GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
Just heard it on ESPN1000 in Chicago.
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Clarett is ELIGIBLE for '04 Draft (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
- Start date
Goat Herders
Footballguy
Good for him. :wacko: I hope he makes sure his cell-phone is on either late Saturday or early Sunday of draft day. ....although I'm sure he'll be glued to the TV from pick #1.HERD
Turf Toe killed Me
Footballguy
Ok. If he's in, where does he fall in top 10 RB's this year?
Burning Sensation
Footballguy
4-6, maybe late 2nd round.
Goat Herders
Footballguy
1. Jones2. Jackson3.Perry4. Greg JonesFrom here: Cobbs, Clarrett, Wilson, Moore, J.Jones, and Turner all have a chance to be the next off the board. Personally, I think that Wilson or Moore will be that guy. However, Moore and J.Jones could easily be thought of as injury-risk/3rd down backs and Cobbs might not climb too high. As for Clarrett, as much as it pains me to admit, I think while many teams gladly pass him up as a problem-child, somebody will take a chance on him in the 2nd even though he hardly deserves it..HERD
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
Kiper and Golic say he's a 2nd round pick, and probably the 5th or 6th best back.
leasesayno:
Don Quixote
Footballguy
NFL can still appeal it. So premature to say he is definitely in.
Titans2003
Footballguy
Is the NFL going to appeal? If so I guess that bars Clarett from the draft. Does this affect Fitzgerald at all?
Bill Young
Footballguy
The NFL's worst (?) nightmare has come true. I don't care how many appeals there are, I don't see any judge overturning this ruling. This isn't the only issue the NFL has under anti-trust, I'm sure.What's next? Someone challenging states rules that say you can't drink until you are 21? 
Jason Wood
Zoo York
Cheers
Don Quixote
Footballguy
It was found unenforcable generally--not just to Clarett. The rule was found to violate antitrust laws.While an appeal is likely, I agree it is not likely to get reversed. This was an easy case.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
I'm no lawyer but my understanding is any appeal would not prevent Clarett from entering this year's draft because the appeal wouldn't be heard until after the process had been well under way.And if there is an appeal heard before the actual draft, the NFL will lose. I recall last year when all this was going down, John Clayton was on ESPN Radio saying that the NFL was privately petrified of Clarett suing because it was a fairly open and shut case of antitrust, and they knew from other sports leagues, that they had no leg to stand on. The only thing the NFL had going for it was the support of the Players Association, but obviously that didn't stop Clarett from doing his thing.Cheers
Don Quixote
Footballguy
The NFL could seek an expedited appeal and the Court of Appeals could hear it before the draft, so I don't think the timing will necessarily be an issue.
BigJim®
Footballguy
They probably could seek cert for an expedited appeal given the ripeness of the issue, but I agree generally that the criteria for overruling a lower court decision ("clearly erroneos" or "abuse of discretion"... I forget the specific threshold) is one that would not be easy to acheive. Anyone think we'll see an 18 year old getting crushed on the gridiron anytime soon? Beyond the uninformed/misled youngsters who will risk their careers entering the draft and not being selected (see the NBA), I'd say the real losers in this ruling are the 4-year college players who now may be bypassed over the promise of some unproven youngster in late rounds, although it's hard to know how NFL teams will be able to draft and make room for kids, who more than likely are not physically or mentally capable of playing NFL ball out of the gate. A lot of them will get cut in last minute roster downsizing and at that point they will likely not be eligible to play in college.
Titans2003
Footballguy
I'm only speculating here, but if the NFL has to admit anyone who's graduated high school, they're going to have to start a minor league and stop depending on the colleges to season their young players.
Bill Young
Footballguy
I agree with you here. That would be the best route the NFL could go. Not quite MLB's Minor League Baseball, but something for someone who doesn't want to go to college.But will they do it?The NFL Developmental League - 18-20 year olds only need apply!
