brings the heat.

I'm not scout, but have watched every single college snap he's taken (both live and on TV). I'm telling you he's not the guy. I'll eat crow all day long if he ends up a high level pro, but from what I've seen, especially vs well schemed defenses, he won't.

I don't even think its a lock that Maye goes before Daniels. Maye's stock is dipping because he's been out of the spotlight for a while now and hasn't played a meaningful game since Thanksgiving.

Teams will like his "tools" more than his tape. I'm not sure if that method ever works out.

I think Josh Allen is the poster child for toolsy QBs. Because of his success, teams are, once again, fixating on top-tier tools as a high priority, possibly even over tape. I think Anthony Richardson was taken early based on this idea.

 

[ffmail4me]

With the talk about Maye struggling vs better competition, just curious if someone has similar data on Josh Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert did in college? Just wondering hasn't there been several other QBs who just got a lot better in the pros than what they showed in college?

 

[Sunday Gravy]

Good evaluation here

https://x.com/chgo_bears/status/1755256650435612868?s=46&t=Il7gWzDI28ydPLvuwjGM6Q

 

[Max Power]

With the talk about Maye struggling vs better competition, just curious if someone has similar data on Josh Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert did in college? Just wondering hasn't there been several other QBs who just got a lot better in the pros than what they showed in college?

I have nothing on Josh Allen. He is a great example of a tools guy and I didn't know who he was until the lead up to the draft.

Mahomes was statistically very good in college, but played in an "air-raid" style offense. I think he had a losing record overall in college.

Herbert did fine at Oregon. He was 29-13 overall with a PAC-12 Championship and Rose Bowl win.

 

[travdogg]

With the talk about Maye struggling vs better competition, just curious if someone has similar data on Josh Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert did in college? Just wondering hasn't there been several other QBs who just got a lot better in the pros than what they showed in college?

Mahomes was carrying an awful Texas Tech team. They lived and died 100% on him. He had some truly rough INT games due to that, which is arguably what made him fall to #10, but his top WRs were Keke Coutee and Jonathan Giles. Mahomes last season they played 3 ranked teams and went 0-3 in those games, though the defense gave up 45+ in all 3 games. Mahomes played well in 2 of those games, including the famous 66-59 shootout loss against Mayfield and the Sooners.

Josh Allen never really faced any tough competition at Wyoming. Oddly, Allen wasn't much of a rusher in college, so I'll take that as Wyoming having a pretty bad play caller, especially as there was no NFL talent around him.

Herbert had little around him skill position wise despite playing in the PAC-12. The only guy who has been an NFL player is Juwan Johnson. Herbert didn't play very well against tougher competition. He played 4 top-25 teams and had 1 good game in that stretch, though Oregon went 3-1 in those games anyway.

Drake Maye probably was a better player in college than any of those guys. He also had a lot more to work with talent wise, as Tez Walker is a likely day 2 pick, and Josh Downs looked pretty good as a rookie. That said, he certainly played worse in games against good teams.

For comparisons sake, Zach Wilson had little to throw to, but a good OL and Tyler Allgeier to hand off to, and he played well against tougher competition, so its debatable how much college performance matters, vs tools and intangibles.

 

[Chreesto]

With the talk about Maye struggling vs better competition, just curious if someone has similar data on Josh Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert did in college? Just wondering hasn't there been several other QBs who just got a lot better in the pros than what they showed in college?

Mahomes was carrying an awful Texas Tech team. They lived and died 100% on him. He had some truly rough INT games due to that, which is arguably what made him fall to #10, but his top WRs were Keke Coutee and Jonathan Giles. Mahomes last season they played 3 ranked teams and went 0-3 in those games, though the defense gave up 45+ in all 3 games. Mahomes played well in 2 of those games, including the famous 66-59 shootout loss against Mayfield and the Sooners.

Josh Allen never really faced any tough competition at Wyoming. Oddly, Allen wasn't much of a rusher in college, so I'll take that as Wyoming having a pretty bad play caller, especially as there was no NFL talent around him.

Herbert had little around him skill position wise despite playing in the PAC-12. The only guy who has been an NFL player is Juwan Johnson. Herbert didn't play very well against tougher competition. He played 4 top-25 teams and had 1 good game in that stretch, though Oregon went 3-1 in those games anyway.

