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Cowboys to get Felix Jones more involved in offense (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter gbill2004
- Start date
bigfeet_88
Footballguy
The quote in itself might have the answer.
Barber would run full speed into a brick wall if the end zone where on the other side. I'd might be happier as a Barber owner if he got a little more rest in the middle of the field while still getting the red zone and 4th quarter looks (and losing a few points) rather than losing him for a half at a time and not lasting the entire season.
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Felix is still a rookie and Marion is still the Barbarian. I project something similar to week 1 for the rest of the season:Barbarian...+/- 20 touches, +/- 100 yards, 1-2 Td's perFelix...+/- 10 touches, +/- 100 all-purpose yards, and a TD every other game or so
Johnny Ice
Footballguy
As long as Barber continues to clean up in the redzone, I don't mind Felix getting touches to keep him fresh.
Liquid Tension
Footballguy
Well, sure, when your offense struggles as much as they did Monday, you need to try something
tombonneau
Footballguy
Exactly. I'm sure a lot of people who drafted Barber were weighing the Barber vs. Gore debate, which is essentially TDs vs. Yardage. You drafted Barber knowing you are getting a TD and not a Yardage Guy, so I'm not overly concerned. Of course, owning Felix doesn't hurt ...
switz
Footballguy
The big thing with Felix is just the coaches working him in and trusting him more in different situations... He was in the game for a fair amount of plays on offense monday, but he didn't see the ball much.As for the numbers above...Barber has played two games and is averaging 17 carries per... 3.5 receptions per... 70 rush yards per... 36 receiving yard perAnd that's with Jones getting ONLY THREE TOUCHES in the second game...They really haven't begun to use Jones much in the offense... so the average of 20 touches and 100 yards per for Barber has nowhere to go but down, as Jones gets more involved.The question is how much?Currently, the coaches know what they have in Barber, and the TRUST Barber... Felix has impressed, no doubt, but he's an unknown to some degree... so in big games, tough games, Barber is going to see the vast majority, lion's share, of touches as long as he's healthyHowever... once the coaches are more comfortable with Felix (and that comfort is growing already) his role will increase.By the end of the season, I predict we'll see an almost even split in number of carries, and Felix having almost twice the receptions per game than Barber. But that will take working into, it's not going to happen next week. Nor the week after.Barber owners should really look into grabbing Felix now, before his stock rises... he's a special talent at the RB position.
Andy Herron
Footballguy
Here's a more complete rundown:
Felix Jones has flashed his big-play ability with touchdowns in his first two NFL games. The Cowboys plan to give him more opportunities on offense.
Jones has only 12 carries, nine of which came with Marion Barber watching from the sideline after bruising his ribs in Cleveland. He's averaged six yards per carry and been an ankle tackle away from breaking a big one twice.
The coaches don't necessarily have a certain amount of touches per game in mind, but they know they need to get the rookie the ball more often.
"It's not easy, because we've got such a great back already back there that can make a big play for you at any time," Wade Phillips said. "But I think he gives you some juice at times. We're going to try to work him in more and more."
Added RB coach Skip Peete: "Like I told him, 'Each week your role is probably going to grow and grow and grow and grow.' We have certain things that we've been practicing and been doing to implement him into the system. A couple of them were called the other night, and a lot of them haven't been called."
Felix Jones has flashed his big-play ability with touchdowns in his first two NFL games. The Cowboys plan to give him more opportunities on offense.
Jones has only 12 carries, nine of which came with Marion Barber watching from the sideline after bruising his ribs in Cleveland. He's averaged six yards per carry and been an ankle tackle away from breaking a big one twice.
The coaches don't necessarily have a certain amount of touches per game in mind, but they know they need to get the rookie the ball more often.
"It's not easy, because we've got such a great back already back there that can make a big play for you at any time," Wade Phillips said. "But I think he gives you some juice at times. We're going to try to work him in more and more."
Added RB coach Skip Peete: "Like I told him, 'Each week your role is probably going to grow and grow and grow and grow.' We have certain things that we've been practicing and been doing to implement him into the system. A couple of them were called the other night, and a lot of them haven't been called."