Jason Wood
Zoo York
They don't HAVE to do anything. As long as the NFL keeps its existing roster requirements, this won't get out of hand. The difference between the NBA and the NFL is physical development. The vast majority of blue chip football prospects coming out of high school are no way, shape or form physically developed enough to have a presence in the NFL. And you simply don't know how a player is going to develop until he puts the weight on. For example, it's not uncommon for a blue chip defensive line prospect to weigh 235-240 coming out of high school...if he doesn't put on a significant amount of weight chances are he's either a) not going to pan out or b) must be converted to linebackers, safety, etc...Cheers
Holy Schneikes
Footballguy
Which would be long overdue.I guess I'm in the minority here, but IF this causes significant changes to the way college and pro football relate to each other (not sure it will), I'm loving it.The college "minor league" sucks for everyone except NFL management.A real minor league would be better for all involved. College football could go back to being college football again, and we'd have the minor leagues to follow/watch.
beef
Footballguy
LOL at those of you way overreacting here. The NFL is not all of a sudden going to be the NBA. So F'n what if a couple of sophmores enter the draft. I garauntee that NFL teams will not be like NBA team and jump on the young guys right away. No NFL team is going to want to wait for a player to mature physically for a few years while paying them 1st round $. Maybe they'll get drafted late, which means cheap salary, and so what then. Also, the NFL roster doesn'y have room to be sitting and waiting on too many players. Maybe a couple, but if you are a back-up and don't play special teams, you're probably gonna be cut.
MonkeyButt
Footballguy
Yup.So now I imagine we will have a bunch of 19-21 year olds making small $ while struggling to make it in the minors. At least with the old way the kids were getting an opportunity to get a college education out of the process.On the upside, think of all of those cities lucky enough to get a minor league NFL team.
Titans2003
Footballguy
Sure, we know that almost all high schoolers are undersized and not ready for the NFL. If a blue-chipper gets hold of an agent like Drew Rosenhaus, he might not listen to people who say that he's not ready. Who knows. Maybe there will be an unspoken agreement that keeps pre-college guys out of the draft. Once one guy bypasses college for the draft, others will follow. Then we have issues like eligibility and roster size to deal with.
BigJim®
Footballguy
Fully agree here. However, its hard to figure how NFL teams will be able to draft a highschooler, pay the draft slotting under the NFLPA bargaining agreement, and not create a salary cap mess when the majority of these kids will likely fulfill their contracts (if at all) on a practice squad or minor league team, as you mention, and that's assuming there is even a way to get them to the practice squad without first cutting them outright. Seems like just an addition to the "dead money" concept. Also, the NFLPA will be hesitant to give NFL teams more flexibility in contract negotiations with young players, as this would obviously impact negotiations for all players. Should be interesting to see how this develops, but what a mess.
Holy Schneikes
Footballguy
Why would parity be the "fall" of the NCAA? Isn't parity a GOOD thing?Personally, I'm sick of the same 10 schools being the pre-season favorites every year. I'm also sick of "student-athletes" who are nothing of the kind.If there is a dramatic change to NCAA football, it will be for the better.
Bill Young
Footballguy
Jason:Agreed, to a point. But there are plenty of 270 - 300 pounders in high school too that play the line. Who says they aren't ready to go now?
What I meant was the level of play in NCAA will decline. Now, in NCAA B-ball, average players leave after 3 yrs, stars after 2 yrs, and superstars play one year in college, if at all.Without superstar college football players, college football fans will have to root for their team, rather than the star players on the team. Maybe that's not a bad thing, just a change.
Greg R
Footballguy
A $20-40k education is nothing? What about 4 years of physical training under specialists, in multi-million dollar training facilities, and being taught by knowledgeable position coaches?What about the ability to showcase their talent on a national stage, and try to draw the notice of the professional leagues.If they don't like it, they can try to go into the pros straight out of high school, and then when they find out they aren't ready for the NFL, decide if they'd really have been so exploited.