Drake Maye probably was a better player in college than any of those guys. He also had a lot more to work with talent wise, as Tez Walker is a likely day 2 pick, and Josh Downs looked pretty good as a rookie. That said, he certainly played worse in games against good teams.

For comparisons sake, Zach Wilson had little to throw to, but a good OL and Tyler Allgeier to hand off to, and he played well against tougher competition, so its debatable how much college performance matters, vs tools and intangibles.

This post, and the others on this subject, are very good, but problematic. It seems like, when we think back to some of the best current QBs in the league, their performances were more drake maye and less jayden daniels. Then there are guys like Burrow, who played with great talent, and had great success, in college and are also great pros. I say it's problematic because, as a Bears fan, I want to believe that there is a way to make this choice correctly. I want to believe that some process exists that will get the Bears their gridiron messiah, these last posts make me think that it really is a crapshoot. It's going to be a long 7 months until the season, no matter what they do.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

With the talk about Maye struggling vs better competition, just curious if someone has similar data on Josh Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert did in college? Just wondering hasn't there been several other QBs who just got a lot better in the pros than what they showed in college?

Mahomes was carrying an awful Texas Tech team. They lived and died 100% on him. He had some truly rough INT games due to that, which is arguably what made him fall to #10, but his top WRs were Keke Coutee and Jonathan Giles. Mahomes last season they played 3 ranked teams and went 0-3 in those games, though the defense gave up 45+ in all 3 games. Mahomes played well in 2 of those games, including the famous 66-59 shootout loss against Mayfield and the Sooners.

Josh Allen never really faced any tough competition at Wyoming. Oddly, Allen wasn't much of a rusher in college, so I'll take that as Wyoming having a pretty bad play caller, especially as there was no NFL talent around him.

Herbert had little around him skill position wise despite playing in the PAC-12. The only guy who has been an NFL player is Juwan Johnson. Herbert didn't play very well against tougher competition. He played 4 top-25 teams and had 1 good game in that stretch, though Oregon went 3-1 in those games anyway.

Drake Maye probably was a better player in college than any of those guys. He also had a lot more to work with talent wise, as Tez Walker is a likely day 2 pick, and Josh Downs looked pretty good as a rookie. That said, he certainly played worse in games against good teams.

For comparisons sake, Zach Wilson had little to throw to, but a good OL and Tyler Allgeier to hand off to, and he played well against tougher competition, so its debatable how much college performance matters, vs tools and intangibles.

This post, and the others on this subject, are very good, but problematic. It seems like, when we think back to some of the best current QBs in the league, their performances were more drake maye and less jayden daniels. Then there are guys like Burrow, who played with great talent, and had great success, in college and are also great pros. I say it's problematic because, as a Bears fan, I want to believe that there is a way to make this choice correctly. I want to believe that some process exists that will get the Bears their gridiron messiah, these last posts make me think that it really is a crapshoot. It's going to be a long 7 months until the season, no matter what they do.

If there were a process, GMs would have figured it out by now. Unfortunately, working with actual humans makes it incredibly difficult to predict. Poles will make the best decision he can with all the information he can gather. That part, I'm sure of.

 

[Sunday Gravy]

With the talk about Maye struggling vs better competition, just curious if someone has similar data on Josh Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert did in college? Just wondering hasn't there been several other QBs who just got a lot better in the pros than what they showed in college?

Mahomes was carrying an awful Texas Tech team. They lived and died 100% on him. He had some truly rough INT games due to that, which is arguably what made him fall to #10, but his top WRs were Keke Coutee and Jonathan Giles. Mahomes last season they played 3 ranked teams and went 0-3 in those games, though the defense gave up 45+ in all 3 games. Mahomes played well in 2 of those games, including the famous 66-59 shootout loss against Mayfield and the Sooners.

Josh Allen never really faced any tough competition at Wyoming. Oddly, Allen wasn't much of a rusher in college, so I'll take that as Wyoming having a pretty bad play caller, especially as there was no NFL talent around him.

Herbert had little around him skill position wise despite playing in the PAC-12. The only guy who has been an NFL player is Juwan Johnson. Herbert didn't play very well against tougher competition. He played 4 top-25 teams and had 1 good game in that stretch, though Oregon went 3-1 in those games anyway.

Drake Maye probably was a better player in college than any of those guys. He also had a lot more to work with talent wise, as Tez Walker is a likely day 2 pick, and Josh Downs looked pretty good as a rookie. That said, he certainly played worse in games against good teams.