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
<--- Wade Phillips
Every time he takes off down the sideline with that Gomer Pyle look on his face I just shake my head...eh...that's why the players love him and why we have Garrett to get in their arses...
switz
Footballguy
Exactly... Barber owners be warned
Or it could be that the Cowboys will attempt to control the ball more and the increase in Felix's carries may actually be at the expense of Tony Romo's pass attempts. Thus, it is conceivable that Barber will continue to see 15-18 carries and 2-4 catches a game even with Felix's increase.
fasteddie_21
2006 NM Poker Champ
I was agreeing w/ you until I got to the bolded part. Not this season. Will his workload increase between the 20's? Sure, but to say EQUAL amount of carries is madness, I say. Madness.
switz
Footballguy
Not really... granted in game one, Barber left with an injury, but Felix was the more effective of the two RBs. He had half as many carries as Barber, but only 18 yards less.Now in the second game, they didn't use Felix much, and Barber really struggled running the ball. They need the threat of Felix in there.
I do believe that some of Felix carries will be at the expense of Romo's passing... but I could see where both backs are seeing 12-15 carries per game.
tombonneau
Footballguy
Fixed.
Andy Herron
Footballguy
Felix will get his carries when he's in there just to keep the defenses honest, but it's in the passing game that they want to fully utilize him. Romo shouldn't suffer much, if at all. Just another weapon downfield and/or underneath.
ETA: Barber will still get his goal line carries, obviously.
ETA: Barber will still get his goal line carries, obviously.
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Bankerguy
Footballguy
Just my humble opinion on the situation:
Felix was used sparingly vs. the Eagles because of their complex blitzing schemes. They didn't want to chance it with the rookie in a big divisional game. Also, I personally believe Barber is hurting with the rib cartledge problem. His arm was hanging oddly the entire game and you could tell he was in some discomfort. They will now start to get Felix more touches to help the Barbarian heal up a bit.
Felix was used sparingly vs. the Eagles because of their complex blitzing schemes. They didn't want to chance it with the rookie in a big divisional game. Also, I personally believe Barber is hurting with the rib cartledge problem. His arm was hanging oddly the entire game and you could tell he was in some discomfort. They will now start to get Felix more touches to help the Barbarian heal up a bit.
SteelerMurf
Footballguy
I won't mind if Barber takes a little less beating and lasts the entire year.
But if there was ever a week to reduce his carries it would be with tender ribs....didn't happen.
But if there was ever a week to reduce his carries it would be with tender ribs....didn't happen.
slckrsmitty
Footballguy
this is the correct answer.
Manster
Footballguy
is this a big surprise? Felix was drafted in the 1st round. he's gonna get some touches. but who would you rather have on your fantasy team? MB3 has been a stud with limited carries before. he'll continue to be a stud, and be the better FF back by some margin, imo.
these two will complement eachother well. Felix will break a long one now and again, and MB3 will get the tough yards, and most of the TD's.
these two will complement eachother well. Felix will break a long one now and again, and MB3 will get the tough yards, and most of the TD's.
packersfan
Footballguy
As much as I like Felix, I think the Cowboys would be insane to reduce Barber's carries to 12-15 a game. He is one of the best RBs in the game right now. Plus, he's a good receiver and a willing blocker in terms of blitz pickups. I don't think there's any question the Cowboys need to get Jones more involved in order to 1) take advantage of his talent and 2) keep Barber fresh all season long, but I think it would be incredibly foolish to significantly reduce Barber's carries. He brings an element that defenses have to fear. In my opinion, the Cowboys need to get Barber 17-18 carries and 2-3 receptions a game. He's that good and that important to their team.
I'm a Jones owner and this is exactly how I look at it.Felix MAY have his day someday. But Jeez, Barber is a beast. Stay healthy Marion, you're too fun too watch.
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
switz
Footballguy
Good find... I am surprised people thought Julius Jones was ever better than Barber. I do believe Jones was negatively impacted by Parcell's coaching... but he was never a superstud RB in the first place. He's much like his brother.Barber runs tough... and gets his yards, not by being the most talented RB, but by being the meanest. He runs with a take no prisoner's mentality. Where Barber plays with all his heart, Julius Jones plays like he's trying to find his.Quickly read this thread before listening to some of the opinions being voiced here on Barber...especially Bankerguy.
LINK.
From staff to regulars, it's an interesting look at how differently people can view a player.
It is gold, trust me.
