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Covering the TE penalty. (1 Viewer)

Pick

Footballguy
Penalty called on Hines Ward on Sunday for covering the TE. I thought this was only illegal if it's a passing play.

 
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apalmer

Footballguy
From the NFL.com rules summmary:

If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Usually this involves a tackle eligible play. However, if the summary is accurate, it applies equally when a player with an eligible number (TE) is covered up and thus becomes ineligible without reporting the change to the referee.
 

-OZ-

Footballguy
From the NFL.com rules summmary:

If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Usually this involves a tackle eligible play. However, if the summary is accurate, it applies equally when a player with an eligible number (TE) is covered up and thus becomes ineligible without reporting the change to the referee.
:goodposting: BTW - how far off the line do you have to be?

 

jeff_eaglz

Moderator
From the NFL.com rules summmary:

If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Usually this involves a tackle eligible play. However, if the summary is accurate, it applies equally when a player with an eligible number (TE) is covered up and thus becomes ineligible without reporting the change to the referee.
:goodposting: BTW - how far off the line do you have to be?
I've seen many TEs used as interior linemen on FG and XPT attempts. For example, Mike Bartrum (TE) is the long snapper in Philly. Does he have to report on each kick?
 

apalmer

Footballguy
From the NFL.com rules summmary:

If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Usually this involves a tackle eligible play. However, if the summary is accurate, it applies equally when a player with an eligible number (TE) is covered up and thus becomes ineligible without reporting the change to the referee.
:goodposting: BTW - how far off the line do you have to be?
I've seen many TEs used as interior linemen on FG and XPT attempts. For example, Mike Bartrum (TE) is the long snapper in Philly. Does he have to report on each kick?
:yes: And "backfield" players must be at least 1 yard off the line.

 

brettdj

Footballguy
From the NFL.com rules summmary:

If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Usually this involves a tackle eligible play. However, if the summary is accurate, it applies equally when a player with an eligible number (TE) is covered up and thus becomes ineligible without reporting the change to the referee.
:goodposting: BTW - how far off the line do you have to be?
I've seen many TEs used as interior linemen on FG and XPT attempts. For example, Mike Bartrum (TE) is the long snapper in Philly. Does he have to report on each kick?
scrimmage kick formations have different rules.
 

Refbuz

Footballguy
From the NFL.com rules summmary:

If a player changes his eligibility, the Referee must alert the defensive captain after player has reported to him.
Usually this involves a tackle eligible play. However, if the summary is accurate, it applies equally when a player with an eligible number (TE) is covered up and thus becomes ineligible without reporting the change to the referee.
:goodposting: BTW - how far off the line do you have to be?
A player is generally considered to be on the line of scrimmage if his helmet is lined up (breaking the plane) of a teammates hip that is on the line of scrimmage...
 

moleculo

Footballguy
I may be wrong, but my understanding is that there must be exactly seven men on the LOS - the center and three men to each side of him. The distance from the center to the outside man is variable, but the guard and tackle must always be in place - that is, at a bare minmum, we have:

T G C G T

Traditionally, a TE is on one side, and split end (in the modern era a WR) on the other side. Anyone not a linemen, TE, or a split end cannot be on the LOS.

Legal formations include:

WR T G C G T TE <-traditional set

TE T G C G T TE <- 2 TE set

WR T G C G C WR <- no TE set

illegal formations might be:

WR WR T G C G T <- tackle is uncovered, 4 men to the left of center, two to the tight

or, in the case of the penalty in question,

WR TE G C G T TE <-too many men on the LOS, 4 men to the left of center, three to the right.

anyone have a better understanding of the rules? Am I right?

edit to add: I have never seen that play before with the ultra-quick handoff to blow by the blitzers. that was one of the coolest plays I have sseen in a long time. kudos to the Steeler staff for having that in the playbook.

 
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AB in DC

Footballguy
I've always wondered how the "swinging gate" play is legal by these rules. Or, as someone else said earlier, would this be covered by separate rules for kicking situations?

 

apalmer

Footballguy
I may be wrong, but my understanding is that there must be exactly seven men on the LOS - the center and three men to each side of him. The distance from the center to the outside man is variable, but the guard and tackle must always be in place - that is, at a bare minmum, we have:

T G C G T

Traditionally, a TE is on one side, and split end (in the modern era a WR) on the other side. Anyone not a linemen, TE, or a split end cannot be on the LOS.

Legal formations include:

WR T G C G T TE <-traditional set

TE T G C G T TE <- 2 TE set

WR T G C G C WR <- no TE set

illegal formations might be:

WR WR T G C G T <- tackle is uncovered, 4 men to the left of center, two to the tight

or, in the case of the penalty in question,

WR TE G C G T TE <-too many men on the LOS, 4 men to the left of center, three to the right.

anyone have a better understanding of the rules? Am I right?

edit to add: I have never seen that play before with the ultra-quick handoff to blow by the blitzers. that was one of the coolest plays I have sseen in a long time. kudos to the Steeler staff for having that in the playbook.
I think the rule says "at least 7", which leads me to believe you can have more IF you're careful about what numbers are covered up by whoever is on the end of the line. Thus, you could have TE T G C G T T TE if you want. I think the Steelers would have been OK if they had two tackles on Ward's side (with proper numbers) instead of a tackle and a TE, even though there would have been 8 guys on the line. *Disclaiimer*: this is based solely on my interpretation of NFL.com's "rules summary", which doesn't really let you read the actual rule.
 

Pick

Footballguy
I think you can put 10 guys on the line as long as you cover your bases by telling the ref who is eligible and who isn't. I think the penalty was called because a player with an eligible number lined up in an ineligible position and didn't tell the ref.

 

moleculo

Footballguy
I think you can put 10 guys on the line as long as you cover your bases by telling the ref who is eligible and who isn't. I think the penalty was called because a player with an eligible number lined up in an ineligible position and didn't tell the ref.
Well, the play was marked down in nfl.com as "illegal formation", which is very vague. I seem to remember the ref saying something about lining up improperly, not mentioning anything aobut elligibility.
 

Pick

Footballguy
I think you can put 10 guys on the line as long as you cover your bases by telling the ref who is eligible and who isn't. I think the penalty was called because a player with an eligible number lined up in an ineligible position and didn't tell the ref.
Well, the play was marked down in nfl.com as "illegal formation", which is very vague. I seem to remember the ref saying something about lining up improperly, not mentioning anything aobut elligibility.
I think a lot is not mentioned when they call illegal formation.
 

jeff_eaglz

Moderator
I think you can put 10 guys on the line as long as you cover your bases by telling the ref who is eligible and who isn't. I think the penalty was called because a player with an eligible number lined up in an ineligible position and didn't tell the ref.
Well, the play was marked down in nfl.com as "illegal formation", which is very vague. I seem to remember the ref saying something about lining up improperly, not mentioning anything aobut elligibility.
The play was described by the ref as a player with an eligible number was playing an ineligible position - such as a TE covered by a WR. I can see why this is illegal as a defense may believe that the TE could run a pass route when he legally cannot, so they may place LB/DB near him for coverage when they don't have to do it.

 

jcjets

Footballguy
Plain and simple. You cannot have an eligible player covered by another on the line of scrimmage unless he reports as ineligible.You will constantly see a slot WR on the line of scrimmage, and the outisde WR off the line. When the slot guy moves back a step, the outside one moves up to the line. The slot WR then goes in motion.Otherwise you would have guards and centers going out for passes. :eek:

 

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