Bill Young
Footballguy
beef:Agreed again. But that's a wholly subjective thing. And there are some who are over 21 that aren't mature yet!But that still won't prevent a kid from trying. And then what's to prevent a team from taking a chance? Nothing. And if there is, I'm sure that's a Collusion case just waiting to happen. 
editted for a small grammatical error not caught previously! - B.
editted for a small grammatical error not caught previously! - B.
Last edited by a moderator:
Some things you guys may not have thought of:1. If Clarett and others enter the NFL and bomb, that will discourage others from doing it.2. For a lot of players, there is not a huge amount of talent difference between players, except maybe at the top of the first round. Every year, players move up multiple rounds (or down) based on their performances in college. So if a high schooler goes to the NFL and isn't one of the best 53 players for the team, he gets cut. Plain and simple.3. The fact is, getting and staying on an NFL team is very difficult for most people. The average NFL career is less than 4 years. Except for the starters, the bulk of the players are quite young, and if they stop developing, they get cut. There are plenty of other people who want their jobs.I am quite concerned if 18 year olds try to join the NFL. Football is an incredible physical sport and an 18 year body may not be physically mature enough to handle the rigors. And this has nothing to do with the mental/emotional aspects of the sport.
Why do I have this sinking feeling Clarett is going to end up a Bear? Maybe they'll give him the Curtis Enis memorial locker. And Stevan Jackson will end up being an uber stud playing for the Lions. You have to think this way when you're a Bears fan, so when these things invariably happen at least it doesnt take you completely by surprise.
Amazingly, its not just the Bears. Chicago sports in general are just a long series of forseeable trainwrecks.
Ill never forget when the Blackhawks brought in Theo Fluery a couple years ago, the GM was on the radio and a caller had to tell him about Theo's little drug problem. Needless to say Fleury was arresting for fighting the bouncers at a strip club by the end of the season. Missing four games recovering from a stripclub bouncer beatdown, now that's Chicago sports for ya.
Amazingly, its not just the Bears. Chicago sports in general are just a long series of forseeable trainwrecks.
Ill never forget when the Blackhawks brought in Theo Fluery a couple years ago, the GM was on the radio and a caller had to tell him about Theo's little drug problem. Needless to say Fleury was arresting for fighting the bouncers at a strip club by the end of the season. Missing four games recovering from a stripclub bouncer beatdown, now that's Chicago sports for ya.
BlueOnion
Footballguy
I don't think this really affects the NFL so much, I think the NFL rule was to protect their vested interest in college football, but in the big scheme of things, I don't think it will affect college football either.As far as Maurice Clarett goes, I think he goes early in the 2nd day. But I really don't know so let me ask some questions:1 How big is Maurice Clarett? Can his body mature to take the pounding of an everydown back? I remember Robert Smith (Vikings) was similar to Clarett and it took him about 5 years to develop into the back we remember him as.2 How fast is Maurice Clarett? Does he have 4.4 speed like Robert Smith to make up for his smallish frame?3 How raw is his pass blocking and reading blitz packages? Playing less than 1 full season of college football makes me wonder how long it will take him to fulfill the running back position in passing downs.Now I think Clarett has some talent, talent that can help a team win but I don't think he has an attributes that could make him a star or everydown contributor. The BlueOnion
Johnny Ice
Footballguy
I don't care how big a high schooler is, when it comes to pushing around a grown man it ain't going to happen. I'll even bet a physical NFL corner such as Ty Law can drop a blue chip high school lineman with no problem. Like beef said, it's the physical maturity.Jason:Agreed, to a point. But there are plenty of 270 - 300 pounders in high school too that play the line. Who says they aren't ready to go now?
Yeh, and how have Tyson Chandler and Eddy Curry done? Its strange, but after 4 years in the pros they are just starting to play like a real NBA player. Its almost like they should have spent the last 4 years learning the game somewhere...Regardless, football is a completely different animal. NBA players can perform well skinny, but a lot of young guys dont really take the next step until theyve put on a little meat. You show up light in the NFL and you're gonna get hurt. Bad. RBs and WRs might get away with it, occasionally. Anybody else would be making a huge mistake.