Felix plays with a lot of heart, like Barber. And while Felix isn't as tough as Barber, he's the more talented RB overall. It's only a matter of time before he gets worked into a large role of the offense, because as much as they couldn't afford to keep Barber on the bench to play Julius Jones, they can't afford to keep Felix on the bench to play Barber. There are areas where they need Barber over Felix, and there are areas they need Felix over Barber.
packersfan
Footballguy
Didn't read the old thread but I think Julius Jones had decent (at least) talent. But something just happened to the guy in his last few years in Dallas. I don't know if he got psyched out by all the love Barber was getting or what but in his rookie year Jones really did look like he was going to have a fine career. Strange things happen in the NFL sometimes.
switz, I'm a big Felix Jones fan. I thought you were too high on his projections for this season but I remain in agreement with you about his talent. But I do think you're underrating Barber. The guy is a very good RB and quite talented in his own right in my opinion. He doesn't just run hard, he runs well. Plus, as I noted above, he's a good receiver and a good blocker. He's a very good RB.
switz, I'm a big Felix Jones fan. I thought you were too high on his projections for this season but I remain in agreement with you about his talent. But I do think you're underrating Barber. The guy is a very good RB and quite talented in his own right in my opinion. He doesn't just run hard, he runs well. Plus, as I noted above, he's a good receiver and a good blocker. He's a very good RB.
switz
Footballguy
I didn't say Barber didn't have talent... but his success isn't derived from his talent, rather his heart.ETA - I may be wrong, but Barber isn't the guy putting moves on people leaving them in the dust, or just blowing past them with his speed. In fact he gets caught from behind quite a bit, and there was even a new rule enacted this season based on his getting yards by grabbing his opponents facemask in his stiffarm. He breaks so many tackles because he can't evade them, whether that's a lack of moves, vision, or speed. Yes, he has good hands, and is a tremendous blocker. There is no doubt he has talent. But he's not a great talent. His success has more to do with his heart than natural ability. I wish some of the players with tremendous natural ability loved the game and had even half the heart Barber does.
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packersfan
Footballguy
And that's where we disagree. I think you are underrating how much his talent has impacted his success.
BigJim®
Footballguy
So basically, Felix will be getting more touches than Barber by year end?
Scooby1974
Footballguy
I tend to agree with Switz.........Barber plays with a lot of talent and emotion, but Felix is a better athlete with better vision and the quicks to get to where he needs to go. Barber relies on brute strength and above average quickness. It also helps both that the Dallas line creates holes you could drive a truck through. My thought is that if the line wasn't as good as it is, Felix would be more valuable in this offense.
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
I own both so I'm not down on any one more than the other.
I do think, however, in reading this thread that it seems that some of the posters may be relatives of Felix. There must be some major preseason, possibly pre-NFL draft, supporters here who have reputations on the line.
I do think, however, in reading this thread that it seems that some of the posters may be relatives of Felix. There must be some major preseason, possibly pre-NFL draft, supporters here who have reputations on the line.
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
I did not witness the "truck" holes you're speaking of on Monday against the Eagles in the 1st half. There was nothing there for Barber and there would have been nothing there for Jones either. It wasn't until later in the 2nd half that Barber started to find open lanes. And when he found them, he hit them hard.
Bankerguy
Footballguy
Ok here it is: (Perhaps we could have this pinned)....my goodness. I was wrong in my assesment of Julius Jones (again) and fell too much for the coachspeak. I tried my best to share my sources and articles on the topic to back up my flawed position. Ultimately I was surprised Jones never regained his level performance during his rookie year.Quickly read this thread before listening to some of the opinions being voiced here on Barber...especially Bankerguy.
LINK.
From staff to regulars, it's an interesting look at how differently people can view a player.
It is gold, trust me.
I was correct in how the 2 backs would be utilized last year (again). Many were expecting Barber to get the starting job and the vast majority of the carries. I'm still of the opinion that Barber is not well suited to carry a large load over a long period of time. He has never done it in College or the Pro's. He is a violent runner who likely won't make unscathed through an entire season. Heck, he is already banged up.
People mistook some of my comments about "value" the wrong way. I never stated JJ would outperform Barber last year. Admitedly some of my ideas were a little off and I thought Jones was a better back then he showed. I've also learned that some posters have nothing to offer posting wise, other to just pile on. Anyway, I really don't want to rehash the whole debate.
It's a
move to bump that old thread for a new topic. Feeling better now? Oh and how does last year's situation have anything to do with this year's? Some people here will find my posts valueable and others won't. It's all good.I thought of bumping some of your views and past threads on Owens and the famous thread where you guaranteed the Eagles beating the Cowboys, but i decided to digress.
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switz
Footballguy
The Eagles did focus the attention of their defense on the running game in the first half. Honestly, I don't know why they changed defenses in the second half, since they were winning with that scheme.However, in the first half there were times Barber had a hole to run though, and just couldn't get past the LBs. Barber's YPC in the first half was like 1.7. Jones YPC in the first half was 6.0, same as it is for the season so far.
Interestingly, on the only 3rd and short down where they ran the ball all game, it was Jones who got the call, and the first down.