For comparisons sake, Zach Wilson had little to throw to, but a good OL and Tyler Allgeier to hand off to, and he played well against tougher competition, so its debatable how much college performance matters, vs tools and intangibles.

I say it's problematic because, as a Bears fan, I want to believe that there is a way to make this choice correctly. I want to believe that some process exists that will get the Bears their gridiron messiah, these last posts make me think that it really is a crapshoot. It's going to be a long 7 months until the season, no matter what they do.

Ha wouldn't that be nice.

 

[Max Power]

D.J. Moore hinted he is going to be in a Mt. Dew commercial played during the super bowl.

 

[Sunday Gravy]

All week I've followed this very carefully and the Maye train is steamrolling. You guys that have tunnel vision for Caleb are crazy.

https://x.com/jasrifootball/status/1755656951743066132?s=46&t=Il7gWzDI28ydPLvuwjGM6Q

 

[FarFromHome]

All week I've followed this very carefully and the Maye train is steamrolling. You guys that have tunnel vision for Caleb are crazy.

https://x.com/jasrifootball/status/1755656951743066132?s=46&t=Il7gWzDI28ydPLvuwjGM6Q

This is the time of year draft stock risers and fallers catches fire. It gets clicks. I've been wrong before, but I'd bet my paid off house that after all the smoke and mirrors Caleb goes #1 to Bears.

 

[Sunday Gravy]

All week I've followed this very carefully and the Maye train is steamrolling. You guys that have tunnel vision for Caleb are crazy.

https://x.com/jasrifootball/status/1755656951743066132?s=46&t=Il7gWzDI28ydPLvuwjGM6Q

This is the time of year draft stock risers and fallers catches fire. It gets clicks. I've been wrong before, but I'd bet my paid off house that after all the smoke and mirrors Caleb goes #1 to Bears.

Orlovsky isn't interested in clicks. He's not a draft guy.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

All week I've followed this very carefully and the Maye train is steamrolling. You guys that have tunnel vision for Caleb are crazy.

https://x.com/jasrifootball/status/1755656951743066132?s=46&t=Il7gWzDI28ydPLvuwjGM6Q

This is the time of year draft stock risers and fallers catches fire. It gets clicks. I've been wrong before, but I'd bet my paid off house that after all the smoke and mirrors Caleb goes #1 to Bears.

Exactly. This has a Will Levis vibe.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

The more I think about it, the more I am open to the idea of CHI trading the #1 down into the top 1/3 of the draft. Take the haul, get a OT with one pick and McCarthy with the other and give him a year to sit and study behind Fields. If Fields is "the guy", then he'll be extended and McCarthy traded. If not, McCarthy starts in 2025. I think this hedges bets on both sides and gives the Bears a ton more draft capital to stock the trenches. It is the lowest risk situation possible.

 

[menobrown]

The more I think about it, the more I am open to the idea of CHI trading the #1 down into the top 1/3 of the draft. Take the haul, get a OT with one pick and McCarthy with the other and give him a year to sit and study behind Fields. If Fields is "the guy", then he'll be extended and McCarthy traded. If not, McCarthy starts in 2025. I think this hedges bets on both sides and gives the Bears a ton more draft capital to stock the trenches. It is the lowest risk situation possible.

May not be able to get McCarthy at pick 9, my guess right now is he'll be gone.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

The more I think about it, the more I am open to the idea of CHI trading the #1 down into the top 1/3 of the draft. Take the haul, get a OT with one pick and McCarthy with the other and give him a year to sit and study behind Fields. If Fields is "the guy", then he'll be extended and McCarthy traded. If not, McCarthy starts in 2025. I think this hedges bets on both sides and gives the Bears a ton more draft capital to stock the trenches. It is the lowest risk situation possible.

May not be able to get McCarthy at pick 9, my guess right now is he'll be gone.

Possible, although I have a hard time seeing one of Caleb, Maye, Daniels, MHJ, Nabers, Odunze, Alt, Fashanu, falling out of the top 9. Barring trades, there are 4 QB needy teams in the top 9 and one of them is the Bears. I just have a hard time seeing him go higher than that.

ETA - Throw Bowers into that mix as well.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I haven't watched Fields as much as Bears fans, but I thought when the Eagles played them last year, Fields looked pretty good. I'd trade down and get more picks and try and build up my OL and DL.