Goat Herders
Footballguy
Lebron James is 30 years old. HERD
skbatmen
Footballguy
If the top prospects could be drafted directly of out high school, it is very possible TJ Duckett would be playing linebacker opposed to running back. TJ was the #1 LB prospect out of highschool. Nick Saban recruited him (to MSU) as a LB that would start as a freshman. He also told TJ that he MAY run the ball on short yardage situations. Once in college, Saban realized he had a RB playing LB. Not good or bad, just different if TJ went straight to the NFL from high school.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
If you want evidence of whether it's different from the NBA, just think about freshmen classes. While it's fine and dandy for people like Dean Smith to say "no freshmen should be allowed to declare", it's disingenuous because oftentimes freshmen are the best players in the country.It's quite common for a freshmen to start at the very best of programs. Just last year a freshmen lead his team to the NCAA title while a high school kid was the most sought after pro prospect. Why? Because they could already play the game at the very highest of levels. There's nothing more for LeBron James or 'Melo Anthony to accomplish outside the pros, they're physically developed and dominate against collegiate competition. But in the NCAA, you would be hard pressed to find many true (or even redshirt) freshmen who make a MAJOR impact on their team, which would be required to get themselves on the NFL draft board.Will it change things? Sure, there will be a few blue chip redshirt sophomores who come out that would've otherwise returned, but I see no problem with that at all.Cheersmaturity.Physical maturity doesn't just mean size.Jason:Agreed, to a point. But there are plenty of 270 - 300 pounders in high school too that play the line. Who says they aren't ready to go now?
coolbeans59
Footballguy
1) 6-1 - 230 ..... Smith was 6-2 - 2122) guestimate would be a 4.5-4.63) he'd have to work on this aspect of his gameMy 2 knocks on Clarett are:1) Durability - He's never played a full season AT ANY LEVEL without missing time because of various injuries.2) Character - Lying to cops, cheating in school, associating with a gambler .... wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.He's a kid that needs a good voice in his life that'll put him on the straight an narrow.
guderian
Footballguy
Big difference here. Courts are extremely reluctant to keep someone from working and the laws that apply to Clarrett/the NFL are the same ones that apply to everyone else. As a result, no court is going to prevent someone from being able to work as long as they meet the restrictions imposed by other laws (i.e. child labor, etc.).The NFL's worst (?) nightmare has come true. I don't care how many appeals there are, I don't see any judge overturning this ruling. This isn't the only issue the NFL has under anti-trust, I'm sure.What's next? Someone challenging states rules that say you can't drink until you are 21?
Goat Herders
Footballguy
Here's a thought:What happens when an 18 year old gets drafted in the 7th round and gets offered a 10 year (non-guaranteed of course) deal for very little money? He can decline it and reenter the draft pool, but by being drafted he can't then go to college, so he's forced to sit out of football for a year. And after that, he's going to IMPROVE his draft position? His only other choice would be to sign an unfair contract and lock himself into a bad situation. What agent is going to encourage his client to do that?I think the bubble would burst VERY quickly on high school kids going to the NFL, if that were to ever happen in the first place. The ONLY current college player that I think might have been able to make the jump would be Vincent Young. Some team could have rostered him as a 4th QB based on his physical skills alone, developing him looooong term. But being 300 pounds isn't going to get you drafted out of high school...HERD
Jason Wood
Zoo York
HERD, well said as usual. One of the rare things about Clarett out of the gates as I recall (and one of the reasons he started as a true freshmen) was because he was 220+ and built like an NFLer already.I would just beg anyone who's seriously worried about this to look into the measurables for the guys being projected as top picks and what they measured coming into college, it'll blow you away.Cheers
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
This will hurt college football much more than the NFL.Some of these guys will get agents and then get drafted in the 5th - 7th round......then they won't be able to go back to college.I wonder if there will be a little 'collusion' not to draft these youngins early in the draft, to discourage it - they haven't filled their bodies out quite yet.