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The_U
Footballguy
Classy response, Bankerguy.Ok here it is: (Perhaps we could have this pinned)....my goodness. I was wrong in my assesment of Julius Jones (again) and fell too much for the coachspeak. I tried my best to share my sources and articles on the topic to back up my flawed position. Ultimately I was surprised Jones never regained his level performance during his rookie year.Quickly read this thread before listening to some of the opinions being voiced here on Barber...especially Bankerguy.
LINK.
From staff to regulars, it's an interesting look at how differently people can view a player.
It is gold, trust me.
I was correct in how the 2 backs would be utilized last year (again). Many were expecting Barber to get the starting job and the vast majority of the carries. I'm still of the opinion that Barber is not well suited to carry a large load over a long period of time. He has never done it in College or the Pro's. He is a violent runner who likely won't make unscathed through an entire season. Heck, he is already banged up.
People mistook some of my comments about "value" the wrong way. I never stated JJ would outperform Barber last year. Admitedly some of my ideas were a little off and I thought Jones was a better back then he showed. I've also learned that some posters have nothing to offer posting wise, other to just pile on. Anyway, I really don't want to rehash the whole debate.
It's amove to bump that old thread for a new topic. Feeling better now? Oh and how does last year's situation have anything to do with this year's? Some people here will find my posts valueable and others won't. It's all good.
I thought of bumping some of your views and past threads on Owens and the famous thread where you guaranteed the Eagles beating the Cowboys, but i decided to digress.
lord_helmet
Footballguy
You're on an iceflake drifting south buddy
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
Actually Bankerguy, I DID NOT bump that thread. Quit being so defensive, always. We're all wrong here. It's how you handle being wrong that makes a difference.
What can be gleaned off that old Barber thread, is tendencies, and bias. It's good to know who typically leans one way, or the other on things. It can only help you.
I referenced that thread because it is indeed informative. Looking back, it's interesting to see the different angles people take, staff included, and why. It's like having a profile is all.
What can be gleaned off that old Barber thread, is tendencies, and bias. It's good to know who typically leans one way, or the other on things. It can only help you.
I referenced that thread because it is indeed informative. Looking back, it's interesting to see the different angles people take, staff included, and why. It's like having a profile is all.
scrumptrulescent
Footballguy
I watched the entire game, every play........I did not see the holes you are talking about in the first half. Philly completely shut the running game down. And I'm not so sure Philly wasn't focussed on the running game in the 2nd half, I just think they were starting to get beat by the Dallas OL.Your YPC point must be a joke. Jones had 1 carry in the 1st half and it was a hand-off to him coming from the slot position after a fake to Barber up the middle. It was an attempt by Dallas to get Jones the ball out in space, which they did, and he got 6 yards out of it. If you're trying to be serious with those stats then it's going to be hard to take you seriously when talking about these 2 RB's.
ETA: 2 plays after Felix ran for 6 yards off the left end, Barber ran for 11 off the left guard.
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switz
Footballguy
Nice to see you actually show your face, after arguing so vehemently that the Boys wouldn't draft a running back.
Bankerguy
Footballguy
Providing a link...whatever. Let's not get caught up in samantics.I not sitting here crying or anything...
, but you did call me out specifically. There are no other poster names listed in your above post. So I felt, it necessary to briefly restate what happened as the truth often gets lost on the hypebole that ensues here sometimes. Switz is going through it now too. I think my response to you mentioning me specically was appropriate and far from "Defensive".However, we do agree that it is interesting to see some old threads to look at bias. So, let's recap my bias. I was a Barber and Julis owner (In different leagues) last year and an admitted harcore Cowboys fan. What was my bias, I don't get it? In just reviewing a couple old threads of yours it was interesting to see some themes as well with you. Wouldn't you say? I've shared mine, what are YOUR biases? I'll hang up and listen.Edited for grammar while at work and typing quickly.
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switz
Footballguy
It was only one carry, you're right. But you are arguing there would have been no yards for Jones, when the ONLY evidence suggest to the contrary. You can't argue there would have been no yards for him, when you don't know... the only time he carries, he was very successful, and then the Cowboys ran another play a couple plays later exploiting the hole in the Eagles defense that Felix's carry pointed out.
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Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
Okay, here goes. You are clueless about Barber, and have been from the beginning. I don't know the reason; don't care really. The guy is a monster and it is okay to admit it.
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
Kudos about the one carry admission. That was pretty funny.
Bankerguy
Footballguy
He has multiple times.
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
It was fun boys. 